Resentment - impasse over home improvement

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At some point you are going to sell the house and you’d need to upgrade the kitchen and bathrooms to get full value, and not just repainting the cabinets. Many buyers will not want to take on the project so you are limiting the audience. Doing it now will save you money in the long run and you will get to enjoy it. Come up with a redo and timing that is the least disruptive to your living there.

OP here. I know all of this and have said it all repeatedly. Falls on deaf ears. I feel confident that rationale and common sense are on my side. It doesn’t matter - it’s like talking to a brick wall on this subject. He’s perfectly pleasant on other subjects. Funny, a good father. We take vacations, he doesn’t nit pick day to day household spending. But any mention of this and he’s just like “mmm hmmm, that’s nice, but NO.”

No. This isn’t the reason to do it. This makes it sound like a chore that you have to do and will try to get him to participate in.
Make it sound more like a vacation to Paris where you stay at beautiful hotels and eat at expensive restaurants. Yes, it’s expensive, but you will absolutely love it and be grateful to him for providing it for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At some point you are going to sell the house and you’d need to upgrade the kitchen and bathrooms to get full value, and not just repainting the cabinets. Many buyers will not want to take on the project so you are limiting the audience. Doing it now will save you money in the long run and you will get to enjoy it. Come up with a redo and timing that is the least disruptive to your living there.

OP here. I know all of this and have said it all repeatedly. Falls on deaf ears. I feel confident that rationale and common sense are on my side. It doesn’t matter - it’s like talking to a brick wall on this subject. He’s perfectly pleasant on other subjects. Funny, a good father. We take vacations, he doesn’t nit pick day to day household spending. But any mention of this and he’s just like “mmm hmmm, that’s nice, but NO.”

What does he value? Say NO to whatever it is he wants to buy or do.

Sadly, he values growing numbers on a balance sheet. He wins, I lose. I do work, but he makes way more. I am by far the primary parent though and handle the mental load, the food planning/shopping/prepping and most of the cleaning.

You’ve capitulated way too easily.

Based on what you shared, it IS about the money. He values investing more than a kitchen.

Which is why you need to get a new job, a second job, etc to fund the renovation.

Who will cook, clean and do all the laundry while I’m at my second job? Your idea sounds nice, but I’m pretty stuck unless I want family life to collapse which I don’t.

Gosh can’t imagine why you don’t have your new kitchen.

You do NOT know how to get your way. Defeatist attitude and unwilling to take necessary steps to get what you want.

[Anonymous]

Tough call. I am a woman but would be like the husband in this situation though I sympathize with OP as well.

This isn't some small little thing she wants. It's tens of thousands of dollars for something that is mostly cosmetic. Plus it comes with quality of life inconvenience (and most people are not going to want to rent another house while it's being done!). And she's already like "and you should see our bathrooms..." so you can see where this is going. He's thinking if they open the floodgates with this, it's going to be a new project every year and they may as well just get a new house in a couple ofyears (smaller because the kids will be in college). That makes a ton of sense, I'd 100% be the one making those arguments.


Otoh wifes arguments are valid too. She works and keeps house. They nominally agreed to this in the past. There are cracks that need fixing. They have the money in theory.

What you definitely shouldn't do is the face-lift because you'll still be unhappy with that and your husband will be annoyed you spent the money and still don't like it.

I think you need a heart to heart about finances in general and that you feel undervalued because you make less. A portion of money should be set aside each year for household repairs. And if that money doesn't end up being used for an emergency then use what is left for this remodel.

[Anonymous]

Start selling stuff gifts he has given etc. to start savings. He can do the extra cooking and cleaning while you are gone or hire out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would go to counseling to see if you can get past this together. What is at the root if his hesitation? Is it living through it? If so consider a temp rental and using a company this will deliver within framework. If it’s money then go through accounts/compare to transaction costa of selling/buying. If it’s that he doesn’t care and you do then get to counseling for deeper issues.

Facelifts can help if that’s all that’s needed but sometimes it’s throwing good money after bad. 10 years ago My mom (who did not consult me even though I’ve designed/overseen 4 kitchen remodels) replaced her counters, backsplash, lighting, floor but didn’t want to replace her 40 year old dated cabinets in poor shape or redo the counters a bit to accommodate a wider fridge (she has a tiny 30” wide frig) because she thought it would be a hassle (still took them 10 weeks because they came when they felt like it). . She just repainted them. They have dated arches, interiors are gross/dirty, old rickety drawers that squeak, years of grime,, 30” height with a large gap to ceiling, , the paint wore off in 2 years and the painful part is that she spent 40k on the rest of the refresh ; another 25 k and she could have had a gorgeous functional kitchen. Now we are trying to rent her home and will probably have to redo the kitchen but it paint me to tear out perfectly decent counters and backsplash etc.

I don't know, I'd frame the counseling around the fact that she's seething over not having an updated kitchen when her kitchen and house is probably a lot nicer than most.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, have a bunch of your friends/neighbors recently done remodels or something?

You mean in the last 10 years since we bought the house? I mean, yes I guess, it’s a pretty common activity in UMC areas with older homes.

