Sexless Marriage Question

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

I don't find it that surprising. Couples with matched libidos tend to be happy all other things being equal. They would also tend to stay together versus a couple with mismatched libidos, again, all other things being equal. So even if you think the split of low libido is 90/10 women to men (which is way off, IMO, but whatever), I'd expect a somewhat larger proportion of couples not having sex to be situations where both partners have low libidos or are even asexual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

I don't find it that surprising. Couples with matched libidos tend to be happy all other things being equal. They would also tend to stay together versus a couple with mismatched libidos, again, all other things being equal. So even if you think the split of low libido is 90/10 women to men (which is way off, IMO, but whatever), I'd expect a somewhat larger proportion of couples not having sex to be situations where both partners have low libidos or are even asexual.

Yeah, good point. Matched libidos in a marriage is interesting because libidos USUALLY are high on the onset and taper off. Impossible to predict?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

I don't find it that surprising. Couples with matched libidos tend to be happy all other things being equal. They would also tend to stay together versus a couple with mismatched libidos, again, all other things being equal. So even if you think the split of low libido is 90/10 women to men (which is way off, IMO, but whatever), I'd expect a somewhat larger proportion of couples not having sex to be situations where both partners have low libidos or are even asexual.

Yeah, good point. Matched libidos in a marriage is interesting because libidos USUALLY are high on the onset and taper off. Impossible to predict?

Faking it is a real thing with women. People equate having sex with love. When you can have sex with no future or other emotional attachment, you have a high libido.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

I don't find it that surprising. Couples with matched libidos tend to be happy all other things being equal. They would also tend to stay together versus a couple with mismatched libidos, again, all other things being equal. So even if you think the split of low libido is 90/10 women to men (which is way off, IMO, but whatever), I'd expect a somewhat larger proportion of couples not having sex to be situations where both partners have low libidos or are even asexual.

Consider the statistics on divorce and cheating. I suspect a LARGE portion of those not having sex wind up in one of those buckets (cheating or divorce) before too long.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I love my DH, and he still turns me on. However, I have health issues and menopause has made sex very painful....including lots of bleeding. I have seen various doctors and am trying everything I can, but sadly, sex hurts and that is no fun. I do try to satisfy my husband in other ways, but feel very guilty. However, sex isn’t everything in a marriage and if it caused him to cheat, I would divorce him. We are getting older and things change. The changes have been absolutely no picnic for me either. This thread makes me feel horrible as a wife.

1. Expand your definition of "sex": there are 1000+ mutually pleasurable acts do not involve female penetration. Find ways to make it fun for you!
2. Props for satisfying your husband in other ways... keep that up on a weekly+ basis and you have nothing to feel guilty about, and no fear of him cheating.
3. While your health issues are unfortunate, keep in mind that (if he's healthy) your husband's sex drive is strong as ever so you must not fall into the trap of believing that you are "done with sex" because at that point you should just divorce him ASAP, rather than wait for the inevitable discovery of him going elsewhere.

You are always spouting this crap and you are wrong. Truly one of the most vile posters on the DCUM.

Men's sex lives DO often take a dive. They get older too. They gain weight, they lose their jobs, they stop getting erections (even with drugs), they are stressed and need sleep.

Yes, some *tiny* fraction of older men do lose interest. But why are you so up-in-arms about a minority case? What is so vile about me pointing out the vast majority of men remain highly interested in sex?

Because theses poster always insists on "opening the marriage."

Here's the TRUTH:

Older than 50:

31 percent of couples have sex several times a week; 28 percent of couples have sex a couple of times a month; and 8 percent of couples have sex once a month. Sadly — or so we thought — 33 percent of respondents said they rarely or never have sex. But even among couples who report being "extremely happy," an astonishing one-fourth rarely or never get it on.
Yes, some *tiny* fraction of older men do lose interest. But why are you so up-in-arms about a minority case? What is so vile about me pointing out the vast majority of men remain highly interested in sex?

https://www.aarp.org/home-family/sex-intimacy/info-01-2013/seniors-having-sex-older-couples.html

those figures you highlighted are staggering (and depressing).

