DH wants "open relationship" after my affair...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP: your DH is very angry and he is being vindictive. Look back at why you started to the affair in the first place. Perhaps because the DH was a demanding, dull and vindictive sort of guy? Now he wants you to perform certain acts with him? First confess, then do penance? I suspect that the marriage was really over before the affair began. But now you have the legalities to face, and you need to be the mother to your children. He does not have the right to keep the children away from you. You need a lawyer in a BIG way. More even than you need counseling or confession. A lawyer with experience would likely tell you that tit for tat is not going to put the marriage back together again. Like PP said, that part of your life and relationship is over. You are now on new ground, and your DH does not sound like the forgiving type. Stop blaming yourself and start looking out for yourself. Virginia can be a very hard state to divorce in. Be careful.

Good call - husband is clearly at fault here. She definitely needs to lawyer up and go get that demanding, dull, vindictive guy. I salute your insight and wisdom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much misandry on this thread.

Yeah right, and I am someone that can't stand when other women - and some men - put men down. Posters are easily telling OP how much of a horrible whore she is and never deserves to see her kids.....how many times in threads where OP is a woman talking about her cheating husband do posters say he should never see the kids? Not as much as in this thread.

Above poster is correct. What stands out about this thread was the malicious, targeted way posters are addressing OP, specifically around her gender and sexuality. Her behavior makes her a cheater. A bad spouse and possibly a bad parent. Same nouns one can use for a cheating DH. Posters repeatedly referring to OP as a "whore" and suggesting she lose custody of her kids are coming from an entirely different place. And it's not a good one.

She lost custody because she can't afford to support her kids not because she is a whore. It's because she expects her ex-h to support her even though she has an Ivy League education. She makes $20k a year and refuses to get a real job.

+1. Folks need to read carefully because the unbelievable lack of judgement by OP (not the covert affair part but running to move in with the OM) is what could be the nail in the coffin. That her H is asking for details - that's understandable as some PPs noted due to the fact that he's destroyed by this revelation. That he wants an 'open marriage' or for OP to perform on him as she did with then ON, well that's what OP says and it's coming from someone with with little credibility.

Do you think she deserves, based on behavior, to have her girls? She can't support herself, the girls apparently hate her and at the first sign of trouble (i.e., being caught and kicked out the of the house) what did she do? Does that sound like someone with her shit together? And she think her H is being too mean. wow.

As one PP mentioned, if OP was a man, what you'll be your reaction?

My reaction would be that a cheating spouse has a right to his or her kids despite actions towards the spouse. Linking the two is never okay and very vindictive. I had a mom who was a good wife but not the best mother figure and a dad who was a great father but not a good husband. I think you can be one and not the other at times.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much misandry on this thread.

Yeah right, and I am someone that can't stand when other women - and some men - put men down. Posters are easily telling OP how much of a horrible whore she is and never deserves to see her kids.....how many times in threads where OP is a woman talking about her cheating husband do posters say he should never see the kids? Not as much as in this thread.

Above poster is correct. What stands out about this thread was the malicious, targeted way posters are addressing OP, specifically around her gender and sexuality. Her behavior makes her a cheater. A bad spouse and possibly a bad parent. Same nouns one can use for a cheating DH. Posters repeatedly referring to OP as a "whore" and suggesting she lose custody of her kids are coming from an entirely different place. And it's not a good one.

She lost custody because she can't afford to support her kids not because she is a whore. It's because she expects her ex-h to support her even though she has an Ivy League education. She makes $20k a year and refuses to get a real job.

+1. Folks need to read carefully because the unbelievable lack of judgement by OP (not the covert affair part but running to move in with the OM) is what could be the nail in the coffin. That her H is asking for details - that's understandable as some PPs noted due to the fact that he's destroyed by this revelation. That he wants an 'open marriage' or for OP to perform on him as she did with then ON, well that's what OP says and it's coming from someone with with little credibility.

