Today’s young adults want apologies from their parents; parents want a thank you

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Let's forget passing genetic disorders, abandoning or abusing children and other bigger issues, just passing mediocre looks and IQ and then raising them with little resources while they compete with beautiful, intelligent and resourceful peers, is it really fair? Hard to say but how many parents actually even consider these thoughts?

Less resources and wisdom parents have, more kids they want to bring to this world. Its a complex issue and no body knows the answer but yes, even with best of intentions and efforts, plenty of mistakes are made.

Ooh, in the name of improving this world, let's limit who can procreate. Let's examine everyone, find the defective ones and sterilize them, so no future kid will have to suffer.

Wait, hasn't this already been tried somewhere?

Having information and resources to make educated decisions isn't the same as decisions being forced upon you. Is it?

NP. So the information would be “your average children would have to compete against h average children and having a child wouldn’t really be fair to them?” So not eugenics, just eugenicist propaganda?

Don't try to twist the argument of parents taking more responsibility into propagation of eugenics. Cousin marriage is still allowed in most states, no fenetic testing required.

There is no way you can compare telling a potential parent that kids are a lot of responsibility with telling potential parents that it might not be fair to bring a child into the world who has below-average looks or intelligence. That’s blatantly eugenicist. If you yourself are even within the realm of average intelligence you can read a Wikipedia page to confirm this. (You could also Google “cousin marriage” and see that it’s legality doesn’t exactly prop up the argument you’re trying to make).

What's your take on it?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Do you think this is a real dynamic?

Young adults (18-23) with a sense of being wronged. They’re exhausted parents who did everything they could.

Lots of resentment bubbling over.

I think so. If their parents didn't want to procreate, young people wouldn't have a single problem to begin with. You bring other humans into this world without their consents, pass your subpar genes, do flawed parenting with your limited emotional and financial resources in a messed up world, the least you can do is to apologize. I'm only half kidding here, even the best of parents are literally the source of half of the problems kids face.

Wow. Speechless.

Well kids cause a lot of expense and trouble for the unsuspecting parents too. It evens the score.

I'm honestly saying this all with a light heart (I'm not either of those PPs), but he response to this is why would the parent be unsuspecting? Shouldn't we know what we are getting into when we bring a child into the world?

No. You are told it’s really hard and you see that it’s really hard, but you don’t *really* get it until it’s too late! And Mother Nature sets it up so you decide to have another one right when your first is getting easier but still really cute and importantly, small enough to control easily. You don't get how the teen years will go until it’s too late and you have more than one! Such a bait and switch! If they started as teens, 75% would be only children.

Honest question: what was it you didn’t understand about raising children until you had kids?

I did not understand how biased our society is against mothers. It seems that we are praising motherhood while quietly stubbing mothers in the back.

Can you provide an example?

E.g. an enormous pressure to breastfeed without any consideration of what it means for a particular woman on a practical level. I am saying it as a working mom of three whose kids never had formula - breastfeeding or pumped milk only for at least a year each.

We must live in different worlds. In my circle ($300k+ HHI) most of us formula feed without any sort of guilt or issue after attempting nursing. If you feel pressure to breastfeed, it’s the circle you’re running in.

Things change with time. Once upon a time people use to hire wet nurses, now they buy synthetic formula. What are you going to do if its not working out. What's the point in harboring guilt?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's forget passing genetic disorders, abandoning or abusing children and other bigger issues, just passing mediocre looks and IQ and then raising them with little resources while they compete with beautiful, intelligent and resourceful peers, is it really fair? Hard to say but how many parents actually even consider these thoughts?

Less resources and wisdom parents have, more kids they want to bring to this world. Its a complex issue and no body knows the answer but yes, even with best of intentions and efforts, plenty of mistakes are made.

Ooh, in the name of improving this world, let's limit who can procreate. Let's examine everyone, find the defective ones and sterilize them, so no future kid will have to suffer.

Wait, hasn't this already been tried somewhere?

Having information and resources to make educated decisions isn't the same as decisions being forced upon you. Is it?

NP. So the information would be “your average children would have to compete against h average children and having a child wouldn’t really be fair to them?” So not eugenics, just eugenicist propaganda?

