DD applied "wrong"

[Anonymous]

Apply to Michigan if good stats?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Is she actually ready for college if it was like pulling teeth to get her to apply and now she isn’t interested in any of her choices?

+1. It’s very strange that OP thinks she should have pushed more and made more decisions for her daughter. This is their process, not ours.

I don't think that's what she's saying. She regrets not having provided stronger guidance at a more opportune time.

Right. At several points she had the opportunity to submit more applications, said I'll do it later, then she said she didn't want to bother. I should have insisted more, but I didn't want to cause more conflict and stress.

This is on HER. My daughter is the same. She applied to 3 schools. If she doesn't get in to the one she's actually interested in, it's on her because she didn't put more effort into her application and she didn't seriously search for a backup that she'd be enthused, if not somewhat excited, about.

dp.. I get what you are saying, but this is not a situation where she decided to not take a jacket even though you told her that it was going to be really cold, and she was really cold all day. That's a one day natural consequences.

This is about 4 years of their lives.

I would've insisted more. Some teens just can't strategize for long term. And no, I'm not talking about top tier, but even colleges like UMD are getting really hard to get into for middling students.

I don't believe it was a matter of not being able to strategize. She just had no idea what she wanted or where to begin to figure it out.
On paper, she should be a shoe-in for the one college. The mistake I fear she's made is being so confident she'll be accepted. That will be the hardest life lesson she's ever had if she isn't. I don't have a sense of her chances for the other two.

But I can't fill out the applications for her. I can't write the essays for her - though I know some parents do. She wouldn't even let us proofread her essay. Best I could do was set her up with a friend of ours she was comfortable to let help her and find the balance of pushing her forward but not pushing too hard. And nag her.

She had no clue what she was looking for - or should look for - in a college and wasn't taking any initiative to figure it out. We eventually just signed her up for some college tours and told her we were going. She needed to get onto some campuses and start getting a feel and figuring something out about what she might like or not like. I think, along with having no clue what she wants to study, she was overwhelmed. WAnting to not go too far away and looking for a few specific boxes to check, the options were greatly narrowed. Too narrowed.
All we can do is hope her presumption of acceptance to the one school is right.

I'm the PP... yes, exactly what happened to my older DC now at UMD. Applying broadly is part of the strategy. I didn't help with any of the essays, either. They let me finally look at everything once they were done and ready to hit "send" just to have a second pair of eyes on it.

Yes, it's overwhelming. I agree. Like I said, most kids are not mature enough or have the drive to be really organized and know where to start. IMO, that's where parents come and help them organize their thoughts. Trouble is, like your kid, a lot of kids don't even want to start thinking about it until it's too late. Sorry, but I'm not going to let such an important life decision to natural consequences. College is super expensive. We are investing close to $200K on four years of their lives. That's a serious commitment.

IMO, the hardest part of all this for most kids is being organized. So, you help (push) them to be organized.

It's really maddening. You are damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

It's too late now for your DC to lament not starting earlier. I agree with PPs that you should put a positive spin on it. "No use crying over spilled milk". Help your DC get excited about the college they will be going to.

My DC who ended up at UMD was not excited about it until the day before move in. UMD was their last choice, but for the most part, their only choice, but they seem satisfied with being there, though of course, they would've been happier with their first choice. Still, they are doing ok, if not ecstatic. They have a good internship lined up for the summer.

If you can afford it, a private College counselor is the best $4-5K ever spent. We paid that for 4 years of access (but didn't start until Jan of Junior year). I can manage the process (did with our first kid who wasn't aiming as high). But for 2nd kid I largely did it for two reasons: first to have the CC help manage the process so I didn't have to nag my really smart kid who likes to procrastinate and second to have help generating a list of colleges to apply to. Ultimately it was great. The CC forced our kid to have everything ready to go by Nov 1 for the EA and ED, and to have the supplementals for the 2 they were applying to RD (no EA) if ED didn't work out, ready by Dec 15. SO I didn't have to nag, and Nov/Dec was much less stressful because all the work was 99% finished already.
My kid's final 3 choices included 2 schools that were not on my original list---including our hidden gem of a safety and the school my kid is ultimately attending!!! So money well spent, and even better if you used it over the 4 years.
But I didn't need that---I knew how to help my kid craft a HS course list. I can do 85% of college planning, but I didn't want to nag my senior for 4 months (and I know they are a procrastinator and we butt heads about that).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is she actually ready for college if it was like pulling teeth to get her to apply and now she isn’t interested in any of her choices?

