Failure to Launch Daughter Is Unemployed and Blaming Me for All of Her Problems

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First - it sounds like you don’t really like your daughter because she’s difficult.

In this case just agree with her “yes, we are not the parents you need”, “yes, just like the government with taxes - we encourage behavior with money”, and “yes, we will support you if you play by our rules”. Then pull the plug on all funding. No way I’m supporting my adult children if they behave that way. I had them privately educated in the finest schools. I got them all the tutoring and support the needs. They were involved in so many activities, trips and opportunities - on and on…. If they turned to me and said I failed them as a parent - “I’d agree” and be sad about it because I didn’t raise a grateful kind child. Maybe look at it that way?

OP here. To be clear, we don't give her any money. At all. She's on our health insurance and phone bill (which we very hesitantly pay for -- ideally, I would not be paying for her phone plan at the ripe age of 24!), but we don't give her money for rent or toiletries. She STOLE, repeatedly, from us to pay for her living expenses and THEN some on top of that. And of course, feels zero shame about it.

And yes, we stretched to put our kids in the best school pyramid in our city (HCOL city, not the DMV). We stretched again for all the activities, expensive trips, and pricey opportunities that they wanted. We even paid for her college degree in something absolutely worthless at an artsy fartsy school.

But of course, there's no gratitude or acknowledgement for the sacrifices we've made for her. It's just frustrating when DD's whole personality is how much of a victim she is. With her, it's only about how much DH and I have allegedly "abused" her and "invalidated" her insane emotional responses. All of her poetry is about how badly DH has allegedly abused her. She can't find a single positive thing to say about her childhood despite us pouring a TON of time, money, and effort into her K-12 schooling and paying for all of her college degree.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why everyone is attacking OP.
OP may be a problematic mother but if someone finds their parent disagreeble to the extent that the OP's daughter does, then that person usually aggressively plans for an independent life early on.
A degree in English from a middling artsy-fartsy school does not signal intention towards financial independence.
I think all OP can do now is offer tuition for a professional certificate ready and nothing else for this ingrate child until effort is demonstrated.

OP here. Thank you for acknowledging this! If she really hates us so much and feels like we've wronged her as parents, it's her job to major in something practical (like my DS did, even though he's very appreciative, close to us parents, and rolls his eyes at all of DD's ranting) and get off of our payroll.

Instead, she's pathetically STEALING (yes, hacking into my credit card or Amazon account without asking me beforehand is STEALING) from us. Because surprise surprise, a BA in English from Oberlin doesn't lead to financial independence....

[Anonymous]

It doesn’t sound like you are in a place to take constructive feedback. The tone you use here to discuss your child is filled with rage and hate. In 10+ posts you have not been able to say one kind, positive or even mildly supportive thing.

What do you want this forum to do? Agree with you? Validate that you were the perfect mother and every issue your adult child has is bc she’s just simply terrible?

As a mom, I’d want to find a pathway back to having a loving and supportive relationship with my child. It doesn’t sound like you want that. So I’m not sure why you’re posting here.

[Anonymous]

I think you both sound emotionally immature. You don’t need her gratitude to validate your parenting decisions. That ship has sailed and if you regret key decisions like paying for college it’s on you-you shouldn’t have done it in the first place. You don’t raise children expecting some kind of return on investment in the form on success or gratitude or bragging rights.

Also, she is not a ‘failure to launch.’ You don’t approve of her lifestyle but she’s living independently, pursuing art, and not all alone. You are waaasy to judgey and angry about her adult life and should go spend some time on the special needs forum to gain some perspective. There are parents there who would be thrilled to achieve that outcome.

I’m not sure why you are so angry and hope it comes from love albeit misplaced. I suggest you find a therapist to help you work through your anger before you alienate her entirely.

[Anonymous]

I’m usually opposed to estrangement but I hope your daughter excises you from her life. You are vicious and cruel and seem to have no love for your children. One of my ACs does things that I disapprove of and which have been harmful to our family, but I will always love my child. I could never write these hateful screeds you crank out. They are cruel, mocking, and yes, invalidating.

