DW doesn’t understand how a sexless marriage effects me

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gaining weight is a sometimes stress symptom
It happens to women too.

My ex spouse gained and then lost 50 lbs. Really, he looks great now. He took up running and yoga.
He has a girlfriend. I am still bewildered but it happens. I ‘ve seen it. I had drive and fitness. But I was insufferable at times.

S*x and intimacy became an issue when we lost the emotional bond. Guys know when you don’t respect them anyone. They sense it. It kills off the desire for sure. It’s all hard work (and I would say mostly in your head/attitude).

+1 the libido for women is in the brain, not between her legs.

Respectfully, bullshit. Plenty of women are jumping into bed with guys because they're horny. Not because of some kind of emotional bond. In fact, many women have *less* sex with guys once the emotional bond of a long-term relationship is established than they had when that bond was barely formed. I can't point to double-blind studies, so maybe my anecdata is flawed; but it seems to me that hormones and new relationship energy have a lot more to do with sexual desire than deep emotional bonds.

ah, but their ONS are just that. However, most women don't want to have s3x with men whom they don't like or respect. ONS is different. It's purely about s3x and attraction. You are not going to see your s/o whom you have been with for decades as a ons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have slipped into a sexless marriage and it is severely affecting me emotionally and mentally. Sex has always been important to me and she has always known that. The rejection and physical frustration weigh on my psyche and impact our relationship, my attitude at work, and my overall mood. She knows this and thinks I am being unreasonable and childish. I try to move on and set it aside as something that is just gone, like a deceased relative. But it doesn’t work that way and she just doesn’t get it.
I wont leave her over it and will never cheat because I don’t want my DD to ever have to think of me as that kind of man. I’ve had opportunity but won’t do it.
I’m just miserable and don’t want to be this way any longer. Most of all, I wish she understood and would discuss it without accusing me of being like a horny teen. She doesn’t think sex is important after 40 or after kids.

Jesus Christ. I relate to this post.

I am resentful of the “I could take it or leave it” blazé nature my wife has about something men need to feel connected in marriage. We typically have sex, at best, like once a week. I’m 45, if that helps.

Even then, it’s me initiating. It feels like a chore on her part. It wasn’t this way dating.

Part of me thinks this infrequency and low drive is due to myriad factors: manipulative control, part boredom, part lingering resentments that can’t be let go.

I am a good dad. Do half the chores and things she doesn’t want to do (so for all those chiming in that there is an emotional imbalance or inequitable duty split please don’t).

I wish women fundamentally understood how important physical connection is for men. I know “no one is entitled to anyone’s body”, but also that there is a reasonable expectation of semi frequent sex. For me that would be once a day lol, but I could style for twice a week. Anyway, it is what it is. It’s not a dead bedroom, but really she doesn’t hug me or touch me of her own volition. When we do have sex she is into it and comes. We have toys. It’s just so sporadic. Where are these wives that are clamoring for sex and desperate that post on here? Are you all real? Or are those troll posts? Women just seem to give much less of a fk about sex.

This is a tale as old as time. Nothing will change. Therapy is a fking expensive joke, when realistically if a partner wants the other they will show it. It’s something that I wish was more freely shared. It costs nothing and is so healthy.

Anyway, tear me apart! I mean the horror of what I said is an affront in this era I know. That there is some marital obligation to provide intimacy to your spouse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

While you are figuring out the chemical formula your job is to drain the cortisol out of your world, once the stress is gone and she begins to associate you with joy, achievement, closeness and all the other good feelings her attitude towards you will begin to change and libido will follow shortly behind. You must never ask for it, never pester her again, don’t ever get mopey around her[.]

You might be right for a lot of cases. But, it's incredibly tough to trust that this will actually pay dividends. Because, in the moment, working toward this feels like you're her dancing monkey that she will continue to take for granted.

NP. If you are doing it *just* to get sex and not to build a good relationship and make her happy, of course you'll feel like a dancing monkey. Because that's how you're acting.

Totally, just get her cortisol levels down with a Pavlovian response you develop over 10 years and see if it pays off sexually. It’s so easy. What’s wrong with you?

[Anonymous]

Op,
Try oysters, massage, set a mood, run bath water, I don't know but just kiss and make out?
Get some new techniques if the old ones don't work?

rooting for ya!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I also think that many women who won’t have sex with their husbands and can’t/won’t empathize with the pain this causes him are also not really hugging and kissing and cuddling and listening to his problems and being overall kind and affectionate partners.

