Middle school boys suck

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:My son stopped playing sports at school once he hit 9th grade because while he loved his sport, he was a middle of the pack player and got nothing but grief.

He has other passions and interests so it's not as if quitting his sport left him with nothing else at school but trash talk culture is a bummer. Because NONE OF THESE KIDS ARE GOING TO THE NFL/NBA/MLB. None.

+1

20 years from now, 99.999% of them will be playing in beer leagues. Heck, statistically 70% of them will quit by high school. The trash talk and posturing is so weird.

My DS is in the same boat. Athletically he’s middle of the pack, good skills but not especially aggressive or self-confident. The A team kids in his grade make fun of his hair, call him a nerd, and constantly roast him. He can beat them 1 on 1 at recess, even when they blatantly cheat, but at tryouts they all gang up and never pass the ball to him. We ended up dropping down to rec because the local club/travel teams were full of the same toxic behavior. The extra expense wasn’t worth the constant hits on his self-esteem. He has a lot more fun playing with kids who aren’t out to prove something.

His worst bully ended up also making the B team this year. After they played together for a season (and lost every single game, lol) the bully calmed down a lot and was nicer to DS. Hopefully they’ll all settle down once they realize they’re not That Guy.

A lot of very successful men were athletes. I’m not saying they played professional or even college sports but they were all athletic.

DH played sports. He wasn’t a recruit or anything but he played varsity high school. He enjoys playing and watching sports. His brother was valedictorian of his high school, not into sports, does t like to watch sports. He seems to struggle more socially and professionally.

You seem to understand all about your BIL.

All I’m saying is my BIL never got along with the jocks and it hurts him professionally. DH isn’t the best golfer but he likes to socialize. He goes to Super Bowl or baseball or basketball games. BIL just isn’t interested and never has been interested in sports.

I have friends with boys not good at sports. They say their boys struggle socially. My boys have always liked and played sports. They have always had friends and don’t struggle socially.

What is your point here? Are you just so relieved that things worked out for your boys that you came here to low-key gloat? There are many boys who are athletic and good at sports, and they struggle socially for whatever reason, including that boys often like to take the best players down a peg. You seem very weird, OP, coming here to compare your kids to others and your DH to your BIL.

I don’t know what your problem is. One of pps said 99% of these kids won’t play in nba, nfl, etc. I was just saying that in America, sports is very much part of the culture and boys who don’t play or don’t like sports struggle socially.

I’m not on the field but there is plenty of trash talking. Boys need to grow a thicker skin. People are too sensitive.

I say this as a parent of a kid who didn’t make his first choice AAU basketball team. My kid is a great athlete but not an elite athlete. I don’t know who or what anyone said to him but he looked sad going to school today.

Yep, everyone just needs to buck up. Keep spreading the love, OP. Sorry your son sucks.

A lot of people on this thread seem to be coddling parents of teen boys. This is middle school, not kindergarten. Buck up.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I wasn't there for that trash talk, but sometimes I see my kids (one boy, one girl) pile on each other just to score points/try to be funny/have something to say. I discourage it and sometimes they'll tell me, "That's just how we talk!" I truly see them not knowing what to talk about sometimes, so they'll just go in on each other. I'm not proud of it and not excusing it, but maybe that's an answer to the, "Why so much trash talk?"

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There’s a difference between trash talk amongst peers and friends and cruel ridicule of kids who are weaker. They know the difference.

No they don't the difference. At all. Kids are horribly insecure at that age. They can't tell the difference. They know whey they are doing it but to the recipient of the trash talk, their feelings are easily hurt.

OP here: Yup. These are his friends. I mean as I said the main kid here practically lives at our house. These are people he considers his best friends, and they consider him their best friends. It still hurts when your friends rag on you. The kids don't seem to know the line. Which I know they are learning and will figure it out one day (i hope!). Doesn't mean it doesn't hurt along the way.

I don't think he has any desire to ditch these people, but just wishes they would recognize his other accomplishments sometimes and not just care about sports.

You said in your original post that his one true friend moved. Now you’re saying they consider your son their best friend. Best friends go to each others activities.

My son was horrible at sports. One summer when he was nine years old I sent him to a local that was held at a private school that had a lake. I did not realize that the sports would be taken so seriously. His first two days the bullies were laughing at him, mimicking him, mocking him. I called to tell them the problem he was having. They apologized and the bullying stopped right away.

