SCOTUS: oral arguments for Dobbs v. Jackson (MS abortion case)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I sincerely hope that with the push to end Roe that it will also turn on IVF. I mean isn't that what pro-lifers want? Life begins at conception. IVF isn't even really conception right? So no more IVF. Or at the minimum rich white women/couples are forced to carry to term embryos that are deemed not viable for life.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1018662.page

I know it's childish but this works for me, the people making these decisions and the crowd who is (very easily) swaying them all generally start families later in life, it comes with the territory. So let's takeaway their back up plan.

+10000 - you don't get to preach and blabber on about the "sanctity of life" and then throw away embryos.

All of this. Let's also destroy every single existing frozen embryo. IVF should not be an option anymore (and if anyone cares about their IVF babies, and you associate with any individual who associates with anyone who supports anti-abortion, I completely intend the cruelty and callousness of this statement to hurt you as much as possible).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will never forget the case that changed Ireland's views on abortion and it was less than 10 years ago. I just remember it was a woman who was 17 weeks pregnant. Something came up later in the pregnancy and the only way she was going to survive was to have an abortion. Being Ireland, she couldn't get it. She did die week later, and of course the fetus died too. How many times will the US go through things like that to decide "yeah, perhaps an abortion is needed more in the medical sense than we thought".

It’s going to take women being honest about what happened to them. Sadly, that means they’re going to get nothing but judgment and threats. The one woman I know who had an abortion in her second trimester did so because she was going to die of blood loss before her fetus reached viability, but she didn’t talk about her abortion, she just “lost” the baby. I understand why she didn’t want to open herself and her story up to scorn from her Catholic relatives (has there been another religion that has caused as much misery to the world?), but her very, very necessary abortion became a miscarriage in the telling.

This is such a great point. I wonder how many conservative, Christian women lie about “losing” their baby? I bet it’s a lot. But, of course, that isn’t a “real abortion.” When, in fact, they are actually aborting to save their own lives.

When it starts affecting the Millennial-age daughters of white conservatives, that’s when this sh#tshow will explode.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I sincerely hope that with the push to end Roe that it will also turn on IVF. I mean isn't that what pro-lifers want? Life begins at conception. IVF isn't even really conception right? So no more IVF. Or at the minimum rich white women/couples are forced to carry to term embryos that are deemed not viable for life.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1018662.page

I know it's childish but this works for me, the people making these decisions and the crowd who is (very easily) swaying them all generally start families later in life, it comes with the territory. So let's takeaway their back up plan.

+10000 - you don't get to preach and blabber on about the "sanctity of life" and then throw away embryos.

All of this. Let's also destroy every single existing frozen embryo. IVF should not be an option anymore (and if anyone cares about their IVF babies, and you associate with any individual who associates with anyone who supports anti-abortion, I completely intend the cruelty and callousness of this statement to hurt you as much as possible).

Also frozen eggs and sperm should be destroyed as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will never forget the case that changed Ireland's views on abortion and it was less than 10 years ago. I just remember it was a woman who was 17 weeks pregnant. Something came up later in the pregnancy and the only way she was going to survive was to have an abortion. Being Ireland, she couldn't get it. She did die week later, and of course the fetus died too. How many times will the US go through things like that to decide "yeah, perhaps an abortion is needed more in the medical sense than we thought".

It’s going to take women being honest about what happened to them. Sadly, that means they’re going to get nothing but judgment and threats. The one woman I know who had an abortion in her second trimester did so because she was going to die of blood loss before her fetus reached viability, but she didn’t talk about her abortion, she just “lost” the baby. I understand why she didn’t want to open herself and her story up to scorn from her Catholic relatives (has there been another religion that has caused as much misery to the world?), but her very, very necessary abortion became a miscarriage in the telling.

This is such a great point. I wonder how many conservative, Christian women lie about “losing” their baby? I bet it’s a lot. But, of course, that isn’t a “real abortion.” When, in fact, they are actually aborting to save their own lives.

When it starts affecting the Millennial-age daughters of white conservatives, that’s when this sh#tshow will explode.

