Punctuality Disagreement

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

Who is fighting? OP never said there was a fight in front of their friends, you're just making stuff up.

I would never fight with my husband in front of people and we love spending time together just the two of us, but I also wouldn't have married him if he were an inconsiderate jerk who didn't think being on time was important, so we don't have that problem.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think these threads are so weird because I literally don't know anyone who is habitually 15-30 minutes late. Not anyone. 5 minutes? Sure. Not 30 minutes.

I have one friend who is like this. Everyone hates it about her and she wonders why people don't want to spend time with her. She is also incredibly high-maintenance and demanding. Curious how those things go hand in hand...

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Spouse A should have done this years ago. Being late when you're meeting specific people is SO rude. Being late to a reservation is rude to the restaurant. Being 15 minutes late to a 50 person backyard party? No big deal.

But then you're not really "late" - it's just that it didn't have a hard start time. Those events are usually "12-5" or whatever, so showing up at 12:30 isn't late, it's within the window.

No, showing up at 12:30 is late. There is no such thing as "within the window". Would you say the same thing if someone shows up at 4pm? Isn't it still within the 12-5 window? It starts at 12 and you must be there at 12 otherwise you are late. period.

I'm the PP and I'm a Spouse A all the way, but a 50-person backyard party does not have a hard start time (it might have a hard stop time). I wouldn't be bothered if someone showed up at 4 pm but I would be annoyed if they then asked me to make them some food because it had all been eaten.

Maybe you don't socialize much, but we throw big parties all the time at our house, the beach, the pool, the park, and I couldn't care less when people show up because I'm not cooking a seated four-course meal. The food will be ready at 12. If you show up at 1, the hamburgers won't be fresh, or they will be because we'll still be grilling. If you show up at 3, there probably won't be any potato salad left, but that's on you.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Spouse A is correct

It’s never correct to threaten your spouse in front of your kids.

Saying that you'll leave if the spouse is not ready is not a threat. Are you always this fragile or just trying to make a useless point online?

The people who are chronically late will tie themselves into knots to justify their position.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I think these threads are so weird because I literally don't know anyone who is habitually 15-30 minutes late. Not anyone. 5 minutes? Sure. Not 30 minutes.

I know one-- she's one of my best friends. I know this about her, and have decided she's worth it, even though generally speaking, it would make me grind my teeth.

I have one of those friends too. I love her, but I have a rule for doing anything with her. We either have to have independent tickets or the place has to be close to my home and I am not leaving my home until she texts me that she has arrived. She has to be the one to wait.

Same. I will always go separately. She can make the flight or not, that's on her. I won't accommodate her lateness.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

But why do you assume a fight? It’s really fascinating to me - my husband and I once arrived to a New Year party separately, and there was quite a bit of back and forth between me and the hosts. Yes, he is coming later, no, we are OK, really. Something came up, he left work much later than he thought he would and I didn’t feel like sitting there twiddling my thumbs fully dressed while I could be partying.

Isn’t this the subject of the thread? Whether it was okay for spouse A to make a huge deal out of arriving separately or if they were out of line?

No, nowhere did the OP say that Spouse A made a huge deal out of it. Spouse B is the one who made a huge deal out of it, ironically.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

But why do you assume a fight? It’s really fascinating to me - my husband and I once arrived to a New Year party separately, and there was quite a bit of back and forth between me and the hosts. Yes, he is coming later, no, we are OK, really. Something came up, he left work much later than he thought he would and I didn’t feel like sitting there twiddling my thumbs fully dressed while I could be partying.

The situation is completely neutral. I’m assuming that it’s a fight because of the language in the OP.
Spouse A threatened to leave early, then pulled the trigger and left early in frustration. Then tried to [b]embarrass spouse B. [/b]

Making a PB&J is neutral, right? But If I told you I threatened to make my toddler a PB&J if he didn’t eat his dinner, then I finally pulled the trigger and made a PB&J in frustration and then tried to embarrass him, then I am giving a neutral action a specific meaning.

