Really tough morning with teen - did I do the right thing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If this kid did not have UMC family would already be in the system.

Not true. I'm the OP and he's an incredibly sweet and pleasant kid 90% of the time. He has never once been in trouble outside of our home - we are the only ones that he gives a hard time to. He has a wonderful group of friends since kindergarten, teachers love him, he's sweet and respectful to his aunts and uncles...he just saves the hard stuff for us, which is normal.

I agree with this and I am the poster who said earlier that comparing a parent to a cop is absurd. I get where you are coming from OP. He pushed it too far and you need to tell him that can't happen again but pushing dad does not mean he is destined for jail. Your husband also needs to not start things. My husband had to grapple with this. For many men, their sons are going to be bigger and stronger than they are. Time for different strategies beyond getting physical (grabbing things or trying to stop entry/exit...I don't even mean hitting or pushing) if that has been something they resorted to in the past.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

But you and OP’s kid could be different. I was poor growing up and I couldn’t afford to lose my coat. I was a totally forgetful kid (like I said, I have adhd too) and the first time I lost my coat, it was a huge consequence of not having one for a month until my family could get one. I can assure you that I never lost my coat again.

He needs to have a reason to keep up with schoolwork. Right now he doesn’t care about grades, so what does he care about? Ski club. His parents made it crystal clear what would happen. He chose to push boundaries. And yes sometimes it’s a choice. It isn’t a choice to not be able to read the words on the page because your brain is swimming with thoughts, but it’s a choice to not open that book at all. To not even try.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

But you and OP’s kid could be different. I was poor growing up and I couldn’t afford to lose my coat. I was a totally forgetful kid (like I said, I have adhd too) and the first time I lost my coat, it was a huge consequence of not having one for a month until my family could get one. I can assure you that I never lost my coat again.

He needs to have a reason to keep up with schoolwork. Right now he doesn’t care about grades, so what does he care about? Ski club. His parents made it crystal clear what would happen. He chose to push boundaries. And yes sometimes it’s a choice. It isn’t a choice to not be able to read the words on the page because your brain is swimming with thoughts, but it’s a choice to not open that book at all. To not even try.

It is true people are different. I truly wish that I was able to just focus and get all my work done like you and others can if there was a threat of consequence. It would have made my life a million times easier. Not being able to just sit down and get everything done even under the threat of consequence has always been my issue. Unfortunately for me, I haver never found anything that just lets me choose to sit down and focus and get all my required work done on time.

As I said, I have no issue with OP following through on consequences. My parents did too, and I have tried to punish myself as an adult too but unfortunately that didn't allow me to choose to get all my work done on time. Hopefully it does work for OPs son and now he will always do his work on time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think PPs appreciate that this isn’t a special trip. It’s an afterschool activity he does regularly for two months. I would totally tell my kids no for a night of ski club if they did not follow through on a more important commitment (ie schoolwork, chores they are expected to do) and needed to reclaim that time.

I think not letting him participate is appropriate - but it would have been much better handled if you laid out the expectations ahead of time and let him know it was coming. When he asked you to back off would have been the time to iron out expectations and consequences and opportunities to check in and change course… in a perfect parenting world. I can see why finding out day of would feel like rug was being pulled out under him, especially if he has felt like he has been trying.

I think you have an opportunity to do that now. Missing ski club tonight is fine and a logical consequence for not having made time for school work and he needs to know you’re not going to just tolerate that. But I would apologize to him for not more clearly laying out your expectations in advance, acknowledge that you understand why he is upset and you could also have done better, and brainstorm with him on a better system where you don’t need to be micromanaging him but he’s more aware of the consequences and can check in with you along the way.

OP here - it was laid out ahead of time. I told him all week that if he still had missing work by Friday, he would not be allowed to participate in anything this week. Yesterday afternoon immediately after school, I reiterated that I still see he is missing all of the work and that he would not be going on the ski trip Friday if he doesn't get it done. I offered my help, as usual. He did nothing.

We have taken away weekend plans in the past when homework wasn't finished. This isn't the first time - just the first time it was a ski trip.

In that case, I don’t think you should be second guessing yourself!

[Anonymous]

I think that because you've said it, you need to follow through. It may not have been the best choice for a punishment, but it was the choice you made, so stick with it this time.

Then I would have a conversation where I said something about getting out there and being social being great for him so you're not going to use that punishment again. But you are going to take the phone and cut off video gaming until all his work is made up.

But honestly, there really is something to be said for letting the kid fail and letting the chips fall where they may. This is anathema on this site which is so focused on intensive helicopter parenting but I think it's true. I also think the grading portals and focus on college is making the life of ADHD kids worse. If my kid fails, he has to take summer school classes. If his GPA sucks, he starts off at Community College. That's real life. I know it's an unusual perspective and requires a lot of faith, but I think it's true. I would also ask my kid how he planned to support himself at 18, if college is off the table due to poor grades. Because parental support is not indefinite.