PP you’re replying to. I bet it’s a lot, too. In her defense, the woman I’m talking about actually is pro-choice and votes accordingly, she just didn’t want to deal with scorn or even just criticism along with mourning the loss of the pregnancy she and her husband wanted very much.

But that’s it, isn’t it? These second and third trimester abortions are wanted pregnancies. They had no urgency to abort earlier because they wanted to have a child, so it is layers of cruelty upon cruelty to force women to carry doomed pregnancies, and all because Republicans hate women in their very marrow.

White women better begin voting pro-choice as their number issue, because at the end of the day, the GOP does not see them as human. I don’t know what it’s going to take for them to understand that their “loving” GOP husbands and “open minded” political party would just as soon crush them under their identity politics of hate against women. You female GOP voters are dirt in your party and you still don’t get it. You think you’ll be protected.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I sincerely hope that with the push to end Roe that it will also turn on IVF. I mean isn't that what pro-lifers want? Life begins at conception. IVF isn't even really conception right? So no more IVF. Or at the minimum rich white women/couples are forced to carry to term embryos that are deemed not viable for life.

https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1018662.page

I know it's childish but this works for me, the people making these decisions and the crowd who is (very easily) swaying them all generally start families later in life, it comes with the territory. So let's takeaway their back up plan.

+10000 - you don't get to preach and blabber on about the "sanctity of life" and then throw away embryos.

All of this. Let's also destroy every single existing frozen embryo. IVF should not be an option anymore (and if anyone cares about their IVF babies, and you associate with any individual who associates with anyone who supports anti-abortion, I completely intend the cruelty and callousness of this statement to hurt you as much as possible).

That’s what Poland has done, sort of.

“The latest woman to die for absolutely no reason was a 30-year-old being identified only as Izabela, a Polish mother of a little girl. She was 22 weeks pregnant and, it seems, wanted to have a second child. But her fetus that lacked amniotic fluid, dooming the pregnancy.

The hospital refused to give her an abortion. She died of sepsis — a lethal infection that can occur when an embryo or fetus dies and isn’t expelled or removed from the body.

Poland is currently under the control of conservative Catholic authoritarians, and they changed the nation’s already-restrictive abortion law last year to be even stricter, deeming unconstitutional abortions in the case of severe fetal abnormality (abortion was already only legal for fetal abnormality and in cases where the pregnant woman was raped or her life was at risk). And it’s not just abortion. Because the Catholic Church does not condone IVF, a conservative Catholic party in Poland also tried to ban an array of fertility procedures. They succeeded in brokering a cruel compromise: Only married or cohabitating heterosexual couples are legally allowed to get IVF procedures in Poland. Single women who want full custody of and responsibility for any child they might have through IVF aren’t just barred from starting the process — they are not entitled to their own frozen embryos.”
https://jill.substack.com/p/abortion-ban-kills-a-young-mother-c8c
https://www.newyorker.com/tech/annals-of-technology/when-the-government-seizes-your-embryos

[Anonymous]

Also, I think these laws will affect lots of middle and upper middle class white women in Southern states.

Let's say you live in southern Georgia. Your conservative husband is a local attorney making very good money, you're a stay-at-home mom who is pregnant. Suddenly, you start hemorrhaging and you need an abortion ASAP.

Where the hell are you going to go? You're many hundreds of miles from the nearest state that can provide you with such a procedure (likely Virginia or Maryland). You can't be transported in your current state. No amount of money will save your life.

I think scenes like this will happen VERY quickly after GOP controlled states outlaw abortion. Many of these laws are not providing any provisions for the health of the mother, rape, or incest. These are zero tolerance laws.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I can’t wait until women start collecting pregnancy and child support for fetuses. Men are never punished or have any responsibilities in this situation. Some really bright female attorneys should start legal cases that have negative repercussions for the men involved in these situations.


Overturning Roe punishes women for pregnancies.

Non-misogynistic make lawyers can help too.

Get on it, legal minds!