You’re also super ableist and sound very ignorant about ND. Your daughter has been living with undiagnosed ADHD for her whole life. That’s extremely challenging and you should be sad that she’s had to go this long without any help or support for that. It’s like she’s been carrying a 50 pound weight. She’s not lazy. She’s had to work harder and feel less than because she didn’t know how her brain worked and how to manage it. I hope she has good help now. Your hate for your child is ugly and I suspect irredeemable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First - it sounds like you don’t really like your daughter because she’s difficult.

In this case just agree with her “yes, we are not the parents you need”, “yes, just like the government with taxes - we encourage behavior with money”, and “yes, we will support you if you play by our rules”. Then pull the plug on all funding. No way I’m supporting my adult children if they behave that way. I had them privately educated in the finest schools. I got them all the tutoring and support the needs. They were involved in so many activities, trips and opportunities - on and on…. If they turned to me and said I failed them as a parent - “I’d agree” and be sad about it because I didn’t raise a grateful kind child. Maybe look at it that way?

OP here. To be clear, we don't give her any money. At all. She's on our health insurance and phone bill (which we very hesitantly pay for -- ideally, I would not be paying for her phone plan at the ripe age of 24!), but we don't give her money for rent or toiletries. She STOLE, repeatedly, from us to pay for her living expenses and THEN some on top of that. And of course, feels zero shame about it.

And yes, we stretched to put our kids in the best school pyramid in our city (HCOL city, not the DMV). We stretched again for all the activities, expensive trips, and pricey opportunities that they wanted. We even paid for her college degree in something absolutely worthless at an artsy fartsy school.

But of course, there's no gratitude or acknowledgement for the sacrifices we've made for her. It's just frustrating when DD's whole personality is how much of a victim she is. With her, it's only about how much DH and I have allegedly "abused" her and "invalidated" her insane emotional responses. All of her poetry is about how badly DH has allegedly abused her. She can't find a single positive thing to say about her childhood despite us pouring a TON of time, money, and effort into her K-12 schooling and paying for all of her college degree.

Huh. As I suspected DD says Daddy abused her and Mommy rages it's all lies. Classic. Really classic

When my mom remarried after being a widow, my new stepfather had a daughter. Mom said she tells lies about her father. I was 21 and living in another state. On one visit my stepsister cane over to mert me. We were alone. We chatted, then she said "Does he ever try to hypnotize you at night? Don't let him."

Yikes. I mentioned this to my mother who raged about it and that lying delinquent.

Next visit he came up behind me in the kitchen and grabbed my breasts. I whirled, said NO! Left early.
Never slept in that house again. Knew whose side mom was on.

I think OP is concealing a lot of family abuse and is a monster herself.

[Anonymous]

Yep, there it is. Ops daughter was abused in who knows what way by ops husband and op doesn’t believe her. No wonder she’s having trouble functioning.

Also. You can do plenty with an English or other liberal arts degree. I have a nice job in finance and I got my degree in something liberal arts related at (gasp!!!) a state college even.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yep, there it is. Ops daughter was abused in who knows what way by ops husband and op doesn’t believe her. No wonder she’s having trouble functioning.

Also. You can do plenty with an English or other liberal arts degree. I have a nice job in finance and I got my degree in something liberal arts related at (gasp!!!) a state college even.

OP never said sexual abuse is alleged by daughter.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I'm back with an update. DD called me and said that she had a neuropsych eval last month, and that the results would come out later this week. I don't see the point of this at all because we already paid for a neuropsych eval ~5 years ago for her. She is convinced that she has autism, which is ridiculous -- her last neuropsych eval ruled that out.

She told me over the phone this morning that "an update neuropsych will explain why I have a hard time in the workplace." Okay, well... regardless of whatever the results say, that doesn't help her situation. At all.

I'm just sick of her making excuses for her immaturity. It seems like this fixation on autism is the latest in her attempt to build an identity or a personality that is, as always, based on victimhood. At first it was how "abusive" DH and I were to her as a child and how we "traumatized her for life," and now it's autism.

None of this, of course, is helpful nor productive.

Teens are very difficult to diagnose, and autism often presents differently in women. It's a good thing to have a fresh evaluation, and it's a good thing that she recognizes something is going on. You should be waiting to see how you can be supportive of her growth in light of whatever her eval reveals.

