Expecting a different life at this age, so help with a reset:

[Anonymous]

OP, you will have to listen very carefully to a soft whisper to find your muse. Asking others just short circuits this process.

[Anonymous]

OP, you sound like you have had a really good life and you sound not at all grateful for it. Some of us never had the huge, warm family experience growing up or as parents. You had both but still mourn not getting more as a (1950s) grandparent matriarch. It’s not an attractive look and I am sure your kids feel the same. In fact, they may not have enjoyed their large family childhood that much if they don’t even want kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP, people are just trying to problem solve, which is what people do, when I think what you are looking for is just some empathy/sense of shared experiences. I think you're thinking about this the right way, which is that it is a loss that you need to grieve. So, do that. There are books on how to deal with this type of grief -- not the loss of a loved one, but the loss of some expected life path. Find those books. Maybe see a therapist for awhile to help you sort through the emotions.

I'm not at your life stage yet, but I think I would feel similarly to you if I ended up in this situation.

I think what the OP feels sad about is that she did everything 'right' by making family the center of her world and her children also got to interact with their cousins etc. But she seems to have no understanding of the structural reasons as to why things are the way they are. It sounds like she's never had a career so of course she was able to be so family-oriented. Now it's 2021, and people have broader definitions of family and I wouldnt be surprised if her kids prefer to spend Thanksgiving with friends than schlep all the way back to the OP's. There is more to life than having children and OP needs to get that in her head.

Ah, alright.... (pause for eye roll) I had an all-encompassing, fairly intense career, and I "accidentally" started a new one without even trying to in these last 4 years. It appears that a new one is sprouting, also without full intention. I also managed a ton of other things while I had a career and kids, and continue to do them. I still put family first and if I could do it all again, I would still make the same choice. It was the best thing ever.

Yes, I had it all, and did it all. Still, I am here to inform you that there is nothing worth more than people- family, and friends who become family, and people who will become friends, who then become family. Nothing. Not money,
not stuff, not houses and trips, not anything. **Ok, dogs- dogs are definitely also worth it.

And my kids do "schlep" home for Thanksgiving, thank you! They schlep home for other things, and we schlep there.

I'm sorry, but I disagree with you about there being more to life than that. You might not have experienced it and, if so, it might be a good thing that you don't know what you missed. I know what I am exactly missing and, well,.... I miss it.

Ok, thanks everyone. I'm ending it here. I've decided to engage interactively with some Viktor Frankl literature, namely Man's Search for Meaning and then I will report back what I have learned. Or did. Or whatever happens.

OP, as you probably already know, the Cliff Notes version of Frankl's work will fundamentally identify the big three as:

making a difference in the world
having particular experiences
adopting particular attitude

"Everything can be taken from a man but one thing: the last of human freedoms - to choose one's attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way."

This is coming from a guy who was in a concentration camp, remember? A suggestion - honestly look at the defensiveness which has crept into your responses.

So, here's a bit of reading for you that I happened upon:

"Attitude Is Everything"

We live in a culture that is blind to betrayal and intolerant of emotional pain. In New Age crowds here on the West Coast, where your attitude is considered the sole determinant of the impact an event has on you, it gets even worse.In these New Thought circles, no matter what happens to you, it is assumed that you have created your own reality. Not only have you chosen the event, no matter how horrible, for your personal growth. You also chose how you interpret what happened—as if there are no interpersonal facts, only interpretations.

The upshot of this perspective is that your suffering would vanish if only you adopted a more evolved perspective and stopped feeling aggrieved. I was often kindly reminded (and believed it myself), “there are no victims.” How can you be a victim when you are responsible for your circumstances?

When you most need validation and support to get through the worst pain of your life, to be confronted with the well-meaning, but quasi-religious fervor of these insidious half-truths can be deeply demoralizing. This kind of advice feeds guilt and shame, inhibits grieving, encourages grandiosity and can drive you to be alone to shield your vulnerability.


Sandra Lee Dennis

**I read your response and tried to remember who wrote this because I think it will help you with your general interactions with others.

+100

[Anonymous]

OP, you are extremely defensive. I'm not one to push for therapy but I think it would help you because you seem to have some very deep-seated anger. Here is the key comment you made which makes me think you need professional help:


"3. Additionally, I've been more than vocal about my own mother's lack of choices in the 1950s, which, in my opinion, would have resulted in her never having kids."

