Difficult niece - family trip

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

Yes. When you rearrange plans and make special trip accommodations you are signaling that she did in fact have something to be anxious about. It validates the anxiety. Yes you need to be sensitive but you can’t rearrange everything in a situation like this that is already safe and normal.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you should let her just bunk with you. Growing up, people always said things like this - you'll have to learn to deal with difficult people, etc. Now, in adulthood, I find that's simply not true. I never have to sleep in the same room as or spend any meaningful time with people who are mean/frustrating, etc. I can just avoid them, and have autonomy to do so. There's no need to make her uncomfortable on a vacation - its a vacation!

very true - thanks. I do think the sleeping arrangement is what is bothering my daughter the most. She likes her sleep and finds the downtime incredibly necessary on a trip like this (there will be 16 people total). She'll be in our bedroom.

Yes, the BIL is also in the picture. But he's not the enabler.

There's more than one enabler in this situation.

(OP) Enabling may be the wrong word here. There is just an overall lack of discipline. They have 3 kids which is more than they can handle. When their kids are occupied, they are happy...

It could just as easily be that your family is used to a quieter, more introverted one-child household and not a more rambunctious, 3-kid one. This is just as much about you as it is your in laws’ family. We aren’t talking about a child bully or mean kid here, just one used to company who isn’t picking up one cues. That’s not a discipline issue, it’s a redirect/coaching one. You seem judgmental here.

I agree. It sounds like a normal 9 year old. It seems like OP's family goes the other way and isn't very flexible.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why can't everyone be direct? Sit down and talk to the girls about both of their needs. The 9 year old is probably clueless. Tell her your daughter needs space sometimes, especially at night. And then remind her when she is again becoming too much? I don't understand why no one is direct with kids anymore. And OP your daughter is now 11 and yes she needs to learn how to deal with life and you coming to the rescue all of the time is not helping her.

This! 9 and 11 are definitely old enough for this conversation & it's a good teachable moment.

[Anonymous]

I would NOT let two such different children sleep in the same room. It sounds like a pretty awful vacation where you'll need to teach your child to use specific phrases for specific behaviors but also intervene yourself, and then resent your SIL and husband for being willing to let your daughter be harassed.

We know a child like this: she has hyperactive ADHD and anxiety. My daughter, who is shy, introverted and socially anxious, tries to avoid her.

Otherwise it sounds like this: "I need my own space right now. Please leave me alone." And then 5 minutes later "LEAVE ME ALONE" and then 5 minutes later "MOM! LARLA KEEPS PULLING MY HAIR AND WRESTLING ME!" And then Larla's Mom tries to intervene ineffectually, because her daughter is out of control, and one family leaves. There's no way we'd ever do something longer than an hour with them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you should let her just bunk with you. Growing up, people always said things like this - you'll have to learn to deal with difficult people, etc. Now, in adulthood, I find that's simply not true. I never have to sleep in the same room as or spend any meaningful time with people who are mean/frustrating, etc. I can just avoid them, and have autonomy to do so. There's no need to make her uncomfortable on a vacation - its a vacation!

This, exactly.

100% agree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

Yes. When you rearrange plans and make special trip accommodations you are signaling that she did in fact have something to be anxious about. It validates the anxiety. Yes you need to be sensitive but you can’t rearrange everything in a situation like this that is already safe and normal.

+100

But there is something to be anxious about! The cousins don't get along. Why are we saying there's nothing to be anxious about?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

They can avoid the whole thing by not having the girls share a room. They can always move them together, if the girls get along well this year.

And then avoid it when she doesn't like her college roommate?
The fact that we are normalizing anxiety in an 11 year old whose biggest problem is rooming with a cousin on vacation just blows my mind.
Does she have a diagnosis OP? Is she medicated and/or seeing a therapist? Her dh clearly thinks she's coddling her and I would agree based on the info provided. If she's getting mental health treatment, then I might change opinions.

She would learn that she does not need to be stuck in an uncomfortable situation and can advocate to change her college roommate.

Not every unpleasant interaction requires a diagnosis. People (adult and young) can simply not get along.

Likely the answer would be no from a college outside of specific reasons, at least for the semester. Advocating isn’t getting.

Learned helplessness at its best.

It’s setting your child up to fail to teach that she will get her way each and every time simply because she “advocates” to change something. Using your voice is a skill but so is accepting the answer no.

These are two different skills. One should always try to get out of an uncomfortable situation.

That couldn't be further from the truth. That's when growth happens. It's uncomfortable to speak in public for some. It's uncomfortable to take difficult exams. I would have not accomplish half the stuff I have if I got myself out every time something was "uncomfortable".
This is a pretty normal situation. This is not putting OP's daughter in a hardship. You can't run from everything.

Growth happens when you just shut up and accept being overwhelmed on vacation? Being quietly miserable in not an accomplishement in my book, but you do you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Looks like it's unanimous LOL!

Thank you all - I need to help her learn how to advocate for herself. She will likely be in our bedroom though - my niece also never sleeps and my daughter is a big sleeper. they are complete opposites.