I had a super high achiever that wasn't diagnosed with severe ADHD and severe dyslexia until college. It was a gut punch knowing how difficult things had been for her. No one ever saw the signs, not me, not teachers, pediatricians, it only became apparent that something was really off when online schooling at the beginning of lockdown really impacted her. The diagnoses were very freeing and she learned to manage her life in a new way that was so much easier for her and relived so much stress and anxiety. OP you are so rigid and controlling. You are going to lose your daughter forever if you don't stop treating her with so much judgment and cruelty. It sounds to me like she is doing her best and you are the one who is failing.

OP here. I just don't understand what an autism diagnose at the age of 24 would do. It's not like she's in high school or college, where an autism diagnosis would at least grant her accommodations and maybe access to social skills classes. It just feels like she wants an excuse from adulting, and that she's latching onto a potential autism diagnosis as a way to escape the "real world" of work and compromising in relationships.

I also think that it's dubious how effective or helpful a diagnosis would be if she's getting diagnosed this late -- at that point, she's high functioning enough (if she even qualifies for a diagnosis in the first place, which I doubt as she's pretty good at picking up on subtext) that it wouldn't qualify her for disability income.

Many employers want to brag that they hire autistic adults - especially if they are large and seek or have federal contracts. Google Employers who hire autistic. This fact is pertinent to your situation, please keep reading.

My DS is autistic/ADHD/Anxiety and 30. Testing was not as precise back then, so it took five rounds of testing with inconclusive findings ("high IQ/maybe ADHD, we don't know/executive function/anxiety") until at 14, we finally got the autism (then called Asperger's) diagnosis. And suddenly all of his struggles fell into line. Our two pediatricians and I missed it. When the psychiatrist told us, I remarked that he had fine, direct eye contact. The shrink said, "No, he doesn't, you are too close to it to see it". She was right - I mentioned that because a PP above said the same about those close to the child being unable to see some significant patterns. After that diagnosis, we tried private school, public school with an IEP, etc. He finished college, using disability services, and is doing fine in a job.

The reason I mention all that is that he wanted (and his therapist recommended) a fresh round of testing at age 30, so he arranged it, and fortunately, his insurance paid for it. The diagnosis was more fulsome but still the same as when he was a teenager: Autism/anxiety/ADHD, but he felt it was well worthwhile because it confirmed for him his life experience. It was helpful to her therapist, physician, and executive-function coach to have it reassessed. That's why your daughter should have it done, and why she may need to do it again after three years. It may, indeed, explain some of the difficulties she has had with life. It may not..

Our son shared that study with us and took the results to HR, which filed it and asked what accommodations he needed. He asked for a few tiny items that would help him focus better, and they accommodated that, but not much more. However, his company underwent a massive layoff, and he survived. Was it the fact that he had filed with HR? We don't know, but his one other friend, who wasn't fired, had also filed disability testing results with HR.

Your daughter sounds troubled, as you know. She clearly wants this diagnosis because she can transfer blame (yes, you are right about that). She may lie about the results. Our son showed us his results. It sounds like your daughter may not want to share, but you can express interest in exploring this new world with her and in seeing the results. The worst she can do is say "no".

Good luck! I'll try to circle back and see if you have any questions.

OP, are you coming back? I'd like to know the results. Whether or not she says she has autism or not, why don't you use this game-changer to start a new relationship with her? Suggest a quiet lunch out and ask her to talk about the results and what they mean to her.

OP here. Just got off a phone call with DD. Yes, the neuropsych (yet again) confirmed that she has ADHD but NOT autism. She was distraught that she didn't get an ASD diagnosis, but I told her that it's important to base her identity off of her "disabilities" or her victimhood. She told me that she was looking forward to an autism diagnosis to explain her struggles and to "find the right job for her," and I definitely felt that she was looking to transfer blame for her poor decisions on a (nonexistent) diagnosis.

It's just frustrating when DD's whole personality is how much of a victim she is. With her, it's only about how much DH and I have allegedly "abused" her and "invalidated" her insane emotional responses. All of her poetry is about how badly DH has allegedly abused her. She can't find a single positive thing to say about her childhood despite us pouring a TON of time, money, and effort into her K-12 schooling and paying for all of her college degree.

