Divorced parents late in life drama

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I didn't say that I didn't value close family ties and supporting one another. But I do not expect my kids to put their own lives on hold and neglect their own responsibilities in in order to take care of me when I'm old. Don't get me wrong, I really hope that I get to see them at that stage of my life. I'm pretty sure that they will want to see me. Hopefully we can make that happen.

NP. This is some warped way of thinking. How is taking care of a loved one amounts to "putting your life on hold"? It is life. Unless you're orphaned/cut ties with family of origin, single, and childless. Again, it's a valid choice, and plenty of people enjoy it immensely. Maybe more people should consider it.

It's not warped. It's simply a different cultural perspective from yours. In my family as well, as I saw from my great-grandparents, and my grandparents, my aged parents, and now for myself, we do not want to be a burden on our children or grandchildren. We want to live on our own and be as independent as possible, for as long as possible, and we want to end our years being as little trouble as possible. That doesn't preclude any of us stepping in and caring for our sick or dying elders with love and grace. We look at it with less entitlement all around. I suppose that's a basic difference between cultures that value independence and the individual versus cultures that push for hyper-dependence and putting the group over the individual.

I wonder how many people still feel just as strongly about this when they are actually dying alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I didn't say that I didn't value close family ties and supporting one another. But I do not expect my kids to put their own lives on hold and neglect their own responsibilities in in order to take care of me when I'm old. Don't get me wrong, I really hope that I get to see them at that stage of my life. I'm pretty sure that they will want to see me. Hopefully we can make that happen.

NP. This is some warped way of thinking. How is taking care of a loved one amounts to "putting your life on hold"? It is life. Unless you're orphaned/cut ties with family of origin, single, and childless. Again, it's a valid choice, and plenty of people enjoy it immensely. Maybe more people should consider it.

If you are, for instance, going out of town and leaving your family to go and take care of a parent then you are not there for your kids and spouse. Many can't make that happen. It doesn't mean that they don't love their parents, it's just that their kids and spouse have to come first.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I didn't say that I didn't value close family ties and supporting one another. But I do not expect my kids to put their own lives on hold and neglect their own responsibilities in in order to take care of me when I'm old. Don't get me wrong, I really hope that I get to see them at that stage of my life. I'm pretty sure that they will want to see me. Hopefully we can make that happen.

NP. This is some warped way of thinking. How is taking care of a loved one amounts to "putting your life on hold"? It is life. Unless you're orphaned/cut ties with family of origin, single, and childless. Again, it's a valid choice, and plenty of people enjoy it immensely. Maybe more people should consider it.

If you are, for instance, going out of town and leaving your family to go and take care of a parent then you are not there for your kids and spouse. Many can't make that happen. It doesn't mean that they don't love their parents, it's just that their kids and spouse have to come first.

Why do so many families not live near each other to begin with?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I didn't say that I didn't value close family ties and supporting one another. But I do not expect my kids to put their own lives on hold and neglect their own responsibilities in in order to take care of me when I'm old. Don't get me wrong, I really hope that I get to see them at that stage of my life. I'm pretty sure that they will want to see me. Hopefully we can make that happen.

NP. This is some warped way of thinking. How is taking care of a loved one amounts to "putting your life on hold"? It is life. Unless you're orphaned/cut ties with family of origin, single, and childless. Again, it's a valid choice, and plenty of people enjoy it immensely. Maybe more people should consider it.

It's not warped. It's simply a different cultural perspective from yours. In my family as well, as I saw from my great-grandparents, and my grandparents, my aged parents, and now for myself, we do not want to be a burden on our children or grandchildren. We want to live on our own and be as independent as possible, for as long as possible, and we want to end our years being as little trouble as possible. That doesn't preclude any of us stepping in and caring for our sick or dying elders with love and grace. We look at it with less entitlement all around. I suppose that's a basic difference between cultures that value independence and the individual versus cultures that push for hyper-dependence and putting the group over the individual.

This sounds good and sure would make someone feel less guilty about not taking care of their elderly parents, warm and fuzzy feel good talk.

The fact is the parents are still dependent on others to help them and care for them, those others are just strangers instead of family.

When you gave birth, did you want your mom to come be with you for a some time or would you have preferred a home health aide that you didn't know?

When you were sick with the flu, did you appreciate your husband bringing you soup or bringing you a blanket? Or would a home health aide have been just as comforting?

These are a person's last years, months, weeks, days of life. Do you really deep down think that they are perfectly satisfied with a complete stranger taking care of them at a time when they are at their most vulnerable state since they were a child?

