What do you do when none of the men you met want a "serious relationship"?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unless a man is in his 30s and has a steady job, he is not looking to settle. He is only looking for sex.

Women need to understand it and work towards becoming more independent in their 20s.

Women need to do the following in their 20s and trust me that they will not be lacking for serious, good quality and suitable suitors.
-Get their professional credentials in order. Study, intern, get degrees.
-Travel
-Build a nest egg by maxing out retirement saving as much as possible.
-Consider buying a condo or house if you are stable in your profession and intend to stay at a place for 5 years or so.
-Take care of their health and fitness, work towards their mental health or other issues fixed through therapy and workshops
-Take care of any cosmetic issues - lasik, laser hair removal, crooked teeth etc
- Develop hobbies, get involved with charities and non-profit work.
- Connect with people and keep in touch with them. Develop and nurture professional connections. Network.
- Expand their personal horizon, get new experiences - sports, travel, museums, art, theatre, book clubs, try new food, learn new language.
- Date a lot of people who treat you nicely from different walks of life.

What has happened to make men this way? I hate this idea that your 20s are just an extended period of adolescence and it's not "real" adulthood anymore. It is! Twenty somethings are more than capable of being adults.

Agree. This list above is absurd!

+ 1

Lotta guys like this is DC too. ALLLL over the hill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP where does she live?

NY - Brooklyn

That's the problem. Many of my friends left NYC for love. It is just a dating culture and encourages guys to remain bachelors til their 40s.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unless a man is in his 30s and has a steady job, he is not looking to settle. He is only looking for sex.

Women need to understand it and work towards becoming more independent in their 20s.

Women need to do the following in their 20s and trust me that they will not be lacking for serious, good quality and suitable suitors.
-Get their professional credentials in order. Study, intern, get degrees.
-Travel
-Build a nest egg by maxing out retirement saving as much as possible.
-Consider buying a condo or house if you are stable in your profession and intend to stay at a place for 5 years or so.
-Take care of their health and fitness, work towards their mental health or other issues fixed through therapy and workshops
-Take care of any cosmetic issues - lasik, laser hair removal, crooked teeth etc
- Develop hobbies, get involved with charities and non-profit work.
- Connect with people and keep in touch with them. Develop and nurture professional connections. Network.
- Expand their personal horizon, get new experiences - sports, travel, museums, art, theatre, book clubs, try new food, learn new language.
- Date a lot of people who treat you nicely from different walks of life.

What has happened to make men this way? I hate this idea that your 20s are just an extended period of adolescence and it's not "real" adulthood anymore. It is! Twenty somethings are more than capable of being adults.

Np actually this is a great list. As a female I wasn’t really mature enough in my twenties to commit and have kids. I guess I could have ‘stepped up’ but I’m glad I didn’t. I travelled a ton, worked hard, partied hard, had a blast. Learned a lot about life and myself that you just don’t figure out until you are on your own. Only thing I didn’t do from this list was buy a condo or do the cosmetic stuff. Now I’m out in the suburbs with two kids and SO glad I had that time. My friends who married in their twenties really felt like they missed out, especially on travel, if they had kids earlier. Some are already divorced. I don’t think it’s necessarily ideal for women. OTOH I feel sooo tired now having two young kids at 40, and I almost didn’t get to have them due to age. So there are definitely trade offs. But OP should tell her SIL to stop worrying about boys and just have a blast!

[Anonymous]

I am LOLing at all the 1950s "don't give the milk away for free advice"

That's DCUM for you!

So many frumpy middle aged women who haven't dated in decades think they can weigh in on what men (really boys) in their 20s will respond to.

They obviously no nothing, just ignore that BS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unless a man is in his 30s and has a steady job, he is not looking to settle. He is only looking for sex.

Women need to understand it and work towards becoming more independent in their 20s.

