If you come from a FUNCTIONAL family, why resent/dislike people from dysfunctional families?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Observationally, a lot of "functional" families that are drama-free, warm, welcoming, no abuse, addiction, codependency, etc. also tend to have this dynamic of exclusivity and "our home is a refuge, our family is better than everyone else". Not to say this is a bad thing, but in my experience having friends from these types of families, they breed sanctimony and judgement. Understandably so - when you come from a place of comfort and understanding you feel discomfort and even disgust when you're around dysfunction.

I think this hits the nail on the head. I also think it is very, very conceptually difficult for people who grew up in functional environments to really understand the isolation and shame that come from being abused etc. I do think also that there may be some subconscious (or conscious!) victim blaming - I see it all the time re: victims of domestic violence, rape, those in poverty etc. Finally I think there is this embedded fear of contagion - kind of like when people say they avoid divorced people for this reason, they avoid those who’ve experienced misfortune because it might mean that it will then happen to them.

The fact is, untreated trauma - which is really the source of most dysfunction - can make people very unpleasant! But that’s no reason to judge. We all have our trials in life.

No it isn’t “hitting the nail on the head” to claim with zero evidence that functional families “breed sanctimony and judgment.”

It's not a blanket statement. I'm sure there's plenty of functional, kind, empathetic families out there who wash feet of all stripes just like Jesus intended. I also put quotation marks around "functional", and indicated the lens of my own experience. Sounds like this description resonated with others in the thread, so I know I'm not totally off base here. Maybe it's more accurate to say that there are families who are on paper very functional and happy: no obvious signs of trauma or abuse, home is a safe place, parent, child, and sibling relationships and attachments are close and healthy. But there is an insularity, whether intentional or not, that prevents exposure to the diversity of experiences that develop a stronger sense of empathy and inclusion. Hence they turn out kids who grow into adults who react in an "Ew, that would never happen in MY precious, perfect family" sort of way. Venture over to the private schools forum sometime.

I am the PP and I do agree with the clarification here, not the blanket statement above. You can’t always tell which family is functional from the outside looking in, and even fully functional families may have their flaw - it’s functional, not perfection.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is the over-sharing. I don't need or want to hear about every problem you're having or ever had. Keep the drama to yourself.

I admit that this is how I feel too. I only interact with people like this at work (have no patience for them in my regular life) and this is why I am respectful but keep my distance.

Same. My work is different from my private life. In my private life, I choose to stay away from people who essentially want free therapy from me. While I am respectful of their needs, they need to respect that I get to make this choice.

OP here. I'm not talking about people who choose to limit interaction with someone who is behaving in a dysfunctional way. I do that too.

I'm talking about when people are cruel and critical of people who are struggling, whether it's complaining endlessly about their coworker who is negative and angry (the irony of this one) or using "dysfunctional" as an insult. I've just encountered a lot of people from "good" families who are mean when it comes to these issues and it surprises me.

Another thing I've observed. I have a couple friends who are from really loving families with really kind and loving parents (who I adore). When I socialize with these friends, they can be so cutting about people from dysfunctional backgrounds or people who's struggle with mental health, to the point that I've had to distance myself from them because I find their attitude offensive. But since I know their parents, I also know their parents would NEVER talk like that. It really surprises me to hear people from what I know to be really solid upbringings being very intolerant and sometimes cruel towards people who simply don't have their advantages. Is it just ignorance? Do they learn these attitudes from peers and just repeat that instead of following in their parents' tolerant, empathetic footprints? I've never understood this.

I think your latter paragraph is just getting at the idea that some people can be judgmental and harsh and cutting - even when raised by people who didn’t teach that way of behaving. It’s why sometimes you will see one sibling who is caring and loving and another that…isn’t. Same household, same parents.

Now, will the “good” family (your words) necessarily disown that rude family member? Not necessarily, just as you haven’t disowned your friend despite her rudeness. Maybe the parents have their ways of coping with your friend’s more toxic personality elements, whether limiting the time spent with her (like to family holidays), or by deliberately calling out her rude words when they hear it.

