Other parent called my kid a slur--how should I respond?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Geez, PPs. "Well, I've never heard it, so..." Yeah, are you Latino? I'd never seen a cab not stop for black people before I was with my black friends, either.

+1 Some people on DCUM seem to have limited social circles.

We're such losers that we only are friends with people who would never such things to a child, and probably not to an adult. We should broaden our social circles to include bigots, jerks, racists, and morons, obviously.

You don't need to be friends with bigots, jerks, racists, and morons, but it would be nice if you at least acknowledged they exist. The (non-hispanic) PPs are like "Well, I've never heard it, so I'm sure the OP's daughter didn't hear it." Do you see the problem with that statement? Do you see why your response isn't warranted?

Limited social circles poster could also be referring to not knowing people who've been on the receiving end of bigotry too.

That's how I read it. i.e. The people who keep trying to find excuses for the father may not know many people of color.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here again. Thank you for the thoughtful responses. To clear one thing up, I truly believe that the word that was said was "spic" and not "Hispanic." DD knows she is Hispanic. She knows Latino/a. She is learning that some people are white, black, Asian, etc. But she is very aware of the term Hispanic. As far as I know, she had never heard spic before. I'll allow that it's certainly not said as often as I'm sure it once was, but it is definitely in usage these days. DD asked me "what is a spic?" I asked her if she meant Hispanic and she was firm that it was "uh-spic" and she didn't know what that was. Then I asked her how she heard it and got the story about the dad.

After I thought about it, my plan was to reach out to the mom and mention what I heard and see if she knew anything about it. Like a PP suggested, clue her in but not accuse. We've communicated on Facebook, so I went on there to message her. From there I saw the dad's page, which is full of shared anti-immigration/"illegals" posts. So I decided not to contact the mom, and not say anything. Safe to say DD will not be going over to that house anymore. I think we will probably still have the child over if DD asks (and her parents allow).

For those of you who questioned whether there was any ill intent, it's very hard to describe. I'm not one to say "you don't understand because you haven't been there," but really, I feel like those who are minorities understand in a way that white people just can't. It's hard to describe. Many new people I get to know are surprised that I "speak English so good" or have multiple college degrees, despite being born in a lowly Central American country. Or when most people assume DH, a teacher, teaches Spanish, which itself is a subtle burn--what else would he be qualified for? And he would only get that kind of job because he grew up speaking the language (meaning it wasn't the result of talent or work on his part). New neighbors assume we rent our house, and ask DH where he's from (answer: Maryland). Those things may not be mean or outwardly racist, but they do make us feel like we are looked down upon, and not fully "like" everyone else. And of course, participating in the school forums on DCUM which always have many posts ranking schools as undesirable because of a high Hispanic population, which means the kids don't speak English and the parents don't value education. MY kids are represented in those Hispanic figures, but if these many posters just look at the figures, they will assume my kids are making the school bad. It's hard not to see the racism everywhere when it truly is (almost?) everywhere.

To say you've never heard the word spic, or hardly ever hear it, well, I'm guessing nobody would ever call you that. But I've heard it plenty.

Anyway, thank you for the responses, especially those of you who understand how much words can hurt.

Well said OP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Geez, PPs. "Well, I've never heard it, so..." Yeah, are you Latino? I'd never seen a cab not stop for black people before I was with my black friends, either.

+1 Some people on DCUM seem to have limited social circles.

We're such losers that we only are friends with people who would never such things to a child, and probably not to an adult. We should broaden our social circles to include bigots, jerks, racists, and morons, obviously.

You don't need to be friends with bigots, jerks, racists, and morons, but it would be nice if you at least acknowledged they exist. The (non-hispanic) PPs are like "Well, I've never heard it, so I'm sure the OP's daughter didn't hear it." Do you see the problem with that statement? Do you see why your response isn't warranted?

Limited social circles poster could also be referring to not knowing people who've been on the receiving end of bigotry too.

That's how I read it. i.e. The people who keep trying to find excuses for the father may not know many people of color.

