DH Rant

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why I like alpha males. I absolutely hate insecure emasculated men. They're worthless both in the boardroom and the bedroom. They might as well bend over and join the other team.

Is a wife's success "emasculating?" Seriously men, weigh in here. Why marry an intelligent, educated and accomplished woman if you are only going to act like babies when she does well, insisting that she's "emasculated" you? I don't get it.

I personally dont find it emasculating, but then again, I'm a leader in my field. It would be hard to make my work seem insignificant in comparison.

From what I have observed, its not the act of being successful that lesser men find emasculating, its the other attitudes that come with it. And I think the women themselves find themselves less interested in their men once the woman's success reaches greater highs.

Women want to mate with men equal or better. No momma every says to their daughter 'I Hope you find someone who is less educated and less successful than you!"

Women, even the educated working ones want to feel lead at times. When they feel like they are the "grown up" or the one doing the leading, everything breaks down.

OP back. I've been monitoring for an intelligent comment, so thank you. The bolded is SPOT ON. DH asks me to weigh in on every little decision. He's currently working from home, and while I appreciate on some level him calling to ask "do you want X or Y for dinner?" on some level I just want him to fucking choose. Surprise me. Ditto should we see move X at noon on Saturday or 2pm on Sunday? I DON'T CARE. Pick one and then call the sitter. Or just say, hey I plan to do X is your calendar clear? (Avoiding scheduling conflicts I would get. But if my assistant said should I schedule this meeting for you at noon or two my answer would be - if my calendar is clear, JUST DO IT.) Instead of asking my opinion on every career move, networking call, etc etc and regaling me with insecurities about how and why it won't work, just DO IT. Just have some confidence, gird your loins, and DO IT ALREADY!! I mean, I want to be consulted on the important shit. Buying a new car, house, choosing a school for our child - check. Other little crap? Just DO IT. Career move? DO IT. Then tell me all about how it went after.

Okay, you're a man, so tell me - please - how do I tell him this stuff without it coming across as offensive? The reality is that I have every confidence in the world in his ability to make good decisions, get shit done, and do it right. Why the hell doesn't he? He's intelligent or else I wouldn't have married him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"we never could have afforded to have kids unless I worked"

and maintain the lifestyle you wanted you mean?

basically, when women say this, unless you're telling me he makes like $25,000, you're basically saying that you have chosen luxury items and cash over spending more time with your kids.

Um, no. When we had our child DH was making $65K and we lived in DC. Yes, I suppose we could have lived in a one-bedroom shit hole somewhere but yeah, I didn't bust my ass getting two degrees to basically live no better than I did growing up. And my mother didn't kill herself raising me for me to live hand to mouth, paycheck to paycheck either. Check your fucking lifestyle judgment bullshit at the door. If you think struggling is glamorous, go for it. I don't live some fancy lifestyle, but I'm not going to live like I'm 25 forever with no savings, no retirement funds, etc etc. So bite me.

you don't have to live in DC, btw. $65,000 is more than plenty to live in the far suburbs and provide. You could work part time and supplement.
You got your two degrees, amazing job btw!, so you could work hard and be an achiever. Good for you. But you should have realized that when you did that your $65k man would look like a schlub to you afterwards.

Moms should teach their daughters that the pussy dries up when you think you're above your man.

which includes being able to boss him into moving where you want.

Look, if you think, as OP said, life is just all about "providing," then as she said go for it. There's a reason we push education and achievement in this country - because strong, thriving economies are dependent on it. Mediocrity and "providing" doesn't build a strong country. Just ask the communists. But don't give OP shit for doing well for herself. Her husband could be adding to his education and getting ahead at work. It even sounds like he wants to, but maybe doesn't know how.

you know what you said can be translated into : "our economy depends on people being slaves to mortgages, student loans and trapped in their jobs so they keep spending and being good little consumers addicted to 'luxury' items"

who wants to be a slave?

If you're not paying for a mortgage, you're paying someone else's. I'd rather pay my own and have an asset to show for it, as opposed to supporting someone else's balance sheet. Just because you have a mortgage doesn't mean you've bought too much house. Some of us are smart and buy what we can afford and what we need, nothing more.

