Need advice from moms who work long hours at very demanding jobs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parenting happens by putting in the hours. Yes you can outsource drives but it’s during the drives that you have the deep talks with your kids or you eavesdrop on them with their friends to get a sense of who your kid is and what emotional needs they might have. Yes you can outsource the cooking but kids will not be nostalgic for your meals after they move away. You can’t have three kids and work those long hours unless you actually don’t value them as your offspring, in which case yes you can go ahead and outsource the whole enterprise.

I scaled back my work considerably when I realized how much time parenting takes (and that DH wasn’t going to be much help). It wasn’t planned and of course I’ve been miserable about it. My kids are now headed to college and I’ve ramped up my career a lot but my career is nowhere near what it would have been without kids. I wish I could have had a 120% career but I wouldn’t have been able to handle the guilt over shortchanging my kids.

Or you can live walking distance to activities, or in a city, and obviate the need for mom to sacrifice her career so she can be a driver. There is nothing magical about driving nor is it an essential part of parenting.

I also have late HS abd college kids and realize that some of the job sacrifices I made to spend more time with them were probably not a good idea. They would benefit a lot now (and in the future) from us having more money, and I would benefit from having a higher powered and more interesting career. I understand why I did it — guilt like the guilt doled out on this thread is partly why — but it’s not clear cut to me.

It is pretty normal to want to spend time with the kids you chose to have. That desire , when unfulfilled, may cause feelings of guilt. No one said driving kids around is magical. Its just more time you spend with them, which may create opportunities for conversation and closeness. No guarantees, just opportunities. Some people on this thread are simply suggesting the OP find a way to create more of those opportunities. She will have to make adjustments for that to happen.

[Anonymous]

Be very wary of relying on a nanny this much. I know at least one family who organized their lives around relying on a nanny, then the nanny quit with very little notice. Finding a replacement when you have 3 kids & zero free time is very difficult, if even possible, in a timely manner.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much do you make and how much does your husband make?

250k each

That's not a "big job" unless you are running a charity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You are missing precious moments that are literally gone forever.

Hire a meal service. Make sure you eat as a family every night. Put your kids to bed yourself every night.

Have the nanny make sure homework is done and good. You may need to hire a more expensive nanny who will handle things like school supplies.

Set aside 2 hours a week to organize your kids activities and schedules.

Don’t miss games, concerts, recitals, etc for anything or anyone.

You control your job. It does not control you. If they don’t cut you slack to be able to do these things, look for a new job.

OP barely makes many more income than the expensive nanny would, after overhead.
She needs Trump's $120K/yr nanny tax deduction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How much do you make and how much does your husband make?

250k each

I was thinking at least 500k or above. OP, this is not enough be stressed all the time and miss out on time with your children. It's more for your ego and self-identity. Which is ok. Some women need that validation from outside the home/children. It's better to acknowledge it and work on not feeling guilty about not being present with children, than mommy track to be with the kids. In my experience, these type of women who have done the latter out of guilty end up miserable and not being a great mother anyways. Children can sense your resentment that you have given up something important for them.

[Anonymous]

Someday you will retire and your children will be grown and gone. They may, or may not, come to see you once or twice a year. You will be hurt because you worked all those hours so you could give them every material thing money could buy--clothes, car, education . Other than education all of those material things are long gone. Their memories of you are nothing. Their nanny was the one who took care of skinned knees and broken hearts. They will have the nannies ethics and morals so be very sure you hire the right person.

I know where of I speak because I was that child. My mother died when I was four and a nanny/housekeeper was the person I loved. My father died when I was 27 and I have yet to shed a tear for him but when the Nanny died, my heart was broken and 35 years later I still miss her. All choices have consequences and you cannot make up time with children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a liberal but honestly there's such a thing as family values. It's a choice of work/career focus v being a mom. As kids get older you drive them a lot. Like my second job is driving activities even with carpools. It's no joke. Kids are a full time job unless you luck out and have perfect kids which I have friends who do. But even then one parent has the flex to drive/be on call as needed. Careers take a lot of work. Flex in a job is awesome but on some level your time and focus is going to be on that career if it's a high visibility job which most are if you're that career oriented.

One parent has to be avail but more than that you have to choose if you want the pressure of balancing kids and career. If you need the money that's one thing but make no mistake that C Sandberg Lean In BS is a huge lie. You really cannot have it all work at the same time.

I mean when you frame it that way, outsourcing like OP actually makes sense.

A lot of talk can happen during a drive. Also seeing and meeting your child's peers are part if that experience.
If outsourced, it is merely an Uber experience. If done by a parent, it can be a window into the child's world.

