Why don't people leave their spouse instead of having affairs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1

Also, I’m the pp who writes that you should get consent from your wives. I’m writing because you asked:
Married for 28years. Have been both sides of the issue and can tell you mature people deal with it as 2 people as opposed to making unilateral decisions.
You don’t want to talk to your wife because you want to have your cake and eat it too. Just selfish.

What is there to deal with? I have had 20+ conversations about the sex drive disparity, what can I do to make it better, how can we solve this together, and it always, always, reverts to 1x per month or so. There is no conversation that leads to permission, only more tears and struggles. I am happy for you that you and your spouse have successfully negotiated varying disparities. I have tried, we haven't, I am enjoying sexual touch again, won't apologize for it, and I didn't ask for this situation.

Maybe you aren't good in bed. If you kept your wife having milnd-blowing orgasms...she would want you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ not true. I know that is not how I would think. I would not assume that I have consented. Just talk to her.

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

So what is the EXACT math when the partner who is being "denied" gets to step out on the marriage? Less than once a month? Once a quarter? Once every two weeks? We need cutoffs!!!

I think years of no sex warrants an affair without judgment.

Well your fellow adulterer thinks once a month gives them the "right" to have an affair.
Which is it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1

Also, I’m the pp who writes that you should get consent from your wives. I’m writing because you asked:
Married for 28years. Have been both sides of the issue and can tell you mature people deal with it as 2 people as opposed to making unilateral decisions.
You don’t want to talk to your wife because you want to have your cake and eat it too. Just selfish.

And what should be the consequence of a unilateral decision to not have sex?

I don’t what should be the consequence in your marriage. That’s up to the 2 of you. It’s your marriage, not mine and so the solution should be yours as well. I can’t tell you what works for you.

I will also say that there are cycles in marriage and so if you value marriage, think long term and know that things don’t remain the same for any situation (whether it’s sex situation or something lease).

Ultimately, either you’re committed or not. If you’re not committed, get out. Don’t cheat.


Anyway, I’m done with this for now. Anything else I say will just be rephrasing of what I have already said. Cheating is not right. No matter what.

[Anonymous]

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

You just made the point for the people arguing that your wife should have a chance to consent. Have you explicitly told your wife that the lack of sex means you will look elsewhere for it? Have you given her a choice between sex and a divorce, or sex and an affair? She deserves a real chance to consent to your extramarital affair or divorce. But of course you haven't had that conversation, because you want to keep your family life and have an AP and being honest would make that impossible. You want to be able to convince yourself that you have justifiable reasons for cheating. You are a cake eater. Stop trying to rationalize your crappy moral code.

[Anonymous]

^+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ not true. I know that is not how I would think. I would not assume that I have consented. Just talk to her.

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

So what is the EXACT math when the partner who is being "denied" gets to step out on the marriage? Less than once a month? Once a quarter? Once every two weeks? We need cutoffs!!!

Ok but I need some precise numbers from you in order to give the exact math. How much actual sex are you having today? In the general population, a normal sex life would be once or twice per week. Now consider your relationship history: how much sex were you having while dating and earlier in the marriage?

Next, consider how often do YOU initiate? How often does he reject you? How often does he initiate? How often do you reject him?

Given these inputs, I can compute whether or now he gets to step out.

Oh so it's an algebraic formula?
A= #times per week while dating
B= #times per week in last year
X=number of times female initiates
Y=number of times male initiates

So maybe its (Y-X)/(B-A) ?

OR MAYBE YOU COULD USE YOUR WORDS AND GET A DIVORCE YOU DONKEY

But the sexless wife doesn't want to divorce, and neither does the normal libido husband. So why are you advising a married couple to divorce when neither of them wants to divorce? You sound like the donkey here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1

Also, I’m the pp who writes that you should get consent from your wives. I’m writing because you asked:
Married for 28years. Have been both sides of the issue and can tell you mature people deal with it as 2 people as opposed to making unilateral decisions.
You don’t want to talk to your wife because you want to have your cake and eat it too. Just selfish.

And what should be the consequence of a unilateral decision to not have sex?

I don’t what should be the consequence in your marriage. That’s up to the 2 of you. It’s your marriage, not mine and so the solution should be yours as well. I can’t tell you what works for you.