If that's your view of independence, it is in fact warped it's just not convenient for you to see it that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

That is not my children's responsibility. That is not my expectation of them. End of story.

That's cool. Enjoy dying alone.

There are far worse things than dying alone my friend.

I'm sure there are. It is still incredibly sad when adult children "visit" their ailing parents once a year.

Again, there are far sadder things.

Maybe to you. Some people value close family ties and supporting one another.

Some people are martyrs and spend their final years embittered and a burden to their spouses and children.

[Anonymous]

Someone's pretty fixated on thinking people all live in the same cosy village forever being cared for by kind and loving relatives from cradle to grave.

There's more than one type of culture on the planet, more than one way to live and die, and people often make compromises and different choices in life. If your outlook and way of life comforts you, great. No one here will try to lock you in a room to die alone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I didn't say that I didn't value close family ties and supporting one another. But I do not expect my kids to put their own lives on hold and neglect their own responsibilities in in order to take care of me when I'm old. Don't get me wrong, I really hope that I get to see them at that stage of my life. I'm pretty sure that they will want to see me. Hopefully we can make that happen.

NP. This is some warped way of thinking. How is taking care of a loved one amounts to "putting your life on hold"? It is life. Unless you're orphaned/cut ties with family of origin, single, and childless. Again, it's a valid choice, and plenty of people enjoy it immensely. Maybe more people should consider it.

If you are, for instance, going out of town and leaving your family to go and take care of a parent then you are not there for your kids and spouse. Many can't make that happen. It doesn't mean that they don't love their parents, it's just that their kids and spouse have to come first.

Why do so many families not live near each other to begin with?

Well, let's see:

My FIL won't leave the little town he's live every day of his life in. My husband left it to go to college, and since econmic opportunities are about zero in said little town, we don't live near him.

My MIL started up an affair and ran off with her boyfriend. Last I knew, they were living in the mountains somewhere, eagerly awaiting the second coming.

As for my parents, they decided they wanted to retire to Florida.

[Anonymous]

Usually the parents want to stay in their hometown and not move closer to their children, who have moved away and established their own homes for educational and career reasons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Someone's pretty fixated on thinking people all live in the same cosy village forever being cared for by kind and loving relatives from cradle to grave.

There's more than one type of culture on the planet, more than one way to live and die, and people often make compromises and different choices in life. If your outlook and way of life comforts you, great. No one here will try to lock you in a room to die alone.

OK, well as a child of immigrants I both (1) understand that sometimes you need to leaves bad situation but also (2) realize America is an outlier in terms of how disconnected people are from their families and communities. Personally I find the latter sad. I guess a lot of people don't.

I wish you well with your independence during the prime of your life when you need the least support from anyone else. Just remember choices have consequences and humans have notoriously short time horizons in their decision-making. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Someone's pretty fixated on thinking people all live in the same cosy village forever being cared for by kind and loving relatives from cradle to grave.

There's more than one type of culture on the planet, more than one way to live and die, and people often make compromises and different choices in life. If your outlook and way of life comforts you, great. No one here will try to lock you in a room to die alone.

OK, well as a child of immigrants I both (1) understand that sometimes you need to leaves bad situation but also (2) realize America is an outlier in terms of how disconnected people are from their families and communities. Personally I find the latter sad. I guess a lot of people don't.

I wish you well with your independence during the prime of your life when you need the least support from anyone else. Just remember choices have consequences and humans have notoriously short time horizons in their decision-making. Good luck.

My prime was many decades ago. You assume this view is only held by people in their prime, and only by "Americans." As the child of immigrants, your view is skewed by your parents' culture, if you grew up in their home, so what you see is "Americans" from the outside, who you assume are sad and disconnected simply because you don't accept that there are gradations of independence and interaction within families according to cultural differences. I agree with you that Americans would benefit by having more options to stay near family and maintain connections more easily. In reality, most of us have to go where jobs take us, and this is a huge country.

My in-laws are immigrants from a culture where everyone is entangled in what my husband admits is a suffocating web of obligations and rules that get enforced with shunning, shaming, and invalidating any individual feelings that don't fit with the group's agenda. In their culture, it's implied that your elders basically own you until they die, and can overrule you in everything. In this type of culture, the individual's feelings and needs have to come second to those of the group (or the whim of the eldest). Under the surface of this family unit that appears so cosy and strong is plenty of dysfunction, shame, and seething resentment, and personality disorders that come from having your individuality beaten down all your life.

