Seeing OPP (other people’s parenting) up close

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you live near Los Angeles? We saw a lot of this when we lived there, maybe over 50% of families were into this nonsense, with the results being everyone was pretty unhappy.

Op here. Lol no but I do think they are very deep into their own interpretation of attachment parenting. The 2 yo is still up 3 times a night to nurse. And I’m not sure I’ve ever seen any of their kids go into timeout before. And yeah even on vacation my sister has to prep all their food. I shopped for her before they came and tried to get all her items but on a few I couldn’t (Costco didn’t have the organic butter, so I got non-organic and she rejected it).

I’m just so tired. We are on day 4. 3.5 days to go.

Oh my god. That is beyond messed up. I try not to judge people who extended breastfeed but to be waking up 3x a night at 2 is not healthy or normal christ

Op here. Yeah I had my sis walk me through a typical night. They also are unwilling to use night pull ups, and their 4 and 6 yo both wet the bed most nights so they are changing bedding in the middle of the night. Also the kids apparently each also wake up at least once a night and need comforting. So between the nursing, pee accidents, comforting, and sippy milk runs for the older kids, it’s basically every 45-90 minutes they are all up every single night.

Also none of her kids nap, so she doesn’t get a break at nap time either.

Can you guys suggest you watch the kids while they nap? I'm a much better parent and person when I'm well rested. Helping out while one naps will maybe show them the benefits of sleep. Is the husband going along with all of this? Does he seem miserable too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think the only thing you can do is comment on your sister and how she's doing, NOT on her parenting choices. So something like "It's been so good to see you. I'm a bit concerned though - you seem really anxious and stressed, and you get so little sleep. Is there anything I can do for you, beyond this week? Have you maybe considered talk to someone about your stress levels, like a therapist?"

Beyond that, help in the moment with what she needs is the best you can offer her. I'm sorry OP, that must be really hard to watch.

+1 to this. The issue is her anxiety, not her parenting. If you question anything with her parenting you're going to hit a wall.

[Anonymous]

Figure out how many days you can handle being around her in a row. Next time only invite them for that amount of time (or just agree to meet them somewhere else and have your own hotel/rental house and don't worry about coordinating meals. It is a shame, but not everybody can be around family 24/7.

I wouldn't bother giving advice. MYOB and figure out how to plan/set up boundaries so you can enjoy your time together next time.

[Anonymous]

I wouldn’t give her advice, but I would ask questions. I’d ask her why she chooses to do all that she does, and really listen. I bet she’s never really heard herself seriously explain all her decisions out loud, because she’s so busy being defensive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op here. I don’t think I can say anything. My sister has already gotten a lot of advice/criticism from most people in her life so she’s extremely defensive and isolated. She’s so defensive that even making suggestions about ideas for plans for their trip winds her up. And she has a lot of opinions about what they do but doesn’t always disclose them so I’m left kind of trying to figure out what she’s thinking. When I just tell her things like “we could go to the zoo” or “you could try this park”, she bristles. She’s extremely cautious/paranoid about COVID so I’m guessing that’s part of the reason. But the hypocrisy is kind of confusing to me, considering they flew on a plane to come here, but then expects me to keep my kids home and isolated the whole time they are here (I sense she’s uncomfortable going to parks or zoos).

Nope.
Your sister is dealing with EXTREME anxiety and no wait should you allow that to negatively affect your kids.
I am all for being sensitive and empathetic but what she is doing is extreme. At this point, we would have a talk if I cannot even use my own kitchen. She needs medication and I’m not being sarcastic. This is over the top, she is suffering.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you live near Los Angeles? We saw a lot of this when we lived there, maybe over 50% of families were into this nonsense, with the results being everyone was pretty unhappy.

Op here. Lol no but I do think they are very deep into their own interpretation of attachment parenting. The 2 yo is still up 3 times a night to nurse. And I’m not sure I’ve ever seen any of their kids go into timeout before. And yeah even on vacation my sister has to prep all their food. I shopped for her before they came and tried to get all her items but on a few I couldn’t (Costco didn’t have the organic butter, so I got non-organic and she rejected it).

I’m just so tired. We are on day 4. 3.5 days to go.

Oh my god. That is beyond messed up. I try not to judge people who extended breastfeed but to be waking up 3x a night at 2 is not healthy or normal christ

Op here. Yeah I had my sis walk me through a typical night. They also are unwilling to use night pull ups, and their 4 and 6 yo both wet the bed most nights so they are changing bedding in the middle of the night. Also the kids apparently each also wake up at least once a night and need comforting. So between the nursing, pee accidents, comforting, and sippy milk runs for the older kids, it’s basically every 45-90 minutes they are all up every single night.

Also none of her kids nap, so she doesn’t get a break at nap time either.

She is knowingly allowing them to Pee on your bed??
Oh
HELL NO!
Your sister needs to go.
She is creating her own nightmare for her for her kids and now she’s pulling you into it and it’s not fair you need to have a real come to Jesus with her she needs weekly therapy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Okay so I’ll chime in because I’m like your sister, maybe not to that extend but still.

