Help me untangle feelings about SIL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would find it very annoying if someone 'advised' me how to play with my kid, unless I had asked for advice and ideas. You have a great game in mind? Feel free to engage and play with my child yourself.

Also, I don't like the people who shove an endless stream of gifts on you at every possible occasion, with the expectation that we should praise them for their 'generosity' and 'thoughtfulness' in return.

Whoa. You might want to look into your issues.

[Anonymous]

OP your heart is in the right place. For whatever reason, your SIL is prickly about your kid-related advice. Could be that you're older and have some experience, and she feels insecure in comparison, could also be that your brother seems to default to asking you thereby making her feeling even more insecure. Your response to him to defer to her is a good start.

Re the gift thing. If she's shown already that she didn't care for small gifts, your insisting on giving it and even attaching a note saying feel free to donate is going a bit too far. Ask yourself, is the gift giving for you or for her? You get something out of it, so you keep giving. But she clearly does not, and has made it clear. Please stop giving gifts and wishing for a difference response.

It sounds like you two are just very different people and have different approaches to things. That's ok. She seems immature, frankly. Though if someone asked her, I'd suspect she'd say you're a bit smothering. Take her lead when it comes to your nephew.

[Anonymous]

I am not a person who appreciates gifts, it's not that I think I'm "right" but to me I think a true act of love is through spending time together or sending a note. I get that everyone expresses love differently, nobody is wrong, nobody is right, it's just personal to them.

If you really want to express your love in a way that she will appreciate then the answer is obvious: stop giving her gifts. If you want to do it your way, you will keep feeling hurt because she will not appreciate it.

The best gift my sister ever gave my daughter was a pack of letters that she wrote every year on her birthday for 18 years. She presented it as a living diary on her 18th birthday. That was a gift!

[Anonymous]

Ok, I think there are a few things going on. Reading your post, I found myself identifying a lot with your SIL's words and behavior. Here's what all this would mean if I were your SIL (I'm not, but I could be!):

1) She doesn't dislike you, but she might feel judged by you. Being a new mom is hard, and there's a steep learning curve. There's also a lot of pressure to be perfect and a lot of cultural narratives about the perfect mother. It can make you a little touchy to criticism or suggestions. It's like starting any new job, only you feel much more vulnerable because it's like everyone is watching you figure it out. Imagine if during your first year of being a teacher or whatever you do, you had to perform your job in front of not just your coworkers, the kids, or their parents, but also your family, strangers in public places, the family of your partner that you only just marrieds etc. There is so much focus on what you are doing and EVERYBODY has a suggestion, criticism, information they think you should know. Even when it's helpful, sometimes it makes you a little prickly. Just to give you a sense of why your SIL might seem defensive or not super welcoming towards your suggestions or advice. What she craves is positive reinforcement ("Wow, I can tell how much you love him -- you're a great mom") not suggestions. And likely she doesn't get enough of the former.

2) She needs stuff for her kid and people keep giving her other stuff. Figuring out what stuff your kid needs is like 20% of your life the first few years of their life. Also figuring out what stuff they DON'T need. Getting surprise gifts from family sounds nice, but so often it's a lot of stuff that isn't quite what you need, and that now you need to find a way to store or organize, plus you still need all this other stuff. My mom and MIL both kept sending dolls for my DD when she was a baby. I know that to them, they imagined these were sweet, sentimental gift that my DD would cherish throughout her childhood. In reality, my infant daughter (who could not yet even play with dolls) just had a bunch of dolls in her nursery when what I really needed was other kinds of toys. And of course, I can't just get rid of these sentimental gifts my child's grandmothers sent. It wound up feeling like an imposition. I ultimately did what your SIL did and told family we had a running wish list of age appropriate books, toys, and clothes. And I just started saying no to certain gifts. Our home is not huge. I don't want to be figuring out what to do with a bunch of stuff my DD can't use or doesn't play with, while also needing to source and purchase the stuff she does actually need. I have enough on my plate.

