my wife's thin skin

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:And OP, you need to hear this loud and clear - your wife, the mother of the children, does not want to harm them or put them in danger. She grew them personally. When you claim that she is putting their lives at risk by driving, which she has done in the past in her own country with no incidents, she will not be able to listen to you.

You are an abrasive communicator.

She has indeed had incidents in her home country. In fact, she had a bit of a minor fender bender a year ago, when we were visiting her parents, backing into a parked car.

Moreover, the highway speeds are much slower in her country. She has never encountered fast and furious roads like ours.

She wouldn't knowingly or willfully put our children's lives at risk. But that doesn't mean that her actions are safe. For lack of a better example, a drunk may be convinced that they are sufficiently sober to drive, even when they are a danger to themselves and others. My wife doesn't drink ... I'm using this as an example to try to better explain the situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How long has your wife been in this country? If over 5 years, I’m not sure cultural differences can explain the divide.
OP - how often do these lapses in judgement occur? Once every six months- not a big deal. Once a month - get into joint counseling ASAP.

Over 10 years in this country.

I'd say we average around one significant communication breakdown every 6 months. That track record isn't bad, I suppose ... maybe better than many couples. But the fact that communication seems completely impossible during these situations really concerns me. It is like an eclipse occurs, completely blocking out the sun.

Sometimes, during these situations, I don't think she is actually processing what I am saying. It is kind of like a tennis match in which I hit the ball to the left side of the court, but she runs over the right side of the court to hit a non-existent ball. I then have to tell her that, well, no, I actually hit the ball to the left side of the court, not the right.

My wife's listening skills seem below average. I don't mean just with me ... I mean with everybody she interacts with. A person might relate a story to her, quite clearly, and she will ask the person a question that was already answered in a minute earlier in the conversation. I recall once a situation in which a mutual friend relayed a recipe for baking bread, and my wife followed this up by asking for the recipe. I don't quite understand how you can stand face-to-face with somebody and not hear them, but it seems to happen periodically with my wife ... not all of the time, but just enough that it seems to be part of a pattern. I'm not sure if this is a factor that feeds into the communication breakdowns that occur in our marriage.

My wife's English is excellent, so the language is not a barrier, just in case you were wondering. So the root of the problem lies elsewhere. Yes yes yes, I get that I might be contributing to the problem. But I'm not quite sure how. I communicate politely and gently with my wife, and I do not yell. I listen. I try to understand her point of view. But something goes badly wrong now and then and I can't understand why.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How long has your wife been in this country? If over 5 years, I’m not sure cultural differences can explain the divide.
OP - how often do these lapses in judgement occur? Once every six months- not a big deal. Once a month - get into joint counseling ASAP.

Over 10 years in this country.

I'd say we average around one significant communication breakdown every 6 months. That track record isn't bad, I suppose ... maybe better than many couples. But the fact that communication seems completely impossible during these situations really concerns me. It is like an eclipse occurs, completely blocking out the sun.

Sometimes, during these situations, I don't think she is actually processing what I am saying. It is kind of like a tennis match in which I hit the ball to the left side of the court, but she runs over the right side of the court to hit a non-existent ball. I then have to tell her that, well, no, I actually hit the ball to the left side of the court, not the right.

My wife's listening skills seem below average. I don't mean just with me ... I mean with everybody she interacts with. A person might relate a story to her, quite clearly, and she will ask the person a question that was already answered in a minute earlier in the conversation. I recall once a situation in which a mutual friend relayed a recipe for baking bread, and my wife followed this up by asking for the recipe. I don't quite understand how you can stand face-to-face with somebody and not hear them, but it seems to happen periodically with my wife ... not all of the time, but just enough that it seems to be part of a pattern. I'm not sure if this is a factor that feeds into the communication breakdowns that occur in our marriage.

My wife's English is excellent, so the language is not a barrier, just in case you were wondering. So the root of the problem lies elsewhere. Yes yes yes, I get that I might be contributing to the problem. But I'm not quite sure how. I communicate politely and gently with my wife, and I do not yell. I listen. I try to understand her point of view. But something goes badly wrong now and then and I can't understand why.

Why are you not willing to seriously consider therapy, instead of just asking anonymous people here? Honest question.

[Anonymous]

Why are you not willing to seriously consider therapy, instead of just asking anonymous people here? Honest question.

