Help me navigate this type of argument or response with my DH

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, take this for what it's worth. I'm a marriage therapist and I've been married for 30 years.

It doesn't matter what your husband is doing, you are the one that needs to change because he may never change.

First piece of advice - pick up the mugs yourself and put them in the sink. Don't want to do that? Okay, then be prepared to have this discussion about dirty mugs for another 20 years. This is so easy for you to just take care of, who cares if it's "your" job or "his" job.

Second, if you are going to make an issue of the mugs just use a few words, no need to go on and on since you've probably had this conversation a hundred times.

"I would really appreciate it if you would put your mugs in the sink."

End of discussion. He can retort with whatever he'd like, just say "mmm hmmm" and keep on moving through your day.

Same with the lights example.

The money thing - I believe if their is enough money for the essentials then nobody has any business telling anybody else how to spend money. Again, you may disagree but you wouldn't like it if it was done to you.

And my last piece of advice, stop watching everything he does and says, he's allowed to not be perfect and so are you. Let it go.

"Enough money for the essentials" is a low bar. Partners need to decide together how to use their joint financial resources. If a spouse's expensive hobby is impairing their ability to save or curtailing another family member's choices, or causing retirement to be delayed eventually, then it is most certainly the other spouse's business and s/he is certainly justified in raising it as an issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I always just say we .

"Wow the bill was high this month. We need to get better about turning the lights off, I know I always forget."

"Shoot, we spent way too much money this week. We need to try to cut back next week to make up for it. I didn't even realize..."

It's so easy. Nobody feels attacked and since you've already looped yourself in on the behavior too he and flip it on you as if you're acting holier than thou.

My DH totally calls that out--"And by 'we,' you mean 'me', right?

It can come across as passive-aggressive, particularly if it is obvious that it is something your DH mainly does.

[Anonymous]

It’s a f***ing mug.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s a f***ing mug.

I guess you missed the part where it's actually NOT a f***ing mug, but bigger issues, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I always just say we .

"Wow the bill was high this month. We need to get better about turning the lights off, I know I always forget."

"Shoot, we spent way too much money this week. We need to try to cut back next week to make up for it. I didn't even realize..."

It's so easy. Nobody feels attacked and since you've already looped yourself in on the behavior too he and flip it on you as if you're acting holier than thou.

My DH totally calls that out--"And by 'we,' you mean 'me', right?

It can come across as passive-aggressive, particularly if it is obvious that it is something your DH mainly does.

Also, it never really changes the behavior. Saying "we should budget more" typically means that the DH (or the one spending too much) doesn't stop but just expects the one that brought it up to change.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, take this for what it's worth. I'm a marriage therapist and I've been married for 30 years.

It doesn't matter what your husband is doing, you are the one that needs to change because he may never change.

First piece of advice - pick up the mugs yourself and put them in the sink. Don't want to do that? Okay, then be prepared to have this discussion about dirty mugs for another 20 years. This is so easy for you to just take care of, who cares if it's "your" job or "his" job.

Second, if you are going to make an issue of the mugs just use a few words, no need to go on and on since you've probably had this conversation a hundred times.

"I would really appreciate it if you would put your mugs in the sink."

End of discussion. He can retort with whatever he'd like, just say "mmm hmmm" and keep on moving through your day.

Same with the lights example.

The money thing - I believe if their is enough money for the essentials then nobody has any business telling anybody else how to spend money. Again, you may disagree but you wouldn't like it if it was done to you.

And my last piece of advice, stop watching everything he does and says, he's allowed to not be perfect and so are you. Let it go.

This stuff really piles up in a house with an ADHD spouse and parent. It is constant and never-ending and gross.

Life is too short to live in a pigsty or with a pig. Seriously.

You almost have to reconcile it as someone with a disability and then decide if that's the life you want and thats the partner-in-life you want.

I'm the PP and I actually do have an Adhd spouse and child. I don't live in a pig sty, I clean it myself. I just recognize that being in a neat house is important to me and not my spouse. If I sit around waiting for him to change then I will spend my whole life angry.

Just because something is important to you doesn't mean it's important to your spouse. If it's important to you then do it yourself. I'm not discussing what's "fair", I'm just being realistic.

My husband has a thousand other wonderful attributes, I choose to focus on those sound don't get resentful of the housework. I highly recommend this approach,it's a choice to live your life with anger and resentment.

