Advice - Fitting in With Other Black Kids

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate having these types of discussions in front of mixed company because things are thrown out there without the proper nuance to explain the complexity of situations like this.

I find it weird that everyone has automatically assumed that this is a group of xenophobic mean girls. There could be a lot more to this situation that isn’t being mentioned here or even to the parent.

In terms of advice. I’d strongly recommend you help your daughter find black community even if it exists outside of her school. I’ve seen the consequences of children not being able to find that community later in life and it can sometimes be really hard for them.

This part

I appreciate the open conversation here, and as a white woman am listening and learning about yet another issue black women and girls are facing that I didn’t know about. I can see how this would be complex and difficult to navigate on multiple levels. Thank you for the discussion!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hate having these types of discussions in front of mixed company because things are thrown out there without the proper nuance to explain the complexity of situations like this.

I find it weird that everyone has automatically assumed that this is a group of xenophobic mean girls. There could be a lot more to this situation that isn’t being mentioned here or even to the parent.

In terms of advice. I’d strongly recommend you help your daughter find black community even if it exists outside of her school. I’ve seen the consequences of children not being able to find that community later in life and it can sometimes be really hard for them.

This part

But let's be real, no one really wants to be frank in these conversations and, amongst other issues, admit how exclusionary our community can really be.

You hit the nail on the head.

[Anonymous]

I may just be that they don't like each other and not related to culture. My three African American kids have African, Asian, Caribbean, Hispanic and White friends in addition to African American friends. They look like an ad when all together.

All your daughter can do is be herself and enjoy the friendships she has. The school year has just started and there is time to add additional friends.

[Anonymous]

This is OP. Thanks for the responses. Just to clarify, DD is coming from another K-8 and is at a high school and the school only starts in 9th grade. There is an affinity group but my DD is not especially interested in joining. However, there are other groups in which these other Black girls participate.

It is not an issue of her isolating herself because she thinks she is better than anyone else or doesn’t believe that racism exists, etc. We are very frank with he about race issues and she understands. Her current friend group just organically happened this way and as a mom, I like the way that they treat her and include her. I am not keen on her sticking her neck out to gain the favor of the other Black girls only to have them reject her or have to jump through hoops because they have misconceptions about her. I will honor how she chooses to proceed but am keeping a close eye on it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a really weird post. You surround your child within the white community her entire life and then she wants to become fiends with those that are black solely on the basis that she is black too? She needs friends that share the same interest as her not friends only because they have the same skin color.

Not OP here - I'd argue differently. Of course she needs friends that share her same interest and I'd add, friends who care and support her as friends should do. But teenage years are a time of greater self awareness and self reflection and defining one's identity. Perhaps she loves her friends but also feels there is more of her identity that she would like to explore. Or, maybe she is reflecting that her friend group is not diverse and she values more diversity and is walking her walk to do something about it.

1st pp again. I can see both points as I was in the OP'S daughter’s shoes as a kid. This is a tough situation to be in and unfortunately quite relatable for many minority kids and their families.

I was replying specifically to the "this is a weird post" person. I think you an I are on the same page.

[Anonymous]

OP, it’s unfortunate you didn’t make a conscious effort to have your daughter interact with a more diverse group of children while she was growing up. It could have been done outside of school and probably would have helped her to be able to navigate both groups/cultures. You can’t just flip the switch. While her group of white friends may be nice, I’m guessing she still feels somewhat out of place being the only in the group. This may be okay when girls are younger, but can be tougher as they mature and start to date. Of course she can date whomever, but fewer black girls date white boys than white girls dating black boys. This can lead to low self esteem. Not what people want to hear, but it’s reality. You’re also only presenting one side.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is OP. Thanks for the responses. Just to clarify, DD is coming from another K-8 and is at a high school and the school only starts in 9th grade. There is an affinity group but my DD is not especially interested in joining. However, there are other groups in which these other Black girls participate.

It is not an issue of her isolating herself because she thinks she is better than anyone else or doesn’t believe that racism exists, etc. We are very frank with he about race issues and she understands. Her current friend group just organically happened this way and as a mom, I like the way that they treat her and include her. I am not keen on her sticking her neck out to gain the favor of the other Black girls only to have them reject her or have to jump through hoops because they have misconceptions about her. I will honor how she chooses to proceed but am keeping a close eye on it.

