GF went out on ..not sure what to call it...with a random guy..advice sought

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women spend their whole lives figuring out how to gently let men down without making it awkward (or even deadly). Men can be really nasty if you don't, and she has a relationship to maintain here for her daughter's sake.

+1

If that guy doesn't figure out that she's not interested, he's a moron. She took his statements at face value (he wanted her advice on dating) as a way to let him down easy.

Taking him at face value is how she lets him save face. It was "just as a friend." "Just for advice," so no reason not to bring along someone else, right? And she talks about you and how happy she is, but now he can pretend it was just "as a friend" and he "got his advice" from the happily partnered and gregarious woman who is, after all, "just a friend." Obviously.

This is how women have to play the game. This means he doesn't have to swallow the feeling of being rejected which, often, would be acted out on her instead of being swallowed and dealt with.

No, that is not how women have to play the game. If they're not interested, they can say so. It is not even how women actually do play the game. If they're not interested, they make it totally clear. They won't meet you some place for drinks. But she did not do that in this case.

SHE is the one who is pretending she met him "just as a friend". That (and bringing her pal along) was her cover for having a date with this guy. The only question is whether or not the OP is weak enough to let her get away with it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women spend their whole lives figuring out how to gently let men down without making it awkward (or even deadly). Men can be really nasty if you don't, and she has a relationship to maintain here for her daughter's sake.

+1

If that guy doesn't figure out that she's not interested, he's a moron. She took his statements at face value (he wanted her advice on dating) as a way to let him down easy.

Taking him at face value is how she lets him save face. It was "just as a friend." "Just for advice," so no reason not to bring along someone else, right? And she talks about you and how happy she is, but now he can pretend it was just "as a friend" and he "got his advice" from the happily partnered and gregarious woman who is, after all, "just a friend." Obviously.

This is how women have to play the game. This means he doesn't have to swallow the feeling of being rejected which, often, would be acted out on her instead of being swallowed and dealt with.

No, that is not how women have to play the game. If they're not interested, they can say so. It is not even how women actually do play the game. If they're not interested, they make it totally clear. They won't meet you some place for drinks. But she did not do that in this case.

SHE is the one who is pretending she met him "just as a friend". That (and bringing her pal along) was her cover for having a date with this guy. The only question is whether or not the OP is weak enough to let her get away with it.

What percentage of the time do you think a woman -- an attractive, friendly, gregarious unmarried woman -- gets "taught a lesson" in some manner by a guy she interacts with regularly, after flatly rejecting him?

[Anonymous]

What Dan Harmon did is not uncommon.

What is uncommon is that he recognized it and apologized for it without making excuses -- even though he had to literally hide his face behind his hands to get through it.

“I was humiliated. So I continued to do the cowardly thing. I continued to do the selfish thing. Now I wanted to teach her a lesson. I wanted to show her that if she didn’t like being liked in that way then, oh boy, she should get over herself. After all, if you’re just going to be a writer then this is how ‘just writers’ get treated,” Harmon continued. “And that was probably the darkest of it all.”

https://uproxx.com/culture/dan-harmon-megan-ganz-apology/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women spend their whole lives figuring out how to gently let men down without making it awkward (or even deadly). Men can be really nasty if you don't, and she has a relationship to maintain here for her daughter's sake.

+1

If that guy doesn't figure out that she's not interested, he's a moron. She took his statements at face value (he wanted her advice on dating) as a way to let him down easy.

Taking him at face value is how she lets him save face. It was "just as a friend." "Just for advice," so no reason not to bring along someone else, right? And she talks about you and how happy she is, but now he can pretend it was just "as a friend" and he "got his advice" from the happily partnered and gregarious woman who is, after all, "just a friend." Obviously.

This is how women have to play the game. This means he doesn't have to swallow the feeling of being rejected which, often, would be acted out on her instead of being swallowed and dealt with.

No, that is not how women have to play the game. If they're not interested, they can say so. It is not even how women actually do play the game. If they're not interested, they make it totally clear. They won't meet you some place for drinks. But she did not do that in this case.

SHE is the one who is pretending she met him "just as a friend". That (and bringing her pal along) was her cover for having a date with this guy. The only question is whether or not the OP is weak enough to let her get away with it.

What percentage of the time do you think a woman -- an attractive, friendly, gregarious unmarried woman -- gets "taught a lesson" in some manner by a guy she interacts with regularly, after flatly rejecting him?

Zero. The guy just goes away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Why women have to tread more lightly with men has been explained by 8 different people, but there are none so blind as them that will not see.