You seem to have the idea that a functional family has no issues. I don’t think it’s that clear cut.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Functional vs dysfunctional are way more nuanced and mean different things to deferent people even within the same family.

I do think there are some people who assume that their “normal” upbringing automatically makes them normal and functional. When in reality, there was a lot of sweeping issues under the rug and therefore nothing was dealt with and so you get some quite emotionally immature adults who fear their own dysfunction.

Whereas, more chaotic upbringings may help create some more resilient compassionate adults.[/[iquote]



My mom says our poverty and homelessness made us tough. In reality, I am aworkaholic who struggles with shame and fear of losing it all.

Dysfunction comes in all shapes and sizes. Be kind to yourself, that’s the first step in breaking the cycles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Observationally, a lot of "functional" families that are drama-free, warm, welcoming, no abuse, addiction, codependency, etc. also tend to have this dynamic of exclusivity and "our home is a refuge, our family is better than everyone else". Not to say this is a bad thing, but in my experience having friends from these types of families, they breed sanctimony and judgement. Understandably so - when you come from a place of comfort and understanding you feel discomfort and even disgust when you're around dysfunction.

I think this hits the nail on the head. I also think it is very, very conceptually difficult for people who grew up in functional environments to really understand the isolation and shame that come from being abused etc. I do think also that there may be some subconscious (or conscious!) victim blaming - I see it all the time re: victims of domestic violence, rape, those in poverty etc. Finally I think there is this embedded fear of contagion - kind of like when people say they avoid divorced people for this reason, they avoid those who’ve experienced misfortune because it might mean that it will then happen to them.

The fact is, untreated trauma - which is really the source of most dysfunction - can make people very unpleasant! But that’s no reason to judge. We all have our trials in life.

No it isn’t “hitting the nail on the head” to claim with zero evidence that functional families “breed sanctimony and judgment.”

But then it begs the question why some people who seem to (and claim to) be from functional families are so sanctimonious and judgmental. Either these people are in denial and actually they have dysfunction in their family that is causing their sanctimony/judgment (these are maladaptive behaviors) OR there is something about being from a functional family that causes these specific things.

This is your perception. Perhaps they aren't. It is hard to say without any specific examples. In general, though, OP (if you are OP), it seems to me like you've recently been let down and had some bad experiences with a specific friend or group of friends. I'm sorry that has happened to you. My suggestion is to take a break from those people and, if you can't, then to at least take a break from sharing your thoughts and feelings with them. Be kind and courteous, the way you expect them to be to you, but stop sharing and simply try to coexist. See if some distance helps.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Thanks for the discussion. I haven't agreed with everyone but I have found everyone's perspective interesting.

To clarify, I haven't experienced this recently but I have come across it in life. A lot more in my 20s and 30s (I'm middle aged now and simply don't interact with as broad a range of people as I once did, which is one reason I don't think I've encountered this recently). But I have seen it in life and I definitely see it on DCUM all the time. I'm certainly not saying that everyone from a functional family is like this. At all. More that I have known people from what appear to be functional families (and specifically people who seem to be well loved and supported by their parents, which I think is very central to family functionality due to the fact that I did not experience this) who CAN be very judgmental and not particularly kind towards people who have not had that experience. It always shocks me a bit. I spent probably the first 24 years of my life wanting nothing more than the love and approval of my family of origin, so when I encounter someone who has that and doesn't understand what a gift it is (or that going without it is a terrible kind of pain that can cause all kinds of challenging behaviors), I'm surprised.

Also, I'm raising my kids with the kind of love and security I didn't have, and it disturbs me to think that one day they might not understand that people who don't get that have it hard. Not even necessarily hardER. Just hard. I just want them to have empathy and to understand that while everyone deserves love and belonging, not everyone gets it, and that's something to have soft feelings for, not judgment and anger.

[Anonymous]

I didn’t have any exposure to people with mental disorders.

