S/O: ‘The DIL is in the busiest chapter of her life; you have nothing to do’

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Some of you that don’t want your MIL to compliment you and your kids sound insane to me. My MIL often says I’m a great/amazing mom and also throws in that I’m a great/amazing wife sometimes. I tend to cringe a tiny bit on the great wife part since I think of that as a little old fashioned. But I know she loves me and means well. I’m super appreciative she feels this way about me. We have two kids with complicated medical stuff so this means a lot to me.

You're wrong. We don't want insincere compliments. I don't want to be told how amazing and perfect I am when I am feeling that I am behind and not being the mom/wife/employee I want to be. Just help me by volunteering to take your grandkids a few hours in the evening or weekend or pick up a fill-in grocery order, etc. if I'm throwing a family bbq, come over early to help me set up or watch the kids. Think about what help you needed and offer those things. I don't need flattery and deference to my mom.

This is so interesting because I can’t even imagine what I WANT, I only know what I find annoying.

Like, I can’t imagine my wanting my MIL coming over before a BBQ to help because she would act clueless about everything. What I would want from HER is for her to show up second to last and just not make it all about her entrance.

So how can I even possibly know what my kids would want? Would they even want me to come early and help?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is such a great thread. Thank you for posting it OP.

Ok, both my kids are in college now so there is probably many years ahead still until they hopefully settle down and have kids. But everyone here has got me thinking. What would the ideal relationship between ILs/parents and their adult children with families be or involve? I can think of some things but I'm sure I am missing many others:

1. the obvious things like not putting extra pressure on DIL/Son-in-law/adult children to visit us, host me, call, etc. etc.
2. if living in close proximity, offer to babysit and as grandkids grow older offer to have them come for sleepovers
3. again, if living close enough, offer to help with any carpooling
4. if not living in close proximity, offer to take grandkids for a week+ over the summer; again, help with babysitting

In a different vein, I can see the following should also be on this list:
5. remember how hard it really is to raise young kids, balance work and home life and all the things that all of that involves
6. really try to not have unfair expectations of your DIL/Son-in-law/adult children expecting them to fit us in to their busy schedules just because we "are here!"; instead the goal is to add value to their lives when we visit
7. remember that as much as we all love one another remember that on a day-to-day basis, parents to grown adults with families are just not as relevant anymore and that that is okay - it is just the cycle of life

What else?

Advice/ observations from a mother of sons, MIL and grandmother.

For better or worse, you've had your turn raising children. Your children deserve their turn without your micromanaging.

Please let go of any and all expectations. Let your adult offspring know you'll always offer help and support to the extent of your abilities. But wait for them to ask! Don't intrude. Let them call you, and thank them for the call. Ask them what they want to do for holidays and vacations and be happy with whatever they propose. That doesn't mean you can't decide you're having Thanksgiving at your house this year (for whatever reason) but don't guilt them if they don't come.

Follow their house rules when you visit. Tell them they are wonderful parents. Tell them their children are perfect. Yes, we all know this is a polite fiction but your job is to praise and be supportive unless asked for advice. If DIL asks for advice, pause thoughtfully, and ask what her mother thinks before you say another word. If DIL tells you she doesn't know how on earth you did it all, tell her you had lots and lots of help. You didn't do it on your own. She's the best mother you know.

Don't show up at the hospital for births unless invited. Say you're very excited to visit or to help out whenever they're
Howeverld us all her friends but wait for that call. When they do call...go asap. Have no opinion on breast vs bottle other than baby looks perfect so obviously being fed correctly.

Don't be competitive or jealous with the other grandparents.

I could go on all day... nice break from wordle. And of course all this advice is for normal kinds of circumstances.

The bolded above in particular caught my attention and I think it deserves to be discussed. I think that the PP who does this is incredibly insightful. To ask what the DIL's mother thinks -- to recognize that this younger woman who your son selected as his wife has her own mother -- is to me a sign of sensitivity and respect. It tells the DIL that you are there for her but that you also know the hierarchy. Before everyone comes at me for using the word "hierarchy" please really think about the relationships involved. If the DIL has a healthy relationship with her own mother, she can of course still have a rich and wonderful one with her MIL but the fact will always remain that the DIL's own mother is a slight bit above. It is just the natural order. I think if more MIL's recognized this of their relationships with their DIL's so many of the issues that come up might be averted.

