We may end up estranged from my parents

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They are in their mid-70s, DH and I are in our early 50s, and we've had enough of them. Since the day we got married my parents have been painfully unpleasant to be around. They've been abusive during visits, commenting on our apartments and homes over the years (your dad is an expert and fixing XYZ, look at the horrible craftsmanship, how did you hire someone like this, where are they from!!), badmouthing our neighborhoods (tsk tsk you should have brought a house in our neighborhood, it's the best community in the USA), starting fights over the holidays, miserable phone calls that always culminate in stress and fights and being hung up on, chastising us over not being religious enough, and then pretty much gleeful when DOGE threatened our jobs (lazy feds deserve to be punished for all that fraud, ha!!).

So, we're done. I have one sibling who is very close to them and tolerates a lot of their crap (I think it's the anti-anxiety meds that make it so easy to listen to them without wanting to throw them out of her house), therefore she may be the one handling their healthcare needs when the time comes. I want to be a better person but they sure have earned it from me. Is there any hope? I have to say that the lack of communication with them has brought such peace into my life.

I assume you have already told them to cut it out with the negative comments and jabs? Maybe they had jobs critiquing things and optimizing things; doesn’t mean that feedback what should come out of your mouth even 50% of the time during family visits.

What did they say or do when you told them to stop talking like that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Having seen via my extended family how damaging estrangement can be, I’m of the opinion that you should only cut off close family members in cases of real abuse (not, they hurt my feelings)/for safety reasons. But this is an unpopular opinion on DCUM.

Almost any relationship has some strife at some point. It’s actually not normal for relationships and life to be stress-free, completely comfortable all the time, etc. So other strategies like setting boundaries, continuing the relationship on your own terms, reducing but not eliminating contact are almost always better than cutting someone out of your life completely.

The damage you may see if people who suddenly have to deal with their own mental illness instead of unloading on someone else. They needed that child/sibling to play a role and be mocked/gossiped about/chastised/manipulated and now they have to deal with eachother and themselves. My question to you is, how is the person who decided to distance? Why don't you care about that person's wellbeing? How are you defining "real abuse?" Is that only physical and sexual abuse for you? Were you inside the home 24-7 and observing interactions? What makes you think you are in a position to judge whether there was abuse?

I’m sick of people pretending to know as a child or teen wtf was actually going on with their parents marriage or with parenting. Teens don’t pay attention to that stuff. And adolescents and children don’t remember squat about that.

We all know the neglectful absentee father who wafted into the house after work, ignored everyone, and then played pretend Family Guy at public social events.

Do we really know what our working or stay at home mothers went through? Was it even age appropriate to know? We were such great, obedient tweens and teens that we deem getting yelled at or disciplined as “abuse.”? Did we have 2-6 hours on iPhone or computer screens a day surfing the web or on social media to F us up more?

Focus people, focus. Be the best person you can be. For your kids for sure, but maybe even show your parents you’re better than them. In a nice way.

[Anonymous]

Say, "that's very rude"
"we don't want our visits together to be unpleasant"
"if our visits are unpleasant we'll all be spending a lot less time together."

And you see them less if it doesn't improve. And less. And even less, if necessary

But there's got to be a better way to handle relationships than "cutting people off"

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I recognize you, OP. Do you ever get tired of beating the same bush. Either cut them off or stop talking about it. I'm guessing you are as obnoxious to them as they are to you. I know you try my nerves and I just have to see your posts about this on occasion.

Not OP but why do you read posts that try your nerves? Do you ever get tired of doing this to yourself? You are obnoxious.

Basically, I wonder why people have to post repeatedly about the same thing. It's as if they have a massive victim mentality and get attention with their "problems" here. If they really wanted to solve their issues they would get help. It is rarely a one-side issue. But OP and people like her are getting attention by posting repeatedly on the same issue. And that's what they want. Attention. A version of Münchausen syndrome.

Doesn't it actually help if they get a reality check that maybe they are part of the problem?

It actually is often a one-sided issue. As you can see it's only one side that has an issue. In this world there are definitely perpetrators that do things just because they want to not caring about the consequences.

My point is that we are only getting OP's side of the story. There are always two sides of every story involving human beings. Each one sees it through their own lens and their own experiences. But whatever about that. I'm just saying that people who talk/complain/post repeatedly about an issue and do nothing to solve it are simply ruminating. At least the people who say I just need to vent are self aware enough to know that they just want to get it off their chests, relieve the pressure of a situation that is either unsolveable or they don't want the consequences of what the/a solution entails.

I just think people like the OP should become more self aware, and by doing so, maybe they'd be able to handle their issues better.

Lots of people post some version of OP's story. Heck, I have posted something along the same lines in the past.

OP- if other relatives are estranged from your parents, it most certainly is NOT you. Don't listen to these "every story has 2 sides" people. That's not always the case.

