married to someone with a perfect education pedigree who has never lived up to the potential

[Anonymous]

I think it's pretty obvious OP is an RN and her DH is an MD working for the government...NIH? FDA? She thought she hit the big ticket, but alas, hubby is following his passion instead of working in ortho surgery.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it's pretty obvious OP is an RN and her DH is an MD working for the government...NIH? FDA? She thought she hit the big ticket, but alas, hubby is following his passion instead of working in ortho surgery.

What's wrong with ortho? DH is ortho spine. He loves what he does.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it's pretty obvious OP is an RN and her DH is an MD working for the government...NIH? FDA? She thought she hit the big ticket, but alas, hubby is following his passion instead of working in ortho surgery.

I think you hit it on the head. OP is surrounded by or very aware of what others make in her husband's field. Makes sense that they are in similar industries. She knows too many people making $$$$$ and it makes her think her husband's income of $$$ is puny.

Surround yourself with people of similar or lower incomes and you will find that you feel wealthy. Surround yourself with people whose incomes are higher than yours and you will always feel poor no matter what your income actually is. I am grateful that I feel well-off (even though our HHI is significantly less than OP's).

[Anonymous]

It's best for OP if the DH IS an MD. Even if he's working for the gov't, as long as he's seeing patients, there is a hospital or private practice somewhere that will take him for more money than the gov't. Maybe the transition is easiest outside of DC, but it can be done. So why not convince the DH?? They can come up with a plan that he can pursue his "passion" and work for the gov't for x more years and then it's time for him to sacrifice for the family and move into the private sector for at least y more yrs.

It's definitely the easiest transition if he's in medicine, rather than law -- where you continuously have to worry about whether you can get on partnership track decades after the fact -- or business, where the banking/hedge fund types will look down on decades in the gov't.

[Anonymous]

Did not mean to imply there is anything wrong with Ortho, rather was trying to illustrate a point by using a higher paying specialty as an example. Your husband does good work!

It's an oversimplification to say her DH can go and find a PP gig. I find many docs in gov went that route because they didn't actually like the seeing patients part of medicine. Perhaps that's the issue?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP - I get what you're saying. Of course I only view an education as an investment as I wasn't that interested in learning, just doing things that would make me money. I got the same kind of degrees as your DH, saved up and invested, and when things didn't work out at times - I've landed in the govt, which I view as "time served" as those jobs give you "experience" that's different from the private sector while giving you time and a paycheck as you plot your next move.

Question re your DH - would he want to try out the private sector? Would he even be open to talking to people about opportunities? Do you think he could survive there or would he go in w a - it's 5 pm, my shift is up - kind of mentality?

Why can't you say this to your DH? Why can't you say - honey, we make x, but in order to be able to afford a nicer home and a vacation per yr, we need to be making y, can we talk about how you can make that happen for us with your Ivy MBA/JD/whatever, I'd do it if I could but there's just not the same potential in my career. What would he say in response to this invite to talk?

Why not just say, Honey, you have failed to live up to your potential. I married you expecting you to earn ---, and you have failed. You have 12 months to turn it around, or you are out on your ass. It's that simple.

You cannot be serious...

I'm the first PP you're quoting - nowhere did I say the message should be, you need to start earning x or we're done. But I do see money and lifestyle expectations as marital issues. Nothing wrong with her saying, when WE paid for and sacrificed for YOUR Harvard MBA or Hopkins MD or whatever, I expected that we were doing it to afford a nice house close in, a vacation every yr, retirement savings etc. WE are not there and having turned 40 already, can we talk about if/how to get there.

Reality is she married him with some expectation - and helped finance some of that expectation by helping pay for a degree or pay off loans. She deserves to be able to talk about what she wants out of life.

While you can still make drastic career changes in your 40s, it's that much harder in your 50s.

Did OP and her DH agree explicitly that he would meet those expectations? Or were/are those OP's expectations, not aligned with her DH's interests (or capabilities?)?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP I was with you until I read the worry that no being able to send the kids to private school meant you wouldn't have anything beyond a bare bones existence. While I do understand the frustration and sadness that comes with realizing life will not be what you once dreamt it will be, think about what really matters. Do you and your husband have fun together? Is he a good father? Do you love eachother? Money is certainly necesasry in this world but it doesn't buy happiness. Choices buy happiness. If you're stressed about money with your current lifestyle, downsize. I promise you there are few things worst than financial stress.

