How to handle a kid who does not want a Bar Mitzvah

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Perhaps. It is also the reason the Jewish people still exists. We are the people who remember. It is our most basic operating principle since Yavne.

Your ideas about guilt are rooted in Protestant individualism. We think in a fundamentally different way.

A pp brought up A Letter in the Scroll. Here's a famous quote from it: “I am a Jew because, knowing the story of my people, I hear their call to write the next chapter. I did not come from nowhere; I have a past, and if any past commands anyone this past commands me. I am a Jew because only if I remain a Jew will the story of a hundred generations live on in me. I continue their journey because, having come this far, I may not let it and them fail. I cannot be the missing letter in the scroll.”

Thank you so much for posting this beautiful quote. As a retired Catholic educator, I always noted my admiration for Jewish families who worked so hard to carry on their traditions -- something I wish more Catholic families would do. Your remark about Jews thinking in a "fundamentally different way" is so true and is to be deeply respected.

[Anonymous]

What does he mean when he says he doesn't consider himself Jewish?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

I'm not forcing anything. My husband is Jewish and I am deeply familiar with Judaism.

Confirmation is not all about faith - it's also about becoming an adult member of a religious community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

I'm not forcing anything. My husband is Jewish and I am deeply familiar with Judaism.

Confirmation is not all about faith - it's also about becoming an adult member of a religious community.

When I was confirmed, it was about picking your own sponsor, choosing your own "confirmation name", learning songs in Latin, getting slapped by the Bishop and having a party.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Perhaps. It is also the reason the Jewish people still exists. We are the people who remember. It is our most basic operating principle since Yavne.

Your ideas about guilt are rooted in Protestant individualism. We think in a fundamentally different way.

A pp brought up A Letter in the Scroll. Here's a famous quote from it: “I am a Jew because, knowing the story of my people, I hear their call to write the next chapter. I did not come from nowhere; I have a past, and if any past commands anyone this past commands me. I am a Jew because only if I remain a Jew will the story of a hundred generations live on in me. I continue their journey because, having come this far, I may not let it and them fail. I cannot be the missing letter in the scroll.”

Jewish version of Catholic guilt. Maintaining the chain of thousands of years is a lot to put on a 13 year old who has told you he isn't ready. Why is everyone so locked down on this happening at this specific time? I know that's what the teachings are but that doesn't make it true for this kid. It seems like who he is as an individual and nurturing his growth as a human is second to the religion which isn't a good thing, regardless of the faith.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What does he mean when he says he doesn't consider himself Jewish?

+1. Many here are arguing that being Jewish isn’t so much about faith as it is about a chain of history and remembrance.

[Anonymous]

We had an identical experience. I did not force my son to have one. As a kid I was forced to go through all the Catholic sacraments, because my Jewish mother and Catholic father decided without my input that I should be Catholic. I hated and resented having a religion I didn't choose forced on me - even moreso because at one point I had to do Confirmation, around bar mitzvah age, and everyone kept emphasizing how it marked my choice to be Catholic. Except I was forced and it didn't. It left me with a bad taste about forced religious rituals, so when my son didn't want a bar mitzvah I didn't force him.

I don't think forcing a kid to have one will make Jewish - it might even do the opposite. And you don't have to have one in order to be Jewish. So that's why I didn't force it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

This. As an aside, I have often wondered how so many women on DCUM with nominally Jewish husbands can seriously consider themselves authorities on the traditional Jewish worldview. If they're depending on those husbands, they're not getting an authentic picture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

This. As an aside, I have often wondered how so many women on DCUM with nominally Jewish husbands can seriously consider themselves authorities on the traditional Jewish worldview. If they're depending on those husbands, they're not getting an authentic picture.

DP but I was raised in a Jewish and Catholic family and had a Confirmation while others had Bar mitzvahs. I think I have pretty good insight into both religions, having been both, and I agree that Confirmation is in many ways like a Bar mitzvah - at least in the sense of the ritual marking the acceptance adult religious obligations. I actually think the person who claimed Confirmation is about faith and a Bar Mitzvah is about becoming a Jewish adult, doesn't actually understand how one or both of those things function in people's lives, and how kids actually come to them.

[Anonymous]

I remember being told - So what? Lots of kids hate Hebrew school. Lots of kids don't want to have a Bar/Bat Mitzvah. But that's what Jews do. Someday you'll have kids of your own and you'll understand. But I guess I never understood because I just couldn't do that to my own kid.

[Anonymous]

And to give all the anecdotes - I have a Jewish mom and a Christian dad and was raised UU because they thought religion was important even though they were both raised in different religions.

My friends had bar/bat mitzvahs and confirmations and I was jealous that I had no one celebrating me

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

But the chain won't die if this op's kid isn't doing a ceremony.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

I'm not forcing anything. My husband is Jewish and I am deeply familiar with Judaism.

Confirmation is not all about faith - it's also about becoming an adult member of a religious community.

When I was confirmed, it was about picking your own sponsor, choosing your own "confirmation name", learning songs in Latin, getting slapped by the Bishop and having a party.

PP here and the confirmation in question is not Roman Catholic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's sad to me that kids are forced to "do" religion even when they don't want to. Why can't they choose? It's not a matter of health and safety, or developing their brains. I don't let my kids skip brushing their teeth or go out of school, but if they wanted to stop going to religious services or not participate in ceremonies, I would let them.

They're "doing" ancestral and community connection to maintain a chain thousands of years old. It isn't "religion" in the Protestant sense.

This.

You all standing by this and insisting on it is the reason generational trauma and guilt exists.

Read up on the benefits of religion - there are plenty.

I agree about the benefits of religion, but a person who doesn't want to do the work to become a bar mitzvah, i.e. an adult in the eyes of the Jewish community, should not be forced to do it. Part of the point is that the boy is "of age" to make this decision.

My son was a confirmation class dropout because he didn't want to be an adult in the eyes of a church he had no intention of participating in. At the time, he told us he was an atheist and the process had no meaning for him. We believed him and let him drop out. Fast-forward a decade, his views are the same.

Confirmation and a bar mitzvah are in no way the same thing. Confirmation is about faith. Bar mitzvah is becoming a Jewish adult. You can be an atheist member of the Jewish community, even some rabbis are. You’re forcing your Christian perspective on a Jewish issue.

This. As an aside, I have often wondered how so many women on DCUM with nominally Jewish husbands can seriously consider themselves authorities on the traditional Jewish worldview. If they're depending on those husbands, they're not getting an authentic picture.

PP here and I do not consider myself an authority. I do however know much more than my "nominally Jewish" husband does about Judaism as I gave serious consideration to converting before I ever met him, and in fact studied for that purpose. He relies on me for information about Judaism, not vice versa.