DH sobered up, I'm contemplating an EA, advice?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:An affair is just a pussy way of ending your marriage. You're delusional if you think it will fix anything.

+1. Your marriage is cooked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here, that came out wrong. I'm sure DH is worth it if you get there, would you have married him if not? Again, good luck.

the PP you were responding to and no worries, no offense, I dont disagree. I'm in my early 40's but I have 2 young kids I adore and a stable home life and a big job. I wish like hell I had more confidence that I could improve my sex life, but I dont - it was never rockin' to begin with with DH (we were well matched in every other way and I thought I had had my fun in my 20's, I could live with it). Given all that has transpired it's hard to imagine him becoming a stud in the sack at this point. I've gone back and forth about it, as you can tell from my musings with OP about my very elaborate fantasies about the guy with the sexy voice, but what I come to in my saner moments (and what I've been trying to convey to OP) is that we have so much going for us: we're good parenting partners, happy kids, jobs that only work because of how we share the responsibilities, and I think we can get back to at least being good friends again. Should I really give that up for the possibility of good sex? I've been tempted but it just doesn't seem rational.

Fire away - maybe I should...?

Mechanical aspects of sex can be improved to an amazing level with a little aid from toys etc. I think it is worth trying it out and see what your mileage is.
Non-mechanical aspects require him to want it so may be harder.
Point being - don't assume things cannot be a lot better with DH.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

OP here - I missed this post I guess because you were replying to someone else. Wow. Not sure I could call my fantasy consuming, although it might have been a close call for me being a "goner" depending on the day. Did you see OM during this period? If so, that must have been mind blowing, perhaps not in a good way. I guess if he has no idea you're obsessing about him then there was no chance of anything happening (and maybe you didn't see him).

DH and I made a counseling appointment, unfortunately not with an addiction specialists as we decided doing this sooner rather than later was better than waiting for another month. Did you have your appointment yet (you said this week I think)? If so, how did it go? Was it your first time in counseling together? Did you discuss this or is way too early for that? We've never been in counseling, so I just have no idea what to expect. Do we slowly ease into the process, or do I just blurt out all my feelings and confessions (and anger and resentment)? I worry about being accusatory since I share in the blame, on the other hand to the extent I shoulder some of that DH engaged the same behavior, plus all the lying, etc. surrounding drinking.

Hi OP, your twin again... We had our first appointment this week. We have done counseling together 2x before, once more successfully than the other, so we sort of knew what to expect. Some advice - and this is critical: you BOTH have to feel comfortable with the therapist, and it is OK to try a few if the first doesn't click. A bad therapist can be worse than none at all. We liked ours but are still going to try another next week just to be sure. Second, try to give the therapist time to talk/interact with you both - dont blather on. For us, DH needs someone who will draw him out while I'm a chatterbox; I have to sit on my hands and give the therapist a chance with DH to see how they interact. IME, the first session should answer the 'why are we here' question in broad strokes. For us it was basically "we were a pretty good couple, weathered a few rough patches, then 4 years of drinking, lying, sneaking around, emotional distance... now we still are pretty good household partners but very emotionally distant and the drinking is a huge gap between us..." (I added that I have a lot of anger, distrust, etc.; also I feel like I dont really know this person anymore; and also since he has never really communicated about the addiction or recovery I have no idea how to be supportive or where I'm complicit/might create situations that are drinking triggers for him). The therapist should guide you and if not, find a new one.

I felt both relief and panic after the first session. We went through some of this background and the therapist tried to sum up, in a provocative way (he said as much), that basically a tornado had blown through our marriage and we were sitting there as if nothing had happened. I felt relief because - there! someone said it! - and he was looking directly at DH when he did; and also panic because - oh crap, now we have to clean up this mess?! I can tell it will be a bumpy ride but this guy is going to force us through it. One last thing, he did not leave out the possibility that we could get through the therapy and decide we should separate, but at least then it would be a thoughtful decision.

I think this is the outer limit of what I should share on the board but if you want to post a junk email address we can pick it up offline, or reignite this thread in a few weeks. I'd love to hear how your first session goes. Best of luck to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

OP here - I missed this post I guess because you were replying to someone else. Wow. Not sure I could call my fantasy consuming, although it might have been a close call for me being a "goner" depending on the day. Did you see OM during this period? If so, that must have been mind blowing, perhaps not in a good way. I guess if he has no idea you're obsessing about him then there was no chance of anything happening (and maybe you didn't see him).