+1. It’s very strange that OP thinks she should have pushed more and made more decisions for her daughter. This is their process, not ours.

I don't think that's what she's saying. She regrets not having provided stronger guidance at a more opportune time.

Right. At several points she had the opportunity to submit more applications, said I'll do it later, then she said she didn't want to bother. I should have insisted more, but I didn't want to cause more conflict and stress.

This is on HER. My daughter is the same. She applied to 3 schools. If she doesn't get in to the one she's actually interested in, it's on her because she didn't put more effort into her application and she didn't seriously search for a backup that she'd be enthused, if not somewhat excited, about.

dp.. I get what you are saying, but this is not a situation where she decided to not take a jacket even though you told her that it was going to be really cold, and she was really cold all day. That's a one day natural consequences.

This is about 4 years of their lives.

I would've insisted more. Some teens just can't strategize for long term. And no, I'm not talking about top tier, but even colleges like UMD are getting really hard to get into for middling students.

No, her daughter applied to and was accepted to 7 SCHOOLS! It's not like she was applying to only 1 school and hoping to get admitted. Or she was applying to 7 T25 schools and hoping to win the lottery.
She obviuosly applied to many targets and safeties.

You can encourage your kids to apply to more, but if they don't do it, then they get to pick from what they did do.

At some point, your kid has to be motivated.

And if you cannot get them to apply to more than say 1 college, well CC is a backup and quite possibly where they belong if they are not mature enough yet to want to apply to 4-5 colleges to gain admission to a few to choose from.

I think they were responding to me, the poster about the daughter applying to 3 schools and interested in only one.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I wonder when parents like OP will understand that they are sending the message that their kids are incompetent and need mommy to “do more” for them and take charge. It is a main reason (along with social media) for the rise in teen and youth anxiety and mental health issues.

This should be shouted from the rooftops. Parents come in and save their kids from the slightest repercussion of their actions at every turn.

That doesn't apply to a huge decision like this one. I always wonder who people making these sorts of comments are.

+1 certain natural consequences are fine. Life altering ones, not so much.

Life-altering: college v. no college
Life-effecting: this good college v. that good college v. might be a better college for your current major

Parent intervention for the first is quite reasonable. For the second, really not that critical.

+1

Back away and let her make the choices.

For all of our kids, we made sure they made the final choices and we didn't give indications of what "our personal top choices were" Why? Because it's not our journey---we wanted our kids to pick their college choice from their list of acceptances. Because they have to be excited about the 4 years there. If issues arise (and they will every freshman has some issue/regrets), I wanted our kids to not "blame us for making them attend that school". They need to own their decisions.

Turns out both worked out well. And yes, both had some challenges freshman year as every kid does. Moving 2-3K miles from home, living in a shared dorm room, managing college courses is new and different. But they picked the right place for them, and were motivated to struggle thru and find solutions largely because they picked it (not mommy & daddy). It's their college experience, our only input as parents ultimately is "we can afford to pay $X per year" beyond that it's up to them

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder when parents like OP will understand that they are sending the message that their kids are incompetent and need mommy to “do more” for them and take charge. It is a main reason (along with social media) for the rise in teen and youth anxiety and mental health issues.

This should be shouted from the rooftops. Parents come in and save their kids from the slightest repercussion of their actions at every turn.

That doesn't apply to a huge decision like this one. I always wonder who people making these sorts of comments are.

Yes, it absolutely applies to the college process. I am the one who made the original comment about OP sending a message of incompetence to her kid. You wonder who I am? I am a parent of three - one college grad, one college junior and one 12th grader. I am also someone who navigated the (albeit much simpler) college (and later, law school) admissions processes by myself.