Your statement about your mother might never have had kids, and your current feelings about being a mother and your own child are obviously intertwined.

You cannot feel better unless you deal with the fundamental issue. So do that first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, how many children to you have, how old are they, any of them married, and insight if they are choosing to be childless?

This is a good question. I see that OP is in pain, but her anger comes through very strongly. She may alienate her children even if she thinks she is holding back and being careful. I would see a therapist. Whether your kids eventually procreate you want to maintain ties. I’m not sure my mom realizes how her years of complaining about how I wasn’t interested in kids soured things even after I started a family. And she believed she was holding her tongue, too.

DP and I completely agree with you. OP keeps on saying she doesn’t judge her children’s choices but she sounds judgemental to the core. I would avoid her if she were my mom.

Not op. There is nothing judgemental in what op posted. She is experiencing grief and expressing that at how things have turned out. People are allowed to feel grief. You and the pp are the judgemental ones. Can you not see that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are extremely defensive. I'm not one to push for therapy but I think it would help you because you seem to have some very deep-seated anger. Here is the key comment you made which makes me think you need professional help:


"3. Additionally, I've been more than vocal about my own mother's lack of choices in the 1950s, which, in my opinion, would have resulted in her never having kids."

Your statement about your mother might never have had kids, and your current feelings about being a mother and your own child are obviously intertwined.

You cannot feel better unless you deal with the fundamental issue. So do that first.

Meant to add that if you've been vocal about your mother's lack of choices to your own child, then it is entirely possible they may have interpreted this as YOUR feeling, too. Kids pick up on things like that and process it with a child's mindset. "Gee, my mom says her mother didn't really want kids. I wonder if my mom wanted me? Maybe not. Maybe I better not have kids either."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, how many children to you have, how old are they, any of them married, and insight if they are choosing to be childless?

This is a good question. I see that OP is in pain, but her anger comes through very strongly. She may alienate her children even if she thinks she is holding back and being careful. I would see a therapist. Whether your kids eventually procreate you want to maintain ties. I’m not sure my mom realizes how her years of complaining about how I wasn’t interested in kids soured things even after I started a family. And she believed she was holding her tongue, too.

1. I'm not your mother.
2. Reread above. I have never once, not once, said anything. Yes, I'm sure they know I would love grandchildren because they know me, not because I believe I was holding my tongue when I wasn't.
3. Additionally, I've been more than vocal about my own mother's lack of choices in the 1950s, which, in my opinion, would have resulted in her never having kids.
4. I have not alienated my kids. In fact, many of **their** child bearing friends have alienated them, which they actually feel comfortable enough to share with me. And-they are sad about that. Different life paths. **Talk about holding my tongue.




That being said, it is ridiculous to assume that each reaction to a situation can't be mutually exclusive. Just as no one can or should judge you for your decision to have or not have kids, there shouldn't be judgement regarding the impact of that either. Each will have their own emotions.

But, odd that you did, despite indicating for so long that you wouldn't, have kids. So something must have changed your mind (?)

Why do you assume I have kids? Anyway, you may want to read this thread " I don't want my parents to visit us while we are at my brothers house....how to handle?" in the Family Relationships forum and be grateful you dont have to deal with any crazy in your life. Oh wait, you are the crazy.

This has really gotten nasty for no reason. Op has tried to explain she doesn't need more activities and you are getting very angry over someone expressing sadness. Consider pondering this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, how many children to you have, how old are they, any of them married, and insight if they are choosing to be childless?

This is a good question. I see that OP is in pain, but her anger comes through very strongly. She may alienate her children even if she thinks she is holding back and being careful. I would see a therapist. Whether your kids eventually procreate you want to maintain ties. I’m not sure my mom realizes how her years of complaining about how I wasn’t interested in kids soured things even after I started a family. And she believed she was holding her tongue, too.

1. I'm not your mother.
2. Reread above. I have never once, not once, said anything. Yes, I'm sure they know I would love grandchildren because they know me, not because I believe I was holding my tongue when I wasn't.
3. Additionally, I've been more than vocal about my own mother's lack of choices in the 1950s, which, in my opinion, would have resulted in her never having kids.
4. I have not alienated my kids. In fact, many of **their** child bearing friends have alienated them, which they actually feel comfortable enough to share with me. And-they are sad about that. Different life paths. **Talk about holding my tongue.