What you said translates into "I am a communist and a fucking naive one at that."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why I like alpha males. I absolutely hate insecure emasculated men. They're worthless both in the boardroom and the bedroom. They might as well bend over and join the other team.

Is a wife's success "emasculating?" Seriously men, weigh in here. Why marry an intelligent, educated and accomplished woman if you are only going to act like babies when she does well, insisting that she's "emasculated" you? I don't get it.

I personally dont find it emasculating, but then again, I'm a leader in my field. It would be hard to make my work seem insignificant in comparison.

From what I have observed, its not the act of being successful that lesser men find emasculating, its the other attitudes that come with it. And I think the women themselves find themselves less interested in their men once the woman's success reaches greater highs.

Women want to mate with men equal or better. No momma every says to their daughter 'I Hope you find someone who is less educated and less successful than you!"

Women, even the educated working ones want to feel lead at times. When they feel like they are the "grown up" or the one doing the leading, everything breaks down.

OP back. I've been monitoring for an intelligent comment, so thank you. The bolded is SPOT ON. DH asks me to weigh in on every little decision. He's currently working from home, and while I appreciate on some level him calling to ask "do you want X or Y for dinner?" on some level I just want him to fucking choose. Surprise me. Ditto should we see move X at noon on Saturday or 2pm on Sunday? I DON'T CARE. Pick one and then call the sitter. Or just say, hey I plan to do X is your calendar clear? (Avoiding scheduling conflicts I would get. But if my assistant said should I schedule this meeting for you at noon or two my answer would be - if my calendar is clear, JUST DO IT.) Instead of asking my opinion on every career move, networking call, etc etc and regaling me with insecurities about how and why it won't work, just DO IT. Just have some confidence, gird your loins, and DO IT ALREADY!! I mean, I want to be consulted on the important shit. Buying a new car, house, choosing a school for our child - check. Other little crap? Just DO IT. Career move? DO IT. Then tell me all about how it went after.

Okay, you're a man, so tell me - please - how do I tell him this stuff without it coming across as offensive? The reality is that I have every confidence in the world in his ability to make good decisions, get shit done, and do it right. Why the hell doesn't he? He's intelligent or else I wouldn't have married him.

Was he like this when you met him?

I suggest you point him in the direction of this website/blog/book : Marriedmansexlife.com

That author espouses a very digestible model of captain/co-captain which encourages the man to be more of a leader within his own life and the relationship. His take is well informed and has generated a lot of positive results for couples.

Many men in this generation have been ground down over time into becoming sniveling betas worried about stepping on toes or being too forceful.

I think all but the softest attempts to convince him of his need to change would be met with resistance.

Its hard for me to relate because if I was screwing up I'd want her to say SACK UP and I would be reminded. But that doesn't happen to me.

Athol Kay, author of marriedmaxsexlife.com, knows how to get that message across.

and believe me, its not just about sex, its about how to be a Man in today's world and how to create a dynamic between husband/wife that is fulfilling to both.

Captain/co-captain

check it out

I have no affiliation with that site at all.

[Anonymous]

You don't sound like a bad person, he doesn't sound like a bad person...but together, you sound like a horrible couple.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You don't sound like a bad person, he doesn't sound like a bad person...but together, you sound like a horrible couple.

Not horrible. Just. . .boring and uninspired. It makes me sad, actually. I WANT it to be better. I just don't know how. And I'm still young, and relatively attractive, and I have a pulse.

[Anonymous]

OP, I really don't think this is helpful for you to think about in terms of gender roles. Your DH is a person with certain qualities and habits; thinking about it in terms of what women want/what men want is really NOT useful. What really matters here is that you seem to have lost all compassion and good will towards your husband. Work on that in concrete ways - seeing it as "women want to be led" is neither true nor useful. I think most PEOPLE want to feel that their partnerships are productive and mutually satisfying and emotionally supportive.

[Anonymous]

13:23 again-

what you describe is very honest and accurate assessment of a lot of the problems i see in relationships all around me.

I admire you for being able to see that clearly and admit that there are certain things you'd like to see change.

many people (women) would be outraged at the notion that a woman likes to lead at times or that a man should just schedule a date and let you know where to be and what to wear! i've seen it right here on DCUM.

with respect to career talk with wife, i don't ask my wife for input there at all on how to do what i need to do. i do update her time to time on what is going on and if there are major changes coming, discuss them with her and see that we're on the same page. but my career is my career and she knows i'll handle it as best as i can.

