Why are men surprised a change in responsibility may lead to change in sex?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man here, the above reply from the woman is the reason why so many divorce or affair. Too much resentment built up. Like how it's hard for me to see my wife as sexual after a decade of complete sexual abandonment. Oh now you want to have sex after rejecting me for 8 years?

It's tough stuff, no one is necessarily wrong. And of course men are idiots if they think nothing will change after the kids come. All I wanted was 30 minutes of us time once a week or so but that wasn't possible for her.

PP here that I think you’re referring to. We have sex 1 -2 times a week now but reading this thread took me right back to the anger over that period of our relationship. When he slips into the chores for sex mode I get mad and lash out. Clearly we have more reckoning to do but outside of this issue we are doing ok. I am hoping eventually even this kind of discussion won’t be a trigger.

Thanks for responding. It's tough for me not to get triggered by her suggesting sex. Like, what does she actually want from me or is she doing it out of guilt or to shut me up? I can't even fathom her having sex with me because she has a desire to do so. Like you, I hope we can get back to normal but I fantasize about divorce or having an affair even though we also get along fine on other issues.

Good.luck

That could be her genuinely trying. The transition back to something a bit more normal like 1-2 time per week was hard. Sometimes it did feel a little like doing it to say we did. But it definitely got better. The thing that drove me super nuts was when my husband, after complaining for months that we were not having enough sex, would turn down a quickly or a bj. Because it wasn’t “good enough.” Talk about two steps back. Sometimes we just had to push through that on both sides - I told him I offered or initiated because I loved him even if I was exhausted but if he was going to shut me down it was never going to improve. If you only want to sex you want on the schedule you want it it’s bound to fail (not saying this is you but it was him). So we both met in the middle and now things are a lot better although definitely not perfect.

I was a DH who used to turn down quickies. It wasn't so much that I wanted a super special performance, it was more that I felt like it was pity and a sign that she'd prefer not to do it at all. On bad days, that felt rapey. On good days, it felt like an overly complicated version of masturbation. I was resentful that even the person who theoretically loved me best in the world found me so off-putting that she didn't even want to have sex with me. Intellectually, I knew things were a lot more nuanced than that. But these were the feelings I was having when I turned her down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Amen, sister!

If I had one piece of advice to my younger self, it would be too extensively try out early on anyone who I was interested in dating - can they cook? do they clean their own house, can they plan and carry out activities that are thoughtful of others? do they prioritize my needs over theirs at least half the time?

Marriage is only partially about falling in love with someone; it is also about finding an equal partner in life.

+1000

This. Also don't marry a guy who was raised by a SAHM who never had a career. They expect the same even though the wife works FT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Man here, the above reply from the woman is the reason why so many divorce or affair. Too much resentment built up. Like how it's hard for me to see my wife as sexual after a decade of complete sexual abandonment. Oh now you want to have sex after rejecting me for 8 years?

It's tough stuff, no one is necessarily wrong. And of course men are idiots if they think nothing will change after the kids come. All I wanted was 30 minutes of us time once a week or so but that wasn't possible for her.

PP here that I think you’re referring to. We have sex 1 -2 times a week now but reading this thread took me right back to the anger over that period of our relationship. When he slips into the chores for sex mode I get mad and lash out. Clearly we have more reckoning to do but outside of this issue we are doing ok. I am hoping eventually even this kind of discussion won’t be a trigger.

Thanks for responding. It's tough for me not to get triggered by her suggesting sex. Like, what does she actually want from me or is she doing it out of guilt or to shut me up? I can't even fathom her having sex with me because she has a desire to do so. Like you, I hope we can get back to normal but I fantasize about divorce or having an affair even though we also get along fine on other issues.

Good.luck

That could be her genuinely trying. The transition back to something a bit more normal like 1-2 time per week was hard. Sometimes it did feel a little like doing it to say we did. But it definitely got better. The thing that drove me super nuts was when my husband, after complaining for months that we were not having enough sex, would turn down a quickly or a bj. Because it wasn’t “good enough.” Talk about two steps back. Sometimes we just had to push through that on both sides - I told him I offered or initiated because I loved him even if I was exhausted but if he was going to shut me down it was never going to improve. If you only want to sex you want on the schedule you want it it’s bound to fail (not saying this is you but it was him). So we both met in the middle and now things are a lot better although definitely not perfect.

I was a DH who used to turn down quickies. It wasn't so much that I wanted a super special performance, it was more that I felt like it was pity and a sign that she'd prefer not to do it at all. On bad days, that felt rapey. On good days, it felt like an overly complicated version of masturbation. I was resentful that even the person who theoretically loved me best in the world found me so off-putting that she didn't even want to have sex with me. Intellectually, I knew things were a lot more nuanced than that. But these were the feelings I was having when I turned her down.