[Anonymous]

OP, you did fine. You have made it clear to your child that schoolwork is a high priority. He pushed for some independence and he messed up. Life has consequences. Have a conversation about the next steps going forward. Is he using his assignment book? Did he imagine he would get the homework done in study hall? Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think PPs appreciate that this isn’t a special trip. It’s an afterschool activity he does regularly for two months. I would totally tell my kids no for a night of ski club if they did not follow through on a more important commitment (ie schoolwork, chores they are expected to do) and needed to reclaim that time.

I think not letting him participate is appropriate - but it would have been much better handled if you laid out the expectations ahead of time and let him know it was coming. When he asked you to back off would have been the time to iron out expectations and consequences and opportunities to check in and change course… in a perfect parenting world. I can see why finding out day of would feel like rug was being pulled out under him, especially if he has felt like he has been trying.

I think you have an opportunity to do that now. Missing ski club tonight is fine and a logical consequence for not having made time for school work and he needs to know you’re not going to just tolerate that. But I would apologize to him for not more clearly laying out your expectations in advance, acknowledge that you understand why he is upset and you could also have done better, and brainstorm with him on a better system where you don’t need to be micromanaging him but he’s more aware of the consequences and can check in with you along the way.

OP here - it was laid out ahead of time. I told him all week that if he still had missing work by Friday, he would not be allowed to participate in anything this week. Yesterday afternoon immediately after school, I reiterated that I still see he is missing all of the work and that he would not be going on the ski trip Friday if he doesn't get it done. I offered my help, as usual. He did nothing.

We have taken away weekend plans in the past when homework wasn't finished. This isn't the first time - just the first time it was a ski trip.

I'm the person who used the word surprise on the last page and I take back everything I said. With this context, you did the right thing. Maybe tempers got heated this morning when you and your husband could have kept your calm, but the overall strategy of clear expectations, communication, and a consequence related to the offense all seem perfectly fine.

Yeah, I agree.

I'm kind of torn, but I do think you basically did the right thing.

I think you all wake up tomorrow and plan for a new week. I agree with a PP that skiing is a healthy, pro-social activity. So, I think your message to him is something like, "Look, I know that ski club is important to you. But I want to give you a goal to work toward. You wanted more independence with your assignments, and that didn't really work. How can we make this week better?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

But you and OP’s kid could be different. I was poor growing up and I couldn’t afford to lose my coat. I was a totally forgetful kid (like I said, I have adhd too) and the first time I lost my coat, it was a huge consequence of not having one for a month until my family could get one. I can assure you that I never lost my coat again.

He needs to have a reason to keep up with schoolwork. Right now he doesn’t care about grades, so what does he care about? Ski club. His parents made it crystal clear what would happen. He chose to push boundaries. And yes sometimes it’s a choice. It isn’t a choice to not be able to read the words on the page because your brain is swimming with thoughts, but it’s a choice to not open that book at all. To not even try.

It is true people are different. I truly wish that I was able to just focus and get all my work done like you and others can if there was a threat of consequence. It would have made my life a million times easier. Not being able to just sit down and get everything done even under the threat of consequence has always been my issue. Unfortunately for me, I haver never found anything that just lets me choose to sit down and focus and get all my required work done on time.

As I said, I have no issue with OP following through on consequences. My parents did too, and I have tried to punish myself as an adult too but unfortunately that didn't allow me to choose to get all my work done on time. Hopefully it does work for OPs son and now he will always do his work on time.

I am now medicated; which is how I can focus more! But in the past before medication, I had a choice to sit down and try and to mess around and avoid. When I sat down it didn’t mean I could focus WELL, but I could focus better than if I were walking around. I’m not saying the threat/consequence or even reward could help my brain stay focused on the page I was reading, but sitting down when I knew I had to made it more of a possibility that I could focus than if I weren’t trying at all. And some days were better than others!

I think our kids have a huge boulder on their backs—the phones. It’s causing way more problem than it’s worth and attention is the biggest loss for me too!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would not have taken the ski trip away. The ski trip is not a direct consequence to not doing homework. There is no correlation. I would put the ski trip back on and let him know that consequences will be discussed and implemented upon his return home.

For the future, you need to figure out a way to “back off” but still support. That can look like this…. You will set a time when he should work on assignments every afternoon and give him a reminder to do so. He will do the homework in front of you. However, you will not assist him further than that unless he asks for it. Every weekend, sit down with him and go over grades. Anything missing? Anything due? Any redos?

Also, work on control. Dad should not snatch anything out of anyone’s arms. Dad had the option of not driving the car until the board is back in the house.