People weren't trying to find excuses for the father. They were asking for more information. Which was finally followed up with more information that explained the situation better and helped everyone understand that it truly was not a misunderstanding. There's nothing wrong with asking for more information. In fact, it's really crappy to rush to judgement without all facts. It's not the same as sticking up for him or saying he isn't racist. Innocent until proven guilty. I think we've gotten enough info at this point to see the dude is a racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here again. Thank you for the thoughtful responses. To clear one thing up, I truly believe that the word that was said was "spic" and not "Hispanic." DD knows she is Hispanic. She knows Latino/a. She is learning that some people are white, black, Asian, etc. But she is very aware of the term Hispanic. As far as I know, she had never heard spic before. I'll allow that it's certainly not said as often as I'm sure it once was, but it is definitely in usage these days. DD asked me "what is a spic?" I asked her if she meant Hispanic and she was firm that it was "uh-spic" and she didn't know what that was. Then I asked her how she heard it and got the story about the dad.

After I thought about it, my plan was to reach out to the mom and mention what I heard and see if she knew anything about it. Like a PP suggested, clue her in but not accuse. We've communicated on Facebook, so I went on there to message her. From there I saw the dad's page, which is full of shared anti-immigration/"illegals" posts. So I decided not to contact the mom, and not say anything. Safe to say DD will not be going over to that house anymore. I think we will probably still have the child over if DD asks (and her parents allow).

For those of you who questioned whether there was any ill intent, it's very hard to describe. I'm not one to say "you don't understand because you haven't been there," but really, I feel like those who are minorities understand in a way that white people just can't. It's hard to describe. Many new people I get to know are surprised that I "speak English so good" or have multiple college degrees, despite being born in a lowly Central American country. Or when most people assume DH, a teacher, teaches Spanish, which itself is a subtle burn--what else would he be qualified for? And he would only get that kind of job because he grew up speaking the language (meaning it wasn't the result of talent or work on his part). New neighbors assume we rent our house, and ask DH where he's from (answer: Maryland). Those things may not be mean or outwardly racist, but they do make us feel like we are looked down upon, and not fully "like" everyone else. And of course, participating in the school forums on DCUM which always have many posts ranking schools as undesirable because of a high Hispanic population, which means the kids don't speak English and the parents don't value education. MY kids are represented in those Hispanic figures, but if these many posters just look at the figures, they will assume my kids are making the school bad. It's hard not to see the racism everywhere when it truly is (almost?) everywhere.

To say you've never heard the word spic, or hardly ever hear it, well, I'm guessing nobody would ever call you that. But I've heard it plenty.

Anyway, thank you for the responses, especially those of you who understand how much words can hurt.

Preach sister!!! Sorry that your dd had to experience this so early. I am also a minority and want to shield my kids for as long as I can from how cruel people can be, then blame you for being sensitive

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here again. Thank you for the thoughtful responses. To clear one thing up, I truly believe that the word that was said was "spic" and not "Hispanic." DD knows she is Hispanic. She knows Latino/a. She is learning that some people are white, black, Asian, etc. But she is very aware of the term Hispanic. As far as I know, she had never heard spic before. I'll allow that it's certainly not said as often as I'm sure it once was, but it is definitely in usage these days. DD asked me "what is a spic?" I asked her if she meant Hispanic and she was firm that it was "uh-spic" and she didn't know what that was. Then I asked her how she heard it and got the story about the dad.

After I thought about it, my plan was to reach out to the mom and mention what I heard and see if she knew anything about it. Like a PP suggested, clue her in but not accuse. We've communicated on Facebook, so I went on there to message her. From there I saw the dad's page, which is full of shared anti-immigration/"illegals" posts. So I decided not to contact the mom, and not say anything. Safe to say DD will not be going over to that house anymore. I think we will probably still have the child over if DD asks (and her parents allow).

