If you’re a two career fam

[Anonymous]

I have made a lot of trade offs to be able to do virtually all those things. My husband can make it to the occasional doctor appointment and tries to make it for dinner and breakfast, though he doesn’t make every dinner and misses some stuff due to travel. To be honest he has turned down higher paying jobs to even be able to do that. Everyone makes trade offs. I prefer to have a smaller job I do extremely well and still have the time I want for my kids rather than pursue more prestigious opportunities. I’m happy with my trade offs; if my husband worked less I might make different ones but here we are. If my kids are doing well I’m happy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I have demanding jobs but in different ways. He goes into the office during the week but travels only domestically for one night at a time (some times doesn't even stay the night). For me, I work from home but have to travel internationally when needed. I'm typically gone for a week at a time since I go to Africa, Asia or Europe.

For the things you listed, my husband and I like to have at least one parent there at doctor appointments, recitals, etc. We've sacrificed things in our career to make that possible but that was a choice we made. We do plenty of things that make us "bad parents" in other respects -- screen time, meals in front of the TV when we have to work, etc. I've learned that with parenting, outside of abuse, there is really so much gray. We're all trying to do our best and that's ok.

When DH and I got married, we both noticed that the most successful power couples we knew had children who didn’t do well. Their kids were disrespectful and did poorly in school and life in general. I don’t necessarily think the kids will always turn out badly but when both parents put their careers first, the children suffer. These were power couples who earned 7-8 figures, not just regular UMC two working parent families.

I now stay home and DH earns a seven figure income. He has a very inflexible job. He never goes to daytime school events. I handle all things kid related. DH does take kids to sports and goes to all the weekend sports games.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I realize this thread is likely going to deteriorate rapidly, im hoping to get a few examples from those living it and hoping those that answer don’t bother coming back to read what will likely spiral into “why did you even have kids” comments

My therapist observed I’ve really narrowly boxed myself into what makes a “good” parent and what makes a “good” professional life basically leaving no viable option to feel good about how I’m doing about both. Logically I agree, but I’m trying to turn that practically into ways I can loosen my rigid parenting definitely

So if you and your spouse both have fairly inflexible jobs, are you comfortable with:
- someone else (nanny / grandparent) - taking your kid to routine doctor and dental appts
- your kid not always having someone at every school performance
- you kid having someone else help them get ready for school or eat dinner with them on a routine basis (not everyday night but not like once a month either)

What are things you feel must be done by a parent (if anything in particular) versus a more flexible generally being there for them and spending enough time with them without rigid rules around what’s ok

There is no one way of good parenting. You do you. You need a full time nanny and a back up sitter (or two nannies for 12 hr shifts if you or kids have sleep issues), as well as a maid who preferably can do some shopping and bookkeeping as well. You can make logistics work.

That being said, if you two made a conscious decision to have children and want to be loving and engaged parents, try to find flexible jobs. Your kids are young only once, time flies away and leaves regrets and resentments if family comes second to your careers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no one way to be a good parent. Some moms are home with their kids but sit and look at the phones while their kids play too many hours a day. Find what works for your family...your kid will adjust.

+1

Go to the playground, and you will see this most of the time, sadly.

Possibly she spent the previous several jours with them and the park is a break. Why assume the worst of people?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no one way to be a good parent. Some moms are home with their kids but sit and look at the phones while their kids play too many hours a day. Find what works for your family...your kid will adjust.

+1

Go to the playground, and you will see this most of the time, sadly.

It is. To be fair, both working and non working parents are on their phones. Non working because they are tired of entertaining kids all day and use it as a relaxed time while kids are playing.

Working parents are often there to check mark the task of being with kids but too busy to actually be with kids so taking calls..

[Anonymous]

Most parents use this time to make social phone calls or get online shopping done, only few actually want to be there. Its hard to blame them, parenting is a tough 24/7 job.

[Anonymous]

Even nannies and sitters are on their phones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I have demanding jobs but in different ways. He goes into the office during the week but travels only domestically for one night at a time (some times doesn't even stay the night). For me, I work from home but have to travel internationally when needed. I'm typically gone for a week at a time since I go to Africa, Asia or Europe.

For the things you listed, my husband and I like to have at least one parent there at doctor appointments, recitals, etc. We've sacrificed things in our career to make that possible but that was a choice we made. We do plenty of things that make us "bad parents" in other respects -- screen time, meals in front of the TV when we have to work, etc. I've learned that with parenting, outside of abuse, there is really so much gray. We're all trying to do our best and that's ok.

This + two parents can't devote 150% to their jobs at the same time. Ideally both have flexibility but there are some days, weeks, months, years that one person has to give more when the other can't give as much. It's a careful dance that requires care and respect from both sides but to be the parents we wanted to be it's necessary.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There is no one way to be a good parent. Some moms are home with their kids but sit and look at the phones while their kids play too many hours a day. Find what works for your family...your kid will adjust.