I will also say that there are cycles in marriage and so if you value marriage, think long term and know that things don’t remain the same for any situation (whether it’s sex situation or something lease).

Ultimately, either you’re committed or not. If you’re not committed, get out. Don’t cheat.


Anyway, I’m done with this for now. Anything else I say will just be rephrasing of what I have already said. Cheating is not right. No matter what.

Sorry but you cannot have 2 different sets of rules.
"If you’re not committed, get out" must also apply to the sexless rejecting party: get a divorce if you don't want a normal sex life with your spouse.
"there are cycles in marriage and so if you value marriage, think long term and know that things don’t remain the same for any situation" must also apply to a spouse who is finding sex elsewhere... just a cycle... don't worry it will not last forever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

You just made the point for the people arguing that your wife should have a chance to consent. Have you explicitly told your wife that the lack of sex means you will look elsewhere for it? Have you given her a choice between sex and a divorce, or sex and an affair? She deserves a real chance to consent to your extramarital affair or divorce. But of course you haven't had that conversation, because you want to keep your family life and have an AP and being honest would make that impossible. You want to be able to convince yourself that you have justifiable reasons for cheating. You are a cake eater. Stop trying to rationalize your crappy moral code.

Bingo, of course that's what this is. I don't think I can stay happily married without the affair, so I would probably initiate a divorce. But then again, my sex life is lower now and will likely be lower later so perhaps this is a reasonable short term fix.

Anyway, I am not trying to rationalize or say I have a good, bad or indifferent moral code. Some people would have cheated sooner, some never would, some would divorce, some would stay married an miserable.

But basically what you advocate for is the lower libido partner gets to continue to veto a normal sex life until someone finally breaks and asks for an open relationship which they can then amp up the game in response. Count me out for that charade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:+1

Also, I’m the pp who writes that you should get consent from your wives. I’m writing because you asked:
Married for 28years. Have been both sides of the issue and can tell you mature people deal with it as 2 people as opposed to making unilateral decisions.
You don’t want to talk to your wife because you want to have your cake and eat it too. Just selfish.

What is there to deal with? I have had 20+ conversations about the sex drive disparity, what can I do to make it better, how can we solve this together, and it always, always, reverts to 1x per month or so. There is no conversation that leads to permission, only more tears and struggles. I am happy for you that you and your spouse have successfully negotiated varying disparities. I have tried, we haven't, I am enjoying sexual touch again, won't apologize for it, and I didn't ask for this situation.

Maybe you aren't good in bed. If you kept your wife having milnd-blowing orgasms...she would want you.

So less frequency is a reason for cheating, wife making an effort to schedule sex would still be a reason for cheating (doesn’t make you feel wanted), sex with same person for many years can be a reason for cheating (more excitement)....I mean anything can be a reason for cheating. So are you seeing that cheating is your problem? It’s all you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ not true. I know that is not how I would think. I would not assume that I have consented. Just talk to her.

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

So what is the EXACT math when the partner who is being "denied" gets to step out on the marriage? Less than once a month? Once a quarter? Once every two weeks? We need cutoffs!!!

Ok but I need some precise numbers from you in order to give the exact math. How much actual sex are you having today? In the general population, a normal sex life would be once or twice per week. Now consider your relationship history: how much sex were you having while dating and earlier in the marriage?

Next, consider how often do YOU initiate? How often does he reject you? How often does he initiate? How often do you reject him?

Given these inputs, I can compute whether or now he gets to step out.

Oh so it's an algebraic formula?
A= #times per week while dating
B= #times per week in last year
X=number of times female initiates
Y=number of times male initiates

So maybe its (Y-X)/(B-A) ?

OR MAYBE YOU COULD USE YOUR WORDS AND GET A DIVORCE YOU DONKEY

But the sexless wife doesn't want to divorce, and neither does the normal libido husband. So why are you advising a married couple to divorce when neither of them wants to divorce? You sound like the donkey here.

I know honesty, trust and openness are THE WORST. How dare I??
I'm actually an advocate for ethical non-monogamy but not lying, sneaking, cheating etc.

[Anonymous]

^ I’m a proponent of working it out. Looking back, there really is a payoff in staying in marriage. Happiness is a perspective that can be cultivated, especially during those middle year’s when life is challenging.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ not true. I know that is not how I would think. I would not assume that I have consented. Just talk to her.