Did you then complain how you never got any? Did you threaten open marriage if her sexual prowess did not meet your very particular standards?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's very chicken and egg. Men do nice things and are motivated to do romantic gestures when they feel emotionally connected through sex. Women want to have sex when men do romantic gestures. When one stops, the other does too and it spirals downward.

These threads are basically "you started this first"

Also, there are massive hormonal differences between the sexes. Married lesbians have a fraction of the sex married straight couples have. Unless you believe women either suck in bed or are horribly unromantic with each other, it's really just hormones.

Lesbian married couples are also far more likely to have 2 hour multi-orgasmic sexual encounters, so I don’t think your framework of hormones or sexual talent really translates the way you’re suggesting.

It supports exactly what I am saying. I never said women suck in bed, merely that even when women are married to other women, know their bodies, and can give each other more orgasms in bed (on average), they still have sex far less than straight couples. Point being, the idea of weekly sex (or more) in marriage is male-driven. Men not getting this frequency isn't because they did something wrong or suck in bed, it's because they are married to women.

+1. And gay dudes have a lot of sex. Presumably a lot of them are also not pulling their weight or "dating" their significant others. We don't like to feel like we're just bags of chemicals, but hormones have a lot to do with desire.

[Anonymous]

If men know hormones also affect desire, why not do everything you can to control the other things than affect desire.
Why blame your wife constantly for her hormones depleting. It is not like women sign up to have hormones removed from their bodies out of spite to their husbands.
If men understand this (the point of this entire thread is why dont' men understand) and they say they do, why the hell is this brought up every damn day?
You don't see women on here complaining her DH going through Chemo and bedridden isn't doing the dishes. BECAUSE he can't control his body and how it is reacting. Women understand this. Men just want what they want and blame anyone who can't give it to them when, where, how they feel they deserve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Every day it is a different man wanting the same level of sex and intamacy and energy out of their wives that they had while dating.
Yet no one realizes that she does not have the same work load, burden, etc that she did while dating.
I haven't had 8 hours of sleep in almost 8 years. First it was babies not sleeping through the night. Then it was DH gaining weight and developing snoring (refusing to do anything until recently), then it was a work promotion and working longer hours etc.
I haven't had a day to myself in over a year due to kids, DH working from home and inlaw visits.
I have to cook or find food for 5 people daily, even if it is cereal or a sandwhich a 2 year old can't do that himself.
I have to do laundry for myself and 3-4 others routinely (DH hates laundry and will ask me to do his too at least 1x a month)
I have to buy more birthday gifts and send cards then I care to (and we have cut back) but with kids in school and friends/family it all adds up.

These are just a few things that deplete my energy and wanting to have sex. We do have sex right now 1-2 times per week but any more than that I just don't have any more to give.
Now, if I had my own place again, only cooked for myself, did laundry for myself, slept in until 9 on the weekends, where a day off of work was all about ME. Then hell ya. I would have a ton more energy to throw at a guy or a husband or whoeever but you know what? That is not what marriage and having a family is. I am sick of the woman always getting blamed for not being willing to light herself on fire to keep others warm without 1 bit of empathy from the men on this thread about all that the woman in their life does to keep it going.

Sounds like you married a man child. Besides, the biggest issue on DCUM is DHs that do their fair share (far more than your DH does) in the house - cook, clean, laundry, child rear, etc. and have DWs that don't appreciate it and the sex life is non-existent. I'm one and tehre are many. We all eat well, stay in shape, are primary cooks, spend lots of time with the kids, work, etc. and yet DWs aren't terribly interested in sex.

Most men don't pull their weight.

https://www.theatlantic.com/family/archive/2019/05/breadwinning-wives-gender-inequality/589237/

https://news.gallup.com/poll/283979/women-handle-main-household-tasks.aspx

So men help out more with traditionally "woman tasks" than women help out with traditionally "man tasks".

FWIW the reasonable people on here weren't saying that all men pull their weight, only that there was a significant portion of the DH population that did so. Your references back this up. In my household, for instance, I do all yard work, car work, make most of our major financial decisions. DW does almost all groceries, decorating and child-specific duties. We split cleaning, cooking, laundry, and trip-planning pretty evenly based on what each of us does well. We are a dual-income household. I make slightly more, and she has a bit more flexibility with her job.

[Anonymous]

If men think mowing every 2 weeks is equivalent to cooking every night and 5 loads of laundry a week you are crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think you can only speak about your specific husband. It's aslo about what you choose to priortizze. My husband is an equal partner in terms of caring for the kids and house, and he understands just as well as I do that sometimes plans for a romantic evening get interupted or put on hold. That said if a choice to use energy for sex or laundry we 9/10 prioritze the sex.

