Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not OP but I do have a question in case anyone knows - in Saudi Arabia the women wear black and in Iran the women wear blue. Why don't women in Saudi Arabia wear blue? Wouldn't in be cooler? Is the color dictated by the government?

Do you mean in Afghanistan?

In Saudi, Saudi women must wear black niquab (only eyes showing). Foreign women can wear any type of headscarf, but they also risk harassment if dressed a lot differently.

In Iran, women are required to wear headscarves, but not of a certain color. You often see much more hair peeking out in Iran, too.

In Afghanistan, women were required to wear a burqa under the Taliban, and they are generally blue. It wards off the evil eye. Now you will see women wearing regular head scarves, but many still wear the burqa for safety.

Is there any reason why a woman would wear the head to toe, face covered, heavy black fabric Saudi outfit here in the US during a hot humid summer day?

Do you think it is a religious thing at this point or a family/father/husband control thing?

I saw two separate young women out like this during the heat wave and it just made me want to cry for them.

I don't feel that way at all about the hajib, but the full coverage with only a tiny rectangle of eyes showing is so very different and repressive.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've been approached plenty of times by christians telling me to let jesus save me. I can't remember one time a muslim approached me and told me I should convert...not once. I guess that explains who is spreading that hateful crap about going to hell if you dont convert

YET.

It's clear around the world that once Islam becomes a certain large percentile of the population, the rate of conversion or 'disappearance' of other faiths goes sky high.

It's not like that here in the U.S. which is one of the reasons the vast majority of Muslims here are peaceful. Something goes awfully wrong though when the numbers get high, I'm not sure why that is. The larger the numbers, the greater the power of the radicals.

That said, I have had 2 Muslims talk to me about Islam, give me a Koran and a book that explains it for lay people and tell me they are praying for me to find their correct path. I am close friends with someone they are also friends with so I do think they felt comfortable with me enough to say that though.

That plus, I'm not of an Abrahamic faith so even jizya wouldn't save me from slaughter in their eyes.

We can discuss conspiracy theories all day, but its not productive and theres no proof on either side so what is the point. It sounds like you're assuming that it has something to do with violence? But really there's not much to support that theory. It can also be said that crusaders spread christianity early on by slaughtering the people that were not feeling up to converting. There are radicals in every religion, christianity as well. I don't know how this thread went from "historical artifact discovered"--> "trying to convert non muslims is the DMV area"--> "global conspiracy theories"....somebody please let this thread die, my brain hurts.

I don't mind letting this thread die, just don't state these are simply conspiracy theories. While Christianity has had it's fair share of historical religious killings mixed in with conversion efforts, those things are not occurring today, in current events, thus incorporating into the conversations of today are perfectly valid. You can falsely accuse me of conspiracy theories, but the violence against minority religions in Bangladesh, Pakistan, Iran, Afghanistan, Nigeria, Syria, etc do not equate to conspiracies.

I also do not believe the majority of Muslims are radicals, certainly not. I stated that for whatever reason, which is not a conspiracy, that when there becomes a large or majority percentage of Muslims in one nation or area, the radicals (who are much fewer in number) end up in the position of gaining power which flips the area into a violent mess. That often times violent mess is also used against fellow Muslims as well as minority faiths. It is accompanied by conversion efforts. You don't have to believe me, you just have to assess what is going on in many parts of the world currently.


Quite frankly, I don't agree with proselytizing commandments of any religion. They too often lead to wars of political and monetary domination under the guise of religious sanctimony.

I guess we will just have agree to disagree. I think the violence and oppression against minorities is just that, violence against minorities irrespective of the religion on either side. I think that is more human nature than anything else. The countries you list have been predominantly muslim for as long as I can remember so I can't speak to your theory that once the muslim population rises to a certain point the others disappear. That being said there ARE minority populations there of other religions that have been stable for quite some time, and yes sometimes they do experience oppression because they are a minority. But I don't see that as any different than the muslim population that has to deal with violence in india because they are a minority. Or the asians that built the railroads during the gold rush (no islam there, just humans being humans). Thankfully that era has passed (for the most part) in developed countries, but even in the U.S if a muslim goes to one of the more conservative southern states and walks around the streets with a headscarf I guarantee you she is not going to feel welcome. People just don't like "different". Let's not forget the oppression of muslims in Israel, that's a huge one. Bulldozing peoples houses and evicting them to make room for people moving to Israel from abroad? The point is minorities are always oppressed throughout history, regardless of religion. You still see it overseas more frequently because there are undeveloped countries that are ruled by violence to begin with. Sorry for the wall of text