+1

Go to the playground, and you will see this most of the time, sadly.

Possibly she spent the previous several jours with them and the park is a break. Why assume the worst of people?

I’m too busy watching my kid or catching up on emails on my phone to notice what other people are doing. I usually go to the playground with friends so I’m socializing with friends while my kid plays with friends.

Is talking to a friend ok but sending a text or returning an email not ok?

What if I was on a conference call or putting out some work emergency?

I have been on my phone looking for rehabs for my dad, calling hospitals, requesting paperwork and many other things while at the playground. It isn’t like I’m watching TikTok. And what if I was watching YouTube, which I don’t. I don’t think it is anyone’s business if I spent all day with my child or if I was at work all day and still have work I have to do so I’m still working while my kid is at the playground. I have also done both.

[Anonymous]

Op, DH and I come from large families and our siblings range the whole span of parenting, from super involved parents who homeschool in order to give their kids a super-tailored education to parents who have a nanny who works 60+ hrs per week, even as the kids are teens because they have demanding, in-person careers.

Guess what? All the kids have turned out kind and hardworking, all have good relationships with their parents. People want to believe their parenting choices are the right ones, but lots of different kids of parenting can result in “successful” kids.

Figure out why attending certain things is important to you, and the make those a priority. Realize that you are modeling for your kids, and maybe that will help you think about what message you want to send.

For example, what is the point of attending every music performance? Of watching every sporting event? If it’s to make your kids feel secure there are other ways of doing that.

This year I attending one of my kids field trips because parents were required for them to participate. I went on another because I was worried about how they were doing socially and it gave me a chance to observe them. My third child begged me to go on one of theirs. I agreed but then an important work event came up, and I had a conversation with my child that I really needed to attend this event, so would they be ok with me not going (my child is 7). They were unhappy but came around and ultimately were fine with it. They had a great time on the field trip without me. They understand that my work is important to me because I talk about it, as does my DH.

They also don’t doubt they come first. I have cancelled work trip when something urgent has come up. I spent seven days in the hospital this year with one.

Finally, is it so bad that your kids build resilience by being disappointed sometimes that you aren’t there? To learn that they don’t always come first? Isn’t that a heathy boundary for them to learn?

I constant feel torn about balance between work and kids, but it’s mostly about what I want to do with my kids, not that I think I am a bad parent for not doing it.

[Anonymous]

I have not read all 9 pages but wanted to share my thoughts because I think we have a pretty good thing going in my family. I am a woman with a corporate job with a moderate level of flexibility. My (now retired) husband worked as a teacher very inflexibly day to day but with Summers and holidays off. This was perfect because I handled the doctors appointments, school day things like chaperoning and volunteering, and he took care of driving to extracurricular activities and child care when there was no school. Both jobs were inflexible but in completely different ways. We also had just one child which helped and she is heading to college soon. I turn 50 next year and I’m hoping to get 10 more years out of my career and really lean into it in this last stretch. This works very well for us and kept our child care costs low.

[Anonymous]

We decided it was important for at least one of us to be able to be flexible. We don’t have local family and don’t want to outsource things to a nanny.

DH’s career is more lucrative than mine, so he has the more inflexible job. Mine is highly flexible and is WFH, so I’m the one who takes DD to appointments. He makes every effort to go to her performances, though, and has only missed one so far.

We could not both have inflexible jobs and be the parents we want to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I have demanding jobs but in different ways. He goes into the office during the week but travels only domestically for one night at a time (some times doesn't even stay the night). For me, I work from home but have to travel internationally when needed. I'm typically gone for a week at a time since I go to Africa, Asia or Europe.

For the things you listed, my husband and I like to have at least one parent there at doctor appointments, recitals, etc. We've sacrificed things in our career to make that possible but that was a choice we made. We do plenty of things that make us "bad parents" in other respects -- screen time, meals in front of the TV when we have to work, etc. I've learned that with parenting, outside of abuse, there is really so much gray. We're all trying to do our best and that's ok.

When DH and I got married, we both noticed that the most successful power couples we knew had children who didn’t do well. Their kids were disrespectful and did poorly in school and life in general. I don’t necessarily think the kids will always turn out badly but when both parents put their careers first, the children suffer. These were power couples who earned 7-8 figures, not just regular UMC two working parent families.

I now stay home and DH earns a seven figure income. He has a very inflexible job. He never goes to daytime school events. I handle all things kid related. DH does take kids to sports and goes to all the weekend sports games.

You seem pretty judgmental for someone whose husband puts his career ahead of his kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My husband and I have demanding jobs but in different ways. He goes into the office during the week but travels only domestically for one night at a time (some times doesn't even stay the night). For me, I work from home but have to travel internationally when needed. I'm typically gone for a week at a time since I go to Africa, Asia or Europe.

