Getting seperated...what is fair?

[Anonymous]

My brother-in-law and sister sound a lot like the two of you. BIL tried to present the collaborative divorce angle to get my sister to agree to a very bad deal. Luckily they live in a state that requires a year-long separation. She agreed to a terrible temporary separation agreement for that year, but by the end of the year it had become clear even to her that he was dealing in bad faith. She eventually got a lawyer and got a better deal, although I still don't think she advocated for herself as much as she should. You just cannot afford to let emotions drive this process. Lawyers have seen a lot of different fact patterns and they can help you figure out what will be best. You would not do open heart surgery on yourself, you would go to a reputable surgeon. This is the same. You need to hire a professional who has experience with divorce to handle the technical details. It will cost money, but it will be worth it in the long run.

[Anonymous]

His first idea was that I would move out and I would watch the kids for him until he could get home (sometimes not until 8 or 9 when he plays sports or whatever). Then, pick them up to go to school the next day. Basically, I was supposed to continue catering his schedule (raising the kids as usual), but also get a second job and live elsewhere.

This is so absurd and bizarre and self-serving that I almost can't believe it's real (but I do believe you, OP).
anyone who proposes this as "fair" is not a good candidate for collaborative divorce.

Time to stop worrying over why he's doing what he's doing (anxiety, job, whatever). Doesn't matter anymore. He made a unilateral decision to break up the family and create financial hardship. He's got to take responsibility for that.

Yes, 50/50 custody is the presumption but you can have joint legal without having 50% joint physical. In his case, it doesn't sound like he really wants to be a 50% time dad. But be careful: the amount of support you get often depends on how much time the kids are with you vs him.

are you sure your house is still underwater?

please do look into ALL the debt accrued, and go over finances, credit reports, etc. He sounds like he might have been planning this a while and could have been taking money aside quietly.

hate to say it, but you need a good lawyer and yes, it will cost you.

[Anonymous]

Try to hammer something out through collaborative divorce BUT caution him that anything decided will be run by an attorney that is looking out for you and only you.

$1500 seems a bit low but let's remember he is making $100k a year and other posters have given their examples which may or may not apply here. Also SN treatments if properly diagnosed and not challenged by the father will be another factor to split (maybe when you both put in the CS calcs you forgot to include daycare, SN treatments, etc.) You may want him to sign off on an agreement that your kid is truly SN and to the current path -- and cost -- of treatment so he doesn't show up 5-6 years down the road and challenges all these treatments and accuse you of having Munchausen's by proxy or something.

The $30k of debt is something you might get saddled with. Perhaps he could offer to assume it for say 55% of the house but getting the whole house that'd be too damn much as he stands to make $10k or MORE 15, 20, whatever years down the road.

Don't let him make you what amounts to a live-out nanny. The basic split (every other weekend and 8 four hour visits) doesn't seem too bad unless he starts trying to weasel around on that (shifting dates last-minute, etc.).

In that case an ironclad agreement always helps if he tries to be a weasel about it ...

A mediator could be helpful as well but the mediator's central loyalty is for the deal and said mediator cannot offer you individual legal advice (i.e. he/she can rule "yeah that'd pass muster" but not "Ma'am, with all due respect you're screwing yourself over.")

[Anonymous]

The DH divorcing his DW upthread, but I do not understand the house issue here. Why does the DH want the house? In my case, I was willing to have DW stay in the current house until last kid graduates HS, then either DW buys out my equity or it is sold and the proceeds split 50/50. That seems a rather fair arrangement to me.

Now, I am in VA and the accumulation of marital assets stop as of date of separation. VA requires a one year wait.

I had to take the "high road" in my divorce b/c DW was nasty and conniving, hiding assets, etc. I actually sued for divorce on grounds of cruelty b/c she was abusive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The DH divorcing his DW upthread, but I do not understand the house issue here. Why does the DH want the house? In my case, I was willing to have DW stay in the current house until last kid graduates HS, then either DW buys out my equity or it is sold and the proceeds split 50/50. That seems a rather fair arrangement to me.

Now, I am in VA and the accumulation of marital assets stop as of date of separation. VA requires a one year wait.

I had to take the "high road" in my divorce b/c DW was nasty and conniving, hiding assets, etc. I actually sued for divorce on grounds of cruelty b/c she was abusive.