I remember telling my wife that even unsolicited back scratches would go a long way toward alleviating my frustrations over our libido gap. There was no additional back scratching, Message received.

Honestly, that is just not hot. It is so needy. So unattractive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have slipped into a sexless marriage and it is severely affecting me emotionally and mentally. Sex has always been important to me and she has always known that. The rejection and physical frustration weigh on my psyche and impact our relationship, my attitude at work, and my overall mood. She knows this and thinks I am being unreasonable and childish. I try to move on and set it aside as something that is just gone, like a deceased relative. But it doesn’t work that way and she just doesn’t get it.
I wont leave her over it and will never cheat because I don’t want my DD to ever have to think of me as that kind of man. I’ve had opportunity but won’t do it.
I’m just miserable and don’t want to be this way any longer. Most of all, I wish she understood and would discuss it without accusing me of being like a horny teen. She doesn’t think sex is important after 40 or after kids.

Jesus Christ. I relate to this post.

I am resentful of the “I could take it or leave it” blazé nature my wife has about something men need to feel connected in marriage. We typically have sex, at best, like once a week. I’m 45, if that helps.

Even then, it’s me initiating. It feels like a chore on her part. It wasn’t this way dating.

Part of me thinks this infrequency and low drive is due to myriad factors: manipulative control, part boredom, part lingering resentments that can’t be let go.

I am a good dad. Do half the chores and things she doesn’t want to do (so for all those chiming in that there is an emotional imbalance or inequitable duty split please don’t).

I wish women fundamentally understood how important physical connection is for men. I know “no one is entitled to anyone’s body”, but also that there is a reasonable expectation of semi frequent sex. For me that would be once a day lol, but I could style for twice a week. Anyway, it is what it is. It’s not a dead bedroom, but really she doesn’t hug me or touch me of her own volition. When we do have sex she is into it and comes. We have toys. It’s just so sporadic. Where are these wives that are clamoring for sex and desperate that post on here? Are you all real? Or are those troll posts? Women just seem to give much less of a fk about sex.

This is a tale as old as time. Nothing will change. Therapy is a fking expensive joke, when realistically if a partner wants the other they will show it. It’s something that I wish was more freely shared. It costs nothing and is so healthy.

Anyway, tear me apart! I mean the horror of what I said is an affront in this era I know. That there is some marital obligation to provide intimacy to your spouse.

Do you dress well? Groom? Exercise regularly? Keep fit with no beer gut, etc? Have a life?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

While you are figuring out the chemical formula your job is to drain the cortisol out of your world, once the stress is gone and she begins to associate you with joy, achievement, closeness and all the other good feelings her attitude towards you will begin to change and libido will follow shortly behind. You must never ask for it, never pester her again, don’t ever get mopey around her[.]

You might be right for a lot of cases. But, it's incredibly tough to trust that this will actually pay dividends. Because, in the moment, working toward this feels like you're her dancing monkey that she will continue to take for granted.

NP. If you are doing it *just* to get sex and not to build a good relationship and make her happy, of course you'll feel like a dancing monkey. Because that's how you're acting.

Totally, just get her cortisol levels down with a Pavlovian response you develop over 10 years and see if it pays off sexually. It’s so easy. What’s wrong with you?

How long does it take to get rid of 10 years of cortisol? It doesn't *sound* easy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I also think that many women who won’t have sex with their husbands and can’t/won’t empathize with the pain this causes him are also not really hugging and kissing and cuddling and listening to his problems and being overall kind and affectionate partners.

I remember telling my wife that even unsolicited back scratches would go a long way toward alleviating my frustrations over our libido gap. There was no additional back scratching, Message received.

Honestly, that is just not hot. It is so needy. So unattractive.

There's no winning, honestly.
"Communicate your needs!"
"I'd like a back scratch sometimes."
"Oh, not like that. You're unf*ckable."

[Anonymous]

Don't let these people gaslight you into thinking you are wrong for wanting relations with your wife.

In marriage each of you have a monopoly on the other person's intimate life. It is wrong for the person who has the monopoly to cut off access.
Every woman on this thread, in their heart, knows its wrong and the shaming language is just simply gaslighting.

