Stuck being closest sibling to declining parent

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I may be the poster you consigned to hell.

I mean at this point, OP, are you a troll? Every suggestion we make is shot down by you. You did not tell us before we made those suggestions that your siblings had actually DECLINED medical bills, etc. Were we supposed to read your mind? Why do you value you siblings' opinions, if they declined to help their own mother?

If your family won't help your mother, what do you prefer to do? Drop the rope as well? Or continue to help and be extremely resentful an whine on DCUM? Or continue to help, knowing no one is ever going to properly thank you, and that you're only doing it out of compassion and duty?

You think you don't have choices, but you do. They are not the choices you want, but they are still choices. There is no right or wrong here.




PS: the actual answer here is that your parent needs to get into an institution where all her needs will be taken care of. A Medicare home. Give your siblings a timeline, and do it. You don't care what anyone thinks at this point. You're done.

Please tell me about the magical soup to nuts homes that Medicare pays for.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

So this description actually addresses what OP would be doing if they were to stop providing care. This does not describe what the siblings are doing, since they never started to provide care in the first place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

So this description actually addresses what OP would be doing if they were to stop providing care. This does not describe what the siblings are doing, since they never started to provide care in the first place.

I think "left at X location" means dropped off on the side of the road. It doesn't mean enrolling the senior at the facility and paying for it out of their estate. The latter is what we encourage OP to do.

[Anonymous]

OP, if your parent resides in one of the states that have filial laws in place, the state can come after the elder’s kids:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/filial-responsibility-laws-by-state

It’s clear that so many people here stating “walk away”, etc. don’t get it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

Question: How many of us have you insulted and didn’t know this existed? I get SO sick of know it alls chiming in here

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

So this description actually addresses what OP would be doing if they were to stop providing care. This does not describe what the siblings are doing, since they never started to provide care in the first place.

Not true. They will go after the sibs as well

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

So this description actually addresses what OP would be doing if they were to stop providing care. This does not describe what the siblings are doing, since they never started to provide care in the first place.

I think "left at X location" means dropped off on the side of the road. It doesn't mean enrolling the senior at the facility and paying for it out of their estate. The latter is what we encourage OP to do.

Nice backpedaling. What if there’s no estate? The state will come after the kids to pay with these laws in place.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with others suggesting that this really is a “you” problem. Expecting your brothers and sisters to spend their vacation time taking care of your mother is unrealistic. And, even if they did it, it would just put a dent in your responsibilities. What good is having your brother or sister in town for a week or two going to do in the grand scheme of things?

You simply have to decide that you are going to do less yourself. You cannot decide that your brothers and sisters are going to do more. The only thing you can even consider doing when it comes to them is to hit them up for more money to help pay others to assist your mother. But beyond money, there’s nothing you can do, and if they say no to money, there’s also nothing you can do. This is all up to you.

Says the sibling who never helps out. Pound sand.

Not true.

Really?? How do?

I don’t live nearby but I contribute more money to support my mother’s care than my six siblings combined. My sister, who does live nearby and does the bulk of the “grunt work,” uses the money that I send (via automatic withdrawal from my checking account every month) to hire help to come in every single day. Literally every single day. And I pay for it even though I never liked my mother.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, if your parent resides in one of the states that have filial laws in place, the state can come after the elder’s kids:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/filial-responsibility-laws-by-state

It’s clear that so many people here stating “walk away”, etc. don’t get it

First, these laws apply to financial contributions. There's no law that requires any adult to take an active hand in a parent's care. OP's mother is in a facility that provides her care. There's no indication that she is on her way to being destitute. And if you think these laws are designed so that a child can be required to pay for upgraded care, or non-essential care, it's you who don't know what you are talking about,.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

Question: How many of us have you insulted and didn’t know this existed? I get SO sick of know it alls chiming in here

None of these laws apply to OP's mother's situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if your parent resides in one of the states that have filial laws in place, the state can come after the elder’s kids:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/filial-responsibility-laws-by-state

It’s clear that so many people here stating “walk away”, etc. don’t get it

First, these laws apply to financial contributions. There's no law that requires any adult to take an active hand in a parent's care. OP's mother is in a facility that provides her care. There's no indication that she is on her way to being destitute. And if you think these laws are designed so that a child can be required to pay for upgraded care, or non-essential care, it's you who don't know what you are talking about,.