Nevertheless, if you and he both agreed he would pursuse a top university degree and that you would sacrifice your education for the benefit of your family as a whole, that totally sucks. I'd be annoyed too, but I'd talk to DH about why he is in his career vs. the career I envisioned, and think, very very carefully before throwing him out for having a solid steady albeit non-super star job. From a purely selfish POV, how much better is your life going to be if you divorce?

OP here. I appreciate what you say here.
I do want to clarify that my kids have been in public school for elementary and we're big advocates of public school. However, we have one child who may benefit from private school going forward so we're beginning to explore this for one child only.

OP, it sounds like you should consider changing jobs to make more money. YOU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, if you want more money, go out and make more yourself. Having an Ivy league education does not obligate anyone to chase the big $$$$$.

+1

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all the wives on here who feel their DHs aren't utilizing their degrees fully and hurting their family finances (and I agree w you -- unlike most of the responders) -- what do your DHs say when you talk to them about this? Or can you not bring this up with them?

I'm in a similar situation. At the height of the legal job bust (think '10) I took an attorney job with the gov't. DW will occasionally say something along the lines of "sometimes I worry that our HHI will max out at 300k." In response, I try to be open and honest, and explain that if I left gov't my $ trajectory may not be much better (factoring in Federal benefits, retirement, etc.). In addition, I am NOT at SEC, DOJ, or another agency that is particularly easy to leave for the private sector. Taking that into account, my exit options are likely consulting or mid/small-law which would not pay much more (or maybe even less) than I am making now. The problem is that a handful of my good friends from law school went biglaw (DC), and my sister is a doctor, so DW is always comparing. Not good.

It is a tragedy that you are married to someone who worries about having only $300K. Really. That is sad.

Agree. "Only" $300K. WTF is wrong with people?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm another guy with a pricey engineering degree from a great school and am making about $60k doing interesting work.
My wife resents the hell out of it and it will probably land us in divorce court.

I hear you - space kind of work by any chance? I have a masters, worked on projects that are in the Smithsonian (space), worked zillions of hours but got paid less than a new teacher. No hope for much more - unless you move to a boring job (commuter, management? Startup somewhere?).
I'm a gal but your wife could not have expected the big bucks because they are just not there. I used to mostly see engineering guys marry teachers or nurses - firmly middle class with no extra should have been expected. The guys were always grandstanding about how cool they were with their technical skills but I always wondered what the wives thought of the income if I thought I was getting pennies for the 80 hours of week of work (time away from kids and family for low pay seemed like a really bad deal to me).

I wouldn't want to change to a more boring job either. Hmmmmmm.

It was really hard work to get the degrees and you had to be really smart but then there was little pay associated with the career (exception is if you have a Ph.D. rather than just a masters). I'm not encouraging my kids towards engineering. Lots of workers from foreign countries taking the jobs anyway
- they can pay them even less.

OP can your hubby teach for a private school and get free tuition for the kids? If private school is a big priority you could talk about that.
Private high schools have many Ph.D.'s from good schools teaching there - which should also clue you in to the fact that all don't graduate and become hedge fund managers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I get it, OP. My DH is brilliant but has no motivation. He left a decent paying job to pursue a lower paying one that has much higher growth potential, but he's never pursued the growth. He works 60+ hours a week and makes about the same as our daycare costs. I earn most of the family money but my career advancement is limited because I have to be flexible to always be the one tending to sick days, appointments, and daycare pick-ups/drop-offs for the kids. It's hard.

If you earn most of the family $$ you explain to him that he takes time off work for sick kids, pickup, appts and the plumber

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all the wives on here who feel their DHs aren't utilizing their degrees fully and hurting their family finances (and I agree w you -- unlike most of the responders) -- what do your DHs say when you talk to them about this? Or can you not bring this up with them?