For those of you who questioned whether there was any ill intent, it's very hard to describe. I'm not one to say "you don't understand because you haven't been there," but really, I feel like those who are minorities understand in a way that white people just can't. It's hard to describe. Many new people I get to know are surprised that I "speak English so good" or have multiple college degrees, despite being born in a lowly Central American country. Or when most people assume DH, a teacher, teaches Spanish, which itself is a subtle burn--what else would he be qualified for? And he would only get that kind of job because he grew up speaking the language (meaning it wasn't the result of talent or work on his part). New neighbors assume we rent our house, and ask DH where he's from (answer: Maryland). Those things may not be mean or outwardly racist, but they do make us feel like we are looked down upon, and not fully "like" everyone else. And of course, participating in the school forums on DCUM which always have many posts ranking schools as undesirable because of a high Hispanic population, which means the kids don't speak English and the parents don't value education. MY kids are represented in those Hispanic figures, but if these many posters just look at the figures, they will assume my kids are making the school bad. It's hard not to see the racism everywhere when it truly is (almost?) everywhere.

To say you've never heard the word spic, or hardly ever hear it, well, I'm guessing nobody would ever call you that. But I've heard it plenty.

Anyway, thank you for the responses, especially those of you who understand how much words can hurt.

Well said OP.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Geez, PPs. "Well, I've never heard it, so..." Yeah, are you Latino? I'd never seen a cab not stop for black people before I was with my black friends, either.

+1 Some people on DCUM seem to have limited social circles.

So interesting that you make these assumptions. I'm one of the "never heard it" PPs, but have very broad social circles.

I have lived all over the US and have interacted meaningfully with just about every kind of person out there--from the wealthiest families in the world to red-dirt farmers in the rural South, and from Tea Party nutjobs to hard-core La Raza activists. Never heard it.

Bottom line is that in my experience (an experience shared by my family members of other races/ethnic backgrounds), very, very few people openly use racial slurs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Geez, PPs. "Well, I've never heard it, so..." Yeah, are you Latino? I'd never seen a cab not stop for black people before I was with my black friends, either.

+1 Some people on DCUM seem to have limited social circles.

So interesting that you make these assumptions. I'm one of the "never heard it" PPs, but have very broad social circles.

I have lived all over the US and have interacted meaningfully with just about every kind of person out there--from the wealthiest families in the world to red-dirt farmers in the rural South, and from Tea Party nutjobs to hard-core La Raza activists. Never heard it.

Bottom line is that in my experience (an experience shared by my family members of other races/ethnic backgrounds), very, very few people openly use racial slurs.

"Openly" is key here -- the parent didn't use it openly, he used it in front of his immediate family and the target. He might not have used it if you were there.

This is one more way bigots make people's lives harder: they hide their bigotry from other whites who might disapprove and let it out in front of POC, who are then met with disbelieve when they tell others what happened.

[Anonymous]

Sorry, disbelief.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The OP says that the other parent CALLED HER KID A SLUR, right? I don't care which slur it is, it is completely inappropriate to insult children.

I'm not sure I'd speak to the parents. Anyone comfortable insulting a small child is probably not going to care that that child's same-slur parents are upset.

But my kid would never go to that house again. Period.

See, this is why I want to know the word and the context. Is this dad comfortable insulting children? Or did he use a word he didn't realize was a slur. Is this mom getting bent out of shape about "oriental" or the n word? I didn't know it was bad to use the term oriental. Now I do.

Except Oriental isn't a slur...

What's with the shocked look? Oriental may be outdated terminology, but it's not a hateful slur. It would be like calling a black person a Negro. Very antiquated, but not inherently hateful.

Chink is a slur. Not "Oriental."

NP here. The term is derogatory. End of story. And for future reference, unless you are in the group of people who may be called that word, you don't get to decide whether a particular term is a slur.

No, it's not, you stupid twit. And I will decide whatever the fuck I want. There's no exclusive right to choose terminology. "Oriental" is NOT a derogatory word and it's not a slur. You need a better education. However, since I CLEARLY have to educate your sorry, ignorant ass, here are some "from the group of people who may be called that word" agreeing with me.

