Perspecitive from the mother of a very popular teenage boy or girl.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fine to care about popularity -- you shouldn't want your kid to be left out. However, realize that there are different shades of popularity. Ultimately, I think HS is best/easiest for those who have a group of friends -- not huge but not just one other person either -- and an activity that they're committed to. Those kids always have people to hang with, people to go to events with, can call someone up when they're bored, and can party to the extent they want to -- maybe not the crazed frat party kind of partying, but they can invite 10-20 people over for a birthday and have a good time. Those kids generally seem more grounded and secure, as they know their friends don't like them because of their clothes or their relationship status.

The trickier road is for those who aspire to be truly "popular" -- part of the alpha group at their school, whether that consists of the athletes, the wealthy or whatever. It is a road that seems really glamorous as those are the kids with the best clothes/cars, always have boyfriends/girlfriends, are consistently on homecoming court etc. But the amount of drama that goes on is a time waster. In those kinds of groups friendships can be more fickle and can change in an instant -- so there's constant concern about how every little thing will be perceived; i.e. I have played flute since grade school and really want to try out for band but what will everyone say if I'm a band geek; or my bf just broke up with me -- I need another guy asap so everyone thinks it was a mutual break.

These are not the kinds of things that typically go hand in hand with top academics. Sure there may be 1 kid that has it all and can do all of the preceding while still acing 7 AP classes, but for most that kind of drama takes time and effort and does detract from school. I had plenty of these kids that I grew up with (and in my public high school -- the varsity football guys and their girlfriends ruled the school). 10-15 yrs after the fact many are still in our hometown, working for their dads' small businesses, and talking about their glory days.

If you're not happy with where you D is at (and tread lightly bc she IS happy) -- why not just encourage her to join an activity or two where she'll meet more kids? The time consuming activities tend to lead to tight groups of friends -- sports; newspaper/yearbook; band; youth group etc -- bc when you spend hours and hours with someone on a common endeavor, you may realize that you really like them as a person.

Agree completely. Of all the adults I have ever known, only two has both an Ivy education and was a star athlete. He is also an alcoholic whose drifted from job to job, doe not get along with the family, wife left him, no kids. So not really a success story. But he has the charm and leadership and brains that allowed him to do those things. Personal and professional life, not that great.
The other was a star athlete at Ivy, academically top and "popular" with a wide variety of people. He committed suicide at age 38.
Everyone else it was one or the other: either a serious sports star, or shining academically, because both are very time consuming. Particularly on the college level.

Figures your only two stories of successful people who had it together end in tragedy...yawn..

Well guess what, there ARE people how can hold it together and maintain that through adulthood! My brother being one! He graduated from the best university in this country (public) is a highly successful litigation attorney for a top firm, 2 girls, wife, the whole nine yards, happy well adjusted and successful. He was very popular in high school, got good grades, did some partying but nothing extreme and was a great role model. Beyond him I know of a few others just like him....so yes they do exist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think there are a lot of parents on this thread who have their heads in the sand. Seriously you need to get with the program.

Yes in the affluence circles particularly...many not all parents do care about the popularity of the kids, yes many of the "popular" and not popular kids are smoking, drinking,etc...at 16. Hooking up at 13 is de rigeour. Stop being so ignorant. If someone says rarely drinks, don't chastise her but accept it, yes for a 16 year old in today's ridiculous growing up way too fast world...rarely drinks IS an accomplishment. I am so sick of these parents who put this silly charade on like they are so shocked all this goes on....like they are appalled that parents care about their precious kids popularity. WELL NEWSFLASH...PEOPLE YES THEY DO!


My D a junior is neither here nor there, she is kind of in the middle, she would LOVE to be popular but in 11th grade is accepting her "position" in the pecking order and no longer seeks to join the "cool kids". Fine with me. But I don't for a minute kid myself into thinking because shes not with those kids, she isn't doing the things so many are, or that she doesn't care about being popular because she does and because I know its important to her....guess what I think about it too (but never let her know it). I cannot get over the ignorance of some of the parents here....

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's fine to care about popularity -- you shouldn't want your kid to be left out. However, realize that there are different shades of popularity. Ultimately, I think HS is best/easiest for those who have a group of friends -- not huge but not just one other person either -- and an activity that they're committed to. Those kids always have people to hang with, people to go to events with, can call someone up when they're bored, and can party to the extent they want to -- maybe not the crazed frat party kind of partying, but they can invite 10-20 people over for a birthday and have a good time. Those kids generally seem more grounded and secure, as they know their friends don't like them because of their clothes or their relationship status.