Why is it depressing that 3/4 report being very happy?

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

Did you read? It's people over 50 that were surveyed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

I don't find it that surprising. Couples with matched libidos tend to be happy all other things being equal. They would also tend to stay together versus a couple with mismatched libidos, again, all other things being equal. So even if you think the split of low libido is 90/10 women to men (which is way off, IMO, but whatever), I'd expect a somewhat larger proportion of couples not having sex to be situations where both partners have low libidos or are even asexual.

Yeah, good point. Matched libidos in a marriage is interesting because libidos USUALLY are high on the onset and taper off. Impossible to predict?

I think some patterns are probably generally true in the big picture. That the frequency of sex tends to decline at least somewhat. That parents of young children often experience more exaggerated declines. That most of those parents then recover somewhat, but not to the frequency before kids. That's nothing more than a guess based on anecdotal evidence, but if I had to bet, I'd wager those things are true for at least a bare majority of long-time relationships.

But I think there are then just a ton of other co-factors. Stress seems to be a huge one, often compounded by anxiety or depression (which is treated with antidepressants that may reduce libido and/or make climax more difficult). Body image and health issues. And yeah, just plain disappointment in a partner or with life in general. Some subset of parents seem to never recover after having children.

[Anonymous]

Blessedly, we will soon have the technology to fix this issue. AI sexbots are the solution. “Declare Open Marriage” Guy: your days are numbered.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

the high amount of couples not having any sex. And I do find it curious about the 1/4 of couples being "extremely happy" despite never having sex. What ages are we talking here? What kind of couples got interviewed for this? I guarantee you if you poll of married couples in their 40s and 50s who rarely/never have sex, you won't get nearly 1/4.

I don't find it that surprising. Couples with matched libidos tend to be happy all other things being equal. They would also tend to stay together versus a couple with mismatched libidos, again, all other things being equal. So even if you think the split of low libido is 90/10 women to men (which is way off, IMO, but whatever), I'd expect a somewhat larger proportion of couples not having sex to be situations where both partners have low libidos or are even asexual.

Consider the statistics on divorce and cheating. I suspect a LARGE portion of those not having sex wind up in one of those buckets (cheating or divorce) before too long.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You don't outsource sex in a marriage, you cheat. This is why I do not feel sorry for any spouse in a sexless marriage. Deal with your mess and divorce.

You, like many people of said exact the same thing: sexless marriage = divorce. And I totally agree that any marriage without sex is not a romantic relationship and should end.

Except for the fact the sexless women often don't want to divorce. The only way that works is by outsourcing the sex.

This is such a horrible concept "outsourcing" the sex. Are you talking about prostitution? Sex is not like house cleaning or changing the oil to the car, it also involves a human being on the other end, with feelings and expectations.
I wonder how many men here would like their daughters to be in this situation. Would you like your precious daughter to be used by some older married guy for sex and promised something that she will never get? Would you like your daughter to be paid for releasing a man who doesn't get his needs met at home? Would you like your daughter to get herpes (condoms don't help) from your cheating son in law?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Blessedly, we will soon have the technology to fix this issue. AI sexbots are the solution. “Declare Open Marriage” Guy: your days are numbered.

Feminists will demand that men have to obtain consent from their AI sexbot before having sex with them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Blessedly, we will soon have the technology to fix this issue. AI sexbots are the solution. “Declare Open Marriage” Guy: your days are numbered.

I know this is a joke, but I think it illustrates why I don't think open marriages or adultery are a solution in a lot of these cases.

I'm in a dead bedroom. It causes me a lot of stress, but it's not really caused by my libido. I'd guess my libido is comparatively low. When I went on Testosterone therapy, my libido unsurprisingly skyrocketed and I was hornier than a moose. But before that therapy, when I wasn't waking up every morning at full-mast, I still desired and missed sex with my wife. So I don't think it's a simple matter of outsourcing sex, because I think the wound is often not healed by just finding some other way to have an orgasm. Even the most pathetic of us dead bedroom husbands can have an orgasm.