Women need to do the following in their 20s and trust me that they will not be lacking for serious, good quality and suitable suitors.
-Get their professional credentials in order. Study, intern, get degrees.
-Travel
-Build a nest egg by maxing out retirement saving as much as possible.
-Consider buying a condo or house if you are stable in your profession and intend to stay at a place for 5 years or so.
-Take care of their health and fitness, work towards their mental health or other issues fixed through therapy and workshops
-Take care of any cosmetic issues - lasik, laser hair removal, crooked teeth etc
- Develop hobbies, get involved with charities and non-profit work.
- Connect with people and keep in touch with them. Develop and nurture professional connections. Network.
- Expand their personal horizon, get new experiences - sports, travel, museums, art, theatre, book clubs, try new food, learn new language.
- Date a lot of people who treat you nicely from different walks of life.

What has happened to make men this way? I hate this idea that your 20s are just an extended period of adolescence and it's not "real" adulthood anymore. It is! Twenty somethings are more than capable of being adults.

Np actually this is a great list. As a female I wasn’t really mature enough in my twenties to commit and have kids. I guess I could have ‘stepped up’ but I’m glad I didn’t. I travelled a ton, worked hard, partied hard, had a blast. Learned a lot about life and myself that you just don’t figure out until you are on your own. Only thing I didn’t do from this list was buy a condo or do the cosmetic stuff. Now I’m out in the suburbs with two kids and SO glad I had that time. My friends who married in their twenties really felt like they missed out, especially on travel, if they had kids earlier. Some are already divorced. I don’t think it’s necessarily ideal for women. OTOH I feel sooo tired now having two young kids at 40, and I almost didn’t get to have them due to age. So there are definitely trade offs. But OP should tell her SIL to stop worrying about boys and just have a blast!

OP's sister is in her LATE twenties. It's a normal time to start looking around for a mate.

Nothing wrong with the list that quoted PP made. However, there IS something wrong with men thinking that "finding the one" before age 40 is a fate worse than death. Their mamas didn't raise them right.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP where does she live?

NY - Brooklyn

That's the problem. Many of my friends left NYC for love. It is just a dating culture and encourages guys to remain bachelors til their 40s.

x 1000

LA too. Apparently also SF (tech bro culture) and Charleston (weirdly enough).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is she asking your advice? Doesn't seem like it.

If she wants a serious relationship she'll find guys who do. There are plenty out there, especially at her age. In all honesty I am much more concerned about my relatives who "met the one" in their teens (a cousin is getting married this week in the summer before her senior year at college to the only boyfriend she's ever had) than someone who dates casually through their twenties.

My advice? No because I obviously have none. But she was definitely venting that she'll meet a great guy who has a lot going for him and who wants to hang out in a way that I would have qualified as boyfriend/girlfriend. But he doesn't want to be "exclusive" (even if they are spending all their time together so they are exclusive - he just doesn't want to close out the possibility of meeting someone even better) and he doesn't want to mislead her that it might lead to marriage because he won't be ready to settle down for years yet.

To add to this, she says it's frustrating because this is all the great men she and her friends meet. Her friends will try to make something of this type of arrangement ("cool girl" syndrome she called it) and it almost never works.

What I'm saying is, it must be soooo frustrating because it's like the men have all the power in this scenario because they are withholding.

eh, it sounds like one of two things 1) she is going for men who are out of her league and she needs to set her sights on someone less "perfect" 2) she is really not that interested in dealing with a long term commitment but wants to be perceived as a "good girl" even though what she really likes is new sex and the thrill of the hunt.

She might even be a combo of the two.

This is a good comment. OP I dated casually through my twenties but if a relative who settled down at 19 asked me about my relationship status (trying to live some SATC fantasy vicariously) I would probably make noises about how it's fun to date but I wish I could find "the one" even though that's not actually what I was looking for at the time. Easier than the conversation about how I'm living and enjoying a very different life than you have NOT THAT THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH YOUR LIFE, or you listening to me talk about various different dates and then leaving the conversation thinking (/telling people) that I'm slutty or have no morals.

"I'm meeting great guys but no one that wants to settle down" is honest while still making you feel like she's the same type of girl you are, in a different situation. Look how mad you are at these guys you've never met - she was right to direct that judgment away from herself.

OP here. Yeah I have to say, you're totally projecting. This is not the conversation we had. You're imagining things based on judgement you may have felt in your own life.