What reason did she give as to why she doesn't want to join the black student union or the related affinity group? Imo, that would be the easiest way to start a friendship with anyone who is a member. And by joining, it signals that she is comfortable or feels apart of the black culture at her school. And it can open up the door to allow other Black girls to befriend her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The reality is that there is an undercurrent of animosity between some Africans who have immigrated to America, and have become naturalized citizens, in the past forty years and some Americans of African descent, many of whose families have been in America for centuries. It's a complicated knot to untie because many of its stands are systemic (e.g., legacies of internalized colonialism about race, recent African arrivals being unfamiliar with the history of racialized enslavement in the US and then, more broadly, of US history regarding race (e.g., Jim Crow, sharecropping, etc.).

They are all victims of white supremacy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is OP. Thanks for the responses. Just to clarify, DD is coming from another K-8 and is at a high school and the school only starts in 9th grade. There is an affinity group but my DD is not especially interested in joining. However, there are other groups in which these other Black girls participate.

It is not an issue of her isolating herself because she thinks she is better than anyone else or doesn’t believe that racism exists, etc. We are very frank with he about race issues and she understands. Her current friend group just organically happened this way and as a mom, I like the way that they treat her and include her. I am not keen on her sticking her neck out to gain the favor of the other Black girls only to have them reject her or have to jump through hoops because they have misconceptions about her. I will honor how she chooses to proceed but am keeping a close eye on it.

OP, it’s might be that you and your daughter are the problem here. Your daughter has no genuine friendship with any other black girls at school African, American or otherwise. Has no interest in joining the cultural group where black students are most likely to cultivate friendship based off of affinity and are scapegoating the other black girls for not accepting her when its convenient for her to seek their friendship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is actually very typical. Black American kids will often “other” African students. It is a cultural thing that is difficult to overcome. I’m African and found that in college and the workforce it became easier to forget relationships with other Black American people but I agree with the other poster who said not to force it. She will just end up feeling excluded and getting her feelings hurt. They don’t accept her and they likely won’t but she has a good group friends who seem to really like her.

Yeah it's common, though I'm not sure anyone is to blame. I think it's worth just continuing to try to connect. Join the BSU if there is one.

[Anonymous]

Could be a group of teen girls who don't feel like including another teen girl?

[Anonymous]

OP, it sounds like your daughter has had opportunities to foster relationships with black students, but she has chosen not to. I think you should take a long, hard look at your daughter’s behavior regarding how she’s approaching the situation as well. You also only have her side of the story. The Black students’ side may be quite different.

And I do question how “being frank” about race may contribute to this situation. Have you projected your biases (conscious or unconscious) on to her that may be affecting how she feels about them?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is actually very typical. Black American kids will often “other” African students. It is a cultural thing that is difficult to overcome. I’m African and found that in college and the workforce it became easier to forget relationships with other Black American people but I agree with the other poster who said not to force it. She will just end up feeling excluded and getting her feelings hurt. They don’t accept her and they likely won’t but she has a good group friends who seem to really like her.

Let’s not ignore the fact that Africans routinely try to separate and “other” themselves from Black Americans. I find this to be the case more than Black folks trying to distinguish themselves from Africans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is actually very typical. Black American kids will often “other” African students. It is a cultural thing that is difficult to overcome. I’m African and found that in college and the workforce it became easier to forget relationships with other Black American people but I agree with the other poster who said not to force it. She will just end up feeling excluded and getting her feelings hurt. They don’t accept her and they likely won’t but she has a good group friends who seem to really like her.

Let’s not ignore the fact that Africans routinely try to separate and “other” themselves from Black Americans. I find this to be the case more than Black folks trying to distinguish themselves from Africans.

I think this happens after quite a bit of rejection. Even on any HBCU campus, the African kids are usually on an island away from the Black American students. Culturally the two groups are just very different and color is the only commonality - it’s just not enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you were to visit most schools in this area you will find black American students and Black African and Black Caribbean students mingling interchangeably.

I assume that the issue might be your daughter’s proximity to whiteness and not her Africanness.

Which schools?

That's my question too. One of our DC's is in a large public with a large group of black American students and Black students from Africa and the Caribbean and of course there's some overlap but for the most part not really. The Black students whose parents are immigrants seem more likely to be friends with Asian or Hispanic immigrants.