We have no family nearby and haven’t had a time alone since kids were born, I complain I want alone time and date night but know that there will be meltdowns so I don’t even want to go through it.

I’m obsessed about the food we eat, family members have color cancer and other types of illnesses, that I hope and desperately want to control and avoid so I’m hoping things like food and what we put in our bodies are as safe as possible. Yes up to date on all vaccinations bc I want to control illness. Here is how you can help, try finding easy recipes or some good healthy takeout, and they’ll welcome it. I know i did when I got smarter about reading labels.

We don’t have elaborate cups but I don’t reuse cups, for myself included. There’s spit and food particles and smells, it’s disgusting and I won’t have it. Now this is where you could help, when my mom visited she put them in the dishwasher not knowing it was hand wash only and they actually...turned out clean and great. So I now do them by dishwasher.

I never sleep trained and I regret it. I hoped things will get better but they never did so three year old still wakes up a few times crying, not able to settle, etc. we don’t cosleep but I get it, you’ve screwed up the sleep and now is too late to fix so you keep hoping it will be improve.

I try the whole compassionate parenting acknowledging feelings or letting them have their feelings out, so I’ve never done timeouts. I was spanked as a kid and sent to time out and I felt very ashamed. Yes there’s tantrums that timeouts may help but I don’t want that.

Now all this to say....you shouldn’t judge because everyone makes different choices, they may not be right or make sense to you, but you can only offer support, acknowledgement, and help where you can, otherwise there’s nothing else to do.

OK I’m going to respond to you as kindly as I can but as frankly as I’m going to be. Part of your issues anxiety just like the original poster sister it’s anxiety. And your anxiety is telling you that these are just choices and other people need to just respect them. But every choice that you spoke of you complain about list of the negative affects you don’t want to hear alternative solutions other than you’re already not working behavior. Would be do you don’t really reuse cups I reuse cups I rinse them out and I wash them sometimes I hand was, some I put in the dishwasher, it’s just a freaking cup nobody’s gonna die from a cup.
the fact that you make that an issue may be a red flag to yourself that you are dealing with anxiety. You didn’t sleep train before but you can sleep train now parenting is hard it’s just hard it can be on comfortable it can be frustrating but you have to get through it and there will be periods where your kid may be uncomfortable or doing something or learning something that is new and they don’t like and they will cry or they will push back against it. That’s life you have to learn how to be the grown-up to lead them through that discomfort I don’t spank either maybe what you need to do is take an actual classes so that you learn how to positively parent and instill discipline because it sounds like you’re flying by the seat of your pants. And by the way a lot of us try to eat healthy and do things that were home keep our bodies healthy a lot of us have people we know are people were laid into her cancer but you cannot control everything and you try to control everything is a hell that’s worse than cancer it’s actually a cancer on your mind and your emotions and that gets inflicted on everyone around you including your kids.

[Anonymous]

Yep talk to her about anxiety, like a po said it sounds like OCD.
She is suffering and so is everyone around her.
What do your parents say.
I don’t know what this point I am she would be on when I’m crazy thing she’s doing and I will just grab her and hug her and just tell her ‘you just can’t help yourself can you, I know you want to but you just can’t can we talk about it?’

[Anonymous]

Op here. Ok only 3.5 more days to go! They leave Tuesday mid day.

A lot of the suggestions here seem to be along the lines of trying to “help” my sister be better. I’m telling you it’s not possible. The only way to have a relationship with her is to play by her rules (she once cut me off for 5 years, I’ve only been back in her good graces for the last 2 years).

I fully accept that it is what it is and I’m a firm believer that, unless someone’s doing something that CPS needs to know about, then they get to do whatever they want with their kids.

I think I’m just trying to figure out how to survive the next 80 hours (not that anyone’s counting haha.....). I like the suggestions of just doing my own thing with my own kids.

Her DH is just a shell of a human. He’s miserable. He does whatever she says. I don’t think he agrees with her (or at least not to the extremes she goes to), but he does whatever she says. I actually have very little direct interaction with him as she doesn’t like him coordinating plans without her being present.

Part of what’s making things hard is just being around my sis and her DH and the way they are just constantly fighting and screaming at their kids. Like they are all sweet and “ok baby” to each other but then they run out of patience and lose their sh1t on each other or their kids 10 times a day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do you live near Los Angeles? We saw a lot of this when we lived there, maybe over 50% of families were into this nonsense, with the results being everyone was pretty unhappy.

Op here. Lol no but I do think they are very deep into their own interpretation of attachment parenting. The 2 yo is still up 3 times a night to nurse. And I’m not sure I’ve ever seen any of their kids go into timeout before. And yeah even on vacation my sister has to prep all their food. I shopped for her before they came and tried to get all her items but on a few I couldn’t (Costco didn’t have the organic butter, so I got non-organic and she rejected it).

I’m just so tired. We are on day 4. 3.5 days to go.