Don't try to twist the argument of parents taking more responsibility into propagation of eugenics. Cousin marriage is still allowed in most states, no fenetic testing required.

There is no way you can compare telling a potential parent that kids are a lot of responsibility with telling potential parents that it might not be fair to bring a child into the world who has below-average looks or intelligence. That’s blatantly eugenicist. If you yourself are even within the realm of average intelligence you can read a Wikipedia page to confirm this. (You could also Google “cousin marriage” and see that it’s legality doesn’t exactly prop up the argument you’re trying to make).

I don't see how trying to educate yourself and then making decisions you feel comfortable with is bad but procreating without a thought or plan isn't? You may secure a better health plan, save more money, gather more vacation time, move to a town with better pediatric care, move near family to have a better support system. There is so much every parent can do to be better prepared for parenting. If you know you may have twins or triplets, you are better off planning for multiples.

[Anonymous]

Not saying that its wrong, just saying you should be prepared that kids may want an apology.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Let's forget passing genetic disorders, abandoning or abusing children and other bigger issues, just passing mediocre looks and IQ and then raising them with little resources while they compete with beautiful, intelligent and resourceful peers, is it really fair? Hard to say but how many parents actually even consider these thoughts?

Less resources and wisdom parents have, more kids they want to bring to this world. Its a complex issue and no body knows the answer but yes, even with best of intentions and efforts, plenty of mistakes are made.

Ooh, in the name of improving this world, let's limit who can procreate. Let's examine everyone, find the defective ones and sterilize them, so no future kid will have to suffer.

Wait, hasn't this already been tried somewhere?

Having information and resources to make educated decisions isn't the same as decisions being forced upon you. Is it?

NP. So the information would be “your average children would have to compete against h average children and having a child wouldn’t really be fair to them?” So not eugenics, just eugenicist propaganda?

Don't try to twist the argument of parents taking more responsibility into propagation of eugenics. Cousin marriage is still allowed in most states, no fenetic testing required.

There is no way you can compare telling a potential parent that kids are a lot of responsibility with telling potential parents that it might not be fair to bring a child into the world who has below-average looks or intelligence. That’s blatantly eugenicist. If you yourself are even within the realm of average intelligence you can read a Wikipedia page to confirm this. (You could also Google “cousin marriage” and see that it’s legality doesn’t exactly prop up the argument you’re trying to make).

I don't see how trying to educate yourself and then making decisions you feel comfortable with is bad but procreating without a thought or plan isn't? You may secure a better health plan, save more money, gather more vacation time, move to a town with better pediatric care, move near family to have a better support system. There is so much every parent can do to be better prepared for parenting. If you know you may have twins or triplets, you are better off planning for multiples.

You can’t plan and control for everything. This is an illusion which, unfortunately, is being used to further cut the safety net.

Especially laughable is securing a better health plan. I have a very good job and a pretty decent health insurance plan through it. I just got a letter that the physical therapy practice that I’ve been going to for years is not in the plan anymore, and instead of covering an assortment of PT places, my plan is switching to covering a single PT chain. Maybe they are good, maybe not, but at this point I can’t even switch plans until the next enrollment period. Oops.

[Anonymous]

Another parent of Zs: This gen also spend a ridiculous amount of time on IG and Tiktok accounts that convince them they have a mental disorder of some kind and need therapy plus aforementioned apologies. I don’t know how society got to this point and it’s so frustrating.

[Anonymous]

I find it a very bizarre concept that adult kids would want an apology for whatever they perceive their parents did wrong. A conversation about it, perhaps, but I believe most parents just do the best they can with what they have to work with. Are they supposed to apologize for being human, imperfect, and therefore a great disappointment to their kids?

It does make sense that the OP refers to young adults because I think almost 100% of everybody that becomes a parent themselves views this issue very differently than most non-parents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I find it a very bizarre concept that adult kids would want an apology for whatever they perceive their parents did wrong. A conversation about it, perhaps, but I believe most parents just do the best they can with what they have to work with. Are they supposed to apologize for being human, imperfect, and therefore a great disappointment to their kids?

It does make sense that the OP refers to young adults because I think almost 100% of everybody that becomes a parent themselves views this issue very differently than most non-parents.