The OP said "Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them." There is no proof that Spouse A did anything other than leaving on time to "embarrass" Spouse B. And Spouse B deserves to feel embarrassed for being so rude.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

But why do you assume a fight? It’s really fascinating to me - my husband and I once arrived to a New Year party separately, and there was quite a bit of back and forth between me and the hosts. Yes, he is coming later, no, we are OK, really. Something came up, he left work much later than he thought he would and I didn’t feel like sitting there twiddling my thumbs fully dressed while I could be partying.

The situation is completely neutral. I’m assuming that it’s a fight because of the language in the OP.
Spouse A threatened to leave early, then pulled the trigger and left early in frustration. Then tried to embarrass spouse B.

Making a PB&J is neutral, right? But If I told you I threatened to make my toddler a PB&J if he didn’t eat his dinner, then I finally pulled the trigger and made a PB&J in frustration and then tried to embarrass him, then I am giving a neutral action a specific meaning.

It never said that spouse A tried to embarrass spouse B. It says spouse B FEELS like she feels he was trying to embarrass her by leaving without her. Different things.

Well, as I said earlier, if I threatened my child repeatedly with a peanut butter sandwich, and then I finally pulled the trigger and made one in anger and made them eat it, and then they FELT embarrassed eating it, then that’s at least partly on me, right?

There is nothing inherently embarrassing about eating a peanut butter sandwich. But if you make fixing a peanut butter sandwich this huge thing that you only finally do in a moment of anger and frustration, then eating it is going to feel pretty awful.

This is why Spouse A was wrong. There was no need to make spouse B feel awful.

Oh man, the stories you have to tell yourself to justify your behavior are ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:threatens, frustration, dithering, furious, embarrass ... language is too strong.
Each spouse can come/go as they like. They should just do it, drama free

I have friends, a couple, who drive to the airport separately. One likes to cut-it-close re:arrival. One gets stressed. So they drive 2 cars. If the late one misses the flight, the other still gets to go. NO DRAMA

Surely you can see that won't work for dinner reservations?

I posted earlier that my husband is often late. He’s a surgeon and sometimes cases go late.
It’s fine for dinner reservations. I just order his food when everyone orders, and he shows up when he shows up.

Sigh. And surely you can see that it is different when someone is unavoidably detained by professional obligations, as opposed to Spouse B, who can't get off his or her butt to be on time, and just doesn't care?

Apparently, your husband is the brains in your relationship. I hope you're good looking, or independently wealthy.

Okay. I’m an idiot.
Why is it that it will work to be drama free if your spouse is at work, but you must threaten them at home and embarrass them in front of your dinner companions if your spouse is “on their butt?”

It seems to me that you could be all drama or no drama in either situation. You could choose see the situation as avoidable or unavoidable in any context. You could absolutely be pissed at your surgeon spouse for tacking on a case at the end of the day or scheduling a big case on a day that she knows you have dinner reservations with your work colleagues. She wouldn’t do that if your kid was the lead in a school play that night.
And you could absolutely see your spouse’s lateness as an unavoidable part of their personality given their cultural upbringing and the way they are other areas of their life.

The way I see it, whether you see your spouse’s behavior as “avoidable” or “unavoidable” is all in how you think about it. You can choose to have thoughts that make you angry and lead to threatening your spouse and ruining your evening. Or you can choose to have thoughts that make you more accepting of other people, happier, and more likely to have a pleasant evening and overall happy home.

It is totally possible to just go to dinner, meet your spouse there, and not threaten or embarrass them. The context does not matter.

DP. I can tell you’re in to dramatization because you keep doubling down, and you’re making up a narrative that wasn’t included in the OP. It didn’t say he embarrassed her. No behavior is “unavoidable.” We’re not Pavlovian dogs, that’s just excuse making. If someone told spouse b she’d get $1M if she showed up on time for a year, I guarantee she’d be on time.