Thanks so much. At the risk of derailing a thread focused on DILs, a few random observations on being a MIL. My mother and I were incredibly close. She was my care taker during pregnancy, childbirth, and postpartum, and the most amazing grandmother ever. And that's absolutely not hyperbole. Every one of her daughters' children would tell you the same. it was a challenge for her to have a married son and have a different place in that family hierarchy,. (Love your description). She did the best she could, but always worried that relationship wasn't what she might have hoped for. But seemingly it was good enough, because my SIL gave a tearful eulogy praising her as the best MIL ever. She told us all her friends were always complaining about their MILs and she just felt so sorry for them because she had the best MIL ever. (more bubble dependent hyperbole) but I think it was sincere because SIL repeatedly brings up my mom as a model of how to be a MIL. Recently she told me her best friend's son had gotten engaged and she asked friend what she had sent fiancee after announcement. Friend asks," I'm supposed to send her a gift?" SIL: "Yes, absolutely. That's what my MIL did". Over and over she'll mention to me she's doing something a certain way, " because that's how your mom did it".

Good lessons for me. I know I'm not going to be the number one grandma, but that's okay. My goal is best number two back up possible. However, the huge surprise is how much of a relief it was my son had a MIL. Almost my first thought on getting engagement news was now there is another mom. If something happens to me, he still has a mom. Huge relief.

This is kind of strange IMO. My thought would be, huge relief, now when I pass away eventually , he has a wife (and possibly kids, down the line). He won’t be alone. He has his own family now. Not “oh he has another mom”. Like, what about the wife?? lol.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is such a great thread. Thank you for posting it OP.

Ok, both my kids are in college now so there is probably many years ahead still until they hopefully settle down and have kids. But everyone here has got me thinking. What would the ideal relationship between ILs/parents and their adult children with families be or involve? I can think of some things but I'm sure I am missing many others:

1. the obvious things like not putting extra pressure on DIL/Son-in-law/adult children to visit us, host me, call, etc. etc.
2. if living in close proximity, offer to babysit and as grandkids grow older offer to have them come for sleepovers
3. again, if living close enough, offer to help with any carpooling
4. if not living in close proximity, offer to take grandkids for a week+ over the summer; again, help with babysitting

In a different vein, I can see the following should also be on this list:
5. remember how hard it really is to raise young kids, balance work and home life and all the things that all of that involves
6. really try to not have unfair expectations of your DIL/Son-in-law/adult children expecting them to fit us in to their busy schedules just because we "are here!"; instead the goal is to add value to their lives when we visit
7. remember that as much as we all love one another remember that on a day-to-day basis, parents to grown adults with families are just not as relevant anymore and that that is okay - it is just the cycle of life

What else?

Advice/ observations from a mother of sons, MIL and grandmother.

For better or worse, you've had your turn raising children. Your children deserve their turn without your micromanaging.

Please let go of any and all expectations. Let your adult offspring know you'll always offer help and support to the extent of your abilities. But wait for them to ask! Don't intrude. Let them call you, and thank them for the call. Ask them what they want to do for holidays and vacations and be happy with whatever they propose. That doesn't mean you can't decide you're having Thanksgiving at your house this year (for whatever reason) but don't guilt them if they don't come.

Follow their house rules when you visit. Tell them they are wonderful parents. Tell them their children are perfect. Yes, we all know this is a polite fiction but your job is to praise and be supportive unless asked for advice. If DIL asks for advice, pause thoughtfully, and ask what her mother thinks before you say another word. If DIL tells you she doesn't know how on earth you did it all, tell her you had lots and lots of help. You didn't do it on your own. She's the best mother you know.

Don't show up at the hospital for births unless invited. Say you're very excited to visit or to help out whenever they're
Howeverld us all her friends but wait for that call. When they do call...go asap. Have no opinion on breast vs bottle other than baby looks perfect so obviously being fed correctly.

Don't be competitive or jealous with the other grandparents.