Fellow teacher and mom

An ADHD kid will doodle, stare into space, try to make themselves small and quiet and disappear (in which case you find them screwing around somewhere), take excessive bathroom breaks etc and one hour passes with 5% of the work done

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

But you and OP’s kid could be different. I was poor growing up and I couldn’t afford to lose my coat. I was a totally forgetful kid (like I said, I have adhd too) and the first time I lost my coat, it was a huge consequence of not having one for a month until my family could get one. I can assure you that I never lost my coat again.

He needs to have a reason to keep up with schoolwork. Right now he doesn’t care about grades, so what does he care about? Ski club. His parents made it crystal clear what would happen. He chose to push boundaries. And yes sometimes it’s a choice. It isn’t a choice to not be able to read the words on the page because your brain is swimming with thoughts, but it’s a choice to not open that book at all. To not even try.

It is true people are different. I truly wish that I was able to just focus and get all my work done like you and others can if there was a threat of consequence. It would have made my life a million times easier. Not being able to just sit down and get everything done even under the threat of consequence has always been my issue. Unfortunately for me, I haver never found anything that just lets me choose to sit down and focus and get all my required work done on time.

As I said, I have no issue with OP following through on consequences. My parents did too, and I have tried to punish myself as an adult too but unfortunately that didn't allow me to choose to get all my work done on time. Hopefully it does work for OPs son and now he will always do his work on time.

PP, you have posted a lot about your own experience. The person you were responding to has ADHD and a kid with ADHD, as do I. There needs to be consequences, plain and simple. Everyone who has ADHD can relate to what you are saying. As I have told my child “you can’t kid a kidder.” We know what you are feeling and it’s not fair, but that doesn’t mean that you just give up. You develop different strategies, you get help, you try different medications. That would be my recommendation to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

But you and OP’s kid could be different. I was poor growing up and I couldn’t afford to lose my coat. I was a totally forgetful kid (like I said, I have adhd too) and the first time I lost my coat, it was a huge consequence of not having one for a month until my family could get one. I can assure you that I never lost my coat again.

He needs to have a reason to keep up with schoolwork. Right now he doesn’t care about grades, so what does he care about? Ski club. His parents made it crystal clear what would happen. He chose to push boundaries. And yes sometimes it’s a choice. It isn’t a choice to not be able to read the words on the page because your brain is swimming with thoughts, but it’s a choice to not open that book at all. To not even try.

It is true people are different. I truly wish that I was able to just focus and get all my work done like you and others can if there was a threat of consequence. It would have made my life a million times easier. Not being able to just sit down and get everything done even under the threat of consequence has always been my issue. Unfortunately for me, I haver never found anything that just lets me choose to sit down and focus and get all my required work done on time.

As I said, I have no issue with OP following through on consequences. My parents did too, and I have tried to punish myself as an adult too but unfortunately that didn't allow me to choose to get all my work done on time. Hopefully it does work for OPs son and now he will always do his work on time.

PP, you have posted a lot about your own experience. The person you were responding to has ADHD and a kid with ADHD, as do I. There needs to be consequences, plain and simple. Everyone who has ADHD can relate to what you are saying. As I have told my child “you can’t kid a kidder.” We know what you are feeling and it’s not fair, but that doesn’t mean that you just give up. You develop different strategies, you get help, you try different medications. That would be my recommendation to you.

As the PP said, ADHD Is different for everyone and her that PP and you as well, being able to choose to do all your work if there is a threat of consequence is something I am jealous of. I could sit down to do work and spend 10 hours and still not get my work done. I would set an alarm and get up early and still not get my work done. I have no issue with consequences - I am just saying that for me, it wasn't just a choice. So the consequences didn't really change anything. You could consequence me left right and center and I still wasn't able to sit down and get my work done. I am glad it isn't that way for others and for you when there are conseuquences you are able to choose to sit down and do what ever needs to be done to avoid the consequence, I really am and I hope the same is true for OPs son and now he won't struggle anymore and will do his work on time. For me, it isn't a personal choice. Not being able to get my work done regardless of conequence has had major impacts on my life. I wish it was just a choice for me too as it was for that PP and for you and your kids. I am glad the threat of consequences leads to you being able to get done what you need to get done in a timely way. People are different, ADHD isn't the same for everyone. I am glad that for you, getting things done isn't an issue. It seemed it was for the OPs son and I really hope his brain is more like yours and not like mine and now that he has consequences, there won't be problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have to go online everyday and look at what assignment is due for my 15 year old with adhd and make a color coded check off list in order to prioritize what is due first.

Work often isn’t completed unless I sit next to him. I am sometimes reading or doing a nyt puzzle so I am not staring at him but I am there when he gets too off task. He also then can take a quick break to talk about random things he thinks of or he will help solve on of the puzzles then gets back to work.