I work FT and so does ADHD husband. If he comes home and makes a mess, he damn well sure is cleaning it up himself ASAP. Not me. If he can't do that, we can hire a housecleaner to follow him around for $25/hour like a pooper scooper. So he better be pulling in bank or picking up after himself. Or just stay out of the house. That'll keep it tidier and cleaner as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, take this for what it's worth. I'm a marriage therapist and I've been married for 30 years.

It doesn't matter what your husband is doing, you are the one that needs to change because he may never change.

First piece of advice - pick up the mugs yourself and put them in the sink. Don't want to do that? Okay, then be prepared to have this discussion about dirty mugs for another 20 years. This is so easy for you to just take care of, who cares if it's "your" job or "his" job.

Second, if you are going to make an issue of the mugs just use a few words, no need to go on and on since you've probably had this conversation a hundred times.

"I would really appreciate it if you would put your mugs in the sink."

End of discussion. He can retort with whatever he'd like, just say "mmm hmmm" and keep on moving through your day.

Same with the lights example.

The money thing - I believe if their is enough money for the essentials then nobody has any business telling anybody else how to spend money. Again, you may disagree but you wouldn't like it if it was done to you.

And my last piece of advice, stop watching everything he does and says, he's allowed to not be perfect and so are you. Let it go.

I have to say that you must not be a good therapist. Someone has an issue with their partner and your first piece of advice is to just accept it and work around it (pick up mugs yourself)? Shouldn't you be giving advice on how to better communicate with your partner? I mean other posters are saying "go to therapy to learn to communicate better." If they went to you, you'd just say to not bring it up and do it yourself - basically "just deal with it." Bad advice.

Second - and this is just advice to you (take it or leave it, but I've been to therapy for years and years with different therapists) but when a client is giving you an example of something that bothers her, don't assume absolutes. Your last piece of advice is predicated on an assumption that they're watching everything he does and says. Bad assumption and a dangerous one for a therapist to make.

Maybe take come continuing education courses or something to freshen up your skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, take this for what it's worth. I'm a marriage therapist and I've been married for 30 years.

It doesn't matter what your husband is doing, you are the one that needs to change because he may never change.

First piece of advice - pick up the mugs yourself and put them in the sink. Don't want to do that? Okay, then be prepared to have this discussion about dirty mugs for another 20 years. This is so easy for you to just take care of, who cares if it's "your" job or "his" job.

Second, if you are going to make an issue of the mugs just use a few words, no need to go on and on since you've probably had this conversation a hundred times.

"I would really appreciate it if you would put your mugs in the sink."

End of discussion. He can retort with whatever he'd like, just say "mmm hmmm" and keep on moving through your day.

Same with the lights example.

The money thing - I believe if their is enough money for the essentials then nobody has any business telling anybody else how to spend money. Again, you may disagree but you wouldn't like it if it was done to you.

And my last piece of advice, stop watching everything he does and says, he's allowed to not be perfect and so are you. Let it go.

I have to say that you must not be a good therapist. Someone has an issue with their partner and your first piece of advice is to just accept it and work around it (pick up mugs yourself)? Shouldn't you be giving advice on how to better communicate with your partner? I mean other posters are saying "go to therapy to learn to communicate better." If they went to you, you'd just say to not bring it up and do it yourself - basically "just deal with it." Bad advice.

Second - and this is just advice to you (take it or leave it, but I've been to therapy for years and years with different therapists) but when a client is giving you an example of something that bothers her, don't assume absolutes. Your last piece of advice is predicated on an assumption that they're watching everything he does and says. Bad assumption and a dangerous one for a therapist to make.

Maybe take come continuing education courses or something to freshen up your skills.

The thing is -- and you'd better learn this -- no matter how well YOU communicate you cannot change your partner. You can only change you.

[Anonymous]

So make it clear so the delinquent husband wants to make a change and improvement in himself. He can only change himself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, take this for what it's worth. I'm a marriage therapist and I've been married for 30 years.

It doesn't matter what your husband is doing, you are the one that needs to change because he may never change.

First piece of advice - pick up the mugs yourself and put them in the sink. Don't want to do that? Okay, then be prepared to have this discussion about dirty mugs for another 20 years. This is so easy for you to just take care of, who cares if it's "your" job or "his" job.

Second, if you are going to make an issue of the mugs just use a few words, no need to go on and on since you've probably had this conversation a hundred times.

"I would really appreciate it if you would put your mugs in the sink."

End of discussion. He can retort with whatever he'd like, just say "mmm hmmm" and keep on moving through your day.

Same with the lights example.

The money thing - I believe if their is enough money for the essentials then nobody has any business telling anybody else how to spend money. Again, you may disagree but you wouldn't like it if it was done to you.