I mostly agree with this, but I think it's equally bizarre for parents to want a thank you for doing their jobs.

[Anonymous]

It's utterly wrong to subject yourself to perpetual trauma. You cannot move forward unless you forgive.

[Anonymous]

Oh, please. My mom and her siblings go on and on about what they endured at the hands of my grandfather. I’d say they all did “better” as parents, but made plenty of mistakes.

I make tons of mistakes as a parent, too. The difference is—and (speaking in very broad strokes, I admit) I think it’s generational—I always apologize and admit when I am wrong. I don’t just let something blow over; I sincerely tell my kids (10 and 7) that I am sorry if I lose my temper, lose my patience, forget something, etc.

Boomers seem to have a particularly hard time admitting any wrong. “We did the best we could, and you had it WAY better than we did.” Both of those things may well be true, but that doesn’t mean you should never apologize as a parent.

My dad will apologize now, but he never did when we were kids; my mom to this day won’t apologize, even when she royally screws up.

Self-awareness, recognition, and apology can go a very long way. I will add to the generational litany: “I do the best I can, my kids have it way better than I did, AND I apologize to my kids and to my spouse when I am wrong.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh, please. My mom and her siblings go on and on about what they endured at the hands of my grandfather. I’d say they all did “better” as parents, but made plenty of mistakes.

I make tons of mistakes as a parent, too. The difference is—and (speaking in very broad strokes, I admit) I think it’s generational—I always apologize and admit when I am wrong. I don’t just let something blow over; I sincerely tell my kids (10 and 7) that I am sorry if I lose my temper, lose my patience, forget something, etc.

Boomers seem to have a particularly hard time admitting any wrong. “We did the best we could, and you had it WAY better than we did.” Both of those things may well be true, but that doesn’t mean you should never apologize as a parent.

My dad will apologize now, but he never did when we were kids; my mom to this day won’t apologize, even when she royally screws up.

Self-awareness, recognition, and apology can go a very long way. I will add to the generational litany: “I do the best I can, my kids have it way better than I did, AND I apologize to my kids and to my spouse when I am wrong.”

she sounds like my father, even after 17 years i still won't talk to him because of this behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids are all young adults - 33, 30, 28, 25, 22. None of them have ever even hinted that they want an apology. And I sure don’t need a thank you. Although all five of them show gratitude often. Either I got really lucky, or these facts are just made up.

or all of you are in denial or avoid conflict

I don’t think so. We are a very close family. They all come home whenever they can. I feel very lucky.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I find it a very bizarre concept that adult kids would want an apology for whatever they perceive their parents did wrong. A conversation about it, perhaps, but I believe most parents just do the best they can with what they have to work with. Are they supposed to apologize for being human, imperfect, and therefore a great disappointment to their kids?

It does make sense that the OP refers to young adults because I think almost 100% of everybody that becomes a parent themselves views this issue very differently than most non-parents.

What I find bizarre is that these people presumably think apologies are appropriate for mistakes in other circumstances, but think the fact that parenting mistakes are the exception.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids are all young adults - 33, 30, 28, 25, 22. None of them have ever even hinted that they want an apology. And I sure don’t need a thank you. Although all five of them show gratitude often. Either I got really lucky, or these facts are just made up.

or all of you are in denial or avoid conflict

I don’t think so. We are a very close family. They all come home whenever they can. I feel very lucky.

Did you apologize to your kids when they were living at home? Like if you later upon reflection realized a punishment was really harsh or something? I wonder if parents who own up to mistakes as they go are less likely to be hit later with a request for an apology.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids are all young adults - 33, 30, 28, 25, 22. None of them have ever even hinted that they want an apology. And I sure don’t need a thank you. Although all five of them show gratitude often. Either I got really lucky, or these facts are just made up.

They are not telling you their issues yet.

Curious. Did you post that out of spite? Anger? Jealousy? Is it possible that we just have great relationships with our kids, our sons and daughters in law, and our grandkids? Do there have to be issues? We are far from perfect parents. But I think our kids know we love them more than anything in the world. I will always be their biggest cheerleader.

I adore my own parents and my in-laws. I don’t need an apology. But, I do feel tremendous gratitude.