It's a psychological injury. It feels like a fundamental betrayal of the relationship in a way that I imagine being cheated on must feel. Like a judgment made on your self-worth and an attempt to punish you. You might even secretly feel it was justified, which makes it worse. I'm not sure it really is that at first usually, but because feeling that way is pretty crippling to your self-esteem, it almost always comes out in your behavior. So you become irritable, mopey, and even pathetic. Which then, of course, gives your spouse plenty of additional reasons to not want to have sex with you. I don't think the posts calling all the guys pathetic whiny jerks are any more productive than the ones instantly calling for open marriages, but I get it. I can be a whiny, mopey jerk. I'm working on it.

The issue that I struggle with is that while making progress on that front and other self-improvement issues will improve my marriage (and it certainly has), it isn't necessarily going to make my wife desire sex with me--or sex with anyone for that matter--again. Knowing full well that I'm sure many here can assume that I'm a beta cuck whose wife is having an affair, I actually think my wife has just tuned out from that aspect of herself. And I suspect she has to decide that she misses that herself if the problem is going to be solved.

Or I could be wrong. I'm not sure about any of this stuff. Everyone always seems so certain about what is best for the kids or who is at fault. I'm not certain of any of that stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Blessedly, we will soon have the technology to fix this issue. AI sexbots are the solution. “Declare Open Marriage” Guy: your days are numbered.

I know this is a joke, but I think it illustrates why I don't think open marriages or adultery are a solution in a lot of these cases.

I'm in a dead bedroom. It causes me a lot of stress, but it's not really caused by my libido. I'd guess my libido is comparatively low. When I went on Testosterone therapy, my libido unsurprisingly skyrocketed and I was hornier than a moose. But before that therapy, when I wasn't waking up every morning at full-mast, I still desired and missed sex with my wife. So I don't think it's a simple matter of outsourcing sex, because I think the wound is often not healed by just finding some other way to have an orgasm. Even the most pathetic of us dead bedroom husbands can have an orgasm.

It's a psychological injury. It feels like a fundamental betrayal of the relationship in a way that I imagine being cheated on must feel. Like a judgment made on your self-worth and an attempt to punish you. You might even secretly feel it was justified, which makes it worse. I'm not sure it really is that at first usually, but because feeling that way is pretty crippling to your self-esteem, it almost always comes out in your behavior. So you become irritable, mopey, and even pathetic. Which then, of course, gives your spouse plenty of additional reasons to not want to have sex with you. I don't think the posts calling all the guys pathetic whiny jerks are any more productive than the ones instantly calling for open marriages, but I get it. I can be a whiny, mopey jerk. I'm working on it.

The issue that I struggle with is that while making progress on that front and other self-improvement issues will improve my marriage (and it certainly has), it isn't necessarily going to make my wife desire sex with me--or sex with anyone for that matter--again. Knowing full well that I'm sure many here can assume that I'm a beta cuck whose wife is having an affair, I actually think my wife has just tuned out from that aspect of herself. And I suspect she has to decide that she misses that herself if the problem is going to be solved.

Or I could be wrong. I'm not sure about any of this stuff. Everyone always seems so certain about what is best for the kids or who is at fault. I'm not certain of any of that stuff.

You don't have a wife, you have a room mate. Assume that her sexual desire (for you!) is permanently gone, there is absolutely NOTHING you can ever do to change that fact. Like you said, she has "turned off that aspect" and she has absolutely zero reason to want to change. Accept your fate living with a platonic room mate

Meanwhile, most men cannot live without sex and (eventually) this will lead you either to divorce, or you will (eventually) wind up getting it elsewhere. How do I know this? Your exact story has played out a billion times before with this exact outcome every time. If you've done any research on dead bedrooms, you know I am right.

Cheating is dishonest and I don't think you want to be like that. Which means the only honest solution (other than divorce) is to tell her before you go outside the marriage. See? The open marriage solution is in fact the ONLY honest way to save your marriage and actually will improve things greatly for her. You mentioned feeling stress, struggles, low self-worth, low self-esteem, being a whiny mopey jerk? That's no fun for her to be around a miserable shell of a man like you, all those problems will be resolved once you have opened the marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Blessedly, we will soon have the technology to fix this issue. AI sexbots are the solution. “Declare Open Marriage” Guy: your days are numbered.