3) You don't know her well enough for some of the gifts you're giving. I know to you that charm bracelet was a really thoughtful gift. But... what if she doesn't like charm bracelets? What if she wears gold jewelry, not silver? What if she had already picked out something to commemorate her first year as a mother and was hoping her husband would give it to her? Jewelry is just a very personal gift and I don't think you know her well enough to buy something that personal for her. Instead, you might have made her feel awkward, like she has to wear this jewelry item she doesn't like or that doesn't feel like her so as not to offend you, which is such a stressful situation to be in. Better gifts might be: a gift card to a spa, books or a magazine subscription, a couple months of Hello Fresh, etc. Still thoughtful, but a little less dependent on her personal tastes.

Also on the issue of "feeling like her" -- she's a new mom. It's literally an out of body experience. She might still be trying to figure out who she is and how she fits into her own life, which is so different than it was just a few years ago. Give her time and space to figure that out and don't write her off before she's settled in. I think my big take away from your post is that you really just don't know her that well and she doesn't know you that well. I think you need to take this relationship more slowly, lower expectations, and maybe focus on your relationship with your brother and nephew and let your (still pretty new) SIL take her time.

[Anonymous]

I had kids before my sister did. When mine were young, she kept sending me all these 'tips' and 'ideas' that were from 'something I read online' or 'all my (her) friends are talking about this'. It was well meaning, and I get that she was just excited to have a small child in the family, but it drove me nuts at the time. Like she didn't think I was capable of doing my own research, or had my own friends to talk to? Or that her reading online somehow trumped my own personal experience? It honestly felt like just one more instance of my big sister thinking she knew more than me, even about my own life.

The combination of your age difference and your experience with children (but not having your own) might make her feel like you are constantly judging her from the outside. It's partly her insecurity, but offering 'tips' doesn't help. And if your brother comes back to her saying 'hey my sister suggested X, Y or Z', that won't help either.

You're on the right track with not offering suggestions. You can take it a step further by asking THEM for advice. This could backfire if you're overbearing about it, but a casual question or two thrown in during normal conversation can really help show that you respect them as parents. "Hey, I heard about this new thing and was thinking about trying it for some of the kids I work with. Have you tried it, or do you know anyone who has?" "What is (nephew's) favorite toy these days? My friend has a son the same age, and I need to find a birthday present for him, any recommendations?" Regardless of your words, SIL has the impression right now that you think you know more than they do. That may be totally unjustified, but try to look at it through her lens and see if you can correct that impression.

[Anonymous]

Just because you have worked with children doesn’t make you an expert. The wrapping gifts in foil thing is odd especially if you have a child that puts things in their mouth. Why I our both raking you for advice ? Tell him to talk to his pediatrician. Basically, back off on all the advice and gifts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had kids before my sister did. When mine were young, she kept sending me all these 'tips' and 'ideas' that were from 'something I read online' or 'all my (her) friends are talking about this'. It was well meaning, and I get that she was just excited to have a small child in the family, but it drove me nuts at the time. Like she didn't think I was capable of doing my own research, or had my own friends to talk to? Or that her reading online somehow trumped my own personal experience? It honestly felt like just one more instance of my big sister thinking she knew more than me, even about my own life.

The combination of your age difference and your experience with children (but not having your own) might make her feel like you are constantly judging her from the outside. It's partly her insecurity, but offering 'tips' doesn't help. And if your brother comes back to her saying 'hey my sister suggested X, Y or Z', that won't help either.

You're on the right track with not offering suggestions. You can take it a step further by asking THEM for advice. This could backfire if you're overbearing about it, but a casual question or two thrown in during normal conversation can really help show that you respect them as parents. "Hey, I heard about this new thing and was thinking about trying it for some of the kids I work with. Have you tried it, or do you know anyone who has?" "What is (nephew's) favorite toy these days? My friend has a son the same age, and I need to find a birthday present for him, any recommendations?" Regardless of your words, SIL has the impression right now that you think you know more than they do. That may be totally unjustified, but try to look at it through her lens and see if you can correct that impression.

This is such great advice. People are so dismissive of the hard-won knowledge mothers have of their own kids. People almost never ask! I feel like moms will ask each other but that's a different sort of interaction. If one of my siblings or in-laws actually asked me for advice based on my years of experience raising a child, that would make me feel appreciated in a way that I often don't. It's also a way of flattering their parenting without just saying "I think you're a good parent."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would find it very annoying if someone 'advised' me how to play with my kid, unless I had asked for advice and ideas. You have a great game in mind? Feel free to engage and play with my child yourself.