I could go on all day... nice break from wordle. And of course all this advice is for normal kinds of circumstances.

The bolded above in particular caught my attention and I think it deserves to be discussed. I think that the PP who does this is incredibly insightful. To ask what the DIL's mother thinks -- to recognize that this younger woman who your son selected as his wife has her own mother -- is to me a sign of sensitivity and respect. It tells the DIL that you are there for her but that you also know the hierarchy. Before everyone comes at me for using the word "hierarchy" please really think about the relationships involved. If the DIL has a healthy relationship with her own mother, she can of course still have a rich and wonderful one with her MIL but the fact will always remain that the DIL's own mother is a slight bit above. It is just the natural order. I think if more MIL's recognized this of their relationships with their DIL's so many of the issues that come up might be averted.

Thanks so much. At the risk of derailing a thread focused on DILs, a few random observations on being a MIL. My mother and I were incredibly close. She was my care taker during pregnancy, childbirth, and postpartum, and the most amazing grandmother ever. And that's absolutely not hyperbole. Every one of her daughters' children would tell you the same. it was a challenge for her to have a married son and have a different place in that family hierarchy,. (Love your description). She did the best she could, but always worried that relationship wasn't what she might have hoped for. But seemingly it was good enough, because my SIL gave a tearful eulogy praising her as the best MIL ever. She told us all her friends were always complaining about their MILs and she just felt so sorry for them because she had the best MIL ever. (more bubble dependent hyperbole) but I think it was sincere because SIL repeatedly brings up my mom as a model of how to be a MIL. Recently she told me her best friend's son had gotten engaged and she asked friend what she had sent fiancee after announcement. Friend asks," I'm supposed to send her a gift?" SIL: "Yes, absolutely. That's what my MIL did". Over and over she'll mention to me she's doing something a certain way, " because that's how your mom did it".

Good lessons for me. I know I'm not going to be the number one grandma, but that's okay. My goal is best number two back up possible. However, the huge surprise is how much of a relief it was my son had a MIL. Almost my first thought on getting engagement news was now there is another mom. If something happens to me, he still has a mom. Huge relief.

This is kind of strange IMO. My thought would be, huge relief, now when I pass away eventually , he has a wife (and possibly kids, down the line). He won’t be alone. He has his own family now. Not “oh he has another mom”. Like, what about the wife?? lol.

Well I already had had the absolute joy of knowing he had a partner. He let me know when it was serious. They had been together a while. They had picked out a family ring * I had just never imagined feeling anything but a slight jealousy towards the other mom. Feeling overjoyed to share mothering of my child was certainly unexpected.

*and before anyone objects. She wanted a family ring. Yes, really. She has absolutely no problem speaking her mind, much less picking out and paying for her own jewelry. They discussed it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm an old rump boomer MIL and don't know how you do it. I still don't know how I did it. Please tell those oldsters you're overwhelmed and need help. If they can't/won't provide it, quit worrying about their feelings. Prioritize your nuclear family. You don't get these years back. Take all the help you can get and pay it forward when the time comes.

Good luck and take care of yourself!

+1

I'm a young boomer and my kids are in their 20s and do not yet have children.

I recall very clearly how overwhelming it was to parent children while working full-time and handling everything else that life has thrown at us. I look back and I truly have no idea how I did it.

Tell your parents and your in-laws that you are overwhelmed and cannot have anything else on your plate, but that if they are able to take something off your plate, that would be amazing. Ask them for meals, to babysit, to take your kids out for excursions, whatever it is that you need.

Prioritize your nuclear family and do not apologize for it.

I wish I knew you because in all seriousness, I would lend a hand.

This is very nice.
My own mom is your age and she just doesn’t seem to understand how overwhelmed I am. She was a wealthy SAHM of two extremely easy kids and I am a DCUM-poor working mom of two not-easy kids. She thinks I should have no trouble keeping my house spotless, landscaping manicured, and still have time for lunches with her!
When she does offer sympathy she doesn’t admit that times were different. She just says “If you’d married well you’d have it easier.” Thanks for the tip.
That said she is a very loving grandma.