Every man has been repeatedly rejected by women - usually clearly and firmly, but sometimes brutally - which is why we don’t believe this bullshit about how the OPs girlfriend was “treading lightly” with the guy. A woman is just not going to meet a guy if she’s not interested. We’re not blind to this explanation, we simply don’t believe it because it’s not true.

Of course, men know better than women because men have met women. Women are just women, what would they know about being women?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women spend their whole lives figuring out how to gently let men down without making it awkward (or even deadly). Men can be really nasty if you don't, and she has a relationship to maintain here for her daughter's sake.

+1

If that guy doesn't figure out that she's not interested, he's a moron. She took his statements at face value (he wanted her advice on dating) as a way to let him down easy.

Taking him at face value is how she lets him save face. It was "just as a friend." "Just for advice," so no reason not to bring along someone else, right? And she talks about you and how happy she is, but now he can pretend it was just "as a friend" and he "got his advice" from the happily partnered and gregarious woman who is, after all, "just a friend." Obviously.

This is how women have to play the game. This means he doesn't have to swallow the feeling of being rejected which, often, would be acted out on her instead of being swallowed and dealt with.

No, that is not how women have to play the game. If they're not interested, they can say so. It is not even how women actually do play the game. If they're not interested, they make it totally clear. They won't meet you some place for drinks. But she did not do that in this case.

SHE is the one who is pretending she met him "just as a friend". That (and bringing her pal along) was her cover for having a date with this guy. The only question is whether or not the OP is weak enough to let her get away with it.

What percentage of the time do you think a woman -- an attractive, friendly, gregarious unmarried woman -- gets "taught a lesson" in some manner by a guy she interacts with regularly, after flatly rejecting him?

Zero. The guy just goes away.

And that tells anyone reading all they need to know about the accuracy and judgment underlying (or not) your opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP

And, am I wrong that this was his attempt to ask her out on a date?

It does not sound like a date to me. I am a woman. If someone asks me advice about dating, that is a friend.

This. I don't think this is a big deal. She brought a friend, gave honest advice. Whats the problem? Maybe he is semi-interested in her, probably. But she didn't take the bait and show up alone and let the conversation wander to the two of them. She was trying to be nice. It can be awkward to flat out tell a guy no, I think saying yes and bringing her friend (and likely talking about you, her boyfriend, at some point in the conversation about dating) she at least made it clear she isn't interested in dating him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Women spend their whole lives figuring out how to gently let men down without making it awkward (or even deadly). Men can be really nasty if you don't, and she has a relationship to maintain here for her daughter's sake.

+1

If that guy doesn't figure out that she's not interested, he's a moron. She took his statements at face value (he wanted her advice on dating) as a way to let him down easy.

Taking him at face value is how she lets him save face. It was "just as a friend." "Just for advice," so no reason not to bring along someone else, right? And she talks about you and how happy she is, but now he can pretend it was just "as a friend" and he "got his advice" from the happily partnered and gregarious woman who is, after all, "just a friend." Obviously.

This is how women have to play the game. This means he doesn't have to swallow the feeling of being rejected which, often, would be acted out on her instead of being swallowed and dealt with.

No, that is not how women have to play the game. If they're not interested, they can say so. It is not even how women actually do play the game. If they're not interested, they make it totally clear. They won't meet you some place for drinks. But she did not do that in this case.

SHE is the one who is pretending she met him "just as a friend". That (and bringing her pal along) was her cover for having a date with this guy. The only question is whether or not the OP is weak enough to let her get away with it.

What percentage of the time do you think a woman -- an attractive, friendly, gregarious unmarried woman -- gets "taught a lesson" in some manner by a guy she interacts with regularly, after flatly rejecting him?

Zero.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP

And, am I wrong that this was his attempt to ask her out on a date?

It does not sound like a date to me. I am a woman. If someone asks me advice about dating, that is a friend.

This. I don't think this is a big deal. She brought a friend, gave honest advice. Whats the problem? Maybe he is semi-interested in her, probably. But she didn't take the bait and show up alone and let the conversation wander to the two of them. She was trying to be nice. It can be awkward to flat out tell a guy no, I think saying yes and bringing her friend (and likely talking about you, her boyfriend, at some point in the conversation about dating) she at least made it clear she isn't interested in dating him.

This is not a friend. It is some random guy who saw her and asked her out. She said yes and who knows if she brought the friend a long or what they talked about. I bet she gave advice on how to date herself. I wonder if OP asked if they are exclusive? Many of the posters who defend OP’s girlfriend like to play that game. OP if you have not asked if you are exclusive the woman is free to play the field.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Something doesn't add up. She was intrigued by the offer, which is why she accepted and brought the friend to justify actually following through with it. If she were not interested she would have shut the door instantly.