The trickier road is for those who aspire to be truly "popular" -- part of the alpha group at their school, whether that consists of the athletes, the wealthy or whatever. It is a road that seems really glamorous as those are the kids with the best clothes/cars, always have boyfriends/girlfriends, are consistently on homecoming court etc. But the amount of drama that goes on is a time waster. In those kinds of groups friendships can be more fickle and can change in an instant -- so there's constant concern about how every little thing will be perceived; i.e. I have played flute since grade school and really want to try out for band but what will everyone say if I'm a band geek; or my bf just broke up with me -- I need another guy asap so everyone thinks it was a mutual break.

These are not the kinds of things that typically go hand in hand with top academics. Sure there may be 1 kid that has it all and can do all of the preceding while still acing 7 AP classes, but for most that kind of drama takes time and effort and does detract from school. I had plenty of these kids that I grew up with (and in my public high school -- the varsity football guys and their girlfriends ruled the school). 10-15 yrs after the fact many are still in our hometown, working for their dads' small businesses, and talking about their glory days.

If you're not happy with where you D is at (and tread lightly bc she IS happy) -- why not just encourage her to join an activity or two where she'll meet more kids? The time consuming activities tend to lead to tight groups of friends -- sports; newspaper/yearbook; band; youth group etc -- bc when you spend hours and hours with someone on a common endeavor, you may realize that you really like them as a person.

Agree completely. Of all the adults I have ever known, only two has both an Ivy education and was a star athlete. He is also an alcoholic whose drifted from job to job, doe not get along with the family, wife left him, no kids. So not really a success story. But he has the charm and leadership and brains that allowed him to do those things. Personal and professional life, not that great.
The other was a star athlete at Ivy, academically top and "popular" with a wide variety of people. He committed suicide at age 38.
Everyone else it was one or the other: either a serious sports star, or shining academically, because both are very time consuming. Particularly on the college level.

Figures your only two stories of successful people who had it together end in tragedy...yawn..

Well guess what, there ARE people how can hold it together and maintain that through adulthood! My brother being one! He graduated from the best university in this country (public) is a highly successful litigation attorney for a top firm, 2 girls, wife, the whole nine yards, happy well adjusted and successful. He was very popular in high school, got good grades, did some partying but nothing extreme and was a great role model. Beyond him I know of a few others just like him....so yes they do exist.

I think you missed the point. The poster was saying that it is the very rare kid who can excel in ALL areas. Who can be a star athlete AND a star students AND a social butterfly, all at the same time. She also did not say that it was impossible. Just that it wasn't common. Your brother's experience does not discount her theory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think there are a lot of parents on this thread who have their heads in the sand. Seriously you need to get with the program.

Yes in the affluence circles particularly...many not all parents do care about the popularity of the kids, yes many of the "popular" and not popular kids are smoking, drinking,etc...at 16. Hooking up at 13 is de rigeour. Stop being so ignorant. If someone says rarely drinks, don't chastise her but accept it, yes for a 16 year old in today's ridiculous growing up way too fast world...rarely drinks IS an accomplishment. I am so sick of these parents who put this silly charade on like they are so shocked all this goes on....like they are appalled that parents care about their precious kids popularity. WELL NEWSFLASH...PEOPLE YES THEY DO!


My D a junior is neither here nor there, she is kind of in the middle, she would LOVE to be popular but in 11th grade is accepting her "position" in the pecking order and no longer seeks to join the "cool kids". Fine with me. But I don't for a minute kid myself into thinking because shes not with those kids, she isn't doing the things so many are, or that she doesn't care about being popular because she does and because I know its important to her....guess what I think about it too (but never let her know it). I cannot get over the ignorance of some of the parents here....

I'm trying to figure out what your point is. I don't care how popular my kid is, as long as he is happy. (And yes, it really is possible for kids to be happy even if they aren't conventionally popular.) Knowing that some parents DO care about shit like this doesn't affect my opinion in any way. You sound like you think that I should care because others do. Thanks for the newsflash, let me consider this a bit more....nope, I still don't care.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think there are a lot of parents on this thread who have their heads in the sand. Seriously you need to get with the program.

