Flame Me: I don't think affairs are generally a big deal

[Anonymous]

It depends on a lot of factors.

1) How long the affair lasted.
2) What the affair took from the marriage (time, money, etc.)
3) How many people knew about it.
4) How the cheating partner behaves following the affair.

I have known of affairs that lasted for years, where the AP was known to everyone in the social group and workplace (except for the cheated on partner), and the cheater and AP continued working together even after it was "over." That's a big deal and a dealbreaker.

I have also known of affairs that lasted only one or two nights on a business trip, and they never saw each other again. I can see how that would be no big deal if you find out about it later, and your partner is genuinely remorseful.

Then there is everything in between.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Religion, sanctity of marriage, family of origin and values. I see drastically different views. It's easy to see why somebody that thinks it is 'no big deal' would never be able to understand somebody that requires 'no lies and honesty' in a marriage. Going behind a spouse's back and outright lying to their face is very serious and the lack of moral code/character for somebody to do that is not something I could accept in somebody I pledged to love, respect and cherish. No thanks.

Marriage is long. The theory or idea of it is drastically different than the lived reality of it. Sometimes you go through a dark time and make bad choices.

Is marriage then, only for those who have easy lifes or no mental illnesses?

I am the OP. My husband and I were living a pretty sexless life for a few years because of me. I think because of that when I found out he was cheating, I wasn't surprised.

Oh no, no, no. You don't get to twist this around and go off on a different tangent. Change the title of your thread to - "DH with mental illness and hard life had affair but I am ok with it because of my own issues" if you want to vent and have sympathetic audience.

The marriage vows do say - ...for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do us part...etc.

A lot of people don't use the traditional marriage vows anymore. Almost no one whose wedding I went to did--we wrote our own. None of us are religious at all, though.

It is nothing to do with religion. A marriage is a bond based on trust. Even if you don't take vows the fact that you are getting married means that a certain societal, human and legal norms will be followed as far as fidelity is concerned. If you don't want to be monogamous you can divorce or not get married or have an open marriage. It is not rocket science. Animals don't have a marriage to produce children.

Agree. I have been to a ton of wedding in Catholic (both were not Catholic) churches, Episcopalian churches, Presbyterian churches, etc. None of these weddings had the expectation of adultery even if it wasn't explicitly stated. I think they ALL had the expectation of honesty and not betraying/lying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, just out of curiosity, what would be your take if it happened again?

You'd be cool with it again? Or is it a one time only get-out-of-jail free card?

OP here. Oh, I will be out of here upon any behavior like that again. We are trying to build emotional and physical intimacy again with the expectation that we are in an exclusive monogamous relationship.Maybe I am being stupid but I am giving it another try.

Leave now before he leaves you for one of them. Eventually, he will be delusional enough to think he's fallen in love.

My take, and backed by therapist, if they are forgiven readily and easily they will do it again.

The ones that hit true rock bottom, have an identity crisis and commit to HEAVY individual therapy (which may be an ongoing need for a long, long time) and couples therapy may change.

But, when a cheater sees they 'got away with it' and were only inconvenienced a minor amount temporarily---that's rug sweeping and they haven't changed. In fact, they just get more careful the next time.

Case in point -

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, just out of curiosity, what would be your take if it happened again?

You'd be cool with it again? Or is it a one time only get-out-of-jail free card?

OP here. Oh, I will be out of here upon any behavior like that again. We are trying to build emotional and physical intimacy again with the expectation that we are in an exclusive monogamous relationship.Maybe I am being stupid but I am giving it another try.

So it's not a big deal until it's a big deal?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It depends on a lot of factors.

1) How long the affair lasted.
2) What the affair took from the marriage (time, money, etc.)
3) How many people knew about it.
4) How the cheating partner behaves following the affair.

I have known of affairs that lasted for years, where the AP was known to everyone in the social group and workplace (except for the cheated on partner), and the cheater and AP continued working together even after it was "over." That's a big deal and a dealbreaker.

I have also known of affairs that lasted only one or two nights on a business trip, and they never saw each other again. I can see how that would be no big deal if you find out about it later, and your partner is genuinely remorseful.

Then there is everything in between.

With all due respect, two nights is not an 'affair' in most people's book. It is cheating and infidelity. I'd also have a hard time believing these people wouldn't do it with someone else if opportunity arose.

I do agree they are all different situations. IMO, they all suck. There is no 'good' cheating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, just out of curiosity, what would be your take if it happened again?

You'd be cool with it again? Or is it a one time only get-out-of-jail free card?

OP here. Oh, I will be out of here upon any behavior like that again. We are trying to build emotional and physical intimacy again with the expectation that we are in an exclusive monogamous relationship.Maybe I am being stupid but I am giving it another try.

Leave now before he leaves you for one of them. Eventually, he will be delusional enough to think he's fallen in love.

My take, and backed by therapist, if they are forgiven readily and easily they will do it again.

