If you "tiger mom'd" your kids, how did they turn out in college (and beyond)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be fair, kids of my circle's tiger moms seem to be doing well.

I don't doubt it. And when they get married, many of them will choose to spend holidays with their spouse's families who are interested in them as human beings and not just what they can achieve.

Yup! You may think they are happy and don't mind how you raised them. But in reality, many did not enjoy it and appreciate being appreciated for whom they are. There is so much more to a person than their GPA and academic achievements. We care more about what they do with their lives. Are they good, kind, generous people? Do other people want to spend time with them?

Plenty of "normal" parents have kids who won't speak to them or spend holidays with them. Nor does having a good GPA preclude one from doing something with their lives or being a good, kind, generous person that other people want to spend time with. You're thinking in black and white.

Obviously it's not just "black and white". But very few kids just up and not speak to their parents for no real reason. There is always a reason---typically something to do with how parents have treated them up til that point.

It is not okay to push push push your kids without allowing them to develop into overall good humans. There are also plenty of good kids with high GPAs who are genuinely good people---the vast majority of them got there because of self motivation and guidance from parents, NOT pushing pushing pushing from a tiger parent.

I'd prefer my kids learn how to motivate themselves and volunteer because it's a fun and good thing to do, not just because "it's needed for college".
No, we didn't just tell our kids "Cs are okay, just make it thru HS and that's all we expect". Our kids know we expected them to give 110% and work their hardest. But we never sent them to tutoring unless they were actually struggling (and getting a 94% in a class is NOT struggling). We never pushed them to do kumon from age 3+ in hopes they would be advanced in math. Instead we read to them, played with them and encouraged games and activities that built math and critical thinking skills. One kid loved to do math problems, so we gave them that. The other had ADHD and EF issues, and certainly wasn't sitting down to do stupid math problems at age 4.

Know what---the first kid is a math wiz since K. Engineering major in college starting in Calc 3.

other kid ended up a business major, did well in college calc (despite struggling in HS), graduated and landed a great job.

For both kids, the motivation to excel came from them and thru their own hardwork.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My SIL's sons, two of them, were best friends with a kid who lived across the street. SIL was absolutely vicious about calling the kid's mother a "tiger mom." (And yes, there was an element of racism, SIL is white and the kid's parents are from China.) The kid's parents pushed him very hard academically.

He is now a doctor, finishing up residency. SIL's sons are living in her house, unemployed, playing online video games all night and stealing from her debit card every chance they get. These kids are all mid-30s now.

Shouldn't a doctor be done with residency before their mid-30s? Even a neurosurgeon should be finished around the age of 33.

You win the prize for the most dumbass poster of the day.

Being done with residency in your mid 30s raises zero red flags.

High school = 18
plus 4 years college = 22
plus 4 years med school = 26
plus 3-7 years residency = 29-33

What is happening during those extra years if someone is mid-30s and still finishing residency? Especially if they're not pursuing neurosurgery or another of the rare specialities that takes 7 years after med school.

The new norm is 1-2 gap years after college to make a competitive application as all of that has gone bananas too.

Not to mention that this is the poster's SIL's neighbor's son. Who knows how old he actually is? He could be 31 and called mid 30s. It's a message board, not testimony under oath.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My SIL's sons, two of them, were best friends with a kid who lived across the street. SIL was absolutely vicious about calling the kid's mother a "tiger mom." (And yes, there was an element of racism, SIL is white and the kid's parents are from China.) The kid's parents pushed him very hard academically.

He is now a doctor, finishing up residency. SIL's sons are living in her house, unemployed, playing online video games all night and stealing from her debit card every chance they get. These kids are all mid-30s now.

Shouldn't a doctor be done with residency before their mid-30s? Even a neurosurgeon should be finished around the age of 33.

You win the prize for the most dumbass poster of the day.

Being done with residency in your mid 30s raises zero red flags.