This is the answer. You will respect her space more than the cousin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

Yes. When you rearrange plans and make special trip accommodations you are signaling that she did in fact have something to be anxious about. It validates the anxiety. Yes you need to be sensitive but you can’t rearrange everything in a situation like this that is already safe and normal.

+100

But there is something to be anxious about! The cousins don't get along. Why are we saying there's nothing to be anxious about?

IKR? We accept a DIL being anxious to spend a week with a MIL, but discount kid’s anxiety.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

Yes. When you rearrange plans and make special trip accommodations you are signaling that she did in fact have something to be anxious about. It validates the anxiety. Yes you need to be sensitive but you can’t rearrange everything in a situation like this that is already safe and normal.

+100

But there is something to be anxious about! The cousins don't get along. Why are we saying there's nothing to be anxious about?

IKR? We accept a DIL being anxious to spend a week with a MIL, but discount kid’s anxiety.

I’d love to be able to skip family vacation because of my MIL, but unfortunately that’s not life. I’ve had to figure out how to deal with her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

Yes. When you rearrange plans and make special trip accommodations you are signaling that she did in fact have something to be anxious about. It validates the anxiety. Yes you need to be sensitive but you can’t rearrange everything in a situation like this that is already safe and normal.

+100

But there is something to be anxious about! The cousins don't get along. Why are we saying there's nothing to be anxious about?

No, sharing a room with a rambunctious cousin is not a prospect that should impact her quality of life and cause her undue anxiety. It is fine to not like the arrangement but no kid should be worrying about it to this extent. Part of anxiety therapy is naming what you are afraid of and realizing it is not so bad. She doesn’t like the cousin - so what? What will actually happen? She will feel annoyed?? She will be tired? All of these are manageable and not that bad. So this is a chance for the kid to learn to cope with her anxiety in a very safe situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:-Your 11 year old needs to learn to advocate for herself
-You and your dh can step in if you see that the niece is driving her crazy
-You can talk to your SIL
-You can put a sleeping bag in your room for her

I think avoiding awkward situations actually increases anxiety in the long run. Give her tools to deal with it and she will see that's it's not as bad as she pictured in her mind.

This, exactly. I don't think you're doing her any favors. It sounds like it's "anxiety" when it's something she doesn't want to do. Like she's got anxiety about sharing a room.

Yes. When you rearrange plans and make special trip accommodations you are signaling that she did in fact have something to be anxious about. It validates the anxiety. Yes you need to be sensitive but you can’t rearrange everything in a situation like this that is already safe and normal.

+100

But there is something to be anxious about! The cousins don't get along. Why are we saying there's nothing to be anxious about?

IKR? We accept a DIL being anxious to spend a week with a MIL, but discount kid’s anxiety.

It was my post and I would also not think it is normal to be anxious and preoccupied to stay with your MIL.

[Anonymous]

Your DD should go away to "camp", or somewhere else.

[Anonymous]

This is a more extreme version of a dynamic we have in my extended family. My kid is the younger cousin (8) who always wants to play with and follow around and share a room with the older cousin (10). Sleeping isn’t an issue as my kid loves his sleep so that’s a major difference. Another difference is my husband and I, as parents to the younger kid, observe them and notice when my 10 year old nephew starts getting annoyed by my son and we talk to our son and explain that he needs to give his cousin some space and help come up w alternate activities he can do w us or w his sibling or another family member.

I think you need to do a few things:
-let your daughter sleep w you since you already know sleep will be an issue if she shares a room w cousin. It’s miserable not being able to sleep due to a noisy roommate.
-talk to your daughter about strategies she can use/what she can say when she is tired of her cousin
-talk w SIL and BIL and ask that they talk to your niece to help her understand when your daughter needs space to give her space. Fortunately for me in our situation my BIL and SIL have never needed to talk to us bc we are on top of it but if they did talk to us about this or something similar, I’d certainly take that to heart. I think as long as you approach it in a kind way that’s not blaming or accusing or judgmental of their parenting, they shouldn’t get offended and might actually try to implement what you suggest.

Alternately you can step in yourself and offer to play w your niece so you DD gets a break.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would NOT let two such different children sleep in the same room. It sounds like a pretty awful vacation where you'll need to teach your child to use specific phrases for specific behaviors but also intervene yourself, and then resent your SIL and husband for being willing to let your daughter be harassed.

We know a child like this: she has hyperactive ADHD and anxiety. My daughter, who is shy, introverted and socially anxious, tries to avoid her.

Otherwise it sounds like this: "I need my own space right now. Please leave me alone." And then 5 minutes later "LEAVE ME ALONE" and then 5 minutes later "MOM! LARLA KEEPS PULLING MY HAIR AND WRESTLING ME!" And then Larla's Mom tries to intervene ineffectually, because her daughter is out of control, and one family leaves. There's no way we'd ever do something longer than an hour with them.

Exactly - my daughter has used her voice in the past, asked for some time to herself, explained she didn't want to play hide and seek or whatever game for the 3rd time. Only to be asked over and over 5 minutes later. This is what she is dreading, especially knowing they are supposed to sleep in the same room. The constant need to tell her cousin to give her space, only to say it over and over and over with the same results. Not fun at all for an entire week. (OP, with 2 kids, FWIW).