I knew how to ID and avoid the alcoholics, womanizers, lazy people, and narcissists but didn’t know anything about spectrum disorders and bipolar. Now I do, so do my kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I try to distance myself from dysfunction. Even though I came from a very functional family, I still have to work for things like good mental healthy, healthy relationships, child raising, etc. It's not like people who have functional families are perfect.

I think dysfunctional people need to work on themselves with therapy and being more cognizant of it. You don't get to dump on other people just because your family of origin was dysfunctional. Stop passing on dysfunction.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the discussion. I haven't agreed with everyone but I have found everyone's perspective interesting.

To clarify, I haven't experienced this recently but I have come across it in life. A lot more in my 20s and 30s (I'm middle aged now and simply don't interact with as broad a range of people as I once did, which is one reason I don't think I've encountered this recently). But I have seen it in life and I definitely see it on DCUM all the time. I'm certainly not saying that everyone from a functional family is like this. At all. More that I have known people from what appear to be functional families (and specifically people who seem to be well loved and supported by their parents, which I think is very central to family functionality due to the fact that I did not experience this) who CAN be very judgmental and not particularly kind towards people who have not had that experience. It always shocks me a bit. I spent probably the first 24 years of my life wanting nothing more than the love and approval of my family of origin, so when I encounter someone who has that and doesn't understand what a gift it is (or that going without it is a terrible kind of pain that can cause all kinds of challenging behaviors), I'm surprised.

Also, I'm raising my kids with the kind of love and security I didn't have, and it disturbs me to think that one day they might not understand that people who don't get that have it hard. Not even necessarily hardER. Just hard. I just want them to have empathy and to understand that while everyone deserves love and belonging, not everyone gets it, and that's something to have soft feelings for, not judgment and anger.

Interesting. I didn't get that background from what you have posted. I have one more point for you to consider.

You indicate that you now have children of your own and you are raising them to be empathetic, and that they need to understand that others can come from a harder life with dysfunction. I think you also need to raise them to be aware that people coming from a functional family frequently find that people with dysfunctional lives are attracted to their functionality. It is like the person with a dysfunctional life or background is a homing pigeon homing in on the person with a functional life.

Teach your children how to empathetically and sympathetically maintain their boundaries when they are targeted by someone who has an extremely dysfunctional background and is dysfunctional themselves. Your functional children shouldn't ever sacrifice their own functionality to try and white knight the dysfunctional person and feel pressured "save" them. It is hard to escape the whirling vortex once you're caught up in it. So as much as they may "love" the dysfunctional person, they need to stand back while the dysfunctional person heals themself and becomes stable, then they can move forward in the relationship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Observationally, a lot of "functional" families that are drama-free, warm, welcoming, no abuse, addiction, codependency, etc. also tend to have this dynamic of exclusivity and "our home is a refuge, our family is better than everyone else". Not to say this is a bad thing, but in my experience having friends from these types of families, they breed sanctimony and judgement. Understandably so - when you come from a place of comfort and understanding you feel discomfort and even disgust when you're around dysfunction.

I think this hits the nail on the head. I also think it is very, very conceptually difficult for people who grew up in functional environments to really understand the isolation and shame that come from being abused etc. I do think also that there may be some subconscious (or conscious!) victim blaming - I see it all the time re: victims of domestic violence, rape, those in poverty etc. Finally I think there is this embedded fear of contagion - kind of like when people say they avoid divorced people for this reason, they avoid those who’ve experienced misfortune because it might mean that it will then happen to them.

The fact is, untreated trauma - which is really the source of most dysfunction - can make people very unpleasant! But that’s no reason to judge. We all have our trials in life.

No it isn’t “hitting the nail on the head” to claim with zero evidence that functional families “breed sanctimony and judgment.”

It's not a blanket statement. I'm sure there's plenty of functional, kind, empathetic families out there who wash feet of all stripes just like Jesus intended. I also put quotation marks around "functional", and indicated the lens of my own experience. Sounds like this description resonated with others in the thread, so I know I'm not totally off base here. Maybe it's more accurate to say that there are families who are on paper very functional and happy: no obvious signs of trauma or abuse, home is a safe place, parent, child, and sibling relationships and attachments are close and healthy. But there is an insularity, whether intentional or not, that prevents exposure to the diversity of experiences that develop a stronger sense of empathy and inclusion. Hence they turn out kids who grow into adults who react in an "Ew, that would never happen in MY precious, perfect family" sort of way. Venture over to the private schools forum sometime.