High school = 18
plus 4 years college = 22
plus 4 years med school = 26
plus 3-7 years residency = 29-33

What is happening during those extra years if someone is mid-30s and still finishing residency? Especially if they're not pursuing neurosurgery or another of the rare specialities that takes 7 years after med school.

2/3 of med students take off one or more years before med school, for the past 10 yrs or more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be fair, kids of my circle's tiger moms seem to be doing well.

I don't doubt it. And when they get married, many of them will choose to spend holidays with their spouse's families who are interested in them as human beings and not just what they can achieve.

Yup! You may think they are happy and don't mind how you raised them. But in reality, many did not enjoy it and appreciate being appreciated for whom they are. There is so much more to a person than their GPA and academic achievements. We care more about what they do with their lives. Are they good, kind, generous people? Do other people want to spend time with them?

Plenty of "normal" parents have kids who won't speak to them or spend holidays with them. Nor does having a good GPA preclude one from doing something with their lives or being a good, kind, generous person that other people want to spend time with. You're thinking in black and white.

Obviously it's not just "black and white". But very few kids just up and not speak to their parents for no real reason. There is always a reason---typically something to do with how parents have treated them up til that point.

It is not okay to push push push your kids without allowing them to develop into overall good humans. There are also plenty of good kids with high GPAs who are genuinely good people---the vast majority of them got there because of self motivation and guidance from parents, NOT pushing pushing pushing from a tiger parent.

I'd prefer my kids learn how to motivate themselves and volunteer because it's a fun and good thing to do, not just because "it's needed for college".
No, we didn't just tell our kids "Cs are okay, just make it thru HS and that's all we expect". Our kids know we expected them to give 110% and work their hardest. But we never sent them to tutoring unless they were actually struggling (and getting a 94% in a class is NOT struggling). We never pushed them to do kumon from age 3+ in hopes they would be advanced in math. Instead we read to them, played with them and encouraged games and activities that built math and critical thinking skills. One kid loved to do math problems, so we gave them that. The other had ADHD and EF issues, and certainly wasn't sitting down to do stupid math problems at age 4.

Know what---the first kid is a math wiz since K. Engineering major in college starting in Calc 3.

other kid ended up a business major, did well in college calc (despite struggling in HS), graduated and landed a great job.

For both kids, the motivation to excel came from them and thru their own hardwork.

So you don't accept certain grades and you did a lot of STEM enrichment? Sounds like you're a species of tiger mom to me. Or is that only Asians?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be fair, kids of my circle's tiger moms seem to be doing well.

I don't doubt it. And when they get married, many of them will choose to spend holidays with their spouse's families who are interested in them as human beings and not just what they can achieve.

Yup! You may think they are happy and don't mind how you raised them. But in reality, many did not enjoy it and appreciate being appreciated for whom they are. There is so much more to a person than their GPA and academic achievements. We care more about what they do with their lives. Are they good, kind, generous people? Do other people want to spend time with them?

Plenty of "normal" parents have kids who won't speak to them or spend holidays with them. Nor does having a good GPA preclude one from doing something with their lives or being a good, kind, generous person that other people want to spend time with. You're thinking in black and white.

Obviously it's not just "black and white". But very few kids just up and not speak to their parents for no real reason. There is always a reason---typically something to do with how parents have treated them up til that point.

It is not okay to push push push your kids without allowing them to develop into overall good humans. There are also plenty of good kids with high GPAs who are genuinely good people---the vast majority of them got there because of self motivation and guidance from parents, NOT pushing pushing pushing from a tiger parent.

I'd prefer my kids learn how to motivate themselves and volunteer because it's a fun and good thing to do, not just because "it's needed for college".
No, we didn't just tell our kids "Cs are okay, just make it thru HS and that's all we expect". Our kids know we expected them to give 110% and work their hardest. But we never sent them to tutoring unless they were actually struggling (and getting a 94% in a class is NOT struggling). We never pushed them to do kumon from age 3+ in hopes they would be advanced in math. Instead we read to them, played with them and encouraged games and activities that built math and critical thinking skills. One kid loved to do math problems, so we gave them that. The other had ADHD and EF issues, and certainly wasn't sitting down to do stupid math problems at age 4.