A high demand job for both parents does not allow much time for parenting.
You choose to either outsource the parenting or cut back on the career until the kids are flown.
We don't double up on developing a career while doing our 4 years of college. We understand that some choices require commitment to that phase of life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is no easy answer to this OP. Like you I am very ambitious and love my job, chose to prioritize staying in an important role over mommy tracking. The truth is my relationship with my kids (2) suffered, and I’m starting to see the long term impact of that more and more. Yes, I am jealous of friends who mommy tracked and remained more involved and emotionally engaged in their kids lives, at least those I know who did this enjoy closer relationships with their kids even after they went to college. But I also have to be honest with myself, I would have been miserable to mommy track and feel like I could not fulfill my potential in my work.

OP, this is your future.

I didn't want that, so I mommy tracked myself. I think I could've been a Sr Director at a FAANG by now had I not had kids. But, I did have kids, and I wanted to be there for them. FWIW, I'm not cut out to be a sahm; I don't like cooking, or doing art, or any little kid stuff. But, I was present.

I, too, went through a period of barely being there for my kids, and having the nanny basically raise them. I worked too much, even if I got home earlyish to have dinner with the kids, I barely spent any time with them because I went back on my laptop and would have meetings with teams in APAC at 8pm.

I hated my life. I was always so stressed out - either at work or self imposed feeling like I wasn't a good mom. My one kid had a weird school schedule, and one day, I got my kid late to school because I was not on top of their schedule, and they missed out on something fun. I felt horrible.

My kids are now teens. I went back to work, but as a IC. I effectively killed my career. Still, I don't think I regret it that much. I love my kids, and it's wonderful to see them thriving in HS and college.

[Anonymous]

I would never work like that, especially not with kids. My career means a lot to me, and I’m good at what I do, but regularly working over 45 hours a week is a complete dealbreaker for me. You can make a meaningful professional contribution without working those kinds of hours.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know families like this. The kids love their nannies and sometimes call them "mom".

This was my neighbor. The dad didn't even work; mom was a physician, but they hired a FT nanny who basically raised the kids because the sahd was off golfing or something all day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, you’re in good company. Many of us work very long hours. Be grateful if you have the resources for household help. Many of us work these hours at lower salaries, so nannies and housekeepers aren’t an option.

If it helps, I manage it by compartmentalizing my hours. I work from 4am-6am or 9pm-midnight, times my children aren’t awake. It isn’t ideal, but I’m able to be the parent I want to be in the evenings and I can get my work done.

you are getting like 4 to 6 hours of sleep. Are you taking uppers to function?

[Anonymous]

You could outsource everything you can, and spend as much time with them as you can, and try it for a year or two, and then see how it is going.

I will say that it is better to do it when the kids are littler. When there are hitting older elementary and middle school, they need you -- not someone else.

I was feeling stuck in a job, and the kids were doing well, so I went to an intense job, when the older one was 9 and the younger 4. Then COVID hit, and we both were intense at home working, when the kids had barely any virtual school. The consequences started showing up about 3 years later, and honestly, I wish I had made different decisions.

I am still doing that job, but less intensely for the past couple of years. We'll see how that goes: my evaluations and performance have gone down, but we have been repairing some of the not insignificant damage (mostly to the older kid) and family. I do like the job, and if I had no kids, I probably would have been promoted again. But you really can't have it all. If my spouse were a very nurturing father and in a less intense job, it might have been OK. But although he is trying, he never will be as much as would be needed. I have learned that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I know families like this. The kids love their nannies and sometimes call them "mom".

This was my neighbor. The dad didn't even work; mom was a physician, but they hired a FT nanny who basically raised the kids because the sahd was off golfing or something all day.

I knew a family that intentionally rotated nannies often so the kids wouldn’t get too attached after they started calling the first one “mom.”

[Anonymous]

There are only so many hours a day. If there’s any way to go part time for you and your spouse, I would push for that. My DH and I are both physicians and each work 3 days a week. On each day, there is always a parent whose only duty is to be a parent and manage house stuff. We still outsourced cleaning/laundry/cooking because I’d rather hang out with my kids. Now my kids are older and I can workout regularly and do other self care and errands without any stress.

[Anonymous]

I too had to back down so I could be the mom I wanted to be. I'm a teacher with 2 masters degrees. I had 12years experience, was head of my dept, had all the extra qualifications (national cert, etc). I dropped the head of dept position, then went to .6 teaching. It was a lot of money to lose but I felt like i was wasn't even raising my own children. When they are off to college or other choice I will go back to full-time.