My in-laws and their first-generation adult children think everyone operates the way their culture does, and if they don't, they should. They assume I'm estranged from my own extended family simply because we don't live in each others' pockets and run each others' lives, as they do. I consider my family to be adequately close and very caring. We have actual boundaries, though, and respect privacy, individuality, and independence while still managing to care for each other. I guess that makes me a "disconnected" American. Of course I'm used to and prefer the freedoms of my culture, and I acknowledge it has its price in a certain insecurity that you don't feel. But I'll take freedom of choice over your sense of safety. There is something in the middle that's healthy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I really don't see any difference between OP and her mom. OP is resentful that mom won't help, mom is resentful that OP won't make time for her. I am neither unhappy, nor divorced, not about to be divorced, people who accuse other people of projecting. How can OP not know why her parents divorced? We all know she knows, she is either lying to herself or to others. Rare is an older woman who seeks divorce, the opposite is more common. Mom divorced Dad, but OP wants to divorce mom because mom won't help. In my mind OP's mom is seeing that her daughter is choosing Dad over her, no matter the illness. And yet again, it is all about Mom making the sacrifice, doing the right thing. Why are your parents divorced OP?

You don't see a difference between OP who is caring for a dying elder and that's causing her difficulties,
And mom who is living it up and making demands for social time with OP and then whining when she doesn't get what she wants?

Mom doesn't have to help. Just don't make it harder than it already is....

[Anonymous]

I haven't read through all the posts. But basically, the same thing happened to me only reversed and it was my mother who was sick. They divorced about 2 years before retirement as well. My father, who wanted nothing to do with my mother, did help me out. He didn't take care of mom, but he watch my child while I dealt with her. They still lived in the same town and he would drive me to and from the airport each time I came to town. He was helping ME during a rough time in my life. He was sorry that my mom was so sick - even if this was the same woman he came to hate.

I just thought he was being supportive of my needs - not hers. He really stepped up.

I think you should just explain to your mom. She should help you as life is really hard right now.

I am sorry. It sucks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I haven't read through all the posts. But basically, the same thing happened to me only reversed and it was my mother who was sick. They divorced about 2 years before retirement as well. My father, who wanted nothing to do with my mother, did help me out. He didn't take care of mom, but he watch my child while I dealt with her. They still lived in the same town and he would drive me to and from the airport each time I came to town. He was helping ME during a rough time in my life. He was sorry that my mom was so sick - even if this was the same woman he came to hate.

I just thought he was being supportive of my needs - not hers. He really stepped up.

I think you should just explain to your mom. She should help you as life is really hard right now.

I am sorry. It sucks.

oh - and my dad did whine once about how I wasn't spending time with him when I was in town. It was stressful time and I admit I snapped - but I was just told him - she's sick, she's dying she needs me and you don't. One day you will need me and I will be there for you too.

[Anonymous]

OP here. My dad died a few days after Christmas. It was incredibly difficult, he was very, very sick and out of it (morphine), but I do have a sense of peace for him. His body is gone, but I can still feel him with me at times.

We've gone through the difficult stuff. Funeral. Cleaning out the house, selling his home (which just went under contract) and explaining things to the kids who are old enough to realize what's happened. My husband has been a rock during the ordeal, but I can see the toll on myself and my sister. I swear we've aged ten years in one and I've lost so much weight that I've begun drinking ensure (eating has been difficult). My dad was the youngest one of his side of the family, the last living of that generation, so it's weird for me and my sister to be it for that side of the family. It's all surreal.

My mother was unhelpful during this whole thing. After realizing that the man wouldn't likely see New Year's, she opted to take a cruise during Christmas with friends and went to South America. To give us our space in her words. I didn't need space. I needed my mother, but that's a whole another story.

I don't know where the future will go with us, me and her. She skipped the funeral and hasn't done anything, but simply say sorry for your loss when I informed her he passed. I'm angry, but I cannot tease out whether it's the loss of my father or the abandonment of my mother during the difficult times that is fueling it.

She wrote me a very, very long email about her desire to visit, to see the Cherry Blossoms and to do various things around DC. She's begun calling and leaving long messages in a sing-songy voice. She's pretending everything's fine. It's not. I haven't responded, but that's mostly because I don't know what to say...

[Anonymous]

Sorry for your loss, OP. She may have really disliked your dad, for some private reason, and this is the best she can do. Nothing will make her mourn him if she didn't love him, no matter how you feel, and she seems to need to avoid seeing your pain. Either she's not a very empathetic person, or she needs to avoid it to keep from saying anything negative and hurting you even more.

You're going to have to let it go. You have this one parent left. Allow her to be who she wants to be to you and your kids. You can't change her, and you're still wasting energy resenting that. Stop projecting everything onto her.