"Why “Oriental” Is a No-No
•
What’s the problem with using the term “Oriental” to describe individuals of Asian descent? Common complaints about the term include that it should be reserved for objects, such as rugs, and not people, and that it’s antiquated—akin to using “Negro” to describe an African American. Howard University Law Professor Frank H. Wu made the comparison in a 2009 New York Times piece about the state of New York banning the use of “Oriental” on government forms and documents. Washington State passed a similar ban in 2002.

“It’s associated with a time period when Asians had a subordinate status,” Professor Wu told the Times. He added that people link the term to old stereotypes of Asians and the era when the United States government passed exclusion acts to keep Asian people from entering the country. Given this, “For many Asian Americans, it’s not just this term: It’s about much more…It’s about your legitimacy to be here,” Wu said.

In the same piece, historian Mae M. Ngai, author of Impossible Subjects: Illegal Aliens and the Making of Modern America, explained that, while the term “Oriental” isn’t a slur, it’s never been widely used by people of Asian descent to describe themselves.

“I think it’s fallen into disfavor because it’s what other people call us. It’s only the East if you’re from somewhere else,” Ngai said, referring to “Oriental’s” meaning—“Eastern.” “It’s a Eurocentric name for us, which is why it’s wrong. You should call people by what (they) call themselves, not how they are situated in relation to yourself.”

http://racerelations.about.com/od/understandingrac1/a/racialnamestoavoid.htm

Now, you WILL refrain from participating in this thread any further. You've completely disqualified yourself as having anything credible to say. Simply put, you're not welcome here anymore.

[Anonymous]

Now, you WILL refrain from participating in this thread any further. You've completely disqualified yourself as having anything credible to say. Simply put, you're not welcome here anymore.

Wtf? Watch this: YOU will refrain from insulting others from now on. You are not welcome here.

did that work??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Geez, PPs. "Well, I've never heard it, so..." Yeah, are you Latino? I'd never seen a cab not stop for black people before I was with my black friends, either.

+1 Some people on DCUM seem to have limited social circles.

We're such losers that we only are friends with people who would never such things to a child, and probably not to an adult. We should broaden our social circles to include bigots, jerks, racists, and morons, obviously.

You don't need to be friends with bigots, jerks, racists, and morons, but it would be nice if you at least acknowledged they exist. The (non-hispanic) PPs are like "Well, I've never heard it, so I'm sure the OP's daughter didn't hear it." Do you see the problem with that statement? Do you see why your response isn't warranted?

Limited social circles poster could also be referring to not knowing people who've been on the receiving end of bigotry too.

That's how I read it. i.e. The people who keep trying to find excuses for the father may not know many people of color.

People weren't trying to find excuses for the father. They were asking for more information. Which was finally followed up with more information that explained the situation better and helped everyone understand that it truly was not a misunderstanding. There's nothing wrong with asking for more information. In fact, it's really crappy to rush to judgement without all facts. It's not the same as sticking up for him or saying he isn't racist. Innocent until proven guilty. I think we've gotten enough info at this point to see the dude is a racist.

So the default is that a person of color has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that they actually heard a racial slur? Because in the opinion of white people, racial slurs just aren't used openly anymore? Right ...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The OP says that the other parent CALLED HER KID A SLUR, right? I don't care which slur it is, it is completely inappropriate to insult children.

I'm not sure I'd speak to the parents. Anyone comfortable insulting a small child is probably not going to care that that child's same-slur parents are upset.

But my kid would never go to that house again. Period.

See, this is why I want to know the word and the context. Is this dad comfortable insulting children? Or did he use a word he didn't realize was a slur. Is this mom getting bent out of shape about "oriental" or the n word? I didn't know it was bad to use the term oriental. Now I do.

Except Oriental isn't a slur...

What's with the shocked look? Oriental may be outdated terminology, but it's not a hateful slur. It would be like calling a black person a Negro. Very antiquated, but not inherently hateful.

Chink is a slur. Not "Oriental."

NP here. The term is derogatory. End of story. And for future reference, unless you are in the group of people who may be called that word, you don't get to decide whether a particular term is a slur.