That is smugness from having kids who matured a little earlier, nothing else.

DP: if your kid isn't ready to manage at least 75-80%+ of the process themselves, they likely are not ready for a 4 year college. And CC with a plan to transfer might be the best use of your money. Or whatever 4 year they manage to get into.

The issue here is what you consider the process to be. It varies.

Well parents can help, as in helping make sure the kid understands what a Reach/Target/Safety are and finding great ones for each category, while explaining family finances so your kid is also selecting schools they can afford---no point in applying to $90K/year schools that dont' give much merit if you make $300K/year, will get no FA and you can only afford to help with $30K/year.

So yes, you help with managing the list and putting together a list of dates for having stuff done/and making sure they all get submitted on time. But ultimately, your kid needs to write the essays. Your kid needs to decide if they want to apply to another Reach with 4 supplemental essays or not. Hint: Many targets and most safeties do not have supplementals.

But a kid who applied to 7 schools and got into them all likely had a good list of Targets and Safeties already. So your job is to lower anxiety and not stress them into thinking "their choices are not good enough".

And if your kid refuses to even write the common app general essay or start the process, you need to sit down with them and figure out what's going on. Why are they so stressed? Because they just might be a good candidate for CC and then transferring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD has a dream school. She could not care about any other school besides this one school. Despite telling her that there are other schools, in better locations, with better programs in a major she seemingly chose out of thin air. I gave up and let her put all her efforts into this one reach school. She applied to about 5 other schools, basically pulling names out of a hat.
She did not get into dream school.
And is now in a tizzy because she hates her other choices. And she announced she is not interested in her major and doesn't know what she wants to do.

All this to say you aren't alone....

What we did and are doing - touring the schools she got into. Telling her that every school will prepare her for the next step (career or grad school) and that no one (her friends, her teachers, other parents) can legitimately state that one school is better that the other unless they have been to all of these schools. These are opinions based on their own personal preferences and what they have "heard". I told her that she doesn't need to choose a major right away and finally, she can transfer out if there isn't a fit.

After touring a couple schools, she actually does like one of them. We are waiting for other results. She is still sad about not making it to her dream school, but she is getting excited about the other prospects.

This is an excellent example of why you should work to convince your student to have a great balance of reaches, targets and safeties. And that the targets and safeties are not actual choices if your kid doesn't LIKE the school. You have the opportunity to select them carefully, and given that most kids do NOT get into their reaches (they are called reaches for a reason and for top students, most are single digit acceptance rates), you need to focus on Targets and safeties so you will ultimately pick from choices you LIKE

Also, why you don't hype up a dream school mentality.

That's all well and good when your kid likes multiple schools. Mine is looking for a liberal arts school (because she doesn't know what she wants to major in), with a specific extracurricular, on a pretty campus, not too far from and not too close to home, that isn't too big or too small. She is not interested in "reach" schools and does not believe it's worth $60K + a year to go to a more prestigious school even if she got into one (all her belief development, not ours. We never ever told any of our kids to let the posted tuition keep them from applying if they are really interested in the school, because you never know what offers you may actually get etc). Anyway, my point is, you can apply to 20 schools covering the range you cite. But if they aren't interested in any of them, it really doesn't matter. You should have at least one sure back-up. Unfortunately, some schools that have been strong back-ups are becoming more difficult to get into merely because of the number of students applying to them. The sure thing back-up just might be community college 2+2, or GMU if you're in a school that offers automatic acceptance if you have "x" GPA at the end of your junior year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All along the way, the college admissions process is affected by decisions made before the kids were really mature enough to make certain decisions and judgments. I'll give an example, my sophomore D is the kid who turns in great work and would probably have all As if they turned everything in, didn't listen to harping on grades because it stresses her out, so I had to really take a step back except for situations where her grades were dropping precipitously. As it is, there are a couple of Cs freshman year that will exclude her being able to consider top schools. Now, suddenly, thanks to some of her friends, she is beginning to understand that grades and GPA drive the process, and she has been more focused on pulling out the grades. At least she has the rigor, but she already limited her options. The cake is partly baked.