This.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for the discussion. I haven't agreed with everyone but I have found everyone's perspective interesting.

To clarify, I haven't experienced this recently but I have come across it in life. A lot more in my 20s and 30s (I'm middle aged now and simply don't interact with as broad a range of people as I once did, which is one reason I don't think I've encountered this recently). But I have seen it in life and I definitely see it on DCUM all the time. I'm certainly not saying that everyone from a functional family is like this. At all. More that I have known people from what appear to be functional families (and specifically people who seem to be well loved and supported by their parents, which I think is very central to family functionality due to the fact that I did not experience this) who CAN be very judgmental and not particularly kind towards people who have not had that experience. It always shocks me a bit. I spent probably the first 24 years of my life wanting nothing more than the love and approval of my family of origin, so when I encounter someone who has that and doesn't understand what a gift it is (or that going without it is a terrible kind of pain that can cause all kinds of challenging behaviors), I'm surprised.

Also, I'm raising my kids with the kind of love and security I didn't have, and it disturbs me to think that one day they might not understand that people who don't get that have it hard. Not even necessarily hardER. Just hard. I just want them to have empathy and to understand that while everyone deserves love and belonging, not everyone gets it, and that's something to have soft feelings for, not judgment and anger.

I think you did a better job here explaining your thoughts than you have in your previous posts. Seems the prior poster might feel the same way.

I’ll just add that a couple times you have made the leap to assume that someone doesn’t “understand” or doesn’t appreciate their functional background. I would caution you about assuming that people don’t have gratitude for their family structure when they disagree with you, for example on the importance of self sufficiency. They might never be able to put themselves in your shoes having never experienced the hardship that you have, but that doesnt mean they weren’t raised to appreciate their background. They just have a different perspective.

[Anonymous]

My cousin is from a dysfunctional family but honestly she is a ton of work (as a fully grown adult). she has been trying to have a relationship with me for a couple of years, but having a phone conversation with her is really stressful and unpleasant for me. I’m not a naturally outgoing personality so it’s hard for me to fill all the awkward silences and come up with topics of conversation that are acceptable to her. I tend to ask questions when I’m having trouble with conversations, generally, but with her if she doesn’t like my questions I just get a one word answer and then an awkward silence. I have to psyche myself up for periodically calling her. It’s really hard to be a support for someone like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is the over-sharing. I don't need or want to hear about every problem you're having or ever had. Keep the drama to yourself.

I admit that this is how I feel too. I only interact with people like this at work (have no patience for them in my regular life) and this is why I am respectful but keep my distance.

Same. My work is different from my private life. In my private life, I choose to stay away from people who essentially want free therapy from me. While I am respectful of their needs, they need to respect that I get to make this choice.

OP here. I'm not talking about people who choose to limit interaction with someone who is behaving in a dysfunctional way. I do that too.

I'm talking about when people are cruel and critical of people who are struggling, whether it's complaining endlessly about their coworker who is negative and angry (the irony of this one) or using "dysfunctional" as an insult. I've just encountered a lot of people from "good" families who are mean when it comes to these issues and it surprises me.

Another thing I've observed. I have a couple friends who are from really loving families with really kind and loving parents (who I adore). When I socialize with these friends, they can be so cutting about people from dysfunctional backgrounds or people who's struggle with mental health, to the point that I've had to distance myself from them because I find their attitude offensive. But since I know their parents, I also know their parents would NEVER talk like that. It really surprises me to hear people from what I know to be really solid upbringings being very intolerant and sometimes cruel towards people who simply don't have their advantages. Is it just ignorance? Do they learn these attitudes from peers and just repeat that instead of following in their parents' tolerant, empathetic footprints? I've never understood this.