I am PP and I'm so sorry about your mother's attitude and comments. Not helpful (understatement).

I am 65 years old and will be the first to recognize that your generation has it much harder than mine did. Times have changed dramatically. Childcare is far more expensive and difficult to access, as are housing, well paid jobs, good healthcare, a college education, the list goes on. Expectations in the workplace in this digital age are completely unreasonable. (I retired a short enough time ago that I can experienced them firsthand and know how ridiculous they are.)

It is completely normal and understandable for you to feel overwhelmed, to be overwhelmed. It's not reasonable for you to be expected to do everything you do.

Something has to give, systemically, but I don't know what that is. In the meantime I know that all you can do is keep treading water.

I sincerely wish that I could lend a hand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They do get it. They've done it already.

Agreed. And they did it with less resources/cash and more societal pressure. This generation in the busiest chapter of their life is massively failing in adulting. Mainly because they cannot even take care of their own shit, let alone the kids or the elders.

The MIL generation made sure that even the weakest kid survived by mollycoddling them. As a result, we have the weakest generation boo-hooing about everything now. And the worst of it all, these people have also procreated.

It wasn't more societal pressure. There is definitely more societal pressure on parents today, especially around supervision, attention, and emotional support. The laissez-faire parenting that was standard in the 1970s and 1980s is now considered neglect, and in some cases is illegal. My 8 year old is so annoyed she can't go to the park nearby on her own even though she absolutely is responsible enough to go and to play solo. I would also love to send her. But it's illegal in our municipality and people have called the cops on kids at that specific park for that reason, which is insane. They don't arrest anyone but your kid gets walked home and then you get shamed by the police and whatever ahole neighbor decided to busy body their way into a situation that was not negatively impacting them at all.

So I'm going to go ahead and say there's more societal pressure on parents now.

Link?

https://abcnews.com/Lifestyle/free-range-parents-found-responsible-child-neglect-allowing/story?id=29363859

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Put it in perspective. My parents and in laws have been retired for over 20 years and their youngest left home before then. - They've had basically no responsibility for taking care of anyone else AND no job responsibilities for 20 years.

Yes they have forgotten. And also they aren't the same people they were on the day they retired.

I'll get flamed for this but IMO, that why boomers seem so self centered sometimes. They just have been the center of their own worlds for decades.

I won't blame you, but I will point out that you cannot paint an entire generation that spans almost two decades with a single brush.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Put it in perspective. My parents and in laws have been retired for over 20 years and their youngest left home before then. - They've had basically no responsibility for taking care of anyone else AND no job responsibilities for 20 years.

Yes they have forgotten. And also they aren't the same people they were on the day they retired.

I'll get flamed for this but IMO, that why boomers seem so self centered sometimes. They just have been the center of their own worlds for decades.

Having such a long retirement is unusual for most boomers. The soonest some of us can retire is 65 but later boomers have to wait until 67 for Medicare. If you had your kids in your mid- to late 30s or 40s, you are still working to pay for their college as well as your retirement. Mortgage is not paid off and auto/property insurance keeps climbing. Your parents are fortunate. After the blows of several recessions and the pandemic, many of us cannot afford to retire but we still hope to help our kids.

I think you mean that later boomers (I am one, at 65 years old) have to wait until 67 to collect full Social Security. Medicare kicks in at 65.

[Anonymous]

15:17 here. Correction:

*I won't flame you, but I will point out that you cannot paint an entire generation that spans almost two decades with a single brush.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Put it in perspective. My parents and in laws have been retired for over 20 years and their youngest left home before then. - They've had basically no responsibility for taking care of anyone else AND no job responsibilities for 20 years.

Yes they have forgotten. And also they aren't the same people they were on the day they retired.

I'll get flamed for this but IMO, that why boomers seem so self centered sometimes. They just have been the center of their own worlds for decades.

I won't blame you, but I will point out that you cannot paint an entire generation that spans almost two decades with a single brush.

Agree, the boomers are just the current name for long-retired people. I'm sure it'll be us someday.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My retired MIL takes every opportunity to remind me of how she raised two successful sons without hardly any help from anyone including my FIL, worked full time, cooked everything from scratch and hosted regular parties for friends and relatives!