No, it's not, you stupid twit. And I will decide whatever the fuck I want. There's no exclusive right to choose terminology. "Oriental" is NOT a derogatory word and it's not a slur. You need a better education. However, since I CLEARLY have to educate your sorry, ignorant ass, here are some "from the group of people who may be called that word" agreeing with me.

"Why “Oriental” Is a No-No
•
What’s the problem with using the term “Oriental” to describe individuals of Asian descent? Common complaints about the term include that it should be reserved for objects, such as rugs, and not people, and that it’s antiquated—akin to using “Negro” to describe an African American. Howard University Law Professor Frank H. Wu made the comparison in a 2009 New York Times piece about the state of New York banning the use of “Oriental” on government forms and documents. Washington State passed a similar ban in 2002.

“It’s associated with a time period when Asians had a subordinate status,” Professor Wu told the Times. He added that people link the term to old stereotypes of Asians and the era when the United States government passed exclusion acts to keep Asian people from entering the country. Given this, “For many Asian Americans, it’s not just this term: It’s about much more…It’s about your legitimacy to be here,” Wu said.

In the same piece, historian Mae M. Ngai, author of Impossible Subjects: Illegal Aliens and the Making of Modern America, explained that, while the term “Oriental” isn’t a slur, it’s never been widely used by people of Asian descent to describe themselves.

“I think it’s fallen into disfavor because it’s what other people call us. It’s only the East if you’re from somewhere else,” Ngai said, referring to “Oriental’s” meaning—“Eastern.” “It’s a Eurocentric name for us, which is why it’s wrong. You should call people by what (they) call themselves, not how they are situated in relation to yourself.”

http://racerelations.about.com/od/understandingrac1/a/racialnamestoavoid.htm

Now, you WILL refrain from participating in this thread any further. You've completely disqualified yourself as having anything credible to say. Simply put, you're not welcome here anymore.

Reading comprehension much??? Or are you pretending to parse "offensive" and "hateful" in some way that matters in the slightest?

[Anonymous]

First of all, OP, I am so sorry your dd experienced this. It is awful but it sounds like you handled it in a very appropriate and rational manner. I am curious, though, why you jumped to the conclusion (or confirmed your conclusion) that this dad is a racist because of his beliefs on illegal immigration. I'm a legal immigrant here and have been called slurs as well. But, I also think our country needs to change and fix our immigration laws and system. I just wanted to point that out not to say that the dad isn't racist (clearly he is by what he said to your dd) but to point out that not all people who believe in immigration reform are racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You have to say something just in case there's more to the story, especially if you're like PP and plan to tell other parents about it. You're positive it was the dad? Not an uncle, neighbor, grandpa?

Why are so many people on this board so desperate to "prove" that a total stranger to them wasn't racist?

Pp here. In any situation, I'd rather get the whole story than completely cut someone off. ESPECIALLY if you plan to (as another poster suggested) tell all the other parents. I cant imagine some 5 year old mishearing me say something, or mistakenly tell their mom that my dh said something when it was really scummy uncle Bill who said it, then spreading the false news that we're racists. And I'd definitely want to know if my dh did something so offensive that friends were cutting us off.

Anyway, op said the husband's Facebook page is full of anti immigrant posts, so it seems she did find out more necessary info.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First of all, OP, I am so sorry your dd experienced this. It is awful but it sounds like you handled it in a very appropriate and rational manner. I am curious, though, why you jumped to the conclusion (or confirmed your conclusion) that this dad is a racist because of his beliefs on illegal immigration. I'm a legal immigrant here and have been called slurs as well. But, I also think our country needs to change and fix our immigration laws and system. I just wanted to point that out not to say that the dad isn't racist (clearly he is by what he said to your dd) but to point out that not all people who believe in immigration reform are racist.

Hmmm, maybe you think it could be the confluence between calling a 5-year old a spic, and having virulent anti-immigrant facebook posts, that might just MAYBE lead to the conclusion of racism? No, that would be totally irrational ...