Know what---the first kid is a math wiz since K. Engineering major in college starting in Calc 3.

other kid ended up a business major, did well in college calc (despite struggling in HS), graduated and landed a great job.

For both kids, the motivation to excel came from them and thru their own hardwork.

So you don't accept certain grades and you did a lot of STEM enrichment? Sounds like you're a species of tiger mom to me. Or is that only Asians?

I'm not PP, but for many kids you can't stop them from doing STEM stuff. My 4 yo's favorite activity was to build things with jump ropes, a wagon and a couple of old clothes line pulleys. It's just what some kids do. So of course we get her STEM toys for holidays, because those are her favorites and what she requests, and we send her to STEM camps because that's what she requests. A tiger parent pushes. I'm just a parent who follows my kid's lead.

[Anonymous]

I think there are a lot of self driven kids out there and people lump them into one group of children if yiger moms. I think there’s a huge difference in helping kids who love learning and pushing kids to learn that may not. Not every kid with good grades is going to be pushed to get them. Some kids are perfectionists on their own doing. I also wouldn’t file a parent that wants their kid to maintain As and Bs as a Tiger parent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My SIL's sons, two of them, were best friends with a kid who lived across the street. SIL was absolutely vicious about calling the kid's mother a "tiger mom." (And yes, there was an element of racism, SIL is white and the kid's parents are from China.) The kid's parents pushed him very hard academically.

He is now a doctor, finishing up residency. SIL's sons are living in her house, unemployed, playing online video games all night and stealing from her debit card every chance they get. These kids are all mid-30s now.

Shouldn't a doctor be done with residency before their mid-30s? Even a neurosurgeon should be finished around the age of 33.

You win the prize for the most dumbass poster of the day.

Being done with residency in your mid 30s raises zero red flags.

High school = 18
plus 4 years college = 22
plus 4 years med school = 26
plus 3-7 years residency = 29-33

What is happening during those extra years if someone is mid-30s and still finishing residency? Especially if they're not pursuing neurosurgery or another of the rare specialities that takes 7 years after med school.

Doubling down on something so idiotic! People can take time off from school, genius.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
People have oddly accusatory ideas about what a Tiger Parent really entails. When intellectual, academically-inclined adults have kids with the same traits, then obviously that household might look to others as "Tiger Parentish", because they will place a high value on doing well in academic settings. If they have kids with varying traits, they need to be mindful of developing their children's talents, whatever they are, instead of insisting on the path they themselves excelled in.

The same goes for parents who used to be star athletes, or any other achievement parents dream of continuing in their offspring.

We're Tiger Parents, I suppose, in that we require straight As and classical music But we also want a best fit college and are not myopically focused on Ivies. We think learning is important for its own sake. Our version is to listen to and nurture our kids while having high academic expectations and foster love of learning. Seems to be going well so far for all our kids, in that they are all curious, intellectual people.

Our oldest has special needs and is doing well in college so far. We were careful to adjust our expectations to his particular needs. He is the most intellectual of our children, actually.

How do you require straight As? It’s not like requiring the bed be made every day. If your oldest has special needs it’s doubtful they had all As only because the special needs get in the way. I know all about having a special needs student with testing in the 99th percentile but in a classroom it’s a different story. Kids can do their very best and it isn’t enough for an A. That needs to be accepted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I went to HYP and still won't forgive my tiger parents. They robbed me of happiness in my formative years that wasn't fully regained until my 40s.