The ones that hit true rock bottom, have an identity crisis and commit to HEAVY individual therapy (which may be an ongoing need for a long, long time) and couples therapy may change.

But, when a cheater sees they 'got away with it' and were only inconvenienced a minor amount temporarily---that's rug sweeping and they haven't changed. In fact, they just get more careful the next time.

Case in point -

There is certainly an honesty and integrity problem with serial cheaters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought the same until my husband had a 4-year affair at year 22, in a happy, sex-filled marriage.

It’s debilitating. I have mentally suffered. I have trauma. I have depression. I lost the ability to work, barely get through the work day. The nightmares don’t stop.

I had a happy childhood with parents happily married 55 years. I am a strong, educated woman with a career and very attractive.

The lies and secrets. The dishonesty.

If you value honesty and integrity, you will never be able to reconcile the actions.

In the abstract, it seems like no big deal. Nothing like reality.

This. It’s the lies and dishonesty that ends it.

I have never been through an affair, but my husband has a substance use disorder. He has been sober for eight years now, but I am not sure I will ever really forget the lies. I still don't really trust that he is where he says he is, and it does create a distance between us.
At least I can always make him take a drug test from CVS though. An affair would be so much harder to get past. It seems like you would never really know for sure that it wasn't happening again.

[Anonymous]

I had friends where the DH was living temporarily in a different city for a legitimate business reasons. He was flying back most (but not all) weekend and the arrangement was supposed to last about a year. DW found out he was cheating on her with high end hookers. He was lonely and bored and missed sex; he was also drinking way too much while living on his own. They got through it. He stopped the arrangement within a week of when she found out (which meant ending it about 6 months early) and moved home, though lived with friends initially. It was a big deal, but I understand how they got through it. (It is now almost 10 years later and they now have kids.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought the same until my husband had a 4-year affair at year 22, in a happy, sex-filled marriage.

It’s debilitating. I have mentally suffered. I have trauma. I have depression. I lost the ability to work, barely get through the work day. The nightmares don’t stop.

I had a happy childhood with parents happily married 55 years. I am a strong, educated woman with a career and very attractive.

The lies and secrets. The dishonesty.

If you value honesty and integrity, you will never be able to reconcile the actions.

In the abstract, it seems like no big deal. Nothing like reality.

Yes, this.

It eroded all trust and safety in the marriage. I could not look at him. I find it a huge character flaw- the lying.

[Anonymous]

A lot of shit goes down in long-term relationship - fights, make-ups, ugly name calling, an occasional screaming match, etc. - and both partners will have periods of "going through something" in marriage.

But you kind of have to draw the line somewhere don't you?

If sticking his dick in someone is how your husband handles problems in his life, you could probably find a better human to be married to...

[Anonymous]

Your husband got a free pass with next to no reprucssions, awesome. But, when and if it happens again, will you be as forgiving? I would imagine cheating can causes serious trauma for some people. It is a big deal.

[Anonymous]

I feel like I would always be tempted to bring it up in a fight.

Him: “You were supposed do the dishes last night and you didn’t.”
Me: “Well, you were supposed to remain faithful in our marriage, and you didn’t.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I feel like I would always be tempted to bring it up in a fight.

Him: “You were supposed do the dishes last night and you didn’t.”
Me: “Well, you were supposed to remain faithful in our marriage, and you didn’t.”

Or this:

Him: “It’s your turn to do the dishes tonight.”
Me: “Remember that night that I made your favorite dinner, but you didn’t come home to eat it because you said you were working late, but you were really screwing some other woman? I think I did the dishes that night. I also think I put the kids to bed that night too. So, I’m pretty sure that makes it your turn.”

I don’t know. Even if he really felt awful about it and worked hard to change, I’m not sure I could be a mature enough person to move past it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like I would always be tempted to bring it up in a fight.

Him: “You were supposed do the dishes last night and you didn’t.”
Me: “Well, you were supposed to remain faithful in our marriage, and you didn’t.”

Or this:

Him: “It’s your turn to do the dishes tonight.”
Me: “Remember that night that I made your favorite dinner, but you didn’t come home to eat it because you said you were working late, but you were really screwing some other woman? I think I did the dishes that night. I also think I put the kids to bed that night too. So, I’m pretty sure that makes it your turn.”

I don’t know. Even if he really felt awful about it and worked hard to change, I’m not sure I could be a mature enough person to move past it.

Do you really think it's maturity that gets you past an affair? Affairs ruin marriages, full stop. Without trust and respect, you have a sham marriage.

[Anonymous]

Just a reminder many of the cheaters are women. Married women now cheat in numbers as high as men. Many have a lot more time and opportunity when kids are in school all day. Marriages where the woman cheated are more likely to end in divorce. I have no idea if this is because women cheat to get out of the marriage and men can still cheat with zero plans to leave OR if men have a harder time getting over an affair.