Exactly. I bet you she shows up to work on time despite her cultural differences because she knows there will be consequences if she doesn't. This is no different.

I have a friend who was always late for work and couldn't figure out why she never got a promotion.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

But why do you assume a fight? It’s really fascinating to me - my husband and I once arrived to a New Year party separately, and there was quite a bit of back and forth between me and the hosts. Yes, he is coming later, no, we are OK, really. Something came up, he left work much later than he thought he would and I didn’t feel like sitting there twiddling my thumbs fully dressed while I could be partying.

The situation is completely neutral. I’m assuming that it’s a fight because of the language in the OP.
Spouse A threatened to leave early, then pulled the trigger and left early in frustration. Then tried to embarrass spouse B.

Making a PB&J is neutral, right? But If I told you I threatened to make my toddler a PB&J if he didn’t eat his dinner, then I finally pulled the trigger and made a PB&J in frustration and then tried to embarrass him, then I am giving a neutral action a specific meaning.

It never said that spouse A tried to embarrass spouse B. It says spouse B FEELS like she feels he was trying to embarrass her by leaving without her. Different things.

Well, as I said earlier, if I threatened my child repeatedly with a peanut butter sandwich, and then I finally pulled the trigger and made one in anger and made them eat it, and then they FELT embarrassed eating it, then that’s at least partly on me, right?

There is nothing inherently embarrassing about eating a peanut butter sandwich. But if you make fixing a peanut butter sandwich this huge thing that you only finally do in a moment of anger and frustration, then eating it is going to feel pretty awful.

This is why Spouse A was wrong. There was no need to make spouse B feel awful.

What is it going to take to get Spouse B show basic consideration to Spouse A? Is Spouse A a prisoner of Spouse B's need for mutual lateness and chaperoning?

No. Spouse A is free to go ahead and be on time. He can even frame it as a kind thing that he’s doing (take your time and take an Uber. I’ll meet you there!).
I’m sure that spouse B will be more likely to show consideration later if Spouse A is nice to her.

So pretend not to find it rude and annoying when really it is?

What about all the drama of "you abandoned me, you chose them over me"?

I posted earlier that my husband is a surgeon and often late. I don’t find it rude and annoying, although I could choose to look at it that way.
Spouse A doesn’t have to find this rude and annoying either. That’s a choice.

I didn’t see anywhere that Spouse B had a bunch of drama about being abandoned. Only that they were upset that Spouse A got angry and tried to embarrass them.

Thank goodness you're not the surgeon.

There is a difference between being late because of something outside of your control and being late because you can't be bothered to get somewhere on time.

And Spouse A didn't get angry or try to embarrass Spouse B.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Spouse A just destroyed their marriage because of a stupid dispute over a diner with a coworker.
Who cares of they showed up late. It’s only a diner.
Spouse A would be right if this was an important appointment where getting late would have had devastating consequences, like getting late to work or an interview and losing your job, etc..

This was just a f*ing diner. Getting late has no major consequences.
It’s important to be on time, but this diner wasn’t the time where they needed to act like this.

It's dinner, not diner, you moron.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

Who is fighting? OP never said there was a fight in front of their friends, you're just making stuff up.

I would never fight with my husband in front of people and we love spending time together just the two of us, but I also wouldn't have married him if he were an inconsiderate jerk who didn't think being on time was important, so we don't have that problem.

Well, he threatened to leave, then walked out in anger. Sounds like a fight to me.

I’m not sure how you can love spending time with just your spouse, but think someone is an inconsiderate jerk that kicks puppies if they leave you alone with your spouse for 15 minutes.

I think people are doing a lot of projecting saying that other people are constantly this judgmental. It’s got to be hard to go through life believing that everyone around you is scrutinizing your behavior like this.