Outside of T50 schools, she will be fine. There are plenty in the 50+ range that will see it for what it is---a kid figuring things out after freshman year and moving forward.

And in reality, if your kid wasn't a striver in Freshman year, they likely will never have the personality/strong desire to actually be at a T25 school--it would be an expensive and miserable experience for a kid like that if they were to somehow get admitted.

That's not necessarily true. Expensive, but not that the kid would never be motivated enough. Motivation and maturity can kick-in after a miserable freshman year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder when parents like OP will understand that they are sending the message that their kids are incompetent and need mommy to “do more” for them and take charge. It is a main reason (along with social media) for the rise in teen and youth anxiety and mental health issues.

This should be shouted from the rooftops. Parents come in and save their kids from the slightest repercussion of their actions at every turn.

That doesn't apply to a huge decision like this one. I always wonder who people making these sorts of comments are.

Yes, it absolutely applies to the college process. I am the one who made the original comment about OP sending a message of incompetence to her kid. You wonder who I am? I am a parent of three - one college grad, one college junior and one 12th grader. I am also someone who navigated the (albeit much simpler) college (and later, law school) admissions processes by myself.

That is smugness from having kids who matured a little earlier, nothing else.

DP: if your kid isn't ready to manage at least 75-80%+ of the process themselves, they likely are not ready for a 4 year college. And CC with a plan to transfer might be the best use of your money. Or whatever 4 year they manage to get into.

The issue here is what you consider the process to be. It varies.

Well parents can help, as in helping make sure the kid understands what a Reach/Target/Safety are and finding great ones for each category, while explaining family finances so your kid is also selecting schools they can afford---no point in applying to $90K/year schools that dont' give much merit if you make $300K/year, will get no FA and you can only afford to help with $30K/year.

So yes, you help with managing the list and putting together a list of dates for having stuff done/and making sure they all get submitted on time. But ultimately, your kid needs to write the essays. Your kid needs to decide if they want to apply to another Reach with 4 supplemental essays or not. Hint: Many targets and most safeties do not have supplementals.

But a kid who applied to 7 schools and got into them all likely had a good list of Targets and Safeties already. So your job is to lower anxiety and not stress them into thinking "their choices are not good enough".

And if your kid refuses to even write the common app general essay or start the process, you need to sit down with them and figure out what's going on. Why are they so stressed? Because they just might be a good candidate for CC and then transferring.

Ah, yes, this is the perfect description for OP's kid! FOMO. Not good enough.
Good enough for who? One man's junk is another man's treasure.

[Anonymous]

Seniors have responsibility for participating in this process. Sounds like she was reluctant for whatever reason, and you moved the needle as best you could to get here even this far. Now it’s time to start thinking about how she can make the most of her experience at the school she will be going to. Start looking forward, not backward.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:She got into 7 schools. She’ll be fine at one of those 7. Don’t “what if” yourself into unhappiness.

+1 You did great, Mama!

[Anonymous]

It’s normal to feel what-if’s at this stage. We do the best we can as parents. Give yourself grace and realize you did what you could. None of us had our parents helping us this much back in the 90s.I’m sure your daughter will be fine. Trust!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD has a dream school. She could not care about any other school besides this one school. Despite telling her that there are other schools, in better locations, with better programs in a major she seemingly chose out of thin air. I gave up and let her put all her efforts into this one reach school. She applied to about 5 other schools, basically pulling names out of a hat.
She did not get into dream school.
And is now in a tizzy because she hates her other choices. And she announced she is not interested in her major and doesn't know what she wants to do.

All this to say you aren't alone....

What we did and are doing - touring the schools she got into. Telling her that every school will prepare her for the next step (career or grad school) and that no one (her friends, her teachers, other parents) can legitimately state that one school is better that the other unless they have been to all of these schools. These are opinions based on their own personal preferences and what they have "heard". I told her that she doesn't need to choose a major right away and finally, she can transfer out if there isn't a fit.

After touring a couple schools, she actually does like one of them. We are waiting for other results. She is still sad about not making it to her dream school, but she is getting excited about the other prospects.