Right. And have they regaled your spouse with stories of wild cost overruns, miserable timeline overruns, flake contractors, discovering problems midstream, and massive disruption - maybe including needing to move out temporarily when that wasn’t part of the renovation plan, either?
Ours certainly have an it’s definitely made an impression on me, enough so that i will not remodel for the sport of it - and what you are talking about is a sport remodel - during our already insanely busy years with the kids at home.
A decade ago I too thought we’d remodel in a few years but now I feel differently. A decade ago I would have said that I was open to the idea of building a home from scratch! And then I saw everyone else go through it, including extreme financial stress, moving out, brink of divorce, “never again” comments.
I’m not saying that’s what would happen to you guys - and it sounds like this rift with your husband is about larger issues, honestly - but I can completely understand him changing his mind or dragging his feet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are your current kitchen and bathrooms non-functional or just out of date?

I guess they function. There is a huge long crack in our old kitchen granite and some of the cabinets don’t close properly. The grout in the bathrooms is missing or discolored in many places. And yes everything is from the 90’s.

But I think what bothers me is that this is important to me and he just does not care. He thinks I should just get over it and see things his way, the only correct way to see the situation.

Not really what functional means. Is the current layout fine such that you may only need a refresh? Is there a triangle (Google it) where all the main features are easily accessible to each other? Or is your fridge in the garage and stove on the balcony or some odd 1920’s house crazy layout?

I’d start with the bathroom the kids use the most and get that done. Even if you pay for it yourself all in should be less than $12k. Be over the top happy about it and he will let you get the kitchen done. If anything goes wrong tell him you really need his help on the next project even if it’s right tell him that

[Anonymous]

Do you have equal access to the money?
I would ignore him and just do it. Let him throw a tantrum about it.

[Anonymous]

With someone like him, you have to play hardball. Stop cooking and cleaning for the family. Start driving for DoorDash and tell everyone it is to save for a new kitchen.
Or just ignore him and write a couple big checks to a kitchen designer or contractor.
It will be uncomfortable temporarily but the final result will be worth it. Otherwise stop complaining I guess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
My husband, who escaped a war as a child and suffered extreme deprivation, is now a financially-successful adult who cannot spend his wealth. He also hoards. These are the consequences of lasting trauma from childhood. He is completely unattached to material things, or how they look or are perceived by others.

We bought one house, very old and rickety but on valuable land in a desirable neighborhood. He agreed to critical renovations, but there are still so many things that could use an upgrade, that will never get done. Our cars are ancient and beaten up, but won't get replaced until they literally cannot move. He doesn't replace his clothes unless there are holes or visible stains.

Meanwhile we have 10M+ in various assets. Thank goodness, he became successful through education, and he is willing to spend on our children's education as well. Otherwise I would divorce him.

So you have all my sympathies. The only way I can get him to spend is by dint of persistent persuasion, where I present all my arguments with scientific precision. Sometimes it takes years to get him to make a purchase. Keep trying.

On the cars, there’s no way. I would tell him my car is making a noise. Call him from somewhere and tell him it won’t start. Call him back 5 minutes later and tell him it came on.

I’m a bad influence. 😞

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:At some point you are going to sell the house and you’d need to upgrade the kitchen and bathrooms to get full value, and not just repainting the cabinets. Many buyers will not want to take on the project so you are limiting the audience. Doing it now will save you money in the long run and you will get to enjoy it. Come up with a redo and timing that is the least disruptive to your living there.

OP here. I know all of this and have said it all repeatedly. Falls on deaf ears. I feel confident that rationale and common sense are on my side. It doesn’t matter - it’s like talking to a brick wall on this subject. He’s perfectly pleasant on other subjects. Funny, a good father. We take vacations, he doesn’t nit pick day to day household spending. But any mention of this and he’s just like “mmm hmmm, that’s nice, but NO.”

What does he value? Say NO to whatever it is he wants to buy or do.

Sadly, he values growing numbers on a balance sheet. He wins, I lose. I do work, but he makes way more. I am by far the primary parent though and handle the mental load, the food planning/shopping/prepping and most of the cleaning.

You’ve capitulated way too easily.

Based on what you shared, it IS about the money. He values investing more than a kitchen.

Which is why you need to get a new job, a second job, etc to fund the renovation.

Who will cook, clean and do all the laundry while I’m at my second job? Your idea sounds nice, but I’m pretty stuck unless I want family life to collapse which I don’t.

That’s the point! Let the house look like a wasteland if DH doesn’t clean on the weekend while you are working. If he speaks up tell him it’s temporary until you get the money for the kitchen which at your wages could take … 3 little years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think this obsession with not looking “dated” is stupid and a result of all those HGTV shows. Anything you do now will look “dated” in 10 years. The idea that a kitchen should always look contemporary is insanity.

Except the kitchen never looked new. Except to the people who lived in the house before us. By this logic no one should ever have anything new at all because one day it will be old?

[Anonymous]

A friend of mine used to hire the workman to remodel when her DH went out of town so there would be less argument about it. She was upfront about getting these things done, so it wasn't too much of a shock when he came home. As long as she managed it, dealt with the cleaning up, etc... he didn't make too much of a fuss.

I've been through a few remodels, including two kitchen remodels, and it is very time consuming, messy, and inconvenient.

[Anonymous]

Team DH. Have you ever lived through a kitchen remodel? Typically you need to move out.

I don't get the argument at all. Just buy a house that's updated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do you have equal access to the money?
I would ignore him and just do it. Let him throw a tantrum about it.

+1. Given he has acknowledged that you can afford it, I would just tell him I was doing it. And then, I would go do it.