9 time out of 10 when a wife give all these excuses about how the husband just isn't romantic or didn't do the right thing to get her in the mood is just making excuses for the simple fact that she isn't attracted to you and that is not your fault. It is a universal phenomenon that women want sex before marriage, but once they get what they want (wedding + baby) they no longer want sex. They blame the man but it is mostly their biology and attitude. The husband no longer excites them because they were using sex as a means to an end and once they get those things they no longer need to use sex.

Moreover, there is a simple fact that women say they want a nice domestic man that takes care of kids and does housework but not really.
What they want is the "beauty and the beast" fantasy where there is a big scary brooding man (also rich) that nobody but them can tame but she can tame him because she is more special than any other woman. What the "beauty and the beast" fantasy doesn't show is what happens after Bell marries the beast.... once he starts being nice he isn't big and scary anymore she doesn't get excited by him and she cuts off sex. She starts thinking about how she should have married Gaston. she then starts picking little fights with the beast because she knows he is domesticated and will not bite her. eventually she cheats with Gaston and when the beast finds out she tells him its his fault because he didn't fulfil her emotional needs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Have you been to therapy to find out why you put so much into this that it’s causing anxiety and depression

Is that a real question? You think it’s a mystery why someone is depressed to be rejected sexually by the one person who they have agreed to have sex with. (I’m a woman by the way).

Yes. Do you think every sexless person/man is depressed. Is every soldier who is deployed depressed? Spouses of ill people.

There are times in life where people are sexless. It doesn’t cause depression.

The soldier knows why he isn't having sex, and it's not because someone doesn't love him anymore. Same with the spouse of an ill person. You know that it's not a reflection of their attraction to you, your worth as a person, their selfishness, or their indifference. OP has no such assurances.

There is so much to upack with you I don't know where to start... but I'll start here.

So you agree, it's all in his head. If he was in a different situation then he would be fine. So it's not really the lack of sex making him depressed. A therapist can help him unpack why he is really depresses.

Perhaps he's depressed because he (like you ) think sex = love and he feels unloved, even though that is not the case. Again, therapy can help with that.

Oh come on. There was a woman who posted yesterday saying that she felt unloved because her husband wouldn’t get on board with a *kitchen renovation,* and I (and many other posters) completely empathized with her feelings.

If people can feel unloved when their spouse rejects their ideas on home remodeling, then how much worse is it when their spouse rejects sex?

She needs therapy if $ = live.

Same with every crazy person who agreed with her,

What do you mean by $ = live?

Both of these people want to feel loved and understood by their spouse.

Love*

Both are using the wrong thing to gauge love, sex or $

If you use these 2 things to gauge love, get help

Well, OP literally said that he is upset that he isnt understood, so it isn’t only sex.

If love isn’t understanding another person, providing physical affection, or spending your time/money on someone, then what is it?

How do you show people you love them, pp?

Nope.

Here is the deal if you don’t understand that life is not sex and money you need deep intense therapy, not a 1 sentence explanation on a website.

I know how I love other people. I hug my kids, cuddle and have sex with my husband, talk to them about their feelings and try to understand their problems, do nice things for them that I think will make them happy.

If you don’t do any of these things for people you love because touch, empathy, and money do not equal love, then what do you do?

If 1 is missing you don’t stop loving them. Your kids will move out and you won’t hug them but you will still love them.

I know that a lot of people had crappy childhoods, but this isn’t true.
If you tell your mom that you need a hug, and she won’t hug you, and then you tell her about something you are sad about, and she won’t try to understand, then she doesn’t love you.
She may have had her own crappy childhood and not be able to bond with people in that way, and that’s sad and it’s not her fault or your fault, but that isn’t what love is.

You cannot be a loving mother, spouse, friend, or anything if you cannot touch someone or empathize with them.

NP here.

I think one of the biggest problems with the sex conversation is that people cannot distinguish between sexual physical affection and nonsexual physical affection. Sexual physical rejection is very hurtful, but having no nonsexual physical affection ever can actually be psychologically damaging. Also, giving someone a hug is just not the level of physical giving as having sex. When someone doesn't want to have sex with their partner, it is often not a personal rejection, even if it feels that way. I know that when I didn't want to have sex with my partner I still wnted to be around them and hug them. I wouldnt' have felt that way if I was actually rejecting him.

and I think a lot of the reason women start to not want sex is that they don't get the nonsexual physical affection they need. It always leads to having sex or an attempt at it. So one person's "need" is getting met, but not hers.