And my last piece of advice, stop watching everything he does and says, he's allowed to not be perfect and so are you. Let it go.

This stuff really piles up in a house with an ADHD spouse and parent. It is constant and never-ending and gross.

Life is too short to live in a pigsty or with a pig. Seriously.

You almost have to reconcile it as someone with a disability and then decide if that's the life you want and thats the partner-in-life you want.

I'm the PP and I actually do have an Adhd spouse and child. I don't live in a pig sty, I clean it myself. I just recognize that being in a neat house is important to me and not my spouse. If I sit around waiting for him to change then I will spend my whole life angry.

Just because something is important to you doesn't mean it's important to your spouse. If it's important to you then do it yourself. I'm not discussing what's "fair", I'm just being realistic.

My husband has a thousand other wonderful attributes, I choose to focus on those sound don't get resentful of the housework. I highly recommend this approach,it's a choice to live your life with anger and resentment.

I work FT and so does ADHD husband. If he comes home and makes a mess, he damn well sure is cleaning it up himself ASAP. Not me. If he can't do that, we can hire a housecleaner to follow him around for $25/hour like a pooper scooper. So he better be pulling in bank or picking up after himself. Or just stay out of the house. That'll keep it tidier and cleaner as well.

I like those 3 options!
1. Pick up after yourself asap
2. Hire a pooper scooper housekeeper
3. Stay out of the house

[Anonymous]

I know what OP is talking about. I really do, and it's not about mugs and crap, it's about the boomerang effect. You can never have a conversation with your spouse without opening up yourself to an arsenal of attacks. It's not a fair way to be with someone. But what I finally found sort of worked was similar to what others are saying. Not the "we" thing (which my husband sees right through), but more of a "hey, so I've been working on this whole thing where I leave glasses around the house, which I know drives you nuts. (true story). I'm wondering if you might be able to put that same energy into not leaving your socks on the floor (whatever it is.) It sort of acknowledges off the bat that 1. you had a complaint. 2. I'm working on it. 3. Can you do the same for me. At least in my house, that's working. It acknowledges your own shortcomings, your own efforts, and takes that out of the conversation. Maybe?

[Anonymous]

I broke down and hit a wall trying to do everything. had a sob about how everything is falling through the cracks - and it was. other families all move ahead, ours is suffering setbacks - and we were. how I must be ill or messed up since I cannot do everything. what or what will we do?

On his own accord, he scheduled a neuropsyche test and got ADHD meds later that month.

[Anonymous]

PP 15:31 did sort of what I did.

I stopped asking about this stuff for a while, and then when we were in a good place I said something like this:

"I know I nag you a lot about the socks/lights (whatever.) And I fully acknowledge that tidying the house is a bigger deal to me than it is to you, and that's totally fair. The thing is, seeing all the socks around the house makes me so anxious and unhappy. I realize it seems silly, but it just does."

It really worked. Framing it as him doing it for ME out of his love and respect for me worked way better than getting him to do it because it's clearly the right way to live. Etc.

[Anonymous]

Same here, he went and lined up a different job and has been much happier since then.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think 11:11 has it exactly right. If your dh will go to counseling and work on his core issues, great, but either way I don't think it's reasonable or fair to constantly tell your spouse what they should be doing or not doing. We all do things that annoy other people.

New poster.
Replies like the one above beg the question: So, rather than ask (not tell, ask) her DH to do some minor things that make the whole household work better for everyone in it (not solely for OP), what should OP do, day to day? Be silent and just do those things herself? Pick up his stuff, haul his mugs to the kitchen etc. rather than ask him to deal with his own stuff? Yes, she can find better ways to phrase what she says, and she's open to making that change.

It's easy to say from outside, it's not reasonable to ask him to do this or that. Yet the "this or that" tasks still need to be done, unless OP goes the passive-aggressive route of simply leaving DH's cups and clothes and junk wherever it lies until it piles up. I'm pretty sure her DH eventually would turn on her for doing that too. She can't win.

OP already indicated that the issues are actually bigger than the examples she gave, so it seems clear that these arguments and DH's habit of "Well, I may do X but YOU always do Y" are not just about dirty dishes and clothes. OP, please get marriage counseling. You can learn to communicate with him better too. And see if your DH will get into individual therapy because the way he argues indicated its probably a very deeply ingrained response he probably learned all his life.

Why? What happens if you pick up someone else’s dirty coffee cup? As long as these tasks don’t add up to more than ten minutes a day, I just don’t see what the big deal is. It certainly seems easier and more pleasant than having a “conversation “ about it.