OP: what about the other areas of his life? is he in shape? does he take care of himself and his appearance? does he do other things to improve himself and broaden his horizons?

I am going to guess no.

Men have to realize that there is no resting on our laurels. We have to keep improving, have to stay sharp, have to continue being the best man we can be - or nature will take its course and eventually wife will recoil at the notion of us touching them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why I like alpha males. I absolutely hate insecure emasculated men. They're worthless both in the boardroom and the bedroom. They might as well bend over and join the other team.

Is a wife's success "emasculating?" Seriously men, weigh in here. Why marry an intelligent, educated and accomplished woman if you are only going to act like babies when she does well, insisting that she's "emasculated" you? I don't get it.

I personally dont find it emasculating, but then again, I'm a leader in my field. It would be hard to make my work seem insignificant in comparison.

From what I have observed, its not the act of being successful that lesser men find emasculating, its the other attitudes that come with it. And I think the women themselves find themselves less interested in their men once the woman's success reaches greater highs.

Women want to mate with men equal or better. No momma every says to their daughter 'I Hope you find someone who is less educated and less successful than you!"

Women, even the educated working ones want to feel lead at times. When they feel like they are the "grown up" or the one doing the leading, everything breaks down.

OP back. I've been monitoring for an intelligent comment, so thank you. The bolded is SPOT ON. DH asks me to weigh in on every little decision. He's currently working from home, and while I appreciate on some level him calling to ask "do you want X or Y for dinner?" on some level I just want him to fucking choose. Surprise me. Ditto should we see move X at noon on Saturday or 2pm on Sunday? I DON'T CARE. Pick one and then call the sitter. Or just say, hey I plan to do X is your calendar clear? (Avoiding scheduling conflicts I would get. But if my assistant said should I schedule this meeting for you at noon or two my answer would be - if my calendar is clear, JUST DO IT.) Instead of asking my opinion on every career move, networking call, etc etc and regaling me with insecurities about how and why it won't work, just DO IT. Just have some confidence, gird your loins, and DO IT ALREADY!! I mean, I want to be consulted on the important shit. Buying a new car, house, choosing a school for our child - check. Other little crap? Just DO IT. Career move? DO IT. Then tell me all about how it went after.

Okay, you're a man, so tell me - please - how do I tell him this stuff without it coming across as offensive? The reality is that I have every confidence in the world in his ability to make good decisions, get shit done, and do it right. Why the hell doesn't he? He's intelligent or else I wouldn't have married him.

Was he like this when you met him?

I suggest you point him in the direction of this website/blog/book : Marriedmansexlife.com

That author espouses a very digestible model of captain/co-captain which encourages the man to be more of a leader within his own life and the relationship. His take is well informed and has generated a lot of positive results for couples.

Many men in this generation have been ground down over time into becoming sniveling betas worried about stepping on toes or being too forceful.

I think all but the softest attempts to convince him of his need to change would be met with resistance.

Its hard for me to relate because if I was screwing up I'd want her to say SACK UP and I would be reminded. But that doesn't happen to me.

Athol Kay, author of marriedmaxsexlife.com, knows how to get that message across.

and believe me, its not just about sex, its about how to be a Man in today's world and how to create a dynamic between husband/wife that is fulfilling to both.

Captain/co-captain

check it out

I have no affiliation with that site at all.

Amen! OP here, and thanks. I agree it's not easy for any of us. It's been a huge cultural shift in the past 50 years and women are reeling too. I have no role models for this life. And for the culture warriors on this thread, DH would be even MORE insecure if I quit my job to SAH. He's even said as much. "What if I lost my job, then?" It's a fair point. I've also generally been the one with the kick-ass retirement plan, so we are both counting on that. Our economy and our reality today is what it is. I feel like you either keep on pushing forward or you get left behind. And neither one of us wants to get left behind. We owe it our child not to get left behind.