OP - I’m still here - the mom with the autistic daughter who explained why testing is still important at this age. Above I suggested you use this new ADHD diagnosis to start a new relationship with your DD. Again, take her to lunch and let her fume about the difficulty of having had undiagnosed ADHD during her formative years. That’s real. Then say “what can I do to help you?” And take it from there. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yep, there it is. Ops daughter was abused in who knows what way by ops husband and op doesn’t believe her. No wonder she’s having trouble functioning.

Also. You can do plenty with an English or other liberal arts degree. I have a nice job in finance and I got my degree in something liberal arts related at (gasp!!!) a state college even.

OP never said sexual abuse is alleged by daughter.

I think you’re the only one saying that. You know are other kinds of abuse, right?

And of course OP is going to be dismissive and disbelieving, OP is never going to admit fault.

[Anonymous]

OP is a closed book. This thread has run its course. Best wishes to DD and hope to see your writing in The New Yorker, Atlantic, Vanity Fair.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is essentially the pilot episode of Girls.

Didn’t Hannah end up pregnant and relying on her mom for help raising her baby?

The most unrealistic part of the show is the magic job that popped up in a small wholesome town right when she needed it and was about to have a baby. In the real world she would have ended up back in her mom’s basement. I think her parents divorced.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She didn’t work while in college? How does she pay rent now? The weight shaming is 100% uncool.

She worked a bunch of random jobs in college (manager of her school's garden, RA for prof), but these aren't jobs that are available for alumni at her school -- they only hire current students. She paid rent through a barista job, but she got fired a few months ago.

Being overweight (at a BMI of 25, which is on the cusp) is not "100% uncool." Being that overweight is a SIGNIFICANT impediment to getting a job offer as a young woman.

OP, I suspected you might be a troll because really, no one talks about their kids this way, but you convinced me with your harping that your 5' 6" daughter is very overweight at 155 and BMI of 25. Good one though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She didn’t work while in college? How does she pay rent now? The weight shaming is 100% uncool.

She worked a bunch of random jobs in college (manager of her school's garden, RA for prof), but these aren't jobs that are available for alumni at her school -- they only hire current students. She paid rent through a barista job, but she got fired a few months ago.

Being overweight (at a BMI of 25, which is on the cusp) is not "100% uncool." Being that overweight is a SIGNIFICANT impediment to getting a job offer as a young woman.

You had me until the weight shaming. BMI of 25 has been my BMI at 16, 20, 30. At one point it was even 29. Guess what, I never had issues getting a job. I am far from skinny now and I am a partner at a mid-size law firm. You may wonder why your daughter is the way she is - take a look in the mirror.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Back with an update, and choosing to ignore the hateful insults hurled at me:

DD called me today to inform me that she received a job offer from the AmeriCorps VISTA program in the city where she lives in (a medium cost of living city in a very cold area). The job is slated to start in two weeks, and pays a pitiful sum of $30k/year for a full-time, 40-hour/week office job.

She then proceeded to beg me for $10k over the phone to help her buy a used car. I refused, and I explained to her YET AGAIN that our family policy is that once young adults graduate college, they must pay for all of their living expenses on their own or live with their parents. I reminded her that she had the option of walking (~40 min) to her workplace from her house or taking the free public transportation in her city. Of course, at that point, I got a bunch of whining over the phone about how cold it is outside and how no one wants to walk in the cold and snow to work or wait for a bus stop.

It's just infuriating that she keeps begging money for things like a used car, which she should really be able to afford on her own. But of course, all of her terrible decisions -- from overeating junk food leading her to being overweight, to majoring in English, to dropping out of HYPS to attend an Oberlin/Wesleyan-esque school -- have put her in this situation where she won't accept the financial consequences of her actions.

It's just frustrating to see her be so delusional and entitled, and to see her act on this selfish belief that she deserves things that she never earned on her own. Of course, she complains relentlessly about how DH and I (lawyer and doctor, respectively) refuse to help her pay for a car... But that's MY money, not hers.