I know this is a joke, but I think it illustrates why I don't think open marriages or adultery are a solution in a lot of these cases.

I'm in a dead bedroom. It causes me a lot of stress, but it's not really caused by my libido. I'd guess my libido is comparatively low. When I went on Testosterone therapy, my libido unsurprisingly skyrocketed and I was hornier than a moose. But before that therapy, when I wasn't waking up every morning at full-mast, I still desired and missed sex with my wife. So I don't think it's a simple matter of outsourcing sex, because I think the wound is often not healed by just finding some other way to have an orgasm. Even the most pathetic of us dead bedroom husbands can have an orgasm.

It's a psychological injury. It feels like a fundamental betrayal of the relationship in a way that I imagine being cheated on must feel. Like a judgment made on your self-worth and an attempt to punish you. You might even secretly feel it was justified, which makes it worse. I'm not sure it really is that at first usually, but because feeling that way is pretty crippling to your self-esteem, it almost always comes out in your behavior. So you become irritable, mopey, and even pathetic. Which then, of course, gives your spouse plenty of additional reasons to not want to have sex with you. I don't think the posts calling all the guys pathetic whiny jerks are any more productive than the ones instantly calling for open marriages, but I get it. I can be a whiny, mopey jerk. I'm working on it.

The issue that I struggle with is that while making progress on that front and other self-improvement issues will improve my marriage (and it certainly has), it isn't necessarily going to make my wife desire sex with me--or sex with anyone for that matter--again. Knowing full well that I'm sure many here can assume that I'm a beta cuck whose wife is having an affair, I actually think my wife has just tuned out from that aspect of herself. And I suspect she has to decide that she misses that herself if the problem is going to be solved.

Or I could be wrong. I'm not sure about any of this stuff. Everyone always seems so certain about what is best for the kids or who is at fault. I'm not certain of any of that stuff.

You don't have a wife, you have a room mate. Assume that her sexual desire (for you!) is permanently gone, there is absolutely NOTHING you can ever do to change that fact. Like you said, she has "turned off that aspect" and she has absolutely zero reason to want to change. Accept your fate living with a platonic room mate

Meanwhile, most men cannot live without sex and (eventually) this will lead you either to divorce, or you will (eventually) wind up getting it elsewhere. How do I know this? Your exact story has played out a billion times before with this exact outcome every time. If you've done any research on dead bedrooms, you know I am right.

Cheating is dishonest and I don't think you want to be like that. Which means the only honest solution (other than divorce) is to tell her before you go outside the marriage. See? The open marriage solution is in fact the ONLY honest way to save your marriage and actually will improve things greatly for her. You mentioned feeling stress, struggles, low self-worth, low self-esteem, being a whiny mopey jerk? That's no fun for her to be around a miserable shell of a man like you, all those problems will be resolved once you have opened the marriage.

And share the spoils of your marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Blessedly, we will soon have the technology to fix this issue. AI sexbots are the solution. “Declare Open Marriage” Guy: your days are numbered.

I know this is a joke, but I think it illustrates why I don't think open marriages or adultery are a solution in a lot of these cases.

I'm in a dead bedroom. It causes me a lot of stress, but it's not really caused by my libido. I'd guess my libido is comparatively low. When I went on Testosterone therapy, my libido unsurprisingly skyrocketed and I was hornier than a moose. But before that therapy, when I wasn't waking up every morning at full-mast, I still desired and missed sex with my wife. So I don't think it's a simple matter of outsourcing sex, because I think the wound is often not healed by just finding some other way to have an orgasm. Even the most pathetic of us dead bedroom husbands can have an orgasm.