I am willing to consider therapy, but I thought I would also getting advice here, since there is nothing to lose.

I do love my wife. And my kids. So getting kicked around a bit by a few strangers on the internet is fine with me if I can pick up a few tidbits that help me mend my marriage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Why are you not willing to seriously consider therapy, instead of just asking anonymous people here? Honest question.

I am willing to consider therapy, but I thought I would also getting advice here, since there is nothing to lose.

I do love my wife. And my kids. So getting kicked around a bit by a few strangers on the internet is fine with me if I can pick up a few tidbits that help me mend my marriage.

So, we're at 12 pages. Is there anything you've read that you think is likely to be terribly helpful?

If yes, how long will you give it before you decide whether or not it was enough?
If no, how long before you make an appointment with a professional?

Good luck. For real. This isn't easy, whatever is behind it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't buy it either.

You probably felt you were gentle but you were being condescending and argumentative. You probably harped on and on about driving mistakes and she exploded and responded I'm never driving them again.

In the end, if she is a bad driver she shouldn't be driving the kids around. Great if she never drives them again

OP here. She was a bad driver because she hadn't driven in 10 years, and hadn't driven in the USA. Now she is much improved. It would make life easier for her if she drove now, but she seems hell-bent on playing the role of the martyr.

When I raised the driving issue initially, I began by explaining that I am uncomfortable driving in any new country. It takes me a while to acclimate, and it isn't wise to go through the acclimation process with kids in the car. I explained this using ME as the example. I then generalized, and said that I would hope that she would want some solo practice before driving with the kids.

I don't think I was condescending. Rather, I was careful and polite, because I knew, from experience, that I was walking on eggshells. And sure enough, those shells cracked. I'm not sure how to magically walk across those shells without breaking them. A two-ounce mouse could crack them.

So if she drove alone and had an accident and died, that would be fine with you, as long as the kids were okay? She is expendable? It seems that you don’t care about her much at all. The reaction may have been different if you had suggested that she get more practice with a driving instructor because you would hate for anything to happen to her or the kids.

Your way of suggesting that more options be looked at for different situations seems phony and condescending, like you think she can’t see through your careful, polite wording to know that you simply don’t like a lot of the things she likes. Those things are in sum an expression of who she is.

It may go better if you simply admit that you don’t like something. You don’t suggest that a range of options be considered for every decision, right? You say it only when you yourself have a quick, instinctive reaction that you don’t like something. You try to mask it by saying that options need to be considered, thinking needs to take place that hasn’t taken place, etc. How do you decide when to raise the need for more deliberation? It’s when you instantly disagree. You don’t spend hours to decide that you disagree. Just say that you disagree. Maybe express regret that you aren’t more similar. There isn’t a right or wrong for many of these decisions, and more thought isn’t going to change what someone feels.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Why are you not willing to seriously consider therapy, instead of just asking anonymous people here? Honest question.

I am willing to consider therapy, but I thought I would also getting advice here, since there is nothing to lose.

I do love my wife. And my kids. So getting kicked around a bit by a few strangers on the internet is fine with me if I can pick up a few tidbits that help me mend my marriage.

So, we're at 12 pages. Is there anything you've read that you think is likely to be terribly helpful?

If yes, how long will you give it before you decide whether or not it was enough?
If no, how long before you make an appointment with a professional?

Good luck. For real. This isn't easy, whatever is behind it.

I'm not sure. 90% of the posters have assumed that I'm an aggressive tyrant who nitpicks every single decision made in my household. So those comments are useless to me because that isn't the situation. I'm relatively soft-spoken and I have a lot of patience after years and years of being with a prior partner for a few years who had borderline personality disorder. So I know a thing or two about how to frame conversations in a careful manner. But my wife doesn't have a disorder. She is a mentally healthy person who is a wonderful spouse 99% of the time. But the 1% scares the heck out of me because the world falls apart precisely in the moment that I most need it to hang together.

The comments I found the most useful were those focused on cultural differences. I think those differences might be playing a role.

Most likely we will try counseling, assuming my spouse is willing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Why are you not willing to seriously consider therapy, instead of just asking anonymous people here? Honest question.

I am willing to consider therapy, but I thought I would also getting advice here, since there is nothing to lose.

I do love my wife. And my kids. So getting kicked around a bit by a few strangers on the internet is fine with me if I can pick up a few tidbits that help me mend my marriage.