I think if you already had sex that day and your partner knew you would have sex again the next day or day after, then every hug wouldn’t turn into an attempt to have sex. And both of your needs could get met.

I also think that many women who won’t have sex with their husbands and can’t/won’t empathize with the pain this causes him are also not really hugging and kissing and cuddling and listening to his problems and being overall kind and affectionate partners.

No, a lot of women complain about their husbands always wanting to turn hugs into sex. Which makes them not want to hug at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

While you are figuring out the chemical formula your job is to drain the cortisol out of your world, once the stress is gone and she begins to associate you with joy, achievement, closeness and all the other good feelings her attitude towards you will begin to change and libido will follow shortly behind. You must never ask for it, never pester her again, don’t ever get mopey around her[.]

You might be right for a lot of cases. But, it's incredibly tough to trust that this will actually pay dividends. Because, in the moment, working toward this feels like you're her dancing monkey that she will continue to take for granted.

NP. If you are doing it *just* to get sex and not to build a good relationship and make her happy, of course you'll feel like a dancing monkey. Because that's how you're acting.

Totally, just get her cortisol levels down with a Pavlovian response you develop over 10 years and see if it pays off sexually. It’s so easy. What’s wrong with you?

How long does it take to get rid of 10 years of cortisol? It doesn't *sound* easy.

Also, a cynical person might think it sounds a lot like "kiss her ass for a long time and maybe, if you're lucky, she'll give you a cookie."
(I'm sure the PP who brought up the chemical formula doesn't mean it that way; but functionally, the approaches amount to the same thing.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gaining weight is a sometimes stress symptom
It happens to women too.

My ex spouse gained and then lost 50 lbs. Really, he looks great now. He took up running and yoga.
He has a girlfriend. I am still bewildered but it happens. I ‘ve seen it. I had drive and fitness. But I was insufferable at times.

S*x and intimacy became an issue when we lost the emotional bond. Guys know when you don’t respect them anyone. They sense it. It kills off the desire for sure. It’s all hard work (and I would say mostly in your head/attitude).

+1 the libido for women is in the brain, not between her legs.

Respectfully, bullshit. Plenty of women are jumping into bed with guys because they're horny. Not because of some kind of emotional bond. In fact, many women have *less* sex with guys once the emotional bond of a long-term relationship is established than they had when that bond was barely formed. I can't point to double-blind studies, so maybe my anecdata is flawed; but it seems to me that hormones and new relationship energy have a lot more to do with sexual desire than deep emotional bonds.

Even in a new relationship, most women don't want to sleep with somebody who doesn't respect them. So imagine what it's like when there is not new relationship energy!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Don't let these people gaslight you into thinking you are wrong for wanting relations with your wife.

In marriage each of you have a monopoly on the other person's intimate life. It is wrong for the person who has the monopoly to cut off access.
Every woman on this thread, in their heart, knows its wrong and the shaming language is just simply gaslighting.

9 time out of 10 when a wife give all these excuses about how the husband just isn't romantic or didn't do the right thing to get her in the mood is just making excuses for the simple fact that she isn't attracted to you and that is not your fault. It is a universal phenomenon that women want sex before marriage, but once they get what they want (wedding + baby) they no longer want sex. They blame the man but it is mostly their biology and attitude. The husband no longer excites them because they were using sex as a means to an end and once they get those things they no longer need to use sex.

Moreover, there is a simple fact that women say they want a nice domestic man that takes care of kids and does housework but not really.
What they want is the "beauty and the beast" fantasy where there is a big scary brooding man (also rich) that nobody but them can tame but she can tame him because she is more special than any other woman. What the "beauty and the beast" fantasy doesn't show is what happens after Bell marries the beast.... once he starts being nice he isn't big and scary anymore she doesn't get excited by him and she cuts off sex. She starts thinking about how she should have married Gaston. she then starts picking little fights with the beast because she knows he is domesticated and will not bite her. eventually she cheats with Gaston and when the beast finds out she tells him its his fault because he didn't fulfil her emotional needs.

I was ready to roll with the casual man/woman stereotyping - because that's how we roll around here. But the extended Beauty and the Beast metaphor just got weird.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

While you are figuring out the chemical formula your job is to drain the cortisol out of your world, once the stress is gone and she begins to associate you with joy, achievement, closeness and all the other good feelings her attitude towards you will begin to change and libido will follow shortly behind. You must never ask for it, never pester her again, don’t ever get mopey around her[.]