For some, the reality that they didn't choose a husband very wisely is harsh. So they fall back on the belief that all men are like their husbands. It's sad, but true.

There aren’t enough equal partner type husbands to go around. How many men do you know that were taught to cook as children? How many young boys? Very few. How many were encouraged to take initiative around the house?

This.
My DH promised the moon and back and couldn't wait to have kids and be a hands on dad!!! However, hands on to him is reading 1 book before bed and playing catch for 10 minutes.

Please divorce this bad-choice unequal partner selfish lying bait and switch man baby small dk loser who thinks (wrongly) that he is somehow "entitled" to sex!

Or... stay with him in your platonic room mate (open) marriage.

Yep Every answer is either demand better (like no woman has ever thought of that) or OPEN MARRIAGE
how about a man grow, mature, communicate and realize that HE is the manbaby and demands shouldn't have to be put on him to be a man. Oh, but then that is on HIM.
Otherwise it is the wife's fault for staying and if she does it is open marriage for them.
Men. Grow the EFF up and understand that being a husband and father is a different role than an Effbuddy from college

I am not excusing the man baby. Quite the opposite, I am agreeing 100% with every one of your complaints. But he's not here, while you are.
Therefore, in regards to YOUR role: if you are married to a man baby who won't grow the EFF up then JUST DIVORCE him!
Do not stay with a terrible partner whom you don't want sex with. Yes that absolutely IS the wife's fault for staying.

But... if you choose NOT divorce, you must know that even man babies absolutely will find sex elsewhere. Your marriage therefore is open.
So please make up your mind. Just as man babies are not entitled to sex (with wife), WOMEN who stay (sexlessly) married to a man baby are not entitled to fidelity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If men think mowing every 2 weeks is equivalent to cooking every night and 5 loads of laundry a week you are crazy.

It isn't which is why you see more men cooking, cleaning, and laundry than you see women doing yard work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If men think mowing every 2 weeks is equivalent to cooking every night and 5 loads of laundry a week you are crazy.

It isn't which is why you see more men cooking, cleaning, and laundry than you see women doing yard work.

Who are you where all of these men are doing these things?
I actually see women out doing yard work (or high school boys) ALL OF THE TIME. All of my female friends handle most of the yard work (minus tree trimming) yet where are these men cooking/cleaning you speak of?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If men think mowing every 2 weeks is equivalent to cooking every night and 5 loads of laundry a week you are crazy.

It isn't which is why you see more men cooking, cleaning, and laundry than you see women doing yard work.

Who are you where all of these men are doing these things?
I actually see women out doing yard work (or high school boys) ALL OF THE TIME. All of my female friends handle most of the yard work (minus tree trimming) yet where are these men cooking/cleaning you speak of?

Ask the PP who posted the poll results.

But to answer your question, they are at my house.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If men think mowing every 2 weeks is equivalent to cooking every night and 5 loads of laundry a week you are crazy.

It isn't which is why you see more men cooking, cleaning, and laundry than you see women doing yard work.

Who are you where all of these men are doing these things?
I actually see women out doing yard work (or high school boys) ALL OF THE TIME. All of my female friends handle most of the yard work (minus tree trimming) yet where are these men cooking/cleaning you speak of?

Ask the PP who posted the poll results.

But to answer your question, they are at my house.

I have no problem prioritizing my sex life or my DH but you can be dang sure if he was demanding sex and not pulling his weight with OUR family my intensity and desire for him would go down further than it has with depleting hormones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I was a DH who used to turn down quickies. It wasn't so much that I wanted a super special performance, it was more that I felt like it was pity and a sign that she'd prefer not to do it at all. On bad days, that felt rapey. On good days, it felt like an overly complicated version of masturbation. I was resentful that even the person who theoretically loved me best in the world found me so off-putting that she didn't even want to have sex with me. Intellectually, I knew things were a lot more nuanced than that. But these were the feelings I was having when I turned her down.

Did you then complain how you never got any? Did you threaten open marriage if her sexual prowess did not meet your very particular standards?

Haha, nope. I told her how quickies of the "don't worry about her" variety made me feel. (Also, not liking "just get it over with" isn't a "very particular standard." But I find declare open marriage guy annoying too.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If men think mowing every 2 weeks is equivalent to cooking every night and 5 loads of laundry a week you are crazy.

If your man is only mowing every other week, divorce him yesterday. That is a lazy, neglectful human being with no pride in his lawn.

[Anonymous]

I didn't read the whole thread but we also have sex about 1-2 times per week with a 2 and 3 year old. I think that is a reasonable cadence, particularly during the little kid years.