Most people really aren’t this judgmental, and they aren’t spending their date night with their spouse talking about what an inconsiderate jerk the other couple is or how they dressed or spoke inappropriately or whatever. They really aren’t thinking about you that much.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

But why do you assume a fight? It’s really fascinating to me - my husband and I once arrived to a New Year party separately, and there was quite a bit of back and forth between me and the hosts. Yes, he is coming later, no, we are OK, really. Something came up, he left work much later than he thought he would and I didn’t feel like sitting there twiddling my thumbs fully dressed while I could be partying.

The situation is completely neutral. I’m assuming that it’s a fight because of the language in the OP.
Spouse A threatened to leave early, then pulled the trigger and left early in frustration. Then tried to embarrass spouse B.

Making a PB&J is neutral, right? But If I told you I threatened to make my toddler a PB&J if he didn’t eat his dinner, then I finally pulled the trigger and made a PB&J in frustration and then tried to embarrass him, then I am giving a neutral action a specific meaning.

It never said that spouse A tried to embarrass spouse B. It says spouse B FEELS like she feels he was trying to embarrass her by leaving without her. Different things.

Well, as I said earlier, if I threatened my child repeatedly with a peanut butter sandwich, and then I finally pulled the trigger and made one in anger and made them eat it, and then they FELT embarrassed eating it, then that’s at least partly on me, right?

There is nothing inherently embarrassing about eating a peanut butter sandwich. But if you make fixing a peanut butter sandwich this huge thing that you only finally do in a moment of anger and frustration, then eating it is going to feel pretty awful.

This is why Spouse A was wrong. There was no need to make spouse B feel awful.

What is it going to take to get Spouse B show basic consideration to Spouse A? Is Spouse A a prisoner of Spouse B's need for mutual lateness and chaperoning?

No. Spouse A is free to go ahead and be on time. He can even frame it as a kind thing that he’s doing (take your time and take an Uber. I’ll meet you there!).
I’m sure that spouse B will be more likely to show consideration later if Spouse A is nice to her.

So pretend not to find it rude and annoying when really it is?

What about all the drama of "you abandoned me, you chose them over me"?

I posted earlier that my husband is a surgeon and often late. I don’t find it rude and annoying, although I could choose to look at it that way.
Spouse A doesn’t have to find this rude and annoying either. That’s a choice.

I didn’t see anywhere that Spouse B had a bunch of drama about being abandoned. Only that they were upset that Spouse A got angry and tried to embarrass them.

Thank goodness you're not the surgeon.

There is a difference between being late because of something outside of your control and being late because you can't be bothered to get somewhere on time.

And Spouse A didn't get angry or try to embarrass Spouse B.

The difference is literally only in your mind. The behavior in visible reality is the same.

And Spouse A literally said he threatened to leave, then left in anger.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Suppose Spouse A is big on punctuality because they come from a military background and also feel that being on time means respecting other people's time. Spouse A also thinks that punctuality is a good habit to pass on to children. Spouse B is less punctual and feels that being 15-30 minutes late is not that big of a deal. Part of this is attributable to cultural/family background and part of it is a tendency to get distracted.

They have discussed the issue repeatedly and Spouse A frequently threatens to just leave Spouse B and go to events, but has never followed through with it until this weekend. They were supposed to meet another couple for dinner and were already running late. The other couple consists of Spouse A's work colleague and their spouse. They are work friends, but not best friends, and the couples have hung out socially together a few times. Spouse A told Spouse B that if they were not ready in 5 minutes, they could take an Uber to the restaurant. Spouse A actually followed through and left to the restaurant in frustration while Spouse B was still dithering.

Spouse B is furious with Spouse A and feels they were trying to embarrass them. Was Spouse A a too drastic?

I would be LIVID if you were 30 minutes late to a dinner with me and my husband without a seriously good excuse. Spouse B is a jerk.

Really? I would be irritated if I was cooking and I prepared things to be ready at a specific time, but it sounds like they were all meeting up at a restaurant. I would just have a drink with my husband.