I don't know. . .maybe it's not even DH so much as it is the cumulative effect of choosing to be married, dual career parents. It's a damned slog. Anything that can help us navigate it better will surely help so I will check it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I really don't think this is helpful for you to think about in terms of gender roles. Your DH is a person with certain qualities and habits; thinking about it in terms of what women want/what men want is really NOT useful. What really matters here is that you seem to have lost all compassion and good will towards your husband. Work on that in concrete ways - seeing it as "women want to be led" is neither true nor useful. I think most PEOPLE want to feel that their partnerships are productive and mutually satisfying and emotionally supportive.

it is helpful because her husband needs to get moving and make changes. and yes it is true that women want to be led. not domineered but led.

compassion and goodwill have to be earned I believe. there is not an inexhaustible well that can be tapped every day for infinity without refilling it. you refill it by doing the things that make you a good person and a good partner and someone to admire.

few women find a man attractive who asks her input on every little thought he has as if he can't manage his own affairs.

[Anonymous]

Maybe the truth is that you know you can do better than DH.

This happens with men when they trade up and get a trophy wife.

I think he is acting beta because he is not sure why you are so dissatisfied. He is trying to be sensitive.

My DH and I accept each other as we are (25 years of marriage) and that could be because we cannot trade up or down anymore. We do not have the opportunity, inclination, stamina or financial flexibility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I really don't think this is helpful for you to think about in terms of gender roles. Your DH is a person with certain qualities and habits; thinking about it in terms of what women want/what men want is really NOT useful. What really matters here is that you seem to have lost all compassion and good will towards your husband. Work on that in concrete ways - seeing it as "women want to be led" is neither true nor useful. I think most PEOPLE want to feel that their partnerships are productive and mutually satisfying and emotionally supportive.

Speak for yourself. I have NOT lost compassion. I have lost patience. Plus, yes, I do want him to be a leader sometimes. Read my previous post. I don't want him to lead ME so much as just be the leader in his own life, as PP said. Or just make an unimportant decision without asking me to weigh in. HOnestly, I would jump for fucking joy if he said "I've bought us theater tickets and made dinner reservations for Saturday night and booked a sitter." I mean, I would DIE. I would cream my panties, seriously. I've done this for him before after checking to see if his calendar is clear. He thought it a lovely surprise. Why wouldn't I? Similarly, I would lose it if I just came home and he said here's dinner. The sheer fact of him making the decision and taking the initiative would be all it would take. Ditto if he made a bold move at work (i.e. going for something big or exhibiting leadership and risk-taking) and then just told me aobut it, as opposed to asking me to help him plot it every single time.

The thing I can't figure out is where he got the idea he has to run every single thing by me. I assume this is something I did, unconsciously, but I need him to understand that yeah, I don't care about 75% of the things you ask me to weigh in on. Just do them. Just like I make doctor's appointments, plan meals, go shopping, etc etc without asking him his opinion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is why I like alpha males. I absolutely hate insecure emasculated men. They're worthless both in the boardroom and the bedroom. They might as well bend over and join the other team.

Is a wife's success "emasculating?" Seriously men, weigh in here. Why marry an intelligent, educated and accomplished woman if you are only going to act like babies when she does well, insisting that she's "emasculated" you? I don't get it.

I personally dont find it emasculating, but then again, I'm a leader in my field. It would be hard to make my work seem insignificant in comparison.

From what I have observed, its not the act of being successful that lesser men find emasculating, its the other attitudes that come with it. And I think the women themselves find themselves less interested in their men once the woman's success reaches greater highs.

Women want to mate with men equal or better. No momma every says to their daughter 'I Hope you find someone who is less educated and less successful than you!"

Women, even the educated working ones want to feel lead at times. When they feel like they are the "grown up" or the one doing the leading, everything breaks down.

OP back. I've been monitoring for an intelligent comment, so thank you. The bolded is SPOT ON. DH asks me to weigh in on every little decision. He's currently working from home, and while I appreciate on some level him calling to ask "do you want X or Y for dinner?" on some level I just want him to fucking choose. Surprise me. Ditto should we see move X at noon on Saturday or 2pm on Sunday? I DON'T CARE. Pick one and then call the sitter. Or just say, hey I plan to do X is your calendar clear? (Avoiding scheduling conflicts I would get. But if my assistant said should I schedule this meeting for you at noon or two my answer would be - if my calendar is clear, JUST DO IT.) Instead of asking my opinion on every career move, networking call, etc etc and regaling me with insecurities about how and why it won't work, just DO IT. Just have some confidence, gird your loins, and DO IT ALREADY!! I mean, I want to be consulted on the important shit. Buying a new car, house, choosing a school for our child - check. Other little crap? Just DO IT. Career move? DO IT. Then tell me all about how it went after.