That was the last time I made the mistake of thinking I could just sign him up for any camp. I picked appropriate camps from then on with no problems.

The top athletes usually don’t bother tormenting the less talented team mates. It’s usually the ones who are better than their target but not that great themselves. And his sobbing makes it apparent that it wasn’t just fun trash talking.

I hope you can find a great STEM summer camp program where he will be his element and can hold his own.

Oh i don't think I said "one true friend" I said the one new friend he made this year. He has camps he love (mostly outdoor survival camps and he goes to sleep away camp). But he is doing a marine science based camp in Florida this year which is new. He is excited

That sounds excellent. He’s got a lot going for him. There is no need for him to play basketball if it makes him that unhappy.

+1 basketball is kind of a trash talk sport traditionally. It’s very physical and you are literally in people’s faces. If wants to play a sport he could try baseball. There are lots of opportunities to be good at something between the positions

The trash talking can be almost as bad in baseball. I’ve been in tournaments and games where the umpires have had to call time to reprimand teams for their lack of sportsmanship. Of course, parents do it too. I’ve heard cross country parents are very supportive.

But agree basketball is bad because it’s so physical and spectators are jammed packed next to each other.

We’ve had a good experience on rec baseball, even being on terrible teams

Rec baseball is way better than travel. Travel baseball players act like entitled jerks, because their parents and coaches treat them like professional players. It's the worst. But rec is usually fine.

We've been through a lot of sports: baseball, basketball, soccer, volleyball, flag football, softball, wrestling, and tackle football.

The two best, when comes it respect and teammate support: wrestling.

It is very rare to see a wrestler showboat or trash-talk their opponent. And if they do, their coach usually shuts it down immediately. Anyone that steps on the mat gets respect. And I've never heard of any issues with teammates. They're all in it together.

Something to consider for your son, OP, especially since wrestling takes all sizes.

My son has played travel baseball and basketball for years. I have never seen any of the players act the way you describe. Other than typical age-appropriate kid behavior, I have actually been struck by how NICE these kids are now compared to when we were kids.

Maybe you’ve just had bad luck with bad teams.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son stopped playing sports at school once he hit 9th grade because while he loved his sport, he was a middle of the pack player and got nothing but grief.

He has other passions and interests so it's not as if quitting his sport left him with nothing else at school but trash talk culture is a bummer. Because NONE OF THESE KIDS ARE GOING TO THE NFL/NBA/MLB. None.

+1

20 years from now, 99.999% of them will be playing in beer leagues. Heck, statistically 70% of them will quit by high school. The trash talk and posturing is so weird.

My DS is in the same boat. Athletically he’s middle of the pack, good skills but not especially aggressive or self-confident. The A team kids in his grade make fun of his hair, call him a nerd, and constantly roast him. He can beat them 1 on 1 at recess, even when they blatantly cheat, but at tryouts they all gang up and never pass the ball to him. We ended up dropping down to rec because the local club/travel teams were full of the same toxic behavior. The extra expense wasn’t worth the constant hits on his self-esteem. He has a lot more fun playing with kids who aren’t out to prove something.

His worst bully ended up also making the B team this year. After they played together for a season (and lost every single game, lol) the bully calmed down a lot and was nicer to DS. Hopefully they’ll all settle down once they realize they’re not That Guy.

A lot of very successful men were athletes. I’m not saying they played professional or even college sports but they were all athletic.

DH played sports. He wasn’t a recruit or anything but he played varsity high school. He enjoys playing and watching sports. His brother was valedictorian of his high school, not into sports, does t like to watch sports. He seems to struggle more socially and professionally.

You seem to understand all about your BIL.

All I’m saying is my BIL never got along with the jocks and it hurts him professionally. DH isn’t the best golfer but he likes to socialize. He goes to Super Bowl or baseball or basketball games. BIL just isn’t interested and never has been interested in sports.

I have friends with boys not good at sports. They say their boys struggle socially. My boys have always liked and played sports. They have always had friends and don’t struggle socially.

What is your point here? Are you just so relieved that things worked out for your boys that you came here to low-key gloat? There are many boys who are athletic and good at sports, and they struggle socially for whatever reason, including that boys often like to take the best players down a peg. You seem very weird, OP, coming here to compare your kids to others and your DH to your BIL.