You might be right for a lot of cases. But, it's incredibly tough to trust that this will actually pay dividends. Because, in the moment, working toward this feels like you're her dancing monkey that she will continue to take for granted.

NP. If you are doing it *just* to get sex and not to build a good relationship and make her happy, of course you'll feel like a dancing monkey. Because that's how you're acting.

Totally, just get her cortisol levels down with a Pavlovian response you develop over 10 years and see if it pays off sexually. It’s so easy. What’s wrong with you?

How long does it take to get rid of 10 years of cortisol? It doesn't *sound* easy.

Also, a cynical person might think it sounds a lot like "kiss her ass for a long time and maybe, if you're lucky, she'll give you a cookie."
(I'm sure the PP who brought up the chemical formula doesn't mean it that way; but functionally, the approaches amount to the same thing.)

A cynical person might think this sounds like you only care about your wife in terms of what she can offer you sexually.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have slipped into a sexless marriage and it is severely affecting me emotionally and mentally. Sex has always been important to me and she has always known that. The rejection and physical frustration weigh on my psyche and impact our relationship, my attitude at work, and my overall mood. She knows this and thinks I am being unreasonable and childish. I try to move on and set it aside as something that is just gone, like a deceased relative. But it doesn’t work that way and she just doesn’t get it.
I wont leave her over it and will never cheat because I don’t want my DD to ever have to think of me as that kind of man. I’ve had opportunity but won’t do it.
I’m just miserable and don’t want to be this way any longer. Most of all, I wish she understood and would discuss it without accusing me of being like a horny teen. She doesn’t think sex is important after 40 or after kids.

Jesus Christ. I relate to this post.

I am resentful of the “I could take it or leave it” blazé nature my wife has about something men need to feel connected in marriage. We typically have sex, at best, like once a week. I’m 45, if that helps.

Even then, it’s me initiating. It feels like a chore on her part. It wasn’t this way dating.

Part of me thinks this infrequency and low drive is due to myriad factors: manipulative control, part boredom, part lingering resentments that can’t be let go.

I am a good dad. Do half the chores and things she doesn’t want to do (so for all those chiming in that there is an emotional imbalance or inequitable duty split please don’t).

I wish women fundamentally understood how important physical connection is for men. I know “no one is entitled to anyone’s body”, but also that there is a reasonable expectation of semi frequent sex. For me that would be once a day lol, but I could style for twice a week. Anyway, it is what it is. It’s not a dead bedroom, but really she doesn’t hug me or touch me of her own volition. When we do have sex she is into it and comes. We have toys. It’s just so sporadic. Where are these wives that are clamoring for sex and desperate that post on here? Are you all real? Or are those troll posts? Women just seem to give much less of a fk about sex.

This is a tale as old as time. Nothing will change. Therapy is a fking expensive joke, when realistically if a partner wants the other they will show it. It’s something that I wish was more freely shared. It costs nothing and is so healthy.

Anyway, tear me apart! I mean the horror of what I said is an affront in this era I know. That there is some marital obligation to provide intimacy to your spouse.

Do you dress well? Groom? Exercise regularly? Keep fit with no beer gut, etc? Have a life?

All of the above. Yes. I get both ends of this issue. I get people not being into it. But I also understand that is a biological need.

Honestly, Elon Musk is working on sex robots or whatever. At some point, the two sexes will probably decamp and just rely on each other for procreation and guys will just bang the cyborgs from Ex-Machina. Honestly, all men want is someone nice, low drama and attractive.

Women are eclipsing men anyway in education. Fking Gen Z men barely have sex as it is and are losing interest in dating. I kind of get it. They care more about their phones, like playing red dead redemption 2, lack of finances from underemployment. Also, it’s a bum deal. Online dating has fked them into oblivion. Women want the “best” 10% of men anyway and have unreal expectations.

Women, in this brave new future, will be fine having a super great time talking to each other about Taylor Swift, clothes and what not. They won’t really need men. They won’t babysit them or constantly complain about them.

I guess we’ll see how it all pans out. The earth needs a lower population anyway. A future where men fk hot robots and women have great careers and nice jewelry seems like a win win for all.