It would be so much weirder to be brought into the middle of someone’s marital drama.

Ok, you do you. I think it's incredibly rude to show up 30 minutes late to a dinner reservation.

I will! I like hanging out with people who married someone they like to be with, and who don’t need me around to be a buffer with their spouse.

I can see how if you feel that you can’t spend 15 minutes alone with your spouse, it probably doesn’t really phase you if the other couple is in a fight or not speaking to each other.

For me, the late thing wouldn’t bother me, but I would find a fight incredibly awkward.

But why do you assume a fight? It’s really fascinating to me - my husband and I once arrived to a New Year party separately, and there was quite a bit of back and forth between me and the hosts. Yes, he is coming later, no, we are OK, really. Something came up, he left work much later than he thought he would and I didn’t feel like sitting there twiddling my thumbs fully dressed while I could be partying.

The situation is completely neutral. I’m assuming that it’s a fight because of the language in the OP.
Spouse A threatened to leave early, then pulled the trigger and left early in frustration. Then tried to embarrass spouse B.

Making a PB&J is neutral, right? But If I told you I threatened to make my toddler a PB&J if he didn’t eat his dinner, then I finally pulled the trigger and made a PB&J in frustration and then tried to embarrass him, then I am giving a neutral action a specific meaning.

It never said that spouse A tried to embarrass spouse B. It says spouse B FEELS like she feels he was trying to embarrass her by leaving without her. Different things.

Well, as I said earlier, if I threatened my child repeatedly with a peanut butter sandwich, and then I finally pulled the trigger and made one in anger and made them eat it, and then they FELT embarrassed eating it, then that’s at least partly on me, right?

There is nothing inherently embarrassing about eating a peanut butter sandwich. But if you make fixing a peanut butter sandwich this huge thing that you only finally do in a moment of anger and frustration, then eating it is going to feel pretty awful.

This is why Spouse A was wrong. There was no need to make spouse B feel awful.

Oh man, the stories you have to tell yourself to justify your behavior are ridiculous.

My behavior of not making everyone around me miserable?
It’s not that hard to justify.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Spouse A just destroyed their marriage because of a stupid dispute over a diner with a coworker.
Who cares of they showed up late. It’s only a diner.
Spouse A would be right if this was an important appointment where getting late would have had devastating consequences, like getting late to work or an interview and losing your job, etc..

This was just a f*ing diner. Getting late has no major consequences.
It’s important to be on time, but this diner wasn’t the time where they needed to act like this.

Really confused why this would destroy a marriage. You were late. He got annoyed. You traveled separately. It's not that big a deal.

Explain again why you can't be polite to his coworker?

No. I was late. You could have left and had it be no big deal, but you were angry, and any feeling you have must be experienced by everyone around you.
So, repeatedly threatened me, then finally left in anger. When I arrived, thinking it was over, you tried to further embarrass me in front of your friends. You couldn’t let it go and until I was just as angry as you are.

Tell me why this is the kind of household I should raise my children in?

Are you the OP? Because if you’re not you’re just making shit up. Such a tired trope. And even if you’re not OP, learn how to adult and honor your commitments to be somewhere at a previously agreed upon time. That’s what adults do. But I can see how a princess like you thinks the whole world revolves just around her.

I’m not the OP. I don’t think the OP posted again after the first post.
I’m just someone who is surprised that so many people think it’s okay to take your anger out like this over something so trivial.

You wouldn’t act like this to your kids or to a stranger. Why do it to your spouse?

I teach my kids to be on time.

Do you expect an airplane to wait 15-30 minutes for you too?

Of course not. I am on time, which means I arrive at the gate and do not have to sit down before boarding. 20-40 flights per year; haven’t missed a flight yet.

Great. So you are capable of bring on time. Now do that when you promise to meet friends at a restaurant. It’s rude and entitled to have them stand around waiting for you.

I take input on this issue from my friends themselves. They don’t agree with you. Thanks though!