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

So what is the EXACT math when the partner who is being "denied" gets to step out on the marriage? Less than once a month? Once a quarter? Once every two weeks? We need cutoffs!!!

Ok but I need some precise numbers from you in order to give the exact math. How much actual sex are you having today? In the general population, a normal sex life would be once or twice per week. Now consider your relationship history: how much sex were you having while dating and earlier in the marriage?

Next, consider how often do YOU initiate? How often does he reject you? How often does he initiate? How often do you reject him?

Given these inputs, I can compute whether or now he gets to step out.

Oh so it's an algebraic formula?
A= #times per week while dating
B= #times per week in last year
X=number of times female initiates
Y=number of times male initiates

So maybe its (Y-X)/(B-A) ?

OR MAYBE YOU COULD USE YOUR WORDS AND GET A DIVORCE YOU DONKEY

But the sexless wife doesn't want to divorce, and neither does the normal libido husband. So why are you advising a married couple to divorce when neither of them wants to divorce? You sound like the donkey here.

I know honesty, trust and openness are THE WORST. How dare I??
I'm actually an advocate for ethical non-monogamy but not lying, sneaking, cheating etc.

And what if his spouse isn't into ethical non monogamy? Then back to the lying or be miserable choice

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ I’m a proponent of working it out. Looking back, there really is a payoff in staying in marriage. Happiness is a perspective that can be cultivated, especially during those middle year’s when life is challenging.

You say to "work it out"...... Wife doesn't want sex, husband does. Explain to us (exactly) what does "work it out" look like here?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ not true. I know that is not how I would think. I would not assume that I have consented. Just talk to her.

I am the PP you are responding too. Are you married? Have you been married to someone for two decades, the last decade we have had sex between 10-20x a year, in a good year. And dwindling. You act like we can just sit down and have a rational discussion: hey honey, I'd like to sleep with Cindy. You are cool with it? Great! See you later, don't wait up!

Instead, this conversation would only lead to more tears, more suspicion, more likely to divorce and screw up the family. So I pass on your radical honesty.

Listen, just have a good sexual and intimate relationship with your spouse and you won't have to worry about being in this position.

So what is the EXACT math when the partner who is being "denied" gets to step out on the marriage? Less than once a month? Once a quarter? Once every two weeks? We need cutoffs!!!

Ok but I need some precise numbers from you in order to give the exact math. How much actual sex are you having today? In the general population, a normal sex life would be once or twice per week. Now consider your relationship history: how much sex were you having while dating and earlier in the marriage?

Next, consider how often do YOU initiate? How often does he reject you? How often does he initiate? How often do you reject him?

Given these inputs, I can compute whether or now he gets to step out.

Oh so it's an algebraic formula?
A= #times per week while dating
B= #times per week in last year
X=number of times female initiates
Y=number of times male initiates

So maybe its (Y-X)/(B-A) ?

OR MAYBE YOU COULD USE YOUR WORDS AND GET A DIVORCE YOU DONKEY

But the sexless wife doesn't want to divorce, and neither does the normal libido husband. So why are you advising a married couple to divorce when neither of them wants to divorce? You sound like the donkey here.

I know honesty, trust and openness are THE WORST. How dare I??
I'm actually an advocate for ethical non-monogamy but not lying, sneaking, cheating etc.

But a sexless marriage is already devoid of honesty/trust/openness so why would you demand this of only one spouse?
You are advising him to inform his wife their marriage is now non-monogamous? Is that you, open marriage guy?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ I’m a proponent of working it out. Looking back, there really is a payoff in staying in marriage. Happiness is a perspective that can be cultivated, especially during those middle year’s when life is challenging.

You say to "work it out"...... Wife doesn't want sex, husband does. Explain to us (exactly) what does "work it out" look like here?

Be honest.
Use your words like a big boy.
"I want to open the marriage or get a divorce."

And honestly, you sound like a big, whiney, angry toddler who feels he is entitled to sex.
Have you tried being truly loving?
You are probably very selfish in bed from the way you come across. I don't want to have sex with you either. You are probably critical and nit-picky towards your DW.
My DH is kind and thoughtful and understanding. We have great communication and trust. He's totally getting some tonight.