This is an excellent example of why you should work to convince your student to have a great balance of reaches, targets and safeties. And that the targets and safeties are not actual choices if your kid doesn't LIKE the school. You have the opportunity to select them carefully, and given that most kids do NOT get into their reaches (they are called reaches for a reason and for top students, most are single digit acceptance rates), you need to focus on Targets and safeties so you will ultimately pick from choices you LIKE

Also, why you don't hype up a dream school mentality.

That's all well and good when your kid likes multiple schools. Mine is looking for a liberal arts school (because she doesn't know what she wants to major in), with a specific extracurricular, on a pretty campus, not too far from and not too close to home, that isn't too big or too small. She is not interested in "reach" schools and does not believe it's worth $60K + a year to go to a more prestigious school even if she got into one (all her belief development, not ours. We never ever told any of our kids to let the posted tuition keep them from applying if they are really interested in the school, because you never know what offers you may actually get etc). Anyway, my point is, you can apply to 20 schools covering the range you cite. But if they aren't interested in any of them, it really doesn't matter. You should have at least one sure back-up. Unfortunately, some schools that have been strong back-ups are becoming more difficult to get into merely because of the number of students applying to them. The sure thing back-up just might be community college 2+2, or GMU if you're in a school that offers automatic acceptance if you have "x" GPA at the end of your junior year.

You should be able to find 5-6 schools that are a combination of targets and at least 2 safeties that your kid can be excited about. That is the time to great a list so you will have somewhere to attend that you will like. If you cannot create that list, you need to step back and remove some of the "restrictions". And nobody should apply to a school they are "not interested in". WTH would you do that? The entire point is to get acceptances to schools you want to attend, so you have choices come March/April

And if you cannot get them interested in 5-6 schools, then explain that there are no guarantees and if none of them work out you will be attending your Likely (safety) or CC it is.

And if your kid is not interested in searching for 5-6 schools (or any safeties), then maybe they are okay with a CC to start.

But no, UMD or UVA cannot be your only choice or you might be sorely disappointed

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All along the way, the college admissions process is affected by decisions made before the kids were really mature enough to make certain decisions and judgments. I'll give an example, my sophomore D is the kid who turns in great work and would probably have all As if they turned everything in, didn't listen to harping on grades because it stresses her out, so I had to really take a step back except for situations where her grades were dropping precipitously. As it is, there are a couple of Cs freshman year that will exclude her being able to consider top schools. Now, suddenly, thanks to some of her friends, she is beginning to understand that grades and GPA drive the process, and she has been more focused on pulling out the grades. At least she has the rigor, but she already limited her options. The cake is partly baked.

Outside of T50 schools, she will be fine. There are plenty in the 50+ range that will see it for what it is---a kid figuring things out after freshman year and moving forward.

And in reality, if your kid wasn't a striver in Freshman year, they likely will never have the personality/strong desire to actually be at a T25 school--it would be an expensive and miserable experience for a kid like that if they were to somehow get admitted.

That's not necessarily true. Expensive, but not that the kid would never be motivated enough. Motivation and maturity can kick-in after a miserable freshman year.

Well there are plenty of motivated kids at schools ranked 30-75 as well. But Not many kids who were not motivated in freshman year of HS are at T25 schools. That is okay. Just pointing out that in general, they would be out of place at a T25. Even my 1520/3.98UW/10AP kid likely would have been out of place at many T25 (didnt' get into the 3 they applied to) because while motivated, they just are not at the "next level" of striving/motivation.

[Anonymous]

I had a couple "musts" to feel like a good parent. I didn't express these, but I knew them, and could relax and drawback from being overly involved once done: First: admission to an acceptable safety. Second: admission to 1 instate public (in case it turned out they didn't want to be far from home). Both DC ended up accepted and attended great schools, out of state, I never would have had on my radar. It was their process. But as parents, I think it's ok to insist and hover and push (within reason) for whatever it is that's going to help us feel calmer. We have emotional needs. It's ok to try to meet those, as long as the final decision on where they attend is theirs to make.

[Anonymous]

She got into 7 schools, what are complaining about?