Do you think she deserves, based on behavior, to have her girls? She can't support herself, the girls apparently hate her and at the first sign of trouble (i.e., being caught and kicked out the of the house) what did she do? Does that sound like someone with her shit together? And she think her H is being too mean. wow.

As one PP mentioned, if OP was a man, what you'll be your reaction?

Children aren't pawns.

They have a right to contact with their mother. The gender of the offending parent doesn't matter. How selfish are you that you think cutting a kid's mother out of her life is the solution to infidelity? That's messed up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much misandry on this thread.

Yeah right, and I am someone that can't stand when other women - and some men - put men down. Posters are easily telling OP how much of a horrible whore she is and never deserves to see her kids.....how many times in threads where OP is a woman talking about her cheating husband do posters say he should never see the kids? Not as much as in this thread.

Above poster is correct. What stands out about this thread was the malicious, targeted way posters are addressing OP, specifically around her gender and sexuality. Her behavior makes her a cheater. A bad spouse and possibly a bad parent. Same nouns one can use for a cheating DH. Posters repeatedly referring to OP as a "whore" and suggesting she lose custody of her kids are coming from an entirely different place. And it's not a good one.

She lost custody because she can't afford to support her kids not because she is a whore. It's because she expects her ex-h to support her even though she has an Ivy League education. She makes $20k a year and refuses to get a real job.

+1. Folks need to read carefully because the unbelievable lack of judgement by OP (not the covert affair part but running to move in with the OM) is what could be the nail in the coffin. That her H is asking for details - that's understandable as some PPs noted due to the fact that he's destroyed by this revelation. That he wants an 'open marriage' or for OP to perform on him as she did with then ON, well that's what OP says and it's coming from someone with with little credibility.

Do you think she deserves, based on behavior, to have her girls? She can't support herself, the girls apparently hate her and at the first sign of trouble (i.e., being caught and kicked out the of the house) what did she do? Does that sound like someone with her shit together? And she think her H is being too mean. wow.

As one PP mentioned, if OP was a man, what you'll be your reaction?

Children aren't pawns.

They have a right to contact with their mother. The gender of the offending parent doesn't matter. How selfish are you that you think cutting a kid's mother out of her life is the solution to infidelity? That's messed up.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Let's make OP a man. Now give him advice.

It wouldn't help. DCUM is notorious for having a very vocal "blame the victim" minority. There aren't that many, but they are very persistent in coming out on every thread and castigating the victim. You can tell by writing style that there are a small handful that keep coming back with the same obnoxious mentality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
My reaction would be that a cheating spouse has a right to his or her kids despite actions towards the spouse. Linking the two is never okay and very vindictive. I had a mom who was a good wife but not the best mother figure and a dad who was a great father but not a good husband. I think you can be one and not the other at times.

Please read the whole thread before responding to a non-argument. OP has admitted that she has visitation with her teenage daughters, but that they hate her and each visit is a very uncomfortable tense time as she tries to find a way to connect with her daughters who don't want it. The victim is not keeping her from her kids; the kids are because they correctly fault her for her actions. She had an affair, hid it for 2.5 years, when caught, she moved in with her gigolo and has made no effort to address whatever weakness she had that caused her to betray her whole family. She has no one to blame but herself, but tried vainly to blame the victim.

She should do as he asks and get individual therapy to find out whether she has any remorse and whether she can find some way to make amends to her family, but she isn't willing to do that. She just wants them to forgive and go back to her old life without any commitment from her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much misandry on this thread.

Yeah right, and I am someone that can't stand when other women - and some men - put men down. Posters are easily telling OP how much of a horrible whore she is and never deserves to see her kids.....how many times in threads where OP is a woman talking about her cheating husband do posters say he should never see the kids? Not as much as in this thread.