Op, I never bothered much with the "good girl" act but I know a lot of women that did. You are convinced that "ALL" men are commitment phobes but the common denominator is this young woman...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am LOLing at all the 1950s "don't give the milk away for free advice"

That's DCUM for you!

So many frumpy middle aged women who haven't dated in decades think they can weigh in on what men (really boys) in their 20s will respond to.

They obviously no nothing, just ignore that BS.

If you say you are fine with sex without commitment and go out with someone that wants sex without commitment why then be shocked that you aren’t in a committed relationship?

But pray tell, what great evolution do you think has happened with men in their 20’s over the last 20 years that would make a guy that says he doesn’t want to settle down, decide to settle down with a woman that wants a relationship but accepts less than that? Because I haven’t see any evidence of guys in their late 20’s with no intention of settling down saying “Ohhh you mean independent, career minded “cool girls” that don’t require a relationship, let me put a ring on it”. But it behooves guys to keep the myth alive that right woman can change them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is she asking your advice? Doesn't seem like it.

If she wants a serious relationship she'll find guys who do. There are plenty out there, especially at her age. In all honesty I am much more concerned about my relatives who "met the one" in their teens (a cousin is getting married this week in the summer before her senior year at college to the only boyfriend she's ever had) than someone who dates casually through their twenties.

My advice? No because I obviously have none. But she was definitely venting that she'll meet a great guy who has a lot going for him and who wants to hang out in a way that I would have qualified as boyfriend/girlfriend. But he doesn't want to be "exclusive" (even if they are spending all their time together so they are exclusive - he just doesn't want to close out the possibility of meeting someone even better) and he doesn't want to mislead her that it might lead to marriage because he won't be ready to settle down for years yet.

To add to this, she says it's frustrating because this is all the great men she and her friends meet. Her friends will try to make something of this type of arrangement ("cool girl" syndrome she called it) and it almost never works.

What I'm saying is, it must be soooo frustrating because it's like the men have all the power in this scenario because they are withholding.

Well, duh, playing the “cool girl” never works. It shows you have no self esteem and will settle for scraps. Of course no man wants to commit to that, and no man is attracted to desperation.

It’s pretty disturbing that you use the term “withholding”. Nobody is entitled to something that another person doesn’t want to give. It’s no different than single guys complaining that women “withhold” sex.

Because these guys are more than happy to act the part of a boyfriend (hanging out every night, meeting the friends, practically living together on weekends, etc.) and not use the term and not be willing to give up the possibility of other women. That's withholding!

Females do this all the time- enjoy the perks of being a “girlfriend” without having sex with the guy. They shouldn’t be criticized for withholding because that’s not a right the other person is entitled to. Same applies when the sexes are reversed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am LOLing at all the 1950s "don't give the milk away for free advice"

That's DCUM for you!

So many frumpy middle aged women who haven't dated in decades think they can weigh in on what men (really boys) in their 20s will respond to.

They obviously no nothing, just ignore that BS.

If you say you are fine with sex without commitment and go out with someone that wants sex without commitment why then be shocked that you aren’t in a committed relationship?

But pray tell, what great evolution do you think has happened with men in their 20’s over the last 20 years that would make a guy that says he doesn’t want to settle down, decide to settle down with a woman that wants a relationship but accepts less than that? Because I haven’t see any evidence of guys in their late 20’s with no intention of settling down saying “Ohhh you mean independent, career minded “cool girls” that don’t require a relationship, let me put a ring on it”. But it behooves guys to keep the myth alive that right woman can change them.

What?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is she asking your advice? Doesn't seem like it.

If she wants a serious relationship she'll find guys who do. There are plenty out there, especially at her age. In all honesty I am much more concerned about my relatives who "met the one" in their teens (a cousin is getting married this week in the summer before her senior year at college to the only boyfriend she's ever had) than someone who dates casually through their twenties.

My advice? No because I obviously have none. But she was definitely venting that she'll meet a great guy who has a lot going for him and who wants to hang out in a way that I would have qualified as boyfriend/girlfriend. But he doesn't want to be "exclusive" (even if they are spending all their time together so they are exclusive - he just doesn't want to close out the possibility of meeting someone even better) and he doesn't want to mislead her that it might lead to marriage because he won't be ready to settle down for years yet.