Also, I don't like the people who shove an endless stream of gifts on you at every possible occasion, with the expectation that we should praise them for their 'generosity' and 'thoughtfulness' in return.

+1 Added to this I think charm bracelets are the strangest, tackiest thing on earth and if someone thoughtfully selected me a charm I would be irritated that I had to keep a piece of clutter around.

It's great that you love your nephew and have experience with kids but you're not presenting yourself as a doting aunt, you're presenting yourself as an expert on childcare that she needs to learn from and appreciate. The reason she told you that's the first thing that comes up on Google is because you're implying she hasn't thought about ways to make travel easier or plan ahead for a trip with her kid. If your brother asks for advice, give it. But chill out with your "expert advice," it's condescending.

You say you love and admire her, but your insertion of "surprise pregnancy" for no reason and in a way that adds nothing to the OP tells otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So I am single and childless but I have worked for over a decade with young children. My brother and his GF had a surprise pregnancy and got married and had my nephew, now a toddler. I genuinely adore my SIL. She is so smart, kind and is a wonderful wife and mother. That said, I often feel like she doesn’t much care for me. Even though my brother is constantly asking me for parenting advice, when I offer even a small tip or idea to SIL she always either tells me why I am wrong or more often tells me that she already knows.

Example: They were going on a trip so I ordered some mini figurines of characters from nephews’ favorite show. I mentioned to her that a fun activity is to wrap little toys like these in several layers of aluminum foil so it takes him a long time to unwrap and he can rewrap and playing with the wrapper becomes it’s own activity. She said. “Yeah, we do that all the time.” I said “Oh I should have known you would know all the best toddler activities.” She said “That’s like the first thing that comes up when you google sensory activities.”

The other stress point is that I am a gift person. I love to shop for presents for others and spend a lot of time and energy trying to find nice things. Not only has SIL been kind of blasé about gifts in the past (e.g., I spent a lot of time choosing charms for a sterling silver charm bracelet symbolizing different milestones in her first year as a mom and she never even mentioned it until I asked if she had opened it yet). She recently sent a long email to all family members saying basically that they are not interested in getting random presents for my nephew and included a link to an online wish list of approved gift ideas. I get why they might not want a bunch of miscellaneous toys and presents for him, but a) everything on the list is very expensive (like they asked for organic cotton training pants that were $20 a pair) and b) I just can’t help feeling that it was basically a way of saying “your presents aren’t good enough.”

So: tell me how much of this is that I am being oversensitive of crazy and how much is real. And tell me what to do about it. Is there any point in discussing things with her? Do I just bite my lip?

I would stop with the advice and stop with the gifts. If your brother asks just say "I'm sure you and SIL know your son better than me" No parent wants advice from someone without kids ( except maybe siblings) Sorry but, she isn't open to advice and she might be insulted that you are judging her not to be a good mom. Don't talk about it just change your behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks. I really really do not give unsolicited advice. The closest I ever come is the example I gave. And at this point when my brother asks me advice I usually tell him that he should talk to his wife instead. And I am well aware of the clutter factor so I try to send things that are small or consumable (like bath bombs for nephew) and I always include in my note that anything they don’t find useful they can just donate.

Honestly I kind of feel like “why can’t you just lie to me?” If I send a gift you hate, why not just say thank you and quietly donate it instead of going out of your way to tell me “Yeah, I have been wanting one of these from X brand but Y brand will do for now, I guess.”

You are making work for her. If she doesn't like the thing she never asked for she has to them coordinate getting said thing donated somewhere? This is the unwanted gift that won't stop giving. Stop it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So I am single and childless but I have worked for over a decade with young children. My brother and his GF had a surprise pregnancy and got married and had my nephew, now a toddler. I genuinely adore my SIL. She is so smart, kind and is a wonderful wife and mother. That said, I often feel like she doesn’t much care for me. Even though my brother is constantly asking me for parenting advice, when I offer even a small tip or idea to SIL she always either tells me why I am wrong or more often tells me that she already knows.