How is it possible that anyone believes that there is ever only one side of a story? Of course everyone has their own version. How can you be so self involved as to believe otherwise?

What can be true is that the level of difference a person has is too much for the other to deal with. Fine, then move on. But you people who act like you are blameless or perfect or superior to the other is myopic. You're just different or incompatible.

If multiple family members (both blood and married in, especially) are estranged from someone, then fine, there can be 2 sides to the story. But 1 side is wrong. And it's not self involved to admit that. It's smart.

So if both sides claimed to be wronged, how do you sort out which it is? I'm dealing with two family parties in an estrangment who vehemently say it's the other side. I feel pulled in both directions. There is no physical abuse allegations, FWIW, just emotional manipulation and verbal slights. They both seem like they've played a part, TBH, but of course one of them must be more wrong. How do I figure it out- please help. SHould I hire a family thereapist to be a mediator?

Boundaries. No need to be dramatic. The "just emotional manipulation and verbal slights" shows me where you stand on emotional abuse. If you want to remain close to both, you gently let them know you don't want to hear about the other and you do not share information about them to eachother. If you entertain and invite them both, you let them both know so they can decline to protect themselves and you accept graciously one or both declining. It really is that simple. Stay out. If they continue to drag you in, you keep your boundaries. If one dumps you for not taking sides, then you just accept that.

Be prepared that sometimes people who need to have a target will find a new target. Hopefully, it won't be you. In the case of my mother, once it was clear no abuse would be tolerated she started lashing out at the others, the same people who thought she was so kind and full of praise.In that case, once again, boundaries.

This.

Your behavior is in your control.

Their behavior is in their control.

Especially if just a routine low stakes interactions or question. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise (or blame you for their $hitty behavior).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Not OP here. I keep reading comments like "This is just criticism, not abuse" and "Maybe they're offering feedback because they love you." There's a huge difference between constructive, helpful criticism and venom / mockery. If you could hear the hostility in my mother's voice when she attacks, you'd dread being around her as much as I do. If you've never had a parent wash dishes at you or fold clothes at you angrily, well, this sentence won't make sense to you at all and I envy you.

I’m curious if there are any learning disorders or mental disorders at play- with Op or the parents(s)?

Those can often lead to weird perceptions of things and rejection dysphoria.

Most people are able to tell their own parents to Cut it out. Stop talking politics or money or neighborhood or the bad kitchen cabinets. Whatever.

[Anonymous]

I say go for it but maybe do not announce it. At least think before you announce it. That way, you can always change to low contact one day ONLY IF YOU WANT.

I went low contact with a toxic sibling. My health improved. My mood improved. I could focus on creative projects. My imagination improved. I had energy to put into other relationships.

Wow, it was just amazing. I thought back to when my sibling and mother had me in a Karpman's Drama Triangle and I was miserable. My mother baited me at a mother's day brunch. They would both scream at me. My mother would badmouth my sister. The drama never stopped.

But I was done. I exited the triangle.

Mother has dementia so that took care of itself. Of course, sibling does almost nothing for mother unless people at assisted living can "see" the work she is doing...But the assisted living is on to her, thank god.

I blocked sibling on all social and on my phone. I faced the fact they could die and I might not know. I try to keep a relationship with the kids but keep it low key and I never, ever, ever say anything bad about their mother. The oldest child KNOWS and has complained, but they will never hear me complain about their mom.

Good luck to you. You'll find your way. You'll find your own rules and boundaries that work best for you, and I predict you will feel a lot better in the future.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Thanks for all the feedback. They never went for therapy and most certainly don’t go now. They’ve told themselves all the tears it’s everyone else, not them— they are estranged from their relatives in their own families.

They just don’t get it, that they could be the problem in the room. They will not curb their behavior or keep their mouths shut as they believe they are really helping you in some way by calling out all the problems that you supposedly don’t see and that they’re just so intuitive and details and well, you should be grateful for their input. They think they’re doing you a favor by telling you that your neighborhood isn’t that great or your handyman did a bad job fixing the sink or they find some piece of news on Yahoo about your school district.

So yeah, if I do end up capitulating and helping them, I will just say I’m not doing it for them. I’m doing it for my sibling.

That's terrible. The actress Natasha Lyonne talked about her family and how she thrived in her acting career once her mother was dead. She referred to her mother and others in her family as "untreated."

It's not your job to handle their untreated selves, and I hope you find peace.

One of my friends brings up all the bad stuff. If I was sick, for example, she will immediately ask me about my illness or my dying relative or my sick dog...it's always some awful and depressing topics she is bringing up. Recently, I said clearly two times that I did not want to talk about my health. I may have to do this many times before she understands.

She does not seem to have any idea that she starts off with the worst thing possible in your life to ask about. What about just asking someone, "What's going on with you?" And then that person can bring up the topic they want to talk about instead of having some horrible, depressing topic foisted upon them??