DH and I made a counseling appointment, unfortunately not with an addiction specialists as we decided doing this sooner rather than later was better than waiting for another month. Did you have your appointment yet (you said this week I think)? If so, how did it go? Was it your first time in counseling together? Did you discuss this or is way too early for that? We've never been in counseling, so I just have no idea what to expect. Do we slowly ease into the process, or do I just blurt out all my feelings and confessions (and anger and resentment)? I worry about being accusatory since I share in the blame, on the other hand to the extent I shoulder some of that DH engaged the same behavior, plus all the lying, etc. surrounding drinking.

Hi OP, your twin again... We had our first appointment this week. We have done counseling together 2x before, once more successfully than the other, so we sort of knew what to expect. Some advice - and this is critical: you BOTH have to feel comfortable with the therapist, and it is OK to try a few if the first doesn't click. A bad therapist can be worse than none at all. We liked ours but are still going to try another next week just to be sure. Second, try to give the therapist time to talk/interact with you both - dont blather on. For us, DH needs someone who will draw him out while I'm a chatterbox; I have to sit on my hands and give the therapist a chance with DH to see how they interact. IME, the first session should answer the 'why are we here' question in broad strokes. For us it was basically "we were a pretty good couple, weathered a few rough patches, then 4 years of drinking, lying, sneaking around, emotional distance... now we still are pretty good household partners but very emotionally distant and the drinking is a huge gap between us..." (I added that I have a lot of anger, distrust, etc.; also I feel like I dont really know this person anymore; and also since he has never really communicated about the addiction or recovery I have no idea how to be supportive or where I'm complicit/might create situations that are drinking triggers for him). The therapist should guide you and if not, find a new one.

I felt both relief and panic after the first session. We went through some of this background and the therapist tried to sum up, in a provocative way (he said as much), that basically a tornado had blown through our marriage and we were sitting there as if nothing had happened. I felt relief because - there! someone said it! - and he was looking directly at DH when he did; and also panic because - oh crap, now we have to clean up this mess?! I can tell it will be a bumpy ride but this guy is going to force us through it. One last thing, he did not leave out the possibility that we could get through the therapy and decide we should separate, but at least then it would be a thoughtful decision.

I think this is the outer limit of what I should share on the board but if you want to post a junk email address we can pick it up offline, or reignite this thread in a few weeks. I'd love to hear how your first session goes. Best of luck to you.

OP here - Thanks! Lots to chew on there. My junk email is Mary dot maryson at yahoo. I don't check very often but will this weekend. Also, I might get squeamish and chicken out on such a private conversation, but send me something and lets see how it goes.

[Anonymous]

NP here - these all sound like almost no win situations. Perhaps a struggle through therapy is the best choice, it shows your strengths and limits your own damage and guilt. Stay strong DWs, I feel for y'all!

[Anonymous]

So DWs how about an update? How is it going? Happy with DH in therapy? Did you go through with it with OM? TBD?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DH, after several years battling alcoholism, has been sober for just over 10 months now, and good for him. However, the physical and emotional neglect of the past few years has continued into DH's sobriety. I have just started Al Anon and DH is receptive to marriage counseling, which gives me confidence or at least hope that the emotional aspect of our marriage will be addressed (or at least there will be an attempt).

That leaves the physical part. Here is where I feel most betrayed by DH's drinking and am worried that counseling will fail. I'm pretty sure DH never cheated (obviously I can't know), but the lying about how much and when DH was drinking ("only two drinks"), the sneaking around, and the physical danger feels very much like he did (worse in some ways). I feel violated. Had DH shown some interest in me after quitting this feeling would have subsided (I think), but there has been nothing.

I'm so angry about this specifically and the entire thing generally that I've been contemplating an EA. So much so that I've got a target (former colleauge out of town, love each other's company each time we get together, married but I think he's interested and has a place). I'm at fault myself on this score some, but its not close to 50/50. Also, I have to admit there is a small element of "revenge" at play. But mostly, it's a need that also of course has feedback into our emotional relationship. It's just been so...draining, and empty. And DH is not giving me any hope on this side of the relationship.

Has anyone else experienced something similar, especially with a recovering DH or DW (doesn't necessarily have to be alcohol)? Did you stray or take steps in that direction? If so, how did you feel afterward? Did it help? If so, how? If faithful, what's kept you going and helped you stay faithful? I feel like I'm at a tipping point and real life examples will help, or at least inform and give food for thought.