[Anonymous]

^ Male lawyers ^

[Anonymous]

It’s so cute that that potted plant John Roberts, whose family resulted from IVF IIRC, is so inspired by the example of Romania that he wants to dance down that road. The lights are on in that head, but ain’t no one home. Just a soulless nobody, looking to ruin women’s lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ Male lawyers ^

Yes! I will take male lawyers who want to let women make decisions about their bodies!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Also, I think these laws will affect lots of middle and upper middle class white women in Southern states.

Let's say you live in southern Georgia. Your conservative husband is a local attorney making very good money, you're a stay-at-home mom who is pregnant. Suddenly, you start hemorrhaging and you need an abortion ASAP.

Where the hell are you going to go? You're many hundreds of miles from the nearest state that can provide you with such a procedure (likely Virginia or Maryland). You can't be transported in your current state. No amount of money will save your life.

I think scenes like this will happen VERY quickly after GOP controlled states outlaw abortion. Many of these laws are not providing any provisions for the health of the mother, rape, or incest. These are zero tolerance laws.

MS ban allows them in medical emergencies. It wouldn't happen at a planned parenthood anyway. Hello. I'm hemmoraging, let me find nearest planned parenthood for an abortion??? No, you go to a hospital.

http://billstatus.ls.state.ms.us/2019/pdf/history/SB/SB2116.xml

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, I think these laws will affect lots of middle and upper middle class white women in Southern states.

Let's say you live in southern Georgia. Your conservative husband is a local attorney making very good money, you're a stay-at-home mom who is pregnant. Suddenly, you start hemorrhaging and you need an abortion ASAP.

Where the hell are you going to go? You're many hundreds of miles from the nearest state that can provide you with such a procedure (likely Virginia or Maryland). You can't be transported in your current state. No amount of money will save your life.

I think scenes like this will happen VERY quickly after GOP controlled states outlaw abortion. Many of these laws are not providing any provisions for the health of the mother, rape, or incest. These are zero tolerance laws.

MS ban allows them in medical emergencies. It wouldn't happen at a planned parenthood anyway. Hello. I'm hemmoraging, let me find nearest planned parenthood for an abortion??? No, you go to a hospital.

http://billstatus.ls.state.ms.us/2019/pdf/history/SB/SB2116.xml

And if you think that’s going to save women’s lives, you’re nuts. If there’s any question at all, women will be left to die; CYA medicine will mean just that. What are the provider penalties for performing abortions? You think a doctor is going to risk their license? Like Mississippi wasn’t already backwater enough.

[Anonymous]

Most men I know are disgusted by this.

My ancient uncle even just posted something on FB.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s so cute that that potted plant John Roberts, whose family resulted from IVF IIRC, is so inspired by the example of Romania that he wants to dance down that road. The lights are on in that head, but ain’t no one home. Just a soulless nobody, looking to ruin women’s lives.

Roberts has issues. His kids were acquired via a very shady adoption from Ireland that was otherwise illegal. IIRC, the Irish kids were sent to a Latin American country in an effort to skirt Irish laws.

I'm convinced it is a point of blackmail against Roberts:

Adoption records
While investigating Roberts' life, the New York Times was accused of attempting to unseal records detailing the 2000 adoption by Roberts and his wife of two infants born in Ireland[10] via a Latin American country. The Times denied any attempts to unseal legal records and stated that "[o]ur reporters made initial inquiries about the adoptions" and "[t]hey did so with great care, understanding the sensitivity of the issue."

The Times was condemned by the National Council for Adoption, "NCFA denounces, in the strongest possible terms, the shocking decision of the New York Times to investigate the adoption records of Justice John Roberts' two young children. The adoption community is outraged that, for obviously political reasons, the Times has targeted the very private circumstances, motivations, and processes by which the Roberts became parents."[11]

The reasons for the adoption happening in the unnamed Latin American country remain unclear, though it was noted that the Irish 1991 Adoption Act only allows adoption of children born in Ireland by people resident in Ireland.[12]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Roberts_Supreme_Court_nomination#Adoption_records

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s so cute that that potted plant John Roberts, whose family resulted from IVF IIRC, is so inspired by the example of Romania that he wants to dance down that road. The lights are on in that head, but ain’t no one home. Just a soulless nobody, looking to ruin women’s lives.

I believe his children are adopted.