Sport Fair Winter Classic

[Anonymous]

She was fine, doing great at mako, and she'll be fine doing great at NCAP. She is by far the fastest and most talented NCAP Burke female, and will be for the next 3 years. NCAP will get the credit, though, even though she was MAKO for 9 or so years.
Is this a salty MAKO coach posting?

Hardly. This wasn't me, but NCAP has a brand name outside of the DC area. Some of it is well earned, some of it, not so much. Most swimmers in the US stick with their club from start to finish, if for no other reason than it's the only club in town. So when people hear outsiders gush over NCAP...it's like George not getting credit for paying for the The Big Salad.

[Anonymous]

very nice analogy, really very good and nice

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

Just because they are NCAP doesn't mean they are at the same site. She went to Burke and I am sure she went there to train with the Burke guys.

She was fine, doing great at mako, and she'll be fine doing great at NCAP. She is by far the fastest and most talented NCAP Burke female, and will be for the next 3 years. NCAP will get the credit, though, even though she was MAKO for 9 or so years.

Is this a salty MAKO coach posting?

Um i'm the OP of the comment, and it wasn't negative about either team. And definitely about this young lady, who I hope continues her success. I am just so tired of all the NCAP people here who think they are the end all and be all. It is so tiring. I don't even like that this young lady is mentioned in the thread. Upthread another kid is mentioned. People need to get a life.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

DP. But as part of a bigger club with multiple swimmers at that level you aren’t attending those big USA swimming meets by yourself. You have teammates with you, coaches from the club, etc. Swim in a lot of ways is a grind and having teammates that understand and that you can let off steam with is important. You are also participating in meets in between the big USA swimming meets that are more competitive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

No female at NCAP burke was an Olympic trial qualifier this olympics, and not sure when there was one last.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

Not a makos guy, but one of the last truly elite swimmers from the area was with makos from start to age 18, and was the #1 recruit in the country.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

No female at NCAP burke was an Olympic trial qualifier this olympics, and not sure when there was one last.

You know there is a very small number of trials qualifiers in this area that are HS aged swimmers, right? It’s basically NCAP, RMSC and 1 girl from ASA. That really isn’t the entirety of the standard being applied because there are so few, and at some point the commute to those sites becomes unreasonable (maybe NCAP West was doable if they chose Burke, but Maryland definitely isn’t). But you cannot with a straight face say that the cohort at Burke (which includes their boys) is not markedly better than the cohort at Makos.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

Not a makos guy, but one of the last truly elite swimmers from the area was with makos from start to age 18, and was the #1 recruit in the country.

Really, who is this? I’m actually curious.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

Not a makos guy, but one of the last truly elite swimmers from the area was with makos from start to age 18, and was the #1 recruit in the country.

Really, who is this? I’m actually curious.

I just pulled up the Mako club records— they probably mean Anthony Grimm?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are hearing rumors some big clubs aren’t attending this year and were also just told we could bring more swimmers than originally planned. Which clubs are definitely attending? Who dropped out?

There are not many big clubs at this meet. The big clubs (RMSC, NCAP, Machine, etc) all attend NCI and Turkey Claus.

NCI pulls in a lot of teams from out of state and many qualifying cuts are faster than senior champs. It certainly takes a faster time to final. It’s a really fast meet.

NCI is just an incredibly fast meet. Thankfully Turkey Claus, sport Fair winter classic, etc exist for the not incredibly fast.

To be clear, there are plenty of swimmers at the Winter Classic that are fast enough to swim at the NCI. Their teams just don't participate so they cannot, even though they have the cuts. NCI is unquestionably a much faster meet, but it's inaccurate to say that the Winter Classic is for swimmers that are "not incredibly fast".

100%! Just looking at one event (50 back) in 9-10 girls, York, Makos, and OCCS all have 9-10 girls who are as fast as girls on NCAP and RMSC. York has the two fastest 9-10 girls in all of PVS by miles. (We swim at NCAP, but huge props to York. If we lived closer, I might change to York. They look like they are a true team.)

By the way YORK has literally always has good 10&Unders so where are their girls ranked in 13-14 and 15&Over categories right now?

If they aren’t high then sorry they aren’t a good team (unless you only want success at 10)

A lot of them move to NCAP.

Also NP but if every good kid needs to switch teams you don’t have a good team, however a girls Olympic Trials qualifier switching is a totally different situation. She needs higher level training partners which she will get with the NCAP boys (which are way better than Mako boys)

I don’t disagree. But I think the point getting lost is that she already achieved an incredible outcome before the switch.

People get that but are pointing out that her cohort was older kids and as those kids age out she’s left with kids her own age that not only cannot push her, but probably can’t even keep up with the basic level of training she needs.

And if you look at her times there are quite a few NCAP females that are her age that are definitely a cohort. Not to mention the ones that might be older or male.

https://swimstandards.com/rankings?page=1

She has a true training group.

It’s not just about the training cohort. The top groups from the various NCAP sites go to much faster meets outside of PVS. They had a meet in Charlottesville instead of the October open then the NOVA Sr Classic in Richmond. Going to bigger and faster meets also helps prepare you.

Anybody that’s been to Olympic Trials is qualified for the biggest USA swimming meets. Don’t delude yourself that those other meets mean anything.

But they do. They are better pools with faster kids. It is not just training but practicing racing and NCAP meets are faster. Where other kids making Olympic qualifying cuts are also competing. Instead of attending an Open where no one is close to your speen you are at a venue with multiple competition pools, cool down pools and fast kids that have come from many states. The meets you attend is part of the better competition.

Look up the fast kids nationwide and you see kids from all over but certain clubs tend to have more.

Makos doesn’t even do open meets. I understand what you’re saying and disagree respectfully.

They host meets that have even lighter competition than the Opens, and they do participate in Opens. Last fall that swimmer did a Makos meet, Oct Open, Swim and Rock, US Open and Winter Classic. This year it will be Oct Open, NOVA Senior Classic, US Open and NCI. I know it’s frustrating for clubs like Fish and Makos to lose amazing swimmers to the NCAP machine, but it’s crazy to say a truly elite swimmer can get the same competitive experience at Makos as they can at NCAP.

No female at NCAP burke was an Olympic trial qualifier this olympics, and not sure when there was one last.

You know there is a very small number of trials qualifiers in this area that are HS aged swimmers, right? It’s basically NCAP, RMSC and 1 girl from ASA. That really isn’t the entirety of the standard being applied because there are so few, and at some point the commute to those sites becomes unreasonable (maybe NCAP West was doable if they chose Burke, but Maryland definitely isn’t). But you cannot with a straight face say that the cohort at Burke (which includes their boys) is not markedly better than the cohort at Makos.

A training cohort is only swimmers of the same age and gender though

-Typical DCUM responder