I don’t know what your problem is. One of pps said 99% of these kids won’t play in nba, nfl, etc. I was just saying that in America, sports is very much part of the culture and boys who don’t play or don’t like sports struggle socially.

I’m not on the field but there is plenty of trash talking. Boys need to grow a thicker skin. People are too sensitive.

? It’s factually true that the vast majority of kids aren’t going to play sports for a living. Not sure why that disturbed you. Lots of boys develop character, self confidence and social/vocational success outside of sports. Lots of boys within sports are miserable and ostracized. It’s not a magic road, or the only road, to connecting with other people.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I wasn't there for that trash talk, but sometimes I see my kids (one boy, one girl) pile on each other just to score points/try to be funny/have something to say. I discourage it and sometimes they'll tell me, "That's just how we talk!" I truly see them not knowing what to talk about sometimes, so they'll just go in on each other. I'm not proud of it and not excusing it, but maybe that's an answer to the, "Why so much trash talk?"

.

There’s a difference between trash talk amongst peers and friends and cruel ridicule of kids who are weaker. They know the difference.

No they don't the difference. At all. Kids are horribly insecure at that age. They can't tell the difference. They know whey they are doing it but to the recipient of the trash talk, their feelings are easily hurt.

OP here: Yup. These are his friends. I mean as I said the main kid here practically lives at our house. These are people he considers his best friends, and they consider him their best friends. It still hurts when your friends rag on you. The kids don't seem to know the line. Which I know they are learning and will figure it out one day (i hope!). Doesn't mean it doesn't hurt along the way.

I don't think he has any desire to ditch these people, but just wishes they would recognize his other accomplishments sometimes and not just care about sports.

You said in your original post that his one true friend moved. Now you’re saying they consider your son their best friend. Best friends go to each others activities.

My son was horrible at sports. One summer when he was nine years old I sent him to a local that was held at a private school that had a lake. I did not realize that the sports would be taken so seriously. His first two days the bullies were laughing at him, mimicking him, mocking him. I called to tell them the problem he was having. They apologized and the bullying stopped right away.

That was the last time I made the mistake of thinking I could just sign him up for any camp. I picked appropriate camps from then on with no problems.

The top athletes usually don’t bother tormenting the less talented team mates. It’s usually the ones who are better than their target but not that great themselves. And his sobbing makes it apparent that it wasn’t just fun trash talking.

I hope you can find a great STEM summer camp program where he will be his element and can hold his own.

Oh i don't think I said "one true friend" I said the one new friend he made this year. He has camps he love (mostly outdoor survival camps and he goes to sleep away camp). But he is doing a marine science based camp in Florida this year which is new. He is excited

That sounds excellent. He’s got a lot going for him. There is no need for him to play basketball if it makes him that unhappy.

+1 basketball is kind of a trash talk sport traditionally. It’s very physical and you are literally in people’s faces. If wants to play a sport he could try baseball. There are lots of opportunities to be good at something between the positions

The trash talking can be almost as bad in baseball. I’ve been in tournaments and games where the umpires have had to call time to reprimand teams for their lack of sportsmanship. Of course, parents do it too. I’ve heard cross country parents are very supportive.

But agree basketball is bad because it’s so physical and spectators are jammed packed next to each other.

We’ve had a good experience on rec baseball, even being on terrible teams

Rec baseball is way better than travel. Travel baseball players act like entitled jerks, because their parents and coaches treat them like professional players. It's the worst. But rec is usually fine.

We've been through a lot of sports: baseball, basketball, soccer, volleyball, flag football, softball, wrestling, and tackle football.

The two best, when comes it respect and teammate support: wrestling.

It is very rare to see a wrestler showboat or trash-talk their opponent. And if they do, their coach usually shuts it down immediately. Anyone that steps on the mat gets respect. And I've never heard of any issues with teammates. They're all in it together.

Something to consider for your son, OP, especially since wrestling takes all sizes.

My son has played travel baseball and basketball for years. I have never seen any of the players act the way you describe. Other than typical age-appropriate kid behavior, I have actually been struck by how NICE these kids are now compared to when we were kids.

Maybe you’ve just had bad luck with bad teams.

We have had some bad luck with bad teams, which is why we've switched teams. But its not just the teams we're on; its also the teams we're playing.