Yes in the affluence circles particularly...many not all parents do care about the popularity of the kids, yes many of the "popular" and not popular kids are smoking, drinking,etc...at 16. Hooking up at 13 is de rigeour. Stop being so ignorant. If someone says rarely drinks, don't chastise her but accept it, yes for a 16 year old in today's ridiculous growing up way too fast world...rarely drinks IS an accomplishment. I am so sick of these parents who put this silly charade on like they are so shocked all this goes on....like they are appalled that parents care about their precious kids popularity. WELL NEWSFLASH...PEOPLE YES THEY DO!


My D a junior is neither here nor there, she is kind of in the middle, she would LOVE to be popular but in 11th grade is accepting her "position" in the pecking order and no longer seeks to join the "cool kids". Fine with me. But I don't for a minute kid myself into thinking because shes not with those kids, she isn't doing the things so many are, or that she doesn't care about being popular because she does and because I know its important to her....guess what I think about it too (but never let her know it). I cannot get over the ignorance of some of the parents here....

+1000

Also agree- think a lot of parents don't want to fess up to their own vulnerabilities as far as their kids go- just my take.....seems to either be touching a lot of nerves or reawakening some doubts they didn't want to face.

[Anonymous]

Interesting conversation, one which has too many responses to go over.

My opinion is this- even if we want our kids to be Mrs. popularity, it's not going to happen even if we do. Nothing we can do will change the fate of our kids whether its being a loner, being right in the middle or the queen bee. Which brings me to my point....the sooner we accept our kids for who they are and how they are comfortable being, the faster we can expend that energy into enjoying each other and strengthening our bond. Remember parents, no matter what "cool clothes" you buy your kids, no matter how you try to entice the attention of the "cool group" genetics determined long before you did if you kid is destined to be popular or not. So stop trying. Just accept things as they are.

Trust me it's incredibly liberating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Exactly. I can't think of anything I want more than for my children than that they have a solid moral compass, a good sense of themselves, and the courage to march to their inner drumbeats. Whether that makes them popular or not, I could not care less.

Yearning for validation from others is a sure road to neurosis and unhappiness.

This. I wish more parents understood this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Interesting conversation, one which has too many responses to go over.

My opinion is this- even if we want our kids to be Mrs. popularity, it's not going to happen even if we do. Nothing we can do will change the fate of our kids whether its being a loner, being right in the middle or the queen bee. Which brings me to my point....the sooner we accept our kids for who they are and how they are comfortable being, the faster we can expend that energy into enjoying each other and strengthening our bond. Remember parents, no matter what "cool clothes" you buy your kids, no matter how you try to entice the attention of the "cool group" genetics determined long before you did if you kid is destined to be popular or not. So stop trying. Just accept things as they are.

Trust me it's incredibly liberating.

I don't think that's true. I do think that parents can help kids who may not really be a "loner" but in fact have serious social anxiety or lack confidence in social skills.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think there are a lot of parents on this thread who have their heads in the sand. Seriously you need to get with the program.

Yes in the affluence circles particularly...many not all parents do care about the popularity of the kids, yes many of the "popular" and not popular kids are smoking, drinking,etc...at 16. Hooking up at 13 is de rigeour. Stop being so ignorant. If someone says rarely drinks, don't chastise her but accept it, yes for a 16 year old in today's ridiculous growing up way too fast world...rarely drinks IS an accomplishment. I am so sick of these parents who put this silly charade on like they are so shocked all this goes on....like they are appalled that parents care about their precious kids popularity. WELL NEWSFLASH...PEOPLE YES THEY DO!


My D a junior is neither here nor there, she is kind of in the middle, she would LOVE to be popular but in 11th grade is accepting her "position" in the pecking order and no longer seeks to join the "cool kids". Fine with me. But I don't for a minute kid myself into thinking because shes not with those kids, she isn't doing the things so many are, or that she doesn't care about being popular because she does and because I know its important to her....guess what I think about it too (but never let her know it). I cannot get over the ignorance of some of the parents here....

I think you have totally missed the point.

1. Yes, many kids do care about being popular. Their still kids and their frontal lobes aren't fully developed, so they care about a bunch of crap that doesn't matter and don't always make good decisions.

2. Most kids hide drinking and having sex from their parents. Especially if the parent is the type to say their child would neverrrrrr do something like that. Not exactly an ideal situation for the teenager to discuss issues.