It's a psychological injury. It feels like a fundamental betrayal of the relationship in a way that I imagine being cheated on must feel. Like a judgment made on your self-worth and an attempt to punish you. You might even secretly feel it was justified, which makes it worse. I'm not sure it really is that at first usually, but because feeling that way is pretty crippling to your self-esteem, it almost always comes out in your behavior. So you become irritable, mopey, and even pathetic. Which then, of course, gives your spouse plenty of additional reasons to not want to have sex with you. I don't think the posts calling all the guys pathetic whiny jerks are any more productive than the ones instantly calling for open marriages, but I get it. I can be a whiny, mopey jerk. I'm working on it.

The issue that I struggle with is that while making progress on that front and other self-improvement issues will improve my marriage (and it certainly has), it isn't necessarily going to make my wife desire sex with me--or sex with anyone for that matter--again. Knowing full well that I'm sure many here can assume that I'm a beta cuck whose wife is having an affair, I actually think my wife has just tuned out from that aspect of herself. And I suspect she has to decide that she misses that herself if the problem is going to be solved.

Or I could be wrong. I'm not sure about any of this stuff. Everyone always seems so certain about what is best for the kids or who is at fault. I'm not certain of any of that stuff.

You don't have a wife, you have a room mate. Assume that her sexual desire (for you!) is permanently gone, there is absolutely NOTHING you can ever do to change that fact. Like you said, she has "turned off that aspect" and she has absolutely zero reason to want to change. Accept your fate living with a platonic room mate

Meanwhile, most men cannot live without sex and (eventually) this will lead you either to divorce, or you will (eventually) wind up getting it elsewhere. How do I know this? Your exact story has played out a billion times before with this exact outcome every time. If you've done any research on dead bedrooms, you know I am right.

Cheating is dishonest and I don't think you want to be like that. Which means the only honest solution (other than divorce) is to tell her before you go outside the marriage. See? The open marriage solution is in fact the ONLY honest way to save your marriage and actually will improve things greatly for her. You mentioned feeling stress, struggles, low self-worth, low self-esteem, being a whiny mopey jerk? That's no fun for her to be around a miserable shell of a man like you, all those problems will be resolved once you have opened the marriage.

worse

a mooching roommate.

get rid of her.

Never had as good sex life as now. mid 50;s and divorced. so many horny women out there. get rid of the dead weight.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
You don't have a wife, you have a room mate. Assume that her sexual desire (for you!) is permanently gone, there is absolutely NOTHING you can ever do to change that fact. Like you said, she has "turned off that aspect" and she has absolutely zero reason to want to change. Accept your fate living with a platonic room mate

Meanwhile, most men cannot live without sex and (eventually) this will lead you either to divorce, or you will (eventually) wind up getting it elsewhere. How do I know this? Your exact story has played out a billion times before with this exact outcome every time. If you've done any research on dead bedrooms, you know I am right.

Cheating is dishonest and I don't think you want to be like that. Which means the only honest solution (other than divorce) is to tell her before you go outside the marriage. See? The open marriage solution is, in fact, the ONLY honest way to save your marriage and actually will improve things greatly for her. You mentioned feeling stress, struggles, low self-worth, low self-esteem, being a whiny mopey jerk? That's no fun for her to be around a miserable shell of a man like you, all those problems will be resolved once you have opened the marriage.

The situation is distressing, but she's more than a roommate. She's a friend (and I don't have a ton of those), a confidante, a co-parent, a more than equal financial partner, and a mentor who has helped me mitigate some self-defeating behaviors at home and at work. Sure, I want more than that, but I still recognize what she's done for me and she would not be easily replaced. I hope she can say the same about me, but I think I'd be easier for her to replace me than vice versa.

I'm aware of the odds. We're trying counseling because she assures me it's something she wants. And I'm trying to get my own house in order in any case. I'm not ready to separate or divorce yet, but we both realize that time will come if we can't fix the problem. I need to know I tried. Working on myself and my own happiness is a beneficial step whether we stay together or split, so that's what I'm doing.

And I'm not stating a moral objection to open marriages. If that works for a couple, great. I just know it wouldn't work for me because no strings attached sex wouldn't cure the problem and something more would just lead us right back to divorce. I know there are people who can compartmentalize between sexual gratification and emotional connection. I can't. Not as a matter of moral principle, just as a matter of temperament.