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've been approached plenty of times by christians telling me to let jesus save me. I can't remember one time a muslim approached me and told me I should convert...not once. I guess that explains who is spreading that hateful crap about going to hell if you dont convert

And yet, this whole thread could be read as a Muslim conversion effort. Islam has unparalleled authenticity... jizhya is a gift to the unconverted...Muslim men and women can marry whomever they want....

Jizhya is part of a choice the Quran gives Abrahamic faiths, to convert, or pay the tax, or die. True, no mention of hell, but that can be assumed.

OP brought up none of those points, except the authenticity of the quran. They are not arguing the authenticity of other religions, simply saying that this bolsters the evidence that the Quran has remained unchanged for a long time. I see nothing wrong with that, and it's hard to argue otherwise. All this other stuff you mentioned has nothing to do with the OP, but was brought up by people accusing them of being provocative for posting a link to a historical artifact. I think the people that thought a historical discovery is inflammatory or provocative need some help. It is, after all, a piece of history and has no bearing whatsoever on their lives.

Anyone in this thread that saw this as more than the sharing of a historical artifact, has some other issues they need to deal with.

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:The recent carbon dating of an ancient Quranic manuscript at the University of Birmingham has now added even more proof regarding the unparalleled degree of certainty with which the Quran has been preserved. These folios have been Carbon 14 dated to within the same time frame, or perhaps shortly after, the Prophet saw life. Waiting on Fox news to put this on a spin "see we told you but no one listened. Well there you go, we now have historical evidence that shows this is a Muslim city"....

The tests, carried out by the Oxford University Radiocarbon Accelerator Unit, showed that the fragments, written on sheep or goat skin, were among the very oldest surviving texts of the Koran.

These tests provide a range of dates, showing that, with a probability of more than 95%, the parchment was from between 568 and 645.

"They could well take us back to within a few years of the actual founding of Islam," said David Thomas, the university's professor of Christianity and Islam.

"According to Muslim tradition, the Prophet Muhammad received the revelations that form the Koran, the scripture of Islam, between the years 610 and 632, the year of his death."

SOURCE : http://www.bbc.com/news/business-33436021

Thanks you for posting this. This is fascinating, and I don't know that I would have seen it earlier.

The tests, carried out by the Oxford University Radiocarbon Accelerator Unit, showed that the fragments, written on sheep or goat skin, were among the very oldest surviving texts of the Koran.

These tests provide a range of dates, showing that, with a probability of more than 95%, the parchment was from between 568 and 645.

"They could well take us back to within a few years of the actual founding of Islam," said David Thomas, the university's professor of Christianity and Islam.

"According to Muslim tradition, the Prophet Muhammad received the revelations that form the Koran, the scripture of Islam, between the years 610 and 632, the year of his death."

jsteele wrote:More about the mental health state of Abdulazeez:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/chattanooga-shooting-fbi-recovers-gunmans-disturbing-diary/story?id=32558310

"With more than 30 FBI agents due to arrive today in Chattanooga, a diary belonging to the gunman and FBI interviews with his parents paint a picture of a disturbed, suicidal young man using drugs, preparing for bankruptcy and facing an appearance in criminal court, according to a representative of the shooter’ s family.

"Four days after the shooting, the FBI has not found any connection to overseas terrorist groups, but Mohammod Abdulazeez's diary says that as far back as 2013, he wrote about having suicidal thoughts and "becoming a martyr" after losing his job due to his drug use, both prescription and non-prescription drugs, the family representative said."

And for the poster above asking whether the family was doing anything about it:

"The family representative said Abdulazeez's family sought, without success, to get him treatment for his mental illness, and to keep him away from a group of friends with whom he would drink and smoke marijuana."