For the things you listed, my husband and I like to have at least one parent there at doctor appointments, recitals, etc. We've sacrificed things in our career to make that possible but that was a choice we made. We do plenty of things that make us "bad parents" in other respects -- screen time, meals in front of the TV when we have to work, etc. I've learned that with parenting, outside of abuse, there is really so much gray. We're all trying to do our best and that's ok.

When DH and I got married, we both noticed that the most successful power couples we knew had children who didn’t do well. Their kids were disrespectful and did poorly in school and life in general. I don’t necessarily think the kids will always turn out badly but when both parents put their careers first, the children suffer. These were power couples who earned 7-8 figures, not just regular UMC two working parent families.

I now stay home and DH earns a seven figure income. He has a very inflexible job. He never goes to daytime school events. I handle all things kid related. DH does take kids to sports and goes to all the weekend sports games.

You seem pretty judgmental for someone whose husband puts his career ahead of his kids.

Dh doesn’t make it to school events but our kids always feel loved and supported by their father. The kids don’t notice that DH isn’t at their appointments and events since I’m always there.

All I was saying was that kids seem to suffer if both parents have demanding jobs. Almost all families we know have at least one parent who has a flexible or work from home job or stays home.

[Anonymous]

I am late to this thread but I read the entire thing and I want to chime in. This thread is so privileged and out of touch that it’s a bit embarrassing. It’s also very difficult for me to comprehend where everyone’ time and energy is going. I am a single parent and have been so since my younger child was a few days old (I have two). I fled a life-threatening situation with a toddler and a newborn, had to start over from literal scratch, dead broke and with nowhere to live and no support, and fight off a very dangerous abuser in court for years (and fully fund that fight myself) to boot. There have also been some other horrific tragedies and brutal challenges along the way that I won’t get into details about which have made this experience 100x hardest. Suffice to say I have zero support from the other parent, have to keep my kids away from him for life in fact (for their own safety) and unfortunately no support from anyone else.

Despite all of that, I manage to work full-time in a very high-pressure job and provide an income and lifestyle equivalent to most married two-income families. I even managed to put in extra work the first couple of years to rapidly increase my income through a promotion and then new offer, working at night with a baby on my breast and a toddler in my bed, so that I could cover everything, until I finally got to a place where I could pull back a bit and was comfortable financially. At the same time, I have managed to be a fully present parent. I found a job working from home to make it all work (and nowadays, almost anyone with an education can do so). I do all school drop offs. I have done every single bedtime except for 2 nights in the past 4 years. I breastfed both my kids for 3 years and co-slept that entire time as well, even through all this madness. I tried working without childcare in the beginning and nearly lost my mind and almost got fired, so I have childcare during 9-5 hours, but I almost never get childcare outside of that. I do every dinner. I am fully present and we do all kinds of fun activities in the evenings and on weekends. We travel. My kids lack for nothing except of course a loving second parent, but plenty of kids with married parents don’t have that either. I make time for my kids and they always come first, and I still manage to make time for a career that is notoriously stressful and high pressure.

My point is that on my own, I manage to provide both the lifestyle/income, and the level of attention/parenting that I consider to be typical of most married, educated, professional couples. If you have 1 or 2 healthy kids and two white collar parents, you have it on EASY MODE - literally have it easier than 99% of people on the planet both now and throughout human history. I literally cannot IMAGINE how much easier having a second parent around would be (or even just a parent who takes the kids every other weekend for visitation) even if thar parent were doing the bare minimum. Just having a person around so I could go to the bathroom in peace, or so I could sleep in literally just once, , or a parent who had another job to relieve some of that financial burden that’s 100% on me, I would feel like I was on vacation. If I had another parent with an income, I wouldn’t have to work a job I hate because it’s the only thing that pays enough to afford everything and gives me a hope of buying a home in this obscenely expensive area and paying for college in the future. I wouldn’t have to grovel and take abuse at that job because I can’t risk losing it and having no income for several months during a bad market. I could have the luxury of sitting around and feeling guilty and wringing my hands on a thread like this that I chose my career over my kids - I don’t get to choose career or kids. I have to choose both, everyday, and I can’t slack in either because there is no other person to pick up that slack.

The only thing that slides is my personal life, which is nonexistent, but that’s typical while kids are young and that’s how it’s always been since long before mothers worked. If you want a lot of “me” time, don’t have kids. If the issue is not that you’re expecting a lot of time for yourself, and you still seriously cannot manage being a fully active parent and also having a career, AND you have another involved parent around (whether involved with kids or with the bank account), then you need to take a step back and reevaluate what you are doing and where all your time and energy is going. Most people on earth are managing with much higher challenges and workloads. That’s even true for me as a single parent that makes a high income, has a nanny, and all the trappings of an upper middle class lifestyle. Seriously, I am reading this thread and shaking my head because there is simply something not computing for me (unless you have 4 or 5 kids, or kids with special needs, in which case I get it).