So, we're at 12 pages. Is there anything you've read that you think is likely to be terribly helpful?

If yes, how long will you give it before you decide whether or not it was enough?
If no, how long before you make an appointment with a professional?

Good luck. For real. This isn't easy, whatever is behind it.

I'm not sure. 90% of the posters have assumed that I'm an aggressive tyrant who nitpicks every single decision made in my household. So those comments are useless to me because that isn't the situation. I'm relatively soft-spoken and I have a lot of patience after years and years of being with a prior partner for a few years who had borderline personality disorder. So I know a thing or two about how to frame conversations in a careful manner. But my wife doesn't have a disorder. She is a mentally healthy person who is a wonderful spouse 99% of the time. But the 1% scares the heck out of me because the world falls apart precisely in the moment that I most need it to hang together.

The comments I found the most useful were those focused on cultural differences. I think those differences might be playing a role.

Most likely we will try counseling, assuming my spouse is willing.

DP here.

Get it into your thick skull that if your wife was as crazy as your OP suggested, she will not be great 99% of the time.

If she is great 99% of the time, then there is something going on besides her being thin skinned. Somebody that thin skinned would be impossible to live with peacefully. This is because everything would set them off.

So if you are happy with her 99% of the time, theres is something that either you have communicated to her or she has misunderstood from your communication with her that sets her off. You are the one on the Board seeking advice, so see what you can do to solve this problem.

Or maybe she is like everyone else and is pissy 1% of the time and you are just being overly dramatic.

Eitherway, take responsibility of your own actions and reactions and see how you can help the situation using all the helpful suggestions that have been offered to you here and elsewhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I'm not sure. 90% of the posters have assumed that I'm an aggressive tyrant who nitpicks every single decision made in my household. So those comments are useless to me because that isn't the situation. I'm relatively soft-spoken and I have a lot of patience after years and years of being with a prior partner for a few years who had borderline personality disorder. So I know a thing or two about how to frame conversations in a careful manner. But my wife doesn't have a disorder. She is a mentally healthy person who is a wonderful spouse 99% of the time. But the 1% scares the heck out of me because the world falls apart precisely in the moment that I most need it to hang together.

The comments I found the most useful were those focused on cultural differences. I think those differences might be playing a role.

Most likely we will try counseling, assuming my spouse is willing.

Here's the most important thing in this thread:

If she doesn't want to do couples therapy, then do individual therapy. Don't hang onto this "assuming my spouse is willing" bullshit.

Reread what you wrote:

But the 1% scares the heck out of me because the world falls apart precisely in the moment that I most need it to hang together.

This suffocates the conversation. So I focus on the kids, and she focuses on the kids, and this seems to keep the ship upright. But it is just sidestepping the problem, and pretending that everything is OK, when it isn't.

I'll do what it takes to get over this hump and get the gears turning again.

It would make life easier for her if she drove now, but she seems hell-bent on playing the role of the martyr.

Rather, I was careful and polite, because I knew, from experience, that I was walking on eggshells. And sure enough, those shells cracked. I'm not sure how to magically walk across those shells without breaking them. A two-ounce mouse could crack them.

But when it comes time to discuss something significant, the wheels sometimes come off. And no, my list of "significant" items is not a mile long -- it is pretty damn short. I think a husband and wife need to be able to discuss key issues without the wheels coming off.

In other words -- we can't talk about big issues. I mean we can't even get the conversation started.... It is almost as if she is opposed to reason itself -- that the mere act of THINKING before making an important choice is a challenge to her approach to decision-making.

I wonder, though, if for some issues my wife simply can't reason her way through.... This makes me nervous, because when a parent is responsible for a child's life, the parent MUST look before they leap.

And I want a cure. ...Well, those suggestions basically mirrored the actual conversations I had with my wife. So the medicine you are prescribing was used from the outset.

But the fact that communication seems completely impossible during these situations really concerns me. It is like an eclipse occurs, completely blocking out the sun.
... I communicate politely and gently with my wife, and I do not yell. I listen. I try to understand her point of view. But something goes badly wrong now and then and I can't understand why.

You are "scared as heck." You are afraid for the safety of your children. You'll do anything to figure out how to make this work.

Either these things are true, and you'll work on what you can change (that's you -- with the help of a professional -- even if the part you fix is your willingness to put up with certain things), or at least one of them isn't, and you'll be happy with some vague suggestion to consider cultural differences, because the point of this wasn't fixing the problem -- it was to bitch about your wife anonymously.