Cut it out with the advantage. It’s no one’s fault your parents were alcoholics.

You’re so annoying, that’s why ppl are short.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Observationally, a lot of "functional" families that are drama-free, warm, welcoming, no abuse, addiction, codependency, etc. also tend to have this dynamic of exclusivity and "our home is a refuge, our family is better than everyone else". Not to say this is a bad thing, but in my experience having friends from these types of families, they breed sanctimony and judgement. Understandably so - when you come from a place of comfort and understanding you feel discomfort and even disgust when you're around dysfunction.

I think this hits the nail on the head. I also think it is very, very conceptually difficult for people who grew up in functional environments to really understand the isolation and shame that come from being abused etc. I do think also that there may be some subconscious (or conscious!) victim blaming - I see it all the time re: victims of domestic violence, rape, those in poverty etc. Finally I think there is this embedded fear of contagion - kind of like when people say they avoid divorced people for this reason, they avoid those who’ve experienced misfortune because it might mean that it will then happen to them.

The fact is, untreated trauma - which is really the source of most dysfunction - can make people very unpleasant! But that’s no reason to judge. We all have our trials in life.

This is a good post. And explains an early PP who was talking about how they feel like they can't trust people who take about having been abused because they might be playing the victim (which is a messed up outlook).

I also think the resentment sometimes stems from two related issues:

(1) The perception that someone from a dysfunctional background is using their background to get out of responsibility for things. I get this. I've been in the situation before where someone really hurt me and instead of apologizing was like "well actually I'm the victim here because I dealt with xyx in my life." And that is really frustrating. In my case, though, it doesn't lead me to resent people from dysfunctional backgrounds in general because I am from one. So I am more inclined to think "I resent people who don't take responsibility for their own behavior, especially when it impacts me directly." I don't dislike people from dysfunctional backgrounds as a matter of course because what matters is how they act and treat other people now.

(2) Some people from dysfunctional backgrounds WILL use their backstory as a tool in getting attention/help/etc. from other people. Like it's a manipulation tactic. Similar to what I was talking about in #1 but more broadly. I think when people talk about "vulnerable narcissism" this can often be part of it -- it's this perspective some people get where they feel they are permanently deserving of other people's time, attention, and forgiveness because of a past trauma.

But to reiterate, this is SOME people with background dysfunction. I'd never pain everyone who grew up with dysfunction this way. I would say that more than half of my close friends have some kind of trauma or dysfunction they have had to deal with and I would not describe any of them as struggling to take responsibility for their actions or using their past trauma to manipulate others. And I have known people from seemingly idyllic backgrounds who do shirk responsibility and are manipulative. What matters is how people act, not what their background is.

+1 to the italicized - I came here to posted exactly this but PP was much more articulate.

[Anonymous]

Different take: I had an extremely “dysfunctional” home life for my entire childhood and I think can it makes me less sympathetic to those with dysfunctional behaviors than someone with a normal family otherwise would be. I made a conscious choice to refuse to let what happened in my childhood define the rest of my life. I draw strong boundaries and purposefully choose not to meditate on the past all day. I have bad days sometimes as anyone would but I believe in stoicism and the idea that I can only control my reaction, not other people or random tragedy.

In contrast I have some acquaintances who are in never ending therapy for what are ostensibly less traumatic pasts and just cannot get perspective or learn to carry what happened to them in a way that doesn’t define them. I don’t enjoy listening to them constantly over analyze. I think some therapy is useful but I don’t know that the current push for therapy as the panacea is really the correct path for everyone - for some it just leads to endless rumination. I try to be kind but it is exhausting to listen to. On the other hand, i have little to no patience for people who use the past/hard times as an excuse to be mean to others. I lived a slow motion tragedy every day for decades and never used it as an excuse to be mean.

[Anonymous]

People first and foremost want to distance themselves from poverty and all of its concomitant ugliness. People only enjoy reading about the dysfunctional lives of the rich and famous in Vanity Fair. The real life version is too Jerry Soringer and we just can’t.