Above poster is correct. What stands out about this thread was the malicious, targeted way posters are addressing OP, specifically around her gender and sexuality. Her behavior makes her a cheater. A bad spouse and possibly a bad parent. Same nouns one can use for a cheating DH. Posters repeatedly referring to OP as a "whore" and suggesting she lose custody of her kids are coming from an entirely different place. And it's not a good one.

She lost custody because she can't afford to support her kids not because she is a whore. It's because she expects her ex-h to support her even though she has an Ivy League education. She makes $20k a year and refuses to get a real job.

Why should it come down to money? Suppose it was her breadwinner husband who cheated and left. In that case, she wouldn't have been able to support her kids, either. Do you think the cheating husband should have had custody just because he's the one with the paycheck?

Mind you, I am not saying that she should have custody, we simply don't know enough to make that call. I am saying that it should not come down to who can afford what.

[Anonymous]

Look, it comes down to this: Agreeing that OP made hurtful, irreversible decisions in her marriage and pointing out that posters needn't refer to her as a "whore" are not mutually exclusive. These really are two separate issues. Of course, plenty of posters don't understand this, which explains the persistence of misogyny. I also don't enjoy reading the threads that devolve into male-bashing, either. Any serious discussion of partnership and family moves beyond these gender issues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much misandry on this thread.

Yeah right, and I am someone that can't stand when other women - and some men - put men down. Posters are easily telling OP how much of a horrible whore she is and never deserves to see her kids.....how many times in threads where OP is a woman talking about her cheating husband do posters say he should never see the kids? Not as much as in this thread.

Above poster is correct. What stands out about this thread was the malicious, targeted way posters are addressing OP, specifically around her gender and sexuality. Her behavior makes her a cheater. A bad spouse and possibly a bad parent. Same nouns one can use for a cheating DH. Posters repeatedly referring to OP as a "whore" and suggesting she lose custody of her kids are coming from an entirely different place. And it's not a good one.

She lost custody because she can't afford to support her kids not because she is a whore. It's because she expects her ex-h to support her even though she has an Ivy League education. She makes $20k a year and refuses to get a real job.

Why should it come down to money? Suppose it was her breadwinner husband who cheated and left. In that case, she wouldn't have been able to support her kids, either. Do you think the cheating husband should have had custody just because he's the one with the paycheck?

Mind you, I am not saying that she should have custody, we simply don't know enough to make that call. I am saying that it should not come down to who can afford what.

Children should have a stable home. In this situation the H can provide the children the same home that they have lived in since birth and provide a stable environment. She can not. I don't care if it were reversed. Women who decide to SAH basically given up control of their own life and in this situation custody of their children out of a leap of faith. It is crazy to me. It was her educated decision.

Yes. It does come down to who can afford what.

He can afford a house, the school they have friends in and everything else. She can offer an apartment, who knows where.

Sorry, but consequences suck but she did this to herself.

[Anonymous]

I don't think OP's decisions make her a "whore," but they do make her someone who put her own desires ahead of her family's wellbeing, and she does not sound at all remorseful about doing so. I would not agree to some of the terms that her DH is asking for either - namely, telling and acting out all aspects of the affair with him. So just say no, and he can either get a divorce or not.

[Anonymous]

Moving in with the lover won't help her cause much. I don't blame the kids for not really wanting to hang out with OP all that much.

Now if the husband takes her back and proceeds to treat her like complete dirt, OP can paint her husband as abusive/fucked in the head (or some polite, court-approved method of stating that.)

Asking OP to take it up the pooper won't cut it for abusive/fucked in the head territory, nor will asking OP to compose Penthouse Forum letters based on her real life experiences.

Taking OP up the pooper without her consent, NOW we're getting into abusive/fucked in the head (and worse) territory.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Moving in with the lover won't help her cause much. I don't blame the kids for not really wanting to hang out with OP all that much.

Now if the husband takes her back and proceeds to treat her like complete dirt, OP can paint her husband as abusive/fucked in the head (or some polite, court-approved method of stating that.)