That being said, it is ridiculous to assume that each reaction to a situation can't be mutually exclusive. Just as no one can or should judge you for your decision to have or not have kids, there shouldn't be judgement regarding the impact of that either. Each will have their own emotions.

But, odd that you did, despite indicating for so long that you wouldn't, have kids. So something must have changed your mind (?)

Why do you assume I have kids? Anyway, you may want to read this thread " I don't want my parents to visit us while we are at my brothers house....how to handle?" in the Family Relationships forum and be grateful you dont have to deal with any crazy in your life. Oh wait, you are the crazy.

This has really gotten nasty for no reason. Op has tried to explain she doesn't need more activities and you are getting very angry over someone expressing sadness. Consider pondering this.

No one here is as angry as the OP over....well, nothing. If she came on complaining about adult children who couldn’t adult, or had children who they were ill-equipped for, then I will admit we would be sympathetic. But OP has had a full life and her children are living their own full lives...what is the problem?

[Anonymous]

I can understand , op. My kids are not grown yet but I can already see for various reasons that grandchildren are unlikely. My kids have no cousins either. I think it is possible to feel as you do, though, even WHILE having grandchildren: that they alone wouldn’t give you what you seek. I have several friends who are older who don’t get to see their grandchildren often and are occasional visitors rather than integral parts of the day to day. That seems more common than not. So I would think not about the grandchildren but about what you really need: to be needed, to be indispensable, to be loved, to snuggle, to be in control, to counsel? What piece is missing from your life now?

[Anonymous]

I think this is why people should think of kids as just a part of their lives for 18 years. You might not have kids or grandkids after that. They could live overseas or not have grandchildren. You get a blissful 18 years and then hopefully they’ve sprung into wonderful people who will find their place in life. This is partly why we’re so adamant on Christmas and holidays at home. I want these memories to remember when my kids are gone versus sitting at MILs table and not having any control.

[Anonymous]

I am a 38 year old mother of 4 under 8. My 73 year old mother rarely visits and complains that the kids are too much when she does. My mil prefers to take over my kitchen and ignore the kids.

I didn’t have any of the life you experienced and I do not have it now. My children do not have it.

I don’t have advice, but only to say you have been very very lucky in life. I’m not sure how you could make it better. Maybe look outside yourself and focus on giving back because of all your blessings?

Thank you and God bless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Yes, I had it all, and did it all.

I think this is the problem. You have had no prior experiences with disappointment or having to change things up in the past. As a result, you never built up the skill set, life experience and or had the life resets that many of us have. My life plans changed considerably after my children were born and we discovered that they had special needs. As a result, my expectations of the future changed - mainly that you can’t really plan life. Life happens and you deal with what you have to deal.

I do think that seeing a therapist might help you learn how to mourn the life that will not be, learn to appreciate the fantastic family life that you experienced (that many never get to do) and to learn how to become more resilient when life hands you something different than expected.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, you are extremely defensive. I'm not one to push for therapy but I think it would help you because you seem to have some very deep-seated anger. Here is the key comment you made which makes me think you need professional help:


"3. Additionally, I've been more than vocal about my own mother's lack of choices in the 1950s, which, in my opinion, would have resulted in her never having kids."

Your statement about your mother might never have had kids, and your current feelings about being a mother and your own child are obviously intertwined.

You cannot feel better unless you deal with the fundamental issue. So do that first.

Meant to add that if you've been vocal about your mother's lack of choices to your own child, then it is entirely possible they may have interpreted this as YOUR feeling, too. Kids pick up on things like that and process it with a child's mindset. "Gee, my mom says her mother didn't really want kids. I wonder if my mom wanted me? Maybe not. Maybe I better not have kids either."

Omg..this was the funniest one here... but it has competition with all the usual suspects. Some of these are DCUM typical, especially the one that has issues with her own mother and transfers it.










.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

This has really gotten nasty for no reason. Op has tried to explain she doesn't need more activities and you are getting very angry over someone expressing sadness. Consider pondering this.

+1. Kindness SHOULD be the response when someone expresses pain or sorrow

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think this is why people should think of kids as just a part of their lives for 18 years. You might not have kids or grandkids after that. They could live overseas or not have grandchildren. You get a blissful 18 years and then hopefully they’ve sprung into wonderful people who will find their place in life. This is partly why we’re so adamant on Christmas and holidays at home. I want these memories to remember when my kids are gone versus sitting at MILs table and not having any control.

blissful?