The show-boating, the arrogance, arguing with umps, etc. It's toxic throughout baseball.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wasn't there for that trash talk, but sometimes I see my kids (one boy, one girl) pile on each other just to score points/try to be funny/have something to say. I discourage it and sometimes they'll tell me, "That's just how we talk!" I truly see them not knowing what to talk about sometimes, so they'll just go in on each other. I'm not proud of it and not excusing it, but maybe that's an answer to the, "Why so much trash talk?"

.

There’s a difference between trash talk amongst peers and friends and cruel ridicule of kids who are weaker. They know the difference.

No they don't the difference. At all. Kids are horribly insecure at that age. They can't tell the difference. They know whey they are doing it but to the recipient of the trash talk, their feelings are easily hurt.

OP here: Yup. These are his friends. I mean as I said the main kid here practically lives at our house. These are people he considers his best friends, and they consider him their best friends. It still hurts when your friends rag on you. The kids don't seem to know the line. Which I know they are learning and will figure it out one day (i hope!). Doesn't mean it doesn't hurt along the way.

I don't think he has any desire to ditch these people, but just wishes they would recognize his other accomplishments sometimes and not just care about sports.

You said in your original post that his one true friend moved. Now you’re saying they consider your son their best friend. Best friends go to each others activities.

My son was horrible at sports. One summer when he was nine years old I sent him to a local that was held at a private school that had a lake. I did not realize that the sports would be taken so seriously. His first two days the bullies were laughing at him, mimicking him, mocking him. I called to tell them the problem he was having. They apologized and the bullying stopped right away.

That was the last time I made the mistake of thinking I could just sign him up for any camp. I picked appropriate camps from then on with no problems.

The top athletes usually don’t bother tormenting the less talented team mates. It’s usually the ones who are better than their target but not that great themselves. And his sobbing makes it apparent that it wasn’t just fun trash talking.

I hope you can find a great STEM summer camp program where he will be his element and can hold his own.

Oh i don't think I said "one true friend" I said the one new friend he made this year. He has camps he love (mostly outdoor survival camps and he goes to sleep away camp). But he is doing a marine science based camp in Florida this year which is new. He is excited

That sounds excellent. He’s got a lot going for him. There is no need for him to play basketball if it makes him that unhappy.

+1 basketball is kind of a trash talk sport traditionally. It’s very physical and you are literally in people’s faces. If wants to play a sport he could try baseball. There are lots of opportunities to be good at something between the positions

The trash talking can be almost as bad in baseball. I’ve been in tournaments and games where the umpires have had to call time to reprimand teams for their lack of sportsmanship. Of course, parents do it too. I’ve heard cross country parents are very supportive.

But agree basketball is bad because it’s so physical and spectators are jammed packed next to each other.

We’ve had a good experience on rec baseball, even being on terrible teams

Rec baseball is way better than travel. Travel baseball players act like entitled jerks, because their parents and coaches treat them like professional players. It's the worst. But rec is usually fine.

We've been through a lot of sports: baseball, basketball, soccer, volleyball, flag football, softball, wrestling, and tackle football.

The two best, when comes it respect and teammate support: wrestling.

It is very rare to see a wrestler showboat or trash-talk their opponent. And if they do, their coach usually shuts it down immediately. Anyone that steps on the mat gets respect. And I've never heard of any issues with teammates. They're all in it together.

Something to consider for your son, OP, especially since wrestling takes all sizes.

My son has played travel baseball and basketball for years. I have never seen any of the players act the way you describe. Other than typical age-appropriate kid behavior, I have actually been struck by how NICE these kids are now compared to when we were kids.

Maybe you’ve just had bad luck with bad teams.

We have had some bad luck with bad teams, which is why we've switched teams. But its not just the teams we're on; its also the teams we're playing.

The show-boating, the arrogance, arguing with umps, etc. It's toxic throughout baseball.

+1

So much awful behavior in travel baseball. Some teams are better than others, yes.

[Anonymous]

A pitch to look at Scouts f/k/a Boy Scouts. There are a good many science kids in scouts. It’s outdoorsy and camping but not athletic oriented.

We were late comers to Scouting, but two of my boys did it and went through Eagle rank. It’s a very good middle school activity for kids who are not way into sports. My older son played fairly low level travel soccer and had no problem fitting it in. It’s a once a week thing then weekend camping once a month or so. Also, the troops typically do a week in the summer.