Asking OP to take it up the pooper won't cut it for abusive/fucked in the head territory, nor will asking OP to compose Penthouse Forum letters based on her real life experiences.

Taking OP up the pooper without her consent, NOW we're getting into abusive/fucked in the head (and worse) territory.

wow. such hate for this woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Moving in with the lover won't help her cause much. I don't blame the kids for not really wanting to hang out with OP all that much.

Now if the husband takes her back and proceeds to treat her like complete dirt, OP can paint her husband as abusive/fucked in the head (or some polite, court-approved method of stating that.)

Asking OP to take it up the pooper won't cut it for abusive/fucked in the head territory, nor will asking OP to compose Penthouse Forum letters based on her real life experiences.

Taking OP up the pooper without her consent, NOW we're getting into abusive/fucked in the head (and worse) territory.

wow. such hate for this woman.

But think about her situation in the moment. Stuff on the front porch and nowhere else to go. Of course she's going to the OM. That makes her human, not bad. I'm not excusing her, just saying that none of us should re-construct her past from our own armchairs.

Also, some psych should correct me, but I thought it was pretty common for the cheated upon party to want / need to know sordid details, and that this is part of the recovery. As a man, I can understand H resentment for her only sharing parts of her body with the OM and not her him. I couldn't deal with knowing she did XYZ with him, but refused me. I don't think he's necessarily bring malicious, seems more like he's giving her a litmus test for re-entering his life. That's incredibly powerful stuff to give to OM and deny it to H. To all our female colleagues out there, don't underestimate the intensity of this kind of communication.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much misandry on this thread.

Yeah right, and I am someone that can't stand when other women - and some men - put men down. Posters are easily telling OP how much of a horrible whore she is and never deserves to see her kids.....how many times in threads where OP is a woman talking about her cheating husband do posters say he should never see the kids? Not as much as in this thread.

Above poster is correct. What stands out about this thread was the malicious, targeted way posters are addressing OP, specifically around her gender and sexuality. Her behavior makes her a cheater. A bad spouse and possibly a bad parent. Same nouns one can use for a cheating DH. Posters repeatedly referring to OP as a "whore" and suggesting she lose custody of her kids are coming from an entirely different place. And it's not a good one.

She lost custody because she can't afford to support her kids not because she is a whore. It's because she expects her ex-h to support her even though she has an Ivy League education. She makes $20k a year and refuses to get a real job.

+1. Folks need to read carefully because the unbelievable lack of judgement by OP (not the covert affair part but running to move in with the OM) is what could be the nail in the coffin. That her H is asking for details - that's understandable as some PPs noted due to the fact that he's destroyed by this revelation. That he wants an 'open marriage' or for OP to perform on him as she did with then ON, well that's what OP says and it's coming from someone with with little credibility.

Do you think she deserves, based on behavior, to have her girls? She can't support herself, the girls apparently hate her and at the first sign of trouble (i.e., being caught and kicked out the of the house) what did she do? Does that sound like someone with her shit together? And she think her H is being too mean. wow.

As one PP mentioned, if OP was a man, what you'll be your reaction?

Children aren't pawns.

They have a right to contact with their mother. The gender of the offending parent doesn't matter. How selfish are you that you think cutting a kid's mother out of her life is the solution to infidelity? That's messed up.

Clearly they are pawns to a lot of fucked up posters on this site.

Oh well, there's always therapy.

[Anonymous]

Didn't read the whole thread so forgive me if this has already been said. You did a terrible thing OP and I can see why DH has been strict with you. But I don't think he should nor should you agree to having an open relationship. Same with his demands to know the details and requirement that you do the same with him as you did with the person you had an affair with. It would be awful to have to divorce because as you pointed out you have a lot to lose but I don't think you can rebuild a relationship on those terms and it is probably better to part ways at this point than to keep up the race to the bottom with his requirements. He sounds like he really needs a lot of therapy and the both of you, not just you alone, need to go to couples counseling now.