That’s what I would worry about. If a child’s life is so regimented that they can’t have a lot of childhood experiences it’s not worth it. It’s a different thing if the child is self motivated and chooses to go to school, then math school, then violin lesson, then four hours of homework then that’s different. A child forced into this is not a happy child. And happiness is essential for health.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think there are a lot of self driven kids out there and people lump them into one group of children if yiger moms. I think there’s a huge difference in helping kids who love learning and pushing kids to learn that may not. Not every kid with good grades is going to be pushed to get them. Some kids are perfectionists on their own doing. I also wouldn’t file a parent that wants their kid to maintain As and Bs as a Tiger parent.

The Tiger Parents are demanding all As. The kid’s peers know when someone has a tiger mom. They don’t smile as much, not as happy and can never hang out after school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My parents were tiger parents. They pushed me to focus on my studies in high school and get into the best college that I can. I got a full ride to flagship T10 and studied business and engineering. The discipline and work ethics helped me succeed in college and in my career. I have no regrets and am grateful they pushed me.

My oldest thanks me frequently that I helped him by holding him to high standards.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
People have oddly accusatory ideas about what a Tiger Parent really entails. When intellectual, academically-inclined adults have kids with the same traits, then obviously that household might look to others as "Tiger Parentish", because they will place a high value on doing well in academic settings. If they have kids with varying traits, they need to be mindful of developing their children's talents, whatever they are, instead of insisting on the path they themselves excelled in.

The same goes for parents who used to be star athletes, or any other achievement parents dream of continuing in their offspring.

We're Tiger Parents, I suppose, in that we require straight As and classical music But we also want a best fit college and are not myopically focused on Ivies. We think learning is important for its own sake. Our version is to listen to and nurture our kids while having high academic expectations and foster love of learning. Seems to be going well so far for all our kids, in that they are all curious, intellectual people.

Our oldest has special needs and is doing well in college so far. We were careful to adjust our expectations to his particular needs. He is the most intellectual of our children, actually.

How do you require straight As? It’s not like requiring the bed be made every day. If your oldest has special needs it’s doubtful they had all As only because the special needs get in the way. I know all about having a special needs student with testing in the 99th percentile but in a classroom it’s a different story. Kids can do their very best and it isn’t enough for an A. That needs to be accepted.

DP. It really depends on the school and the kid. Just for a dose of reality, at our reasonably ranked middle school, A's fell from trees. With a minimum of effort, my DC got high A's in every class. There was been tremendous grade inflation, with pressure from the school district to pass as many kids as possible so this affected all schools uniformly from high SES to low SES schools. They get to turn things in late, redo assignments, etc. In such a scenario, I never even had to set the expectation for my academically motivated, 99th %ile on MAPs kid to get straight A's. It probably would have taken DC some effort NOT to get straight As. I would imagine if I were the parent of a bright, but slacker kid who went to the same school, it would be quite reasonable for me to expect straight As.

When my kid entered a far more demanding HS there was a sharp contrast, and I noticed that right away some of their very best efforts were not always getting A's. It was quite a shock. I was quite happy just to know she was trying hard, organized, turning things in on time, etc. Again, I don't have to set expectations since my DC wants to do well. But if I had a bright but slacker kid, I would probably set expectations at the second school to a B.

[Anonymous]

Again, tiger parenting isn't just about expectations, it's also the control freak micromanaging of kids to make sure that they meet the expectations. Those who don't do the latter aren't really tiger parents, they're just plain old demanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't think it's a black-and-white thing where you are either a tiger parent or not a tiger parent. There are many traits that vary on a continuous spectrum; for example being strict to being lax, having high expectations to having no expectations, giving too much attention vs. neglect, etc.. It's terrible if you go overboard, but it's also terrible if you do nothing to nurture your kid or set expectations. Most people don't know that Amy Chua realized that she went overboard in her tiger parenting with her second kid, and that she acknowledges making mistakes, because so few people actually read the book.

+1000

[Anonymous]

I think everyone in this thread is a tiger parent.