If it matters, take care of it. Step up to the plate. Don't keep blaming her for your unwillingness to do the hard things. Blame her for what she is responsible for, not for your actions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How long has your wife been in this country? If over 5 years, I’m not sure cultural differences can explain the divide.
OP - how often do these lapses in judgement occur? Once every six months- not a big deal. Once a month - get into joint counseling ASAP.

Over 10 years in this country.

I'd say we average around one significant communication breakdown every 6 months. That track record isn't bad, I suppose ... maybe better than many couples. But the fact that communication seems completely impossible during these situations really concerns me. It is like an eclipse occurs, completely blocking out the sun.

Sometimes, during these situations, I don't think she is actually processing what I am saying. It is kind of like a tennis match in which I hit the ball to the left side of the court, but she runs over the right side of the court to hit a non-existent ball. I then have to tell her that, well, no, I actually hit the ball to the left side of the court, not the right.

My wife's listening skills seem below average. I don't mean just with me ... I mean with everybody she interacts with. A person might relate a story to her, quite clearly, and she will ask the person a question that was already answered in a minute earlier in the conversation. I recall once a situation in which a mutual friend relayed a recipe for baking bread, and my wife followed this up by asking for the recipe. I don't quite understand how you can stand face-to-face with somebody and not hear them, but it seems to happen periodically with my wife ... not all of the time, but just enough that it seems to be part of a pattern. I'm not sure if this is a factor that feeds into the communication breakdowns that occur in our marriage.

My wife's English is excellent, so the language is not a barrier, just in case you were wondering. So the root of the problem lies elsewhere. Yes yes yes, I get that I might be contributing to the problem. But I'm not quite sure how. I communicate politely and gently with my wife, and I do not yell. I listen. I try to understand her point of view. But something goes badly wrong now and then and I can't understand why.

Considering you're doing the same thing over and over again in this thread ("No, that's not what I said!" when it was actually exactly what you just wrote), the problem is not your wife. It's you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How long has your wife been in this country? If over 5 years, I’m not sure cultural differences can explain the divide.
OP - how often do these lapses in judgement occur? Once every six months- not a big deal. Once a month - get into joint counseling ASAP.

Over 10 years in this country.

I'd say we average around one significant communication breakdown every 6 months. That track record isn't bad, I suppose ... maybe better than many couples. But the fact that communication seems completely impossible during these situations really concerns me. It is like an eclipse occurs, completely blocking out the sun.

Sometimes, during these situations, I don't think she is actually processing what I am saying. It is kind of like a tennis match in which I hit the ball to the left side of the court, but she runs over the right side of the court to hit a non-existent ball. I then have to tell her that, well, no, I actually hit the ball to the left side of the court, not the right.

My wife's listening skills seem below average. I don't mean just with me ... I mean with everybody she interacts with. A person might relate a story to her, quite clearly, and she will ask the person a question that was already answered in a minute earlier in the conversation. I recall once a situation in which a mutual friend relayed a recipe for baking bread, and my wife followed this up by asking for the recipe. I don't quite understand how you can stand face-to-face with somebody and not hear them, but it seems to happen periodically with my wife ... not all of the time, but just enough that it seems to be part of a pattern. I'm not sure if this is a factor that feeds into the communication breakdowns that occur in our marriage.

My wife's English is excellent, so the language is not a barrier, just in case you were wondering. So the root of the problem lies elsewhere. Yes yes yes, I get that I might be contributing to the problem. But I'm not quite sure how. I communicate politely and gently with my wife, and I do not yell. I listen. I try to understand her point of view. But something goes badly wrong now and then and I can't understand why.

Considering you're doing the same thing over and over again in this thread ("No, that's not what I said!" when it was actually exactly what you just wrote), the problem is not your wife. It's you.

I had a long talk with my wife last night. It was the most constructive talk we have ever had. What I learned is that there was one particular button I was pushing in our arguments over the years that deeply angered her. She felt it was a blow below the belt. And yet she never told me until now. I had to drag it out of her, in an effort to penetrate to the root of our problems. I just wish I had known sooner. I've agreed to clean up my act, so that when we do have an argument, we fight with Marquess of Queensberry Rules as opposed to having a street brawl. So, maybe a bit of progress.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How long has your wife been in this country? If over 5 years, I’m not sure cultural differences can explain the divide.
OP - how often do these lapses in judgement occur? Once every six months- not a big deal. Once a month - get into joint counseling ASAP.