OP

I agree and asked her about this.

Here is her answer--obvi paraphrasing.

"In my marriage I ended up with no friends of my own. We had lots of friends as a couple but I didn't really have my own. In divorcing, I am determined to have a cadre of my own friends, men and women. When this guy called, I figured he is in my circle. I see him at games and such. He could be a friend."

This is both why she said she wanted to go; And, why she said she didn't invite me to go with.

I offer that without comment, not that I don't have feelings around it.

By the way, I'm all for her having a circle of friends that she sees, talks to and so on--men and women. I wouldn't want to take that away from her. I think it is good for her and us. I want her to be happy.

That said, what I asked here remains my concern: was this "date-not-date" really a friend thing? Should I be concerned about it?

I'm good with her doing friend things with guys who aren't trying to f*^k her, but if the guy wants that, it doesn't seem like a fiend thing to me--and not something I can go along with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Something doesn't add up. She was intrigued by the offer, which is why she accepted and brought the friend to justify actually following through with it. If she were not interested she would have shut the door instantly.

OP

I agree and asked her about this.

Here is her answer--obvi paraphrasing.

"In my marriage I ended up with no friends of my own. We had lots of friends as a couple but I didn't really have my own. In divorcing, I am determined to have a cadre of my own friends, men and women. When this guy called, I figured he is in my circle. I see him at games and such. He could be a friend."

This is both why she said she wanted to go; And, why she said she didn't invite me to go with.

I offer that without comment, not that I don't have feelings around it.

By the way, I'm all for her having a circle of friends that she sees, talks to and so on--men and women. I wouldn't want to take that away from her. I think it is good for her and us. I want her to be happy.

That said, what I asked here remains my concern: was this "date-not-date" really a friend thing? Should I be concerned about it?

I'm good with her doing friend things with guys who aren't trying to f*^k her, but if the guy wants that, it doesn't seem like a fiend thing to me--and not something I can go along with.

You should do her a favor and break up. Every update you look like a worse boyfriend. She's being incredibly honest and transparent with you and you are determined to believe she is a liar and a sneak. She deserves better.

If you think "she's allowed to have male friends, but not male friends that are attracted to her" is a reasonable rule or one that you have the right to enunciate or enforce for your "gregarious, fun, vibrant" girlfriend, you are an idiot. Men will be attracted to her for the same reasons you are. The question is whether you trust her, and despite her almost pathological honesty with you, it's clear you do not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She got asked out on a date that he tried to frame as "not a date" (just wants advice!) and turned it into not-a-date for real (bringing a girlfriend, talking about her boyfriend). I think that your discomfort makes sense but also that you might not understand, as a guy, the layers women have to navigate to keep guys from feeling rejected when you reject them. Their kids are on a team together so she has to see him in the future and if he gets his feelings hurt he could make it extremely uncomfortable. He could badmouth her to other parents, harass her when he sees her, stalk her, get violent, none of it is out of the realm of reality.

Why didn't she bring op?

I think bringing OP would have been a ridiculous move. She knows this guy through her kid, not her social life. The only reason to bring OP would be if she wanted the two of them to fight or for the guy whose kid is on her kid's sports team to be humiliated and hate her. The way she handled it was remarkably clever - didn't box the guy into a corner where his only option was to feel like a total ass while also making it extremely clear she was not going to be accidentally trapped into going on a date with him by his ploy.

You people are so mad that women know how to handle men that you're essentially saying she's a whore for not forcing OP to handle her business for her. It's interesting because the double bind is apparently not enough - you want a triple bind where a woman can't say yes or no and has to say "help!" so that you can turn around and call her helpless or needy or something.

So you would have been cool with your boyfriend going on a date with another woman to talk about dating?

If I was dating a dad and someone he knew through his kid's activities asked him out on a "this is not a date" pretense and he outmaneuvered her like this, brought a person to turn it into not a date, talked about how happy he was with me, and told me the whole thing I would be fine with it.

Wow. Outmaneuvered? But why? Why go through all that when he could just say no thanks?

He certainly could, which is why "what's if it was opposite day" is a bad premise. But I didn't create the premise. Why women have to tread more lightly with men has been explained by 8 different people, but there are none so blind as them that will not see.

What a load if BS. No you are just a player loving the power, drama and attention of string multiple men a long. No means no, maybe mean try again(but most men will move) and yes mean you go out. OP girlfriend said yes. The only thing we know is she went on a date with another man.