The kids learn some useful stuff, but mostly it’s a good place for kids to fit in. Lots of kids stop when they hit high school ages which is totally fine. Kids who want to “make Eagle” typically have to stick around to 16 or so. But, there will be a few science kids. Mine weren’t, but love telling the story of the younger scout leading them on an orienteering course and intentionally going off track so that he could take some water samples in a swamp for an experiment. That kid did his Eagle ceremony the same time as my youngest and flew back from Boston for the ceremony- he had started at Harvard.

My kids mostly liked learning how to camp and hike, and will take off a couple times a year to backpack/camp for a few days. Goodness knows they didn’t get that from me.

Once kids hit high school there are more non-sport things to do - theater, robotics, etc that don’t meet once a month.

The kids do learn and practice actual leadership skills. Those are frankly hard to get outside of a very few kid activities. It is one thing that my other kids were very impressed by their younger siblings. By high school, They could do group tasks with kids they did not know well and get things accomplished without being jerks.

[Anonymous]

Thanks PP he is in scouts and loves it. I think he feels like he really shines there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son stopped playing sports at school once he hit 9th grade because while he loved his sport, he was a middle of the pack player and got nothing but grief.

He has other passions and interests so it's not as if quitting his sport left him with nothing else at school but trash talk culture is a bummer. Because NONE OF THESE KIDS ARE GOING TO THE NFL/NBA/MLB. None.

+1

20 years from now, 99.999% of them will be playing in beer leagues. Heck, statistically 70% of them will quit by high school. The trash talk and posturing is so weird.

My DS is in the same boat. Athletically he’s middle of the pack, good skills but not especially aggressive or self-confident. The A team kids in his grade make fun of his hair, call him a nerd, and constantly roast him. He can beat them 1 on 1 at recess, even when they blatantly cheat, but at tryouts they all gang up and never pass the ball to him. We ended up dropping down to rec because the local club/travel teams were full of the same toxic behavior. The extra expense wasn’t worth the constant hits on his self-esteem. He has a lot more fun playing with kids who aren’t out to prove something.

His worst bully ended up also making the B team this year. After they played together for a season (and lost every single game, lol) the bully calmed down a lot and was nicer to DS. Hopefully they’ll all settle down once they realize they’re not That Guy.

A lot of very successful men were athletes. I’m not saying they played professional or even college sports but they were all athletic.

DH played sports. He wasn’t a recruit or anything but he played varsity high school. He enjoys playing and watching sports. His brother was valedictorian of his high school, not into sports, does t like to watch sports. He seems to struggle more socially and professionally.

You seem to understand all about your BIL.

All I’m saying is my BIL never got along with the jocks and it hurts him professionally. DH isn’t the best golfer but he likes to socialize. He goes to Super Bowl or baseball or basketball games. BIL just isn’t interested and never has been interested in sports.

I have friends with boys not good at sports. They say their boys struggle socially. My boys have always liked and played sports. They have always had friends and don’t struggle socially.

Stereotyping here. You’re using example of people you know, picking and choosing. There are just as many guys who played sports and peaked in high school. I can give plenty of examples that show the exact opposite but there’s no point.

[Anonymous]

My kid does rock climbing, and it's not as bro-y and more supportive. See if there is a climbing gym near you. They offer intro teams and summer camps. All the stuff is mixed-gender, except for actual competitions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Also, your son probably just needs empathy and an ear to hear his feelings. You don’t need to “solve” this for him or find him stem friends or whatnot. Let him vent and validate his feelings. He will find ways to develop resilience and find friends and situations that fill his bucket.

+1 It sounds like it was a rough night, which we all have from time to time.

I would tone it down with the "middle schools boys suck." You said these are his buddies and that he goes to BS and enjoys it. Trying to "other" these boys, or put blame isn't helpful. It's also escalating it for your DS, even if you aren't saying it in front of him. Taking on a kid's energy I've found is never helpful, and can lead to a complex.

Besides, I had two middle school boys long ago and knew many of them; all in all they were great kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, your son probably just needs empathy and an ear to hear his feelings. You don’t need to “solve” this for him or find him stem friends or whatnot. Let him vent and validate his feelings. He will find ways to develop resilience and find friends and situations that fill his bucket.

+1 It sounds like it was a rough night, which we all have from time to time.