Over 10 years in this country.

I'd say we average around one significant communication breakdown every 6 months. That track record isn't bad, I suppose ... maybe better than many couples. But the fact that communication seems completely impossible during these situations really concerns me. It is like an eclipse occurs, completely blocking out the sun.

Sometimes, during these situations, I don't think she is actually processing what I am saying. It is kind of like a tennis match in which I hit the ball to the left side of the court, but she runs over the right side of the court to hit a non-existent ball. I then have to tell her that, well, no, I actually hit the ball to the left side of the court, not the right.

My wife's listening skills seem below average. I don't mean just with me ... I mean with everybody she interacts with. A person might relate a story to her, quite clearly, and she will ask the person a question that was already answered in a minute earlier in the conversation. I recall once a situation in which a mutual friend relayed a recipe for baking bread, and my wife followed this up by asking for the recipe. I don't quite understand how you can stand face-to-face with somebody and not hear them, but it seems to happen periodically with my wife ... not all of the time, but just enough that it seems to be part of a pattern. I'm not sure if this is a factor that feeds into the communication breakdowns that occur in our marriage.

My wife's English is excellent, so the language is not a barrier, just in case you were wondering. So the root of the problem lies elsewhere. Yes yes yes, I get that I might be contributing to the problem. But I'm not quite sure how. I communicate politely and gently with my wife, and I do not yell. I listen. I try to understand her point of view. But something goes badly wrong now and then and I can't understand why.

Considering you're doing the same thing over and over again in this thread ("No, that's not what I said!" when it was actually exactly what you just wrote), the problem is not your wife. It's you.

I had a long talk with my wife last night. It was the most constructive talk we have ever had. What I learned is that there was one particular button I was pushing in our arguments over the years that deeply angered her. She felt it was a blow below the belt. And yet she never told me until now. I had to drag it out of her, in an effort to penetrate to the root of our problems. I just wish I had known sooner. I've agreed to clean up my act, so that when we do have an argument, we fight with Marquess of Queensberry Rules as opposed to having a street brawl. So, maybe a bit of progress.

What was her trigger?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The way you write it sure sounds like she's overreacting, but ask yourself whether you are frequently critical. Sometimes it's not that you didn't like the chair she picked, it's that you criticized the last 17 things she's suggested or done, and this is just the last straw. Or that you frequently criticize without offering alternatives (so that "let's consider alternatives" really means "you go find some more options for me to consider") so she's making all the suggestions and you're just shooting them down, rather than you offering alternatives.

Also consider your tone. You might think that the words you are saying are totally reasonable, but your tone might be coming across as condescending, abrupt, sharp, etc.

And the driving thing makes it sound like you don't really trust her judgment, and that vibe gets old fast, too.

This x1000 My husband can be really critical sometimes. If your wife is constantly getting shot down by you or your tone suggests that you always know best, I can see why she'd react this way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The way you write it sure sounds like she's overreacting, but ask yourself whether you are frequently critical. Sometimes it's not that you didn't like the chair she picked, it's that you criticized the last 17 things she's suggested or done, and this is just the last straw. Or that you frequently criticize without offering alternatives (so that "let's consider alternatives" really means "you go find some more options for me to consider") so she's making all the suggestions and you're just shooting them down, rather than you offering alternatives.

Also consider your tone. You might think that the words you are saying are totally reasonable, but your tone might be coming across as condescending, abrupt, sharp, etc.

And the driving thing makes it sound like you don't really trust her judgment, and that vibe gets old fast, too.

This x1000 My husband can be really critical sometimes. If your wife is constantly getting shot down by you or your tone suggests that you always know best, I can see why she'd react this way.

Had my wife simply told me what was really bugging her, I would have made adjustments long ago. After our talk last night, I think I understand a bit better the source of the problem. Insane that it reached this point of frustration and dysfunction, but we are from different backgrounds and cultures, and I think that contributed to our issues growing and accumulating across time.

[Anonymous]

Shy are you not willing to say what her trigger was? Sounds like it's something that shows you off in a bad light; something that you should not have been doing in the first place and that justified her behavior towards you. You should mention what it is or you come off as being in the wrong, yet you still blame her for not telling you what it was. Sounds like you should have known not to do it.