Oh my god. That is beyond messed up. I try not to judge people who extended breastfeed but to be waking up 3x a night at 2 is not healthy or normal christ

Op here. Yeah I had my sis walk me through a typical night. They also are unwilling to use night pull ups, and their 4 and 6 yo both wet the bed most nights so they are changing bedding in the middle of the night. Also the kids apparently each also wake up at least once a night and need comforting. So between the nursing, pee accidents, comforting, and sippy milk runs for the older kids, it’s basically every 45-90 minutes they are all up every single night.

Also none of her kids nap, so she doesn’t get a break at nap time either.

She is knowingly allowing them to Pee on your bed??
Oh
HELL NO!
Your sister needs to go.
She is creating her own nightmare for her for her kids and now she’s pulling you into it and it’s not fair you need to have a real come to Jesus with her she needs weekly therapy.

Op here. There’s a waterproof mattress cover on my bed because I’ve got little kids. We gave them the master bedroom since they needed enough space to all cosleep together.

[Anonymous]

Op here. I mean, in my sister’s defense, I think what she would say is that the reason she does these things is because her kids are the most difficult children that have ever walked the earth. And I agree that her oldest is really a hard kid. And I wonder if it’s because of her parenting or because of his innate temperament. But if you asked her she’d say she does these things to cope with how challenging he is (like she’s trying to use diet to treat ADHD if I had to guess but she’d NEVER admit that he has ADHD, or the cosleeping thing I think she does because her kids would tantrum if she didn’t and she can’t bear it).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op here. Ok only 3.5 more days to go! They leave Tuesday mid day.

A lot of the suggestions here seem to be along the lines of trying to “help” my sister be better. I’m telling you it’s not possible. The only way to have a relationship with her is to play by her rules (she once cut me off for 5 years, I’ve only been back in her good graces for the last 2 years).

I fully accept that it is what it is and I’m a firm believer that, unless someone’s doing something that CPS needs to know about, then they get to do whatever they want with their kids.

I think I’m just trying to figure out how to survive the next 80 hours (not that anyone’s counting haha.....). I like the suggestions of just doing my own thing with my own kids.

Her DH is just a shell of a human. He’s miserable. He does whatever she says. I don’t think he agrees with her (or at least not to the extremes she goes to), but he does whatever she says. I actually have very little direct interaction with him as she doesn’t like him coordinating plans without her being present.

Part of what’s making things hard is just being around my sis and her DH and the way they are just constantly fighting and screaming at their kids. Like they are all sweet and “ok baby” to each other but then they run out of patience and lose their sh1t on each other or their kids 10 times a day.

Just take your kids to the playground. Have them wear masks if it makes your sister feel better. Skip the zoo unless it's fully outdoors. Contemplate that this is the last time you will ever, ever do this, because if they ever come back they will be staying in an AirBnB and not with you. Even if you have to split the cost of the AirBnB with them. And if you ever visit them, commit in advance to staying in a hotel or AirBnB yourself!

I hope the cousins enjoy each others' company at least!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Op here. I mean, in my sister’s defense, I think what she would say is that the reason she does these things is because her kids are the most difficult children that have ever walked the earth. And I agree that her oldest is really a hard kid. And I wonder if it’s because of her parenting or because of his innate temperament. But if you asked her she’d say she does these things to cope with how challenging he is (like she’s trying to use diet to treat ADHD if I had to guess but she’d NEVER admit that he has ADHD, or the cosleeping thing I think she does because her kids would tantrum if she didn’t and she can’t bear it).

I’m the poster who suggested she had OCD. I’m also a research scientist and have studied ADHD extensively.

My oldest has special needs, and severe ADHD, and I had to adjust my parenting accordingly. We tried everything (diet, behavioral modification, etc) before understanding that meds were in order. Parenting a child with multiple issues is very hard, particularly in that early phase when you don’t even know what the diagnoses are, and even more so if one parent refuses to even consider an evaluation or treatment. Been there, done that. It’s hell.

Please understand that her parenting did NOT cause her children’s issues!!! Don’t put that most unfair blame on this poor woman who is already struggling so much! However, also understand that these behaviors are inheritable. Either your sister or her husband or both have similar issues that may never have been diagnosed. This contributes to the mess, because it’s hard for an affected parent to recognize their child needs help when they themselves received none, and it’s difficult for them to get organized enough to lead a normal life if the parents themselves have mental health issues. Double whammy.

FYI: comorbidities are frequent in psychiatry, and the same inherited genetic profile can present with a different diagnosis in related family members. ADHD, ASD, various presentations of anxiety (including OCD and hoarding) can all be present in one or more members of the same family.

[Anonymous]

Op here. Ok so my 2 yo has diagnosed special needs. I’m not blaming my sister if her son has ADHD. I am not qualified to diagnose anything, I’m just speculating. I still think that the level of catering these kids have received is an aspect of what’s going on, not that my sister “caused” her son’s potential ADHD (if he even has that).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I wouldn’t give her advice, but I would ask questions. I’d ask her why she chooses to do all that she does, and really listen. I bet she’s never really heard herself seriously explain all her decisions out loud, because she’s so busy being defensive.

Geez, why. No way asking a bunch of questions will not sound judgmental, especially as OP is judging. Just set things up next time so their choices impact your life as little as possible and carry on.