OP stated she had little money. The laws are designed for the states to get money from the kids of the elders. You are correct in that regard and that’s why the siblings can be gone after. Walking away is a good reason for them to come after OP as well. She can’t be forced, but saying to the nursing staff flat out what’s going on? They usually get it. But the social workers? I came out to another state to take care of my dying single aunt. Once she was in full-time hospice, I came back home to my own family - all told about two months. She had others visiting her, etc. Didn’t stop the social worker from calling me regularly, harassing me to come back because they were no longer being paid by Medicare as she lasted more than the five days they expected her to. If I had been her daughter, she surely would have filed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

Question: How many of us have you insulted and didn’t know this existed? I get SO sick of know it alls chiming in here

None of these laws apply to OP's mother's situation.

If OP walks and sibs do nothing, state will come after all three. Best bet is to state her case to the caregivers at the assisted living facility and state she’s drowning and needs a break. They get that. The other sibs can’t be forced to help, but filial laws can force them to pay.

[Anonymous]

No. Coming after the adult children is not legal in most states. OP has to check the laws in her mother's state. Taking the patient's assets, on the other hand, is legal and fair. If there are last minute transfers of wealth to the children to hide assets, that will be clawed back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see some people telling you that you need to just tell your siblings to do x, y and z and they should do these things. I found that advice useless. You cannot force, manipulate, guilt trip anyone into doing something they don't want to do. All you can do is focus on your own boundaries.

That is where the choice comes in. You calmly inform siblings you have done all you will be doing. You found these professionals to take on bills, medical visits, case management, etc. It costs this much a month. They have 3 choices...we hire these people with mom's money, they find people they think are better/more reasonably priced or they take on the tasks themselves. When/if they try to guilt trip you, you calmly make it clear you are done and you will only do f. When they push you remind them there are 3 choices. Then perhaps have a deadline that if they haven't made a decision by this time you will go forward with the hiring.

If the siblings live in a state where the state can come after negligent children, I’d pull that card too

I didn't even know that was a thing. But I guess it is, and it's called "older adult abandonment" or "elder abandonment" and apparently every state has a law that addresses it. Here's one definition:

"Older adult abandonment is the purposeful and permanent desertion of a vulnerable adult over 65. In general, a vulnerable adult struggles to maintain their physical or mental health. This is usually because the older adult suffers from mental incapacity or disability. The victim may be left at their home, a hospital, an assisted living facility, a nursing home, or a public location. The person doing the abandoning may feel overburdened or believe they lack the resources to care for the victim."

https://www.findlaw.com/elder/elder-abuse/elder-abandonment.html

Question: How many of us have you insulted and didn’t know this existed? I get SO sick of know it alls chiming in here

None of these laws apply to OP's mother's situation.

If OP walks and sibs do nothing, state will come after all three. Best bet is to state her case to the caregivers at the assisted living facility and state she’s drowning and needs a break. They get that. The other sibs can’t be forced to help, but filial laws can force them to pay.

Again. No. There are filial responsibility laws in some states, but they are not enforced, or rarely enforced. PA is the exception.

"One of the main reasons why filial responsibility laws are not widely enforced is due to the fact that in the context of needs-based government programs such as Medicaid, federal law has prohibited states from considering the financial responsibility of any person other than a spouse in determining whether an applicant is eligible. However, as many local programs aimed at helping the elderly continue to struggle with insolvency, many states may consider more aggressive enforcement of their filial responsibility laws.

Twenty-one states allow lawsuits to recover financial support. Parties who are allowed to bring such a lawsuit vary state by state. In some states, only the parents themselves can file a claim. In other states, the county, state public agencies or the parent’s creditors can file the lawsuit. In 12 states, criminal penalties may be imposed upon the adult children who fail to support their parents. Three states allow both civil and criminal penalties.

In some states, children are excused from their filial responsibility if they don’t have enough income to help out, or if they were abandoned as children by the parent. However, the abandonment defense can be difficult to prove, especially if the parent had a good reason to abandon the child, like serious financial difficulties. Sometimes, children’s filial responsibility can be reduced if prior bad behavior on the part of the parent can be proven."