Drinking Scapegoat

[Anonymous]

We did a family intervention with DH about five months ago, after which he promised he would not drink. He denied he had a problem but said he would stop and would get help. He has been seeing a therapist off and on as well, which was also part of the agreement.

For the first few months, he would argue and ask when he could drink again, and I would say not yet. He said his therapist (whom he will not allow me to speak to) says he doesn't have a drinking problem because it was way too easy for him to quit. Then I said he had to take control of his recovery and I would focus on me (as part of the agreement I had to agree I would not drink, either, even though I do not have a drinking problem). Then he would ask me if I thought it was a good idea if he drank, and I said no but he had to make his own decisions and then he would get mad that I said it was a bad idea.

All was quiet until last week, when we went on vacation. He asked whether our ban was in effect for vacation. I said I thought it was, but I was not going to make hard and fast rules for him and he could do what he wanted. Every time we went out, he waited for me to order, then when I ordered a drink without alcohol, he did as well. Finally, we went out to dinner just the two of us, no kids. (The resort had a kids' club.)

He asked about getting a glass of wine. I said I didn't want to break my vow over a cheap glass of wine. Yet he, and the waiter, kept pressuring me. Finally I said fine, one glass. The waiter brought a bottle.

He told the waiter I was the one who should test it, not him. After I took my initial sip, he took one and then waited to see if I would drink more. I said the wine wasn't very good. I ultimately did finish the glass but stopped the waiter cold when he tried to pour more. DH did not. He drank another glass. At the end of the meal, the waiter asked if he wanted more, and my DH said maybe just one more splash. The waiter laughed and poured a lot.

After he left the table I said I found the waiter's constant pushing of the alcohol really obnoxious. DH said he agreed but that he had gotten the wine in case I wanted some with my dessert! He then drank half of the big glass the waiter poured as the "splash".

He was snippy and short the next morning, which is common for him after he has been drinking the night before. I told him the following day that I thought the alcohol was a mistake and that I did not want it and it made me sleepy and him snippy. He just yelled at me and said I didn't have to have it.

How do I get out of the middle of this? I am tired of being pressured and used as an excuse but then I get yelled at for not playing along. Honestly, his actions did little to convince me there is no drinking problem. It just makes me wonder what he has been telling the therapist!

[Anonymous]

He stopped drinking--easily--and has been sober for five months, at your request. He asks you permission to drink, and when you say that he can't, he doesn't. You go on vacation, go out to dinner just the two of you, and he has three glasses of wine. One time. On vacation. This is a huge problem for you, and you seem to think that you're the victim here. Is that correct?

[Anonymous]

Did he agree to "never" drink again? When can he drink again in your opinion if not?

[Anonymous]

OP - have you been to Alanon? Is there more you aren't telling us about your husband hitting bottom before the intervention?
You know what makes me snippy? Head games and being manipulated and controlled and treated like a child.

I've never lived with an alcoholic, but my impression is that a true alcoholic would not have been able to refrain from finishing that last "splash" glass, might have asked to take the extra in the bottle to go, might have gone out for more drinks after you fell asleep, or other behaviors that indicate a lack of control.

Maybe you are the issue and your husband sometimes needs a drink to work up to telling you what he thinks and you don't like to hear negative things so you make him think he has a drinking / anger problem when really you have a control problem.

I think you need couples counselling. Why is he sometimes seeing a counselor anyway? Why not AA with a sponsor?

[Anonymous]

No, I have not been to Al-Anon because I have my own therapist who is experienced with alcohol and addiction issues who has been trying to guide me post-intervention. He is sometimes seeing a therapist because he refuses to go to AA, refuses to admit he has an alcohol problem, lies about how much he drinks (including to his parents in our meeeting, but they knew he was lying because they have seen him drinking), and has been known to go through an entire fifth of Scotch plus several beers and glasses of wine in one weekend (pre-intervention).

My question was: Why can't he take ownership of what he wants to do? He didn't order the extra "splash" because he thought I would want it with my dessert. He ordered it because he wanted it. And he didn't order a glass of wine himself. He insisted I order one so he could. He wants me to give him permission to drink. I want him to take ownership of his own recovery (or not) and let the chips fall where they may. But he won't do it. He would rather ask what I think and then yell at me for it.

He also refuses to follow our doctor's advice about his needing some psych drugs for his anger, because he knows more than the doctor of course.