To add to this, she says it's frustrating because this is all the great men she and her friends meet. Her friends will try to make something of this type of arrangement ("cool girl" syndrome she called it) and it almost never works.

What I'm saying is, it must be soooo frustrating because it's like the men have all the power in this scenario because they are withholding.

Well, duh, playing the “cool girl” never works. It shows you have no self esteem and will settle for scraps. Of course no man wants to commit to that, and no man is attracted to desperation.

It’s pretty disturbing that you use the term “withholding”. Nobody is entitled to something that another person doesn’t want to give. It’s no different than single guys complaining that women “withhold” sex.

Because these guys are more than happy to act the part of a boyfriend (hanging out every night, meeting the friends, practically living together on weekends, etc.) and not use the term and not be willing to give up the possibility of other women. That's withholding!

Oh please. Like the woman in that relationship wouldn't ditch him if a better guy came along. Even if she said she was "committed" and "acted the part of a girlfriend".

He's not doing anything that pretty much every woman doesn't do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unless a man is in his 30s and has a steady job, he is not looking to settle. He is only looking for sex.

Women need to understand it and work towards becoming more independent in their 20s.

Women need to do the following in their 20s and trust me that they will not be lacking for serious, good quality and suitable suitors.
-Get their professional credentials in order. Study, intern, get degrees.
-Travel
-Build a nest egg by maxing out retirement saving as much as possible.
-Consider buying a condo or house if you are stable in your profession and intend to stay at a place for 5 years or so.
-Take care of their health and fitness, work towards their mental health or other issues fixed through therapy and workshops
-Take care of any cosmetic issues - lasik, laser hair removal, crooked teeth etc
- Develop hobbies, get involved with charities and non-profit work.
- Connect with people and keep in touch with them. Develop and nurture professional connections. Network.
- Expand their personal horizon, get new experiences - sports, travel, museums, art, theatre, book clubs, try new food, learn new language.
- Date a lot of people who treat you nicely from different walks of life.

What has happened to make men this way?

Feminism made marriage a shit deal for men, and allowed men to get sex without it. Men are just playing by the rules women set.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is she asking your advice? Doesn't seem like it.

If she wants a serious relationship she'll find guys who do. There are plenty out there, especially at her age. In all honesty I am much more concerned about my relatives who "met the one" in their teens (a cousin is getting married this week in the summer before her senior year at college to the only boyfriend she's ever had) than someone who dates casually through their twenties.

My advice? No because I obviously have none. But she was definitely venting that she'll meet a great guy who has a lot going for him and who wants to hang out in a way that I would have qualified as boyfriend/girlfriend. But he doesn't want to be "exclusive" (even if they are spending all their time together so they are exclusive - he just doesn't want to close out the possibility of meeting someone even better) and he doesn't want to mislead her that it might lead to marriage because he won't be ready to settle down for years yet.

She needs to stop having sex until after she has the discussing about exclusivity. Make guys wait a little and make them take their profiles down etc before sex.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am LOLing at all the 1950s "don't give the milk away for free advice"

That's DCUM for you!

So many frumpy middle aged women who haven't dated in decades think they can weigh in on what men (really boys) in their 20s will respond to.

They obviously no nothing, just ignore that BS.

This advice worked for me 8 years ago when I met my now husband. I was 26 at the time. We had several dates and sex didn't happen until there had been an exclusivity discussion, about a month after meeting. I have a really hard time believing it's become "outdated advice" in that period of time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP where does she live?

NY - Brooklyn

Oooh, New York sucks -- definitely filled with a lot of pretentious man-babies.

My advice to her would be to not waste a single minute with a guy who just wants to hook up and not be in a committed relationship, or who states from the outset some kind of opposition to marriage in general. As much as it PAINS me to say it, "he's just not into you" is good advice. (For both genders, actually.)

Then she needs to start deliberately looking for men who want to settle down. Maybe a bit older (mid-late 30s) and in professions that are less jerky -- avoid artists, musicians, Wall Street types.

On the flip side, she needs to be honest with herself about whether she's picking the "cool impressive guy" to focus on, and not the types who would actually settle down. If she's drawn to the drama, she needs to cut that sh*t out right away.