Example: They were going on a trip so I ordered some mini figurines of characters from nephews’ favorite show. I mentioned to her that a fun activity is to wrap little toys like these in several layers of aluminum foil so it takes him a long time to unwrap and he can rewrap and playing with the wrapper becomes it’s own activity. She said. “Yeah, we do that all the time.” I said “Oh I should have known you would know all the best toddler activities.” She said “That’s like the first thing that comes up when you google sensory activities.”

The other stress point is that I am a gift person. I love to shop for presents for others and spend a lot of time and energy trying to find nice things. Not only has SIL been kind of blasé about gifts in the past (e.g., I spent a lot of time choosing charms for a sterling silver charm bracelet symbolizing different milestones in her first year as a mom and she never even mentioned it until I asked if she had opened it yet). She recently sent a long email to all family members saying basically that they are not interested in getting random presents for my nephew and included a link to an online wish list of approved gift ideas. I get why they might not want a bunch of miscellaneous toys and presents for him, but a) everything on the list is very expensive (like they asked for organic cotton training pants that were $20 a pair) and b) I just can’t help feeling that it was basically a way of saying “your presents aren’t good enough.”

So: tell me how much of this is that I am being oversensitive of crazy and how much is real. And tell me what to do about it. Is there any point in discussing things with her? Do I just bite my lip?

The bolded came off to me as pretty passive aggressive. If she doesn’t want your tips or gifts, why do you keep offering them? I think this is more about you than her. She has a toddler, it’s a lot, she’s keeping her toddler entertained, she’s probably not worried right now about what her husband’s sister thinks about her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks. I really really do not give unsolicited advice. The closest I ever come is the example I gave. And at this point when my brother asks me advice I usually tell him that he should talk to his wife instead. And I am well aware of the clutter factor so I try to send things that are small or consumable (like bath bombs for nephew) and I always include in my note that anything they don’t find useful they can just donate.

Honestly I kind of feel like “why can’t you just lie to me?” If I send a gift you hate, why not just say thank you and quietly donate it instead of going out of your way to tell me “Yeah, I have been wanting one of these from X brand but Y brand will do for now, I guess.”

Bath bombs may not be appropriate for toddlers. I just bathed my toddlers in regular baby shampoo. Also, you are making more work for her because now she has to get rid of something she doesn't want or need.

[Anonymous]

I think it's her younger age + her first child = makes her more sensitive/insecure. She doesn't want to look like an unprepared mom, so will shun advice. Not really you, more her. Most moms are more relaxed with the second kid.

As for gifts, she just communicates differently. She didn't target you. I also put a lot of thought into gifts. If there is a wish list, I would purchase an item there and one separately. I would hope both are appreciated, otherwise, they should just say no gifts.

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry to sound harsh, OP, but she sounds annoyed with you because she feels overwhelmed with your unwanted attention.

Personally, I would be too. Just because you work with young kids doesn't mean you're more intelligent, or that your suggestions are somehow better than what your SIL can come up with on her own with a little thought. She appears to be giving this a LOT of thought, and wants to enjoy her little one without everyone breathing down her neck! It's perfectly understandable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks. I really really do not give unsolicited advice. The closest I ever come is the example I gave. And at this point when my brother asks me advice I usually tell him that he should talk to his wife instead. And I am well aware of the clutter factor so I try to send things that are small or consumable (like bath bombs for nephew) and I always include in my note that anything they don’t find useful they can just donate.

Honestly I kind of feel like “why can’t you just lie to me?” If I send a gift you hate, why not just say thank you and quietly donate it instead of going out of your way to tell me “Yeah, I have been wanting one of these from X brand but Y brand will do for now, I guess.”

Small is in many ways worse, because there's more of it. More of the clutter to deal with.

OP I know you mean well and giving stuff is your way of showing you care (my sister is like this) but it's truly not enjoyable to others to have to deal with clutter. Especially if your SIL has articulated that the things you send are not necessary. She is not just being polite.

Send her something she can actually use, if you must send something - maybe a gift card to the grocery store. It may seem "thoughtless" to you, but I assure you it's actually much more thoughtful to her than a charm bracelet. Many, many people find it work and a burden to deal with gifts they do not want.