[Anonymous]

OP, I think I recognize you from previous threads that you've posted. If you are the same person, the amounts you reported that your husband drank were really small/normal, and it seemed like you had simply decided that he had a "problem" and that he was required to stop in order to make you happy. I think you need to look at yourself and try to figure out why you feel compelled to be so incredibly controlling...I can't imagine anyone can have a happy marriage with this particular dynamic going on.

[Anonymous]

You have me mixed up with someone else. No one who knows how much my husband drank before the intervention thought it was small or normal, and I am talking about addiction specialists, AA people, medical docs and interventionists.

[Anonymous]

Many of the women here sound like babysitters or mothers of the husband.

YOU can't make your husband do anything. The question is why are you in this marriage ?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You have me mixed up with someone else. No one who knows how much my husband drank before the intervention thought it was small or normal, and I am talking about addiction specialists, AA people, medical docs and interventionists.

My mistake! Carry on...

[Anonymous]

Here's my take. Because he is an alcoholic/has a drinking problem he's going to interpret anything he hears as permission to keep drinking and twist anything he hears as support for his drinking and denial of the fact that he has a problem in the first place. On top of that, you are passive, passive-aggressive, manipulative, and unable to give him a clear and absolute "NO" about his drinking because you don't want any responsibility for it and you want to be a princess. Together, you are a train wreck.

You asked.

[Anonymous]

Sorry OP but you are playing head games. He is trying to appease you but you change the rules. The only one who has put you in the middle is you. If you say no drinking then you can't order a drink. I have no idea why you felt so much pressure from a waiter and your DH that you would order one. Plus it IS really hard for alcoholics to just stop cold turkey. They typically lie, sneak and do whatever they can to get a drink due to the physical addiction. You don't say he was doing any of that. Was he? I don't think your therapist can really help you since you aren't being truthful to your therapist about your DH. You definitely need couples therapy. I am sure he has problems but it sounds like you do too. Work on them together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Here's my take. Because he is an alcoholic/has a drinking problem he's going to interpret anything he hears as permission to keep drinking and twist anything he hears as support for his drinking and denial of the fact that he has a problem in the first place. On top of that, you are passive, passive-aggressive, manipulative, and unable to give him a clear and absolute "NO" about his drinking because you don't want any responsibility for it and you want to be a princess. Together, you are a train wreck.

You asked.

Thank you for your answer. Every time I have asked about dealing with an alcoholic on here, people day they have to own their own recovery and you can't make them stop. So, based on that advice, I don't make rules for him. I am not his mother.

My therapist does know him, so it's not a matter of me hiding the truth. We originally tried couples counseling with the therapist when I was seeing someone else individually. The therapist has seen first-hand what happens if you suggest he needs to change. First, he threatens to kill himself. Then he threatens to sue the therapist. So this is why we don't do couples counseling.

I think you might be right that together we are a train wreck. I have been struggling for a long time what to do, especially for the kids' sake. But if complete strangers can see this is a train wreck, it!s time to admit it and get out and hope he doesn't spiral downward so that the verbal abuse of the kids we saw all the time before the intervention comes back.

[Anonymous]

Yes, OP, people have to want to quit but your husband worked you over till you drank which he used as justification for him drinking. You need to have the spine to not play along. You're blaming him for pressuring you into drinking but you chose to drink. He's clearly a user. You want him not to be but you know he is so don't play along.

I'm sorry but the reality is that he will do whatever he can to justify drinking. Don't let him blame his drinking on you. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

So sorry OP. This does sound terrible. I dont see you as playing head games with your husband based on what you have said here.

What your DH is doing with the wine sounds very manipulative of HIM. I dont like that he is attempting to make you responsible to be his gatekeeper to the wine via your decision to have or have not. I see what you are saying.

Also the part of threatening suicide and then lawsuit. I am so sorry- this sounds like the kind of hyperdarmatic stuff my husband has been known to do. Its mind blowing and makes you feel like you are in the twilight zone.

My daughter sees through his anger rage/blame issues. But I hope he too does not return to his ways.

If you are able to separate, financially/logistically, then I think it sounds like a good idea. It sounds like your DH needs to be accountable to himSELF, which, as long as you are around, he simply may not ever be motivated to do.

Alcoholism is a very frightening addiction, I feel, because it can hide in plain sight. Dreadful.

Good Luck OP.

[Anonymous]

Yes what the PP said about DH doing anything to justify the drinking is SPOT ON. And it will continue, lather, rinse, repeat, until he bottoms out and sees himself that way. So sad and difficult. Sorry again OP.