I'm in a similar situation. At the height of the legal job bust (think '10) I took an attorney job with the gov't. DW will occasionally say something along the lines of "sometimes I worry that our HHI will max out at 300k." In response, I try to be open and honest, and explain that if I left gov't my $ trajectory may not be much better (factoring in Federal benefits, retirement, etc.). In addition, I am NOT at SEC, DOJ, or another agency that is particularly easy to leave for the private sector. Taking that into account, my exit options are likely consulting or mid/small-law which would not pay much more (or maybe even less) than I am making now. The problem is that a handful of my good friends from law school went biglaw (DC), and my sister is a doctor, so DW is always comparing. Not good.

Wow. That makes me angry. Is she an attorney as well? Maybe you should tell her, yeah it would be great if you had your law degree too. Honestly that is a bitch way to act. I'm in a financial services agency myself and my husband is biglaw (for now). I obsess about my career and just assume he will leave biglaw at some point. I had to interview in a bad market - you were really good to get a gov't gig then.

Then again maybe you should try consulting since you'll travel so much. Maybe you can meet a woman who makes more than your wife!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:"Oh, woe is me, where's my sugar daddy?"

OP here.
Lol.
I supported him through school and financed his degree.
I am the sugar mama.

Or actually--I like to think of us as a team.

You are clearly a 'team' that didn't communicate. You had one idea and he had a totally different one.

Call me crazy but I considered my husbands work life his business. He was considering academic jobs - which are low pay- and ended up with a more comfortable corporate job, but that was his decision to make. Only thing I expressed a preference for was location - not the middle of nowhere where I couldn't get a job and not an extremely expensive area to live in if he had an academic job. His academic life and brain didn't become mine because we married - what a drag that would be.
That being said he is very selfless in spending little of our general $$ on anything but the family and he is dedicated to our kids. Could not ask for better.
We prob earn less then you but I guess I'm too clueless to be unhappy.

Forget the private school unless your kids have special needs to attend to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think it's pretty obvious OP is an RN and her DH is an MD working for the government...NIH? FDA? She thought she hit the big ticket, but alas, hubby is following his passion instead of working in ortho surgery.

I think you hit it on the head. OP is surrounded by or very aware of what others make in her husband's field. Makes sense that they are in similar industries. She knows too many people making $$$$$ and it makes her think her husband's income of $$$ is puny.

Surround yourself with people of similar or lower incomes and you will find that you feel wealthy. Surround yourself with people whose incomes are higher than yours and you will always feel poor no matter what your income actually is. I am grateful that I feel well-off (even though our HHI is significantly less than OP's).

Time to move .... Perhaps far away. You know an MD in Arkansas can live pretty large, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
I feel like I'm in the same situation, with a DW who feels entitled to some sort of pampered dream-life, just because of the degree (translation in her mind: future paycheck) she married.

In our situation, HHI is $250K -- DW $90K DH ~$160K. DH graduated from an excellent school, working for the government. DW not driven career-wise - could certainly do more if she wanted to. Hasn't really done so because of desire to be around for the kids. Educational debt was completely paid off within first year of marriage, well over a decade ago and DW never really had to take any meaningful responsibility for that.

DW would say exactly the same things as OP, I'm sure. I've often been told how much I disappoint her, how I haven't risen to my potential. But I'm happy with what I'm doing; it's meaningful work. Yes, it's busy sometimes -- but I'm able to spend AMPLE time with her and with the kids. Sometimes the known, even at lower income, is better than the risk of the unknown, particularly when time off, work-life balance, and general job satisfaction are part of the equation.

I wish OP and my DW the best in their quest for inclusion in the 0.1% via marriage.

Did all this stuff come re DW's expectations come out after marriage, or did you have an idea before getting married? Not that it changes anything but I'm curious as to whether these women are the types who say -- oh honey I just want you to be happy, I love that you love your meaningful job -- before marriage, and then after marriage it turns into -- you know Jane's DH has the same degree as you and makes 250k, why don't you look around for other opportunities? Or are these wives giving hints when they're just girlfriends re -- your job is fine FOR NOW, but who knows what opportunities you'll have later -- i.e. opportunities paying more.

I think the guys know. They know because they have married someone way out of their league - sound true at all? We knew a couple like that - the gal wanted a double the size diamond engagement ring after two years of marriage. She wanted to stay home with kid but have a nanny and maid and a Beamer too. He knew what he was getting himself into from the start....