It sounds like the OP's husband wants it all, basically. He wants out of the marriage, all the retirement money, all the money that was supposed to be supporting the family (except $1500/month!), the kids, free full-time care for the kids from OP, time to play sports in the evening, and maybe his old girlfriend too. As another PP put it, I'd laugh if it wasn't so horrible. The nerve.

You'll get through this, OP, with a little help from your friends (and a qualified attorney who will advocate for you and your children). Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The DH divorcing his DW upthread, but I do not understand the house issue here. Why does the DH want the house? In my case, I was willing to have DW stay in the current house until last kid graduates HS, then either DW buys out my equity or it is sold and the proceeds split 50/50. That seems a rather fair arrangement to me.

Now, I am in VA and the accumulation of marital assets stop as of date of separation. VA requires a one year wait.

I had to take the "high road" in my divorce b/c DW was nasty and conniving, hiding assets, etc. I actually sued for divorce on grounds of cruelty b/c she was abusive.

It sounds like the OP's husband wants it all, basically. He wants out of the marriage, all the retirement money, all the money that was supposed to be supporting the family (except $1500/month!), the kids, free full-time care for the kids from OP, time to play sports in the evening, and maybe his old girlfriend too. As another PP put it, I'd laugh if it wasn't so horrible. The nerve.

You'll get through this, OP, with a little help from your friends (and a qualified attorney who will advocate for you and your children). Good luck.

^^And bc the house is their biggest asset, obviously. He wants it all.

[Anonymous]

DH is being an ass. My DW was a nasty, abusive bitch, but I played fair and with the help of an attorney gave her what she was legally entitled to have. Nothing more. It made the whole divorce process so much easier. OP, no one will stand up for you but you. Please take the advice on this forum. You do not need to go for the jugular, but you need to insist on what is fair for you under the law. Once you have a "total assets" picture, you can decide on a distribution that is fair and equitable.

[Anonymous]

Time to lawyer up. Try Avery/Upton in Rockville, the consult is probably free. They're fair but tough if necessary.

Take notes, document everything, keep a parenting journal, take notes from phone calls. Educate yourself on divorce. Save all emails, texts, correspondence. I can tell from everything you've written that you're about to be in a huge world of hurt if you don't get a lawyer and toughen up, stop being "nice". Do WHATEVER you have to do to get a lawyer. You'll either pay now or pay later, and if you pay later, your kids may pay, too. Imagine if they ended up with their dad because after the divorce (that you attained through fair mediation without a lawyer) you were left in a vulnerable position financially and your ex then filed for full custody and you couldn't afford a lawyer then? You're in a better position at the current time so USE IT, do not squander it. Something similar happened to me and my ex sounds a lot like yours. Thank god I had family money that he was unaware of or I'd have been so screwed.

Your future ex husband is not the man you married or lived with. He is a total stranger that you don't know at all and you are in a business with him. Do not have that POV at your own peril. I'm sorry for you and good luck, but after the dust has settled, your life may be infinitely better without him. He sounds pretty much like a big jerk so it likely will be.

[Anonymous]

His original offer sounds unreasonable. I'd lawyer up.

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

I keep refreshing this thread. I'm worried about you, OP. Please let us know how it goes. Please come back to tell us that you protected yourself and your kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Oh my god. I'm begging you to get a lawyer. I just did a quick MD calculation and came up with over $2k WITHOUT adding many expenses.

He is trying to screw you. Don't allow yourself to be threatened by the debt. Please please do whatever you need to do to pay for a lawyer.

I bet he's hoping you don't notice that you're likely also entitled to alimony.

+1000 GET A LAWYER. Your DH is trying to screw you. Why are you STILL catering to his schedule? If he wants a divorce, he needs to have the kids 5p% of the time so he will HAVE to change his schedule. How will you work 2 jobs Plus take care of your kids? Get a lawyer, please!

[Anonymous]

I would question any man that didn't want their kids 50% of the time out of the gate. If my DW wanted a divorce and said "I only want the kids every other weekend", I'd push for sole/legal custody and keep her away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would question any man that didn't want their kids 50% of the time out of the gate. If my DW wanted a divorce and said "I only want the kids every other weekend", I'd push for sole/legal custody and keep her away.

That's silly. I give credit to the man that says he isn't able to care for the kids full time, for whatever reason, like the mother can.

[Anonymous]

Some people aren't fans of shuffling this kids back and forth 50 percent of the time. Sometimes a little stability is best for the kids, as opposed to trying to evenly divide them like they are integers.