My goal right now is for him to graduate so some homework assignments I help him with short cuts. So sometimes instead of reading a very long chapter of a novel or history text, I can often find YouTube short documentaries /summaries or I read it aloud to him and we talk about it.

I also am realistic about his classes. He is smart enough to be in all honors classes but he can’t handle that workload and/or the rigidity of some honors teachers. It helps I have an older child so I know or his sibling tells him which teachers are more manageable with the work load.

Serious question is the plan for a kid like this they don’t go to college?

NP, I have a junior like this, and no, I do not see this kid starting a 4y college the fall after (fingers crossed) HS graduation.

Everything is on the table, but the kid I have in front of me today does not have the academic or life skills to succeed in a 4y setting, and getting in is another large obstacle.

At this point, we are trying to get through junior year, parents are not completely on the same page, so that is also tricky. I imagine this summer we will have some more concrete planning conversations.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not do the ski trip.

Disability aside he needs to learn to do his work despite not wanting to. I have adhd and my son has adhd and if he wasn’t doing his work there’s no way I would let him go.

IF he was doing the work and still got bad grades because of a disability, then I would let him go. It’s the EFFORT that needs to be rewarded.

If you let him go to ski club you’re essentially saying “our words mean nothing!” And next time he’ll push harder.

I am the adult that posted before you and consequences didn't change how my brain worked. I really wish they did and I could just focus and get my work done if I knew there was some kind of consequence but for me that isn't how my brain works. My issue back when I was a teen was that I could do well without much effort. My grades in high school weren't stellar as there were so many little assignments and things I didn't hand in but once in college when it was just exams and maybe one major assignment - I could just coast and cram and get good grades.

But you and OP’s kid could be different. I was poor growing up and I couldn’t afford to lose my coat. I was a totally forgetful kid (like I said, I have adhd too) and the first time I lost my coat, it was a huge consequence of not having one for a month until my family could get one. I can assure you that I never lost my coat again.

He needs to have a reason to keep up with schoolwork. Right now he doesn’t care about grades, so what does he care about? Ski club. His parents made it crystal clear what would happen. He chose to push boundaries. And yes sometimes it’s a choice. It isn’t a choice to not be able to read the words on the page because your brain is swimming with thoughts, but it’s a choice to not open that book at all. To not even try.

It is true people are different. I truly wish that I was able to just focus and get all my work done like you and others can if there was a threat of consequence. It would have made my life a million times easier. Not being able to just sit down and get everything done even under the threat of consequence has always been my issue. Unfortunately for me, I haver never found anything that just lets me choose to sit down and focus and get all my required work done on time.

As I said, I have no issue with OP following through on consequences. My parents did too, and I have tried to punish myself as an adult too but unfortunately that didn't allow me to choose to get all my work done on time. Hopefully it does work for OPs son and now he will always do his work on time.

PP, you have posted a lot about your own experience. The person you were responding to has ADHD and a kid with ADHD, as do I. There needs to be consequences, plain and simple. Everyone who has ADHD can relate to what you are saying. As I have told my child “you can’t kid a kidder.” We know what you are feeling and it’s not fair, but that doesn’t mean that you just give up. You develop different strategies, you get help, you try different medications. That would be my recommendation to you.

As the PP said, ADHD Is different for everyone and her that PP and you as well, being able to choose to do all your work if there is a threat of consequence is something I am jealous of. I could sit down to do work and spend 10 hours and still not get my work done. I would set an alarm and get up early and still not get my work done. I have no issue with consequences - I am just saying that for me, it wasn't just a choice. So the consequences didn't really change anything. You could consequence me left right and center and I still wasn't able to sit down and get my work done. I am glad it isn't that way for others and for you when there are conseuquences you are able to choose to sit down and do what ever needs to be done to avoid the consequence, I really am and I hope the same is true for OPs son and now he won't struggle anymore and will do his work on time. For me, it isn't a personal choice. Not being able to get my work done regardless of conequence has had major impacts on my life. I wish it was just a choice for me too as it was for that PP and for you and your kids. I am glad the threat of consequences leads to you being able to get done what you need to get done in a timely way. People are different, ADHD isn't the same for everyone. I am glad that for you, getting things done isn't an issue. It seemed it was for the OPs son and I really hope his brain is more like yours and not like mine and now that he has consequences, there won't be problems.

This just means he needs somebody to sit beside him and ride his butt, which his mom offered and he refused. I think he never intended to do the work so he told his mom what he thought she wanted to hear to buy time to not do his work. There needs to be consequences for that.

OP you mentioned he had a executive function coach or something like that. That coach should have given him explicit tools. You should (and your son) should refer back to that training and apply it.

[Anonymous]

Hell no to the ski trip. My kid wouldn’t be allowed to go to any ski trip if work wasn’t done.