OP girlfriend said she brought a friend. Did she or did she just tell OP she brought her friend? No way of knowing. She said they talked about dating. Who knows what they talked about on their date. She says the guy is some random from a kids activity group or are they friends?

Here is the thing. No man asks a woman out on a date to get advice about dating. She went on a date with another guy and admitted it. She must have been caught by the OP. OP is still processing things but is slowly realizing what happened.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Something doesn't add up. She was intrigued by the offer, which is why she accepted and brought the friend to justify actually following through with it. If she were not interested she would have shut the door instantly.

OP

I agree and asked her about this.

Here is her answer--obvi paraphrasing.

"In my marriage I ended up with no friends of my own. We had lots of friends as a couple but I didn't really have my own. In divorcing, I am determined to have a cadre of my own friends, men and women. When this guy called, I figured he is in my circle. I see him at games and such. He could be a friend."

This is both why she said she wanted to go; And, why she said she didn't invite me to go with.

I offer that without comment, not that I don't have feelings around it.

By the way, I'm all for her having a circle of friends that she sees, talks to and so on--men and women. I wouldn't want to take that away from her. I think it is good for her and us. I want her to be happy.

That said, what I asked here remains my concern: was this "date-not-date" really a friend thing? Should I be concerned about it?

I'm good with her doing friend things with guys who aren't trying to f*^k her, but if the guy wants that, it doesn't seem like a fiend thing to me--and not something I can go along with.

You sound controlling, and she is no doubt out of your league. She is an adult and can manage her friendships without you picking apart every interaction. She is trying to be upfront with you about what happened and you still won’t let it go! She didn’t go on a date with him, he asked for advice as a friend, and she is smart enough to know he might be into her and so she brought someone to set him up with. Sounds like she handled it perfectly and you are still whiney. Grow up, or move on and let her date a real man who isn’t so insecure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She got asked out on a date that he tried to frame as "not a date" (just wants advice!) and turned it into not-a-date for real (bringing a girlfriend, talking about her boyfriend). I think that your discomfort makes sense but also that you might not understand, as a guy, the layers women have to navigate to keep guys from feeling rejected when you reject them. Their kids are on a team together so she has to see him in the future and if he gets his feelings hurt he could make it extremely uncomfortable. He could badmouth her to other parents, harass her when he sees her, stalk her, get violent, none of it is out of the realm of reality.

Why didn't she bring op?

I think bringing OP would have been a ridiculous move. She knows this guy through her kid, not her social life. The only reason to bring OP would be if she wanted the two of them to fight or for the guy whose kid is on her kid's sports team to be humiliated and hate her. The way she handled it was remarkably clever - didn't box the guy into a corner where his only option was to feel like a total ass while also making it extremely clear she was not going to be accidentally trapped into going on a date with him by his ploy.

You people are so mad that women know how to handle men that you're essentially saying she's a whore for not forcing OP to handle her business for her. It's interesting because the double bind is apparently not enough - you want a triple bind where a woman can't say yes or no and has to say "help!" so that you can turn around and call her helpless or needy or something.

So you would have been cool with your boyfriend going on a date with another woman to talk about dating?

If I was dating a dad and someone he knew through his kid's activities asked him out on a "this is not a date" pretense and he outmaneuvered her like this, brought a person to turn it into not a date, talked about how happy he was with me, and told me the whole thing I would be fine with it.

Wow. Outmaneuvered? But why? Why go through all that when he could just say no thanks?

He certainly could, which is why "what's if it was opposite day" is a bad premise. But I didn't create the premise. Why women have to tread more lightly with men has been explained by 8 different people, but there are none so blind as them that will not see.

What a load if BS. No you are just a player loving the power, drama and attention of string multiple men a long. No means no, maybe mean try again(but most men will move) and yes mean you go out. OP girlfriend said yes. The only thing we know is she went on a date with another man.

OP girlfriend said she brought a friend. Did she or did she just tell OP she brought her friend? No way of knowing. She said they talked about dating. Who knows what they talked about on their date. She says the guy is some random from a kids activity group or are they friends?

Here is the thing. No man asks a woman out on a date to get advice about dating. She went on a date with another guy and admitted it. She must have been caught by the OP. OP is still processing things but is slowly realizing what happened.

I don't think you know what a date is. You certainly don't know how to read, because you have mischaracterized every piece of information the OP provided. Sorry about your love life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This was inappropriate. She should have said no. Also lol at the "its just so hard for women to navigate relationships we need to go out on random not-dates all the time."

I wouldn't dump because she brought the friend but she should recognize this was not cool. If she was really uncomfortable saying no she should have brought YOU. Then he would get the message fine.

THIS!