Okay, you're a man, so tell me - please - how do I tell him this stuff without it coming across as offensive? The reality is that I have every confidence in the world in his ability to make good decisions, get shit done, and do it right. Why the hell doesn't he? He's intelligent or else I wouldn't have married him.

Was he like this when you met him?

I suggest you point him in the direction of this website/blog/book : Marriedmansexlife.com

That author espouses a very digestible model of captain/co-captain which encourages the man to be more of a leader within his own life and the relationship. His take is well informed and has generated a lot of positive results for couples.

Many men in this generation have been ground down over time into becoming sniveling betas worried about stepping on toes or being too forceful.

I think all but the softest attempts to convince him of his need to change would be met with resistance.

Its hard for me to relate because if I was screwing up I'd want her to say SACK UP and I would be reminded. But that doesn't happen to me.

Athol Kay, author of marriedmaxsexlife.com, knows how to get that message across.

and believe me, its not just about sex, its about how to be a Man in today's world and how to create a dynamic between husband/wife that is fulfilling to both.

Captain/co-captain

check it out

I have no affiliation with that site at all.

Amen! OP here, and thanks. I agree it's not easy for any of us. It's been a huge cultural shift in the past 50 years and women are reeling too. I have no role models for this life. And for the culture warriors on this thread, DH would be even MORE insecure if I quit my job to SAH. He's even said as much. "What if I lost my job, then?" It's a fair point. I've also generally been the one with the kick-ass retirement plan, so we are both counting on that. Our economy and our reality today is what it is. I feel like you either keep on pushing forward or you get left behind. And neither one of us wants to get left behind. We owe it our child not to get left behind.

I don't know. . .maybe it's not even DH so much as it is the cumulative effect of choosing to be married, dual career parents. It's a damned slog. Anything that can help us navigate it better will surely help so I will check it out.

one of the things we're seeing in these 50 years of changes is what happens when a woman is more powerful/successful than her male partner. bad things happen generally. but its not hopeless. it just takes a more conscious decision in other areas of life.

the man has to be in charge of his own life at least! meaning, even if wife makes 2x money, man needs to be competent and confident in what he chose to do...and do it well independently.

the marriedmansexlife community has lots of good info including a forum dedicated to wives who have husbands who either a) they wish were more of a Captain or b) are actively trying to change their lives. good support there

[Anonymous]

What's with the seemingly recent trend of needing to classify absolutely everyone as Alpha or Beta?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the truth is that you know you can do better than DH.
This happens with men when they trade up and get a trophy wife.

I think he is acting beta because he is not sure why you are so dissatisfied. He is trying to be sensitive.

My DH and I accept each other as we are (25 years of marriage) and that could be because we cannot trade up or down anymore. We do not have the opportunity, inclination, stamina or financial flexibility.

I don't know about that. "Better" is so subjective. I don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater. You may be right on the second point. I just don't know how to broach it. If I try to be subtle he misses the point. If I try to be direct I'm being a bitch and he gets defensive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Gah! I love my husband - he is a good person, kind, thoughtful, generous, a wonderful friend and father. But he is SO fucking beta most of the time that it makes me want to scream. The more success I have in my career, the less patience I have for his status quo. He is moving up, but not as fast or as far as he could if he would stop being so GD self-deprecating and insecure all the effing time. I am not perfect in my career but I bust my ass, I'm creative, and most of all I'm confident. I think I've won jobs precisely because I'm confident and I know I inspire it in others. I just want him to be the same and stop the damned whining.

The upshot is that I have lost all sexual desire for him. I want a man who is an equal partner, comfortable folding laundry, doing dishes and handling childcare AND confident and successful in his career AND can sweep me off my feet and make love to me good and hard. It's just not happening. I look pretty good, take care of myself, and get noticed. I'm at the pont where my mind is starting to wander. I feel guilty about it but hell. . .a girl needs what a girl needs. I do NOT need a second baby to take care of.

Okay. Rant over. I know I'm not alone.

wow - I swear I know who wrote this post. Even if she didn't, I know the type.