There is more than a "small" element of revenge here.

[Anonymous]

OP and PPs, how did your DHs quit (if you're still out there)? My fiancé has a problem and needs to be confronted I think, but I keep hoping a decision gets made without intervention.

Not really on topic here but this seemed a good thread with useful advice around this subject. Thanks!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wife of a recovered alcoholic.

Here's my take. You are in your own recovery process. You can label this contemplating having an affair, but what you are really going through is seeing your husband for real, seeing your marriage for real, and contemplating whether you want to stick around and whether your marriage is worth saving. Having an affair is a side show to that decision.

You need to own your own fallout from the alcoholism and own your own behavior. If you have an affair, it's YOUR BEHAVIOR. You can't blame him for it, just as he can't blame you while he was drinking and say "She made me drink." You can't say "He made me have an affair." Own your own actions. Make a decision[b].

Excellent post.

Agree.

I'll add that it's not easy being married to a recovering alcoholic, and you don't have an obligation to stay.

I don't have first-hand experience with a recovering spouse, but I have family members who have struggled with it. Also, I have a lifetime friend who recently divorced her husband who has been 12-stepping for 15+ years. In my experience, recovering alcoholics don't always change their stripes. Again, this is just my personal anecdote. Because addiction is hard to shake, they may switch addictions from alcohol to sex, religion, drugs, porn, exercise, food, work, etc. Their negative character traits, including the addictive and compulsive personality, stay the same--they're just not using alcohol anymore or have switched vices.

My intention is not to offend, and I realize I sound very negative. And well, I do have a jaded opinion about most addicts and the recovery process, probably because I haven't witnessed many positive outcomes. My friend's husband attended meetings every single day (sometimes twice a day) for years. In a sense, he was addicted to AA. When he wasn't at AA during his free time, he was exercising for hours on end. He had at least one affair with another AA member. Possibly, there were others. He rarely spent time with his family. He talked a good game, and justified his need to do so much for himself (meetings and hobbies), since it helped him to stay sober. All of this was at the expense of his family who never saw him and for whom he was never really present. My point is, he didn't fundamentally change for the better and his behavior was hurtful to those around him. I'm sure this is not the case for many and there are success stories out there, I'm just not personally aware of any, hence, my cynicism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP and PPs, how did your DHs quit (if you're still out there)? My fiancé has a problem and needs to be confronted I think, but I keep hoping a decision gets made without intervention.

Not really on topic here but this seemed a good thread with useful advice around this subject. Thanks!

I'm not the OP or a PP but my DH only sobered up after his second DUI and I threatened to leave. I ended the marriage later anyway for other issues, but he's still sober. In a way, I'm not sure it matters how someone becomes sober as long as it's sustainable. Obviously it would be better for your fiancé to conclude that sobriety is the right choice, but confrontation is the only way for some unfortunately.

Not sure that helps but there it is.

[Anonymous]

Agree with PP, for the most part how the sobriety started (absent some sort of tragedy) doesn't matter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP and PPs, how did your DHs quit (if you're still out there)? My fiancé has a problem and needs to be confronted I think, but I keep hoping a decision gets made without intervention.

Not really on topic here but this seemed a good thread with useful advice around this subject. Thanks!

Here's another thread that is similar.

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/449005.page

[Anonymous]

Sleeping around on the newly sober? Sounds like a recipe for relapse in my book. YMMV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sleeping around on the newly sober? Sounds like a recipe for relapse in my book. YMMV.

Except OP changed her mind. Not sure about the PPs though.

[Anonymous]

In my family, there was a couple with this dynamic. He battled addictions for years, and she was by his side, holding him up, helping him along. He could stay clean for a while. When he was clean was when she'd feel something was missing, and that was when she'd have affairs. By the time he really did manage to get clean, there was so much damage between them on both sides that they couldn't stay together. She's textbook codependent, and he's textbook addict. Recovery needs both people in the couple to work on their issues, to break patterns.

And if the addictive person never gets to and works on the underlying issues that feed the addictive behaviors, it's true they will just switch to some new addictive behavior. I know a lot of people who desperately cling to their 12-step meetings for years and years, but never work on trying to heal the actual issues that drive them.

You can't work on being in a relationship until you get some basic work on yourself done. And that goes for both sides.