I would tone it down with the "middle schools boys suck." You said these are his buddies and that he goes to BS and enjoys it. Trying to "other" these boys, or put blame isn't helpful. It's also escalating it for your DS, even if you aren't saying it in front of him. Taking on a kid's energy I've found is never helpful, and can lead to a complex.

Besides, I had two middle school boys long ago and knew many of them; all in all they were great kids.

OP: I promise I don't say that to him! Goodness. I think I posted in my first post it was just a vent. I really love all of his friends (most of the time ha ha). I am not taking on anything negative. Just listening to him that is all and venting because as a mom it sucks when your kid cries.

[Anonymous]

Just middle school?

I’ve found them to be sucky since around 5th grade and all ages beyond that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Also, your son probably just needs empathy and an ear to hear his feelings. You don’t need to “solve” this for him or find him stem friends or whatnot. Let him vent and validate his feelings. He will find ways to develop resilience and find friends and situations that fill his bucket.

+1 It sounds like it was a rough night, which we all have from time to time.

I would tone it down with the "middle schools boys suck." You said these are his buddies and that he goes to BS and enjoys it. Trying to "other" these boys, or put blame isn't helpful. It's also escalating it for your DS, even if you aren't saying it in front of him. Taking on a kid's energy I've found is never helpful, and can lead to a complex.

Besides, I had two middle school boys long ago and knew many of them; all in all they were great kids.

OP: I promise I don't say that to him! Goodness. I think I posted in my first post it was just a vent. I really love all of his friends (most of the time ha ha). I am not taking on anything negative. Just listening to him that is all and venting because as a mom it sucks when your kid cries.

Ask the other parents you know if they can think of any kids who are very interested in science/the type things your kid likes. Arlington is small, I think you’ll find some ideas.

[Anonymous]

I teach middle school. Let me just say that this is all fairly simple. Boys do these things because no one stops them. The teachers . . . the parents . . . the vice principals. No one. The best you can do as a parent is take a role in helping your middle schooler spend time with the right people, be they kids or adults.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My son stopped playing sports at school once he hit 9th grade because while he loved his sport, he was a middle of the pack player and got nothing but grief.

He has other passions and interests so it's not as if quitting his sport left him with nothing else at school but trash talk culture is a bummer. Because NONE OF THESE KIDS ARE GOING TO THE NFL/NBA/MLB. None.

+1

20 years from now, 99.999% of them will be playing in beer leagues. Heck, statistically 70% of them will quit by high school. The trash talk and posturing is so weird.

My DS is in the same boat. Athletically he’s middle of the pack, good skills but not especially aggressive or self-confident. The A team kids in his grade make fun of his hair, call him a nerd, and constantly roast him. He can beat them 1 on 1 at recess, even when they blatantly cheat, but at tryouts they all gang up and never pass the ball to him. We ended up dropping down to rec because the local club/travel teams were full of the same toxic behavior. The extra expense wasn’t worth the constant hits on his self-esteem. He has a lot more fun playing with kids who aren’t out to prove something.

His worst bully ended up also making the B team this year. After they played together for a season (and lost every single game, lol) the bully calmed down a lot and was nicer to DS. Hopefully they’ll all settle down once they realize they’re not That Guy.

A lot of very successful men were athletes. I’m not saying they played professional or even college sports but they were all athletic.

DH played sports. He wasn’t a recruit or anything but he played varsity high school. He enjoys playing and watching sports. His brother was valedictorian of his high school, not into sports, does t like to watch sports. He seems to struggle more socially and professionally.

You seem to understand all about your BIL.

All I’m saying is my BIL never got along with the jocks and it hurts him professionally. DH isn’t the best golfer but he likes to socialize. He goes to Super Bowl or baseball or basketball games. BIL just isn’t interested and never has been interested in sports.

I have friends with boys not good at sports. They say their boys struggle socially. My boys have always liked and played sports. They have always had friends and don’t struggle socially.

Stereotyping here. You’re using example of people you know, picking and choosing. There are just as many guys who played sports and peaked in high school. I can give plenty of examples that show the exact opposite but there’s no point.

+1 What a silly stereotype. My son has never been on a sports team and is now a senior. He can get along with anyone and is not shy. Loves giving presentations to his classmates and is in FBLA; wants to start his own business someday. He will do fine socially and professionally and will have to settle for outings at TopGolf which is more fun anyways.