My stock answer to that is “that’s why you look ninety at sixty-four”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My retired MIL takes every opportunity to remind me of how she raised two successful sons without hardly any help from anyone including my FIL, worked full time, cooked everything from scratch and hosted regular parties for friends and relatives!

My stock answer to that is “that’s why you look ninety at sixty-four”.

Perfect!🤣

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes! Isn’t it validating?

Our school used to put on a huge parade for the kindergartners, it was basically the event of the year. I had invited my MIL to come with me. DH planned to get off work early and meet us there, but MIL was going to ride with me.

I can’t remember the exact times anymore, but I needed to pick up my preschooler first. I had asked MIL to come around 12:30 so we could pick up DC together and grab lunch before heading to the parade. If that didn’t work, she could come any time after about 1:30, when I’d be back from preschool pickup, and we’d eat then.

Just before 12:30 she texted, “I’m running late. I’m not going to make it by 12:30.” Since she knew I had to leave to get DC, I simply replied, “Okay, see you around 1:30.” So you can imagine my surprise when I pulled up at 1:30, excited to see her there and to go grab food, and instead she was angry that I hadn’t waited for her. Apparently she had arrived sometime after I left and had been sitting in her car, waiting, for nearly an hour.

She was furious about it. She seethed through the entire afternoon, gave my completely confused husband the silent treatment, was cold toward DC, and stayed upset about it for months.

The part that struck me most was that she truly could not grasp why I couldn’t just wait for her before picking up my child from preschool. The idea that a parent’s schedule might be dictated by their small child’s needs simply didn’t compute. Looking back, it really illustrates something I think about often, that when you’re in the thick of raising young children, your life runs on tight, non-negotiable timelines. To someone outside that phase, especially someone who expects to be centered in the plans, it can expose a surprising amount of emotional neediness and rigidity.

It was such an unnecessary, stressful situation that never needed to happen… and one I’ll probably never forget.

Did you post about this at the time? This sounds familiar and I remember being so annoyed at that MIL, as I am again upon reading this post. So clueless and self-obsessed.

OP of this thread, I encourage you to trim where you can and give up some of the feeling of responsibility for the grandparents’ happiness. You count too. You matter too.

I wonder if the previous generation really had it the same. Were their parents really expecting to be so involved in everything, did they insist on so much attention and inclusion?

People who are retired cannot expect others to fill up their now-emptier dance cards. The PP who said her retired parents live two hours away but expect her to visit at least once a month, even though she has elementary-aged kids and works full time—her parents sound incredibly selfish. And I hope she pushed back and doesn’t go once a month, when she’s invited her parents to come stay with her.

No, no they did not. I had this discussion with my own parents (not local so the relationship is different) after yet another frustrating school open house right before school started this year. At these things, you can drop off your kids’ school supplies, see their classrooms, introduce yourself to the teacher, sign up for the PTA in the lobby, etc. It’s crowded. There are all the school kids there plus parents, and sometimes younger siblings especially in the younger grades. We don’t also need grandma grandpa great uncle Bob and retired Mrs. Larla from down the street there with every family, taking up room in the classrooms that are already crowded with 28 4th graders, never mind their parents.

Despite being local and one set being retired, I didn’t think my grandparents would come to anything like that when I was a kid. I have no memory of them at my back to school nights, or daytime recitals/concerts or assemblies or even most evening kid events. And my parents said as much! The Greatest Generation and older Silent Gens were DONE. Going to a kid’s mid-day whatever would have cut into bridge club or coffee at McDonalds or Bible study! Plus one set of grandparents was younger and was still working until I was in middle school anyway. Visiting was for weekends. They didn’t particularly want to be included in little kids stuff.

Really? My grandparents were the ones at every mid day school event because they were retired and could be there while my parents were working full time. Such fond memories for me. Now, we live far away from our kids’ grandparents so someone is only at these endless midday school events if one of us takes off work to be there, which usually involves at least a half day if not a full day given forced full time in office. My grandparents were the best. They took us on sick days so my parents could work, teacher work days as my mother was a teacher, driving us to after school activities. I would kill for the set up my parents had.