3. Some parents do care about their children's popularity. And some parents are shitty parents. There is a lot of overlap between the 2 groups. Doesn't change my position that my childern's popularity is not something I worry about. I worry about their friends, having a group they identify with so that high school is not torture and their school work. But the idea that a grown woman would bask in the glory of teenage popularity is weird, infantile and gross.

Hope that helps!

[Anonymous]

It would never even occur to me to worry that my kid was not popular enough. Worry about whether he has good friends or is bullied? Of course. But whether he is "cool"? That is breathtakingly immature and bespeaks very poor values.

[Anonymous]

^ Agree

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Interesting conversation, one which has too many responses to go over.

My opinion is this- even if we want our kids to be Mrs. popularity, it's not going to happen even if we do. Nothing we can do will change the fate of our kids whether its being a loner, being right in the middle or the queen bee. Which brings me to my point....the sooner we accept our kids for who they are and how they are comfortable being, the faster we can expend that energy into enjoying each other and strengthening our bond. Remember parents, no matter what "cool clothes" you buy your kids, no matter how you try to entice the attention of the "cool group" genetics determined long before you did if you kid is destined to be popular or not. So stop trying. Just accept things as they are.

Trust me it's incredibly liberating.

I don't think that's true. I do think that parents can help kids who may not really be a "loner" but in fact have serious social anxiety or lack confidence in social skills.

This is DH and me. We have two SN children. One has needed a social skills class to learn the social "graces" and construct and is on the mild end of the Autism Spectrum. Our other DC is an introvert and shy and has anxiety. DC2 doesn't need a "social skills" class as DC understands and is capable of the normal back and forth, but needs help in getting out there in smaller setting. School lunch bunches work for DC2.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD is very popular. She feels a ton of pressure to hold up her reputation -- any boyfriend she wants, top athlete, straight As, looking good each day with stylish outfits perfect hair. It would surprise others that she is very grounded and she knows should not "care" as much about some things but she doesn't want to "let down" the friends that made her the Queen bee. It is weird and at the end what she wants BUT it isn't all perfect in beautiful people land. Just be happy that your kid is happy. Really, it sound contrite but it is the truth. My other children are different than her and not as popular but I worry about them all the same. And also not sure what path is the best but each is their own that is what is special.

Deluded white people. Which mythical High school does she go to that she can be a straight A and top athlete and still have time for all that?

OH, 90210!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD is very popular. She feels a ton of pressure to hold up her reputation -- any boyfriend she wants, top athlete, straight As, looking good each day with stylish outfits perfect hair. It would surprise others that she is very grounded and she knows should not "care" as much about some things but she doesn't want to "let down" the friends that made her the Queen bee. It is weird and at the end what she wants BUT it isn't all perfect in beautiful people land. Just be happy that your kid is happy. Really, it sound contrite but it is the truth. My other children are different than her and not as popular but I worry about them all the same. And also not sure what path is the best but each is their own that is what is special.

Deluded white people. Which mythical High school does she go to that she can be a straight A and top athlete and still have time for all that?

OH, 90210!

Come on, not even in 90210.

Brenda, Kelly, and Donna may have been popular, but they were not straight A students and they definitely weren't athletes.

Andrea was a straight A student, but not popular or athletic.

Dylan was none of these things.

Steve was popular and an athlete, but not a straight A student.

Brandon was popular and a straight A student, but not an athlete.

[Anonymous]

My opinion is this- even if we want our kids to be Mrs. popularity, it's not going to happen even if we do. Nothing we can do will change the fate of our kids whether its being a loner, being right in the middle or the queen bee. Which brings me to my point....the sooner we accept our kids for who they are and how they are comfortable being, the faster we can expend that energy into enjoying each other and strengthening our bond. Remember parents, no matter what "cool clothes" you buy your kids, no matter how you try to entice the attention of the "cool group" genetics determined long before you did if you kid is destined to be popular or not. So stop trying. Just accept things as they are.

With the exception of kids that are very introverted or extroverted, I think the whole popularity reflects the parents more than the kids. The more social parents tend to have more social kids because this is what they learn to do. They also get exposed to more kids from their parents having families over for parties etc. Kids that are wealthy have an advantage because they can afford whatever the in thing is at the time. Kids with attractive parents are usually attractive and looks are a large part of popularity at this age. Physical fitness or activities is usually another contributor. The kid in chess club or fencing is less likely to be popular than the dancer or soccer player. The kids may show preferences for some things but the early exposure to repeated socially valuable things comes from the parents.