How to handle a kid who does not want a Bar Mitzvah

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom pressured me to get confirmed. I stood up at the church not believing any of it. While I wasn’t traumatized it was performative, which seemed odd to me. Wouldn’t the church want me to be faithful?

My sister got confirmed in church. I didn't believe any of it and didn't get confirmed. When we got married we had a civil ceremony.

Likewise, if a kid going through a bar mitzvah has to confirm their commitment to certain principles, if they agree to go through this against their beliefs, that seems to be a problem.

Except they don’t. There’s no affirmation. It’s like giving a speech in debate class. You do it but no one cares if you believe it or not. It’s the act that matters.

Then why bother if it doesn’t matter at all? Clearly it does to OP and the strongest argument I’ve heard so far is that “it keeps the chain going.” I do understand the benefits of religion but a 13 year old isn’t getting that right now and would rather hang out with his friends because he does have a community. Maybe as he grows up, he will value it more but it doesn’t sound like the right fit for now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom pressured me to get confirmed. I stood up at the church not believing any of it. While I wasn’t traumatized it was performative, which seemed odd to me. Wouldn’t the church want me to be faithful?

My sister got confirmed in church. I didn't believe any of it and didn't get confirmed. When we got married we had a civil ceremony.

Likewise, if a kid going through a bar mitzvah has to confirm their commitment to certain principles, if they agree to go through this against their beliefs, that seems to be a problem.

Except they don’t. There’s no affirmation. It’s like giving a speech in debate class. You do it but no one cares if you believe it or not. It’s the act that matters.

I'm also left wondering "why bother" if it is meaningless. I don't think that more religious people think it's meaningless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom pressured me to get confirmed. I stood up at the church not believing any of it. While I wasn’t traumatized it was performative, which seemed odd to me. Wouldn’t the church want me to be faithful?

My sister got confirmed in church. I didn't believe any of it and didn't get confirmed. When we got married we had a civil ceremony.

Likewise, if a kid going through a bar mitzvah has to confirm their commitment to certain principles, if they agree to go through this against their beliefs, that seems to be a problem.

Except they don’t. There’s no affirmation. It’s like giving a speech in debate class. You do it but no one cares if you believe it or not. It’s the act that matters.

I'm also left wondering "why bother" if it is meaningless. I don't think that more religious people think it's meaningless.

+1. Judaism is being presented in the thread as a club rather than a faith. I doubt that's true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My son has just started the more intense phase of Bar Mitzvah prep and hates it. He fights us on having to practice, says he doesn't consider himself to be Jewish so does not want to have a Bar Mitzvah. We are reaching out to the (conservative) temple to talk it through, but I am interested in how others might handle it. On the one hand, I hate to teach him the lesson that he can get out of doing anything he doesn't like. On the other hand, he is overall a very hard working kid who will do his regular homework and even additional enrichment work (he asked us to sign him up for Russian School of Math) without us having to bug him at at all. So that makes me think this is more than tween laziness and we should respect his choice.

One complicating factor is that he is old for his grade so he hasn't been to any friend's bar mitzvah's yet (and he does not have many Jewish friends from school). Also zoom Hebrew school led to him being behind in Hebrew so the prep is hard for him. He did not want a party for his Bar Mitzvah so we were going to take a bonus short vacation and bring his best friend, but he is happy to give that up (even though the vacation was his idea) if it means no Bar Mitzvah.

My DH was originally more invested in forcing my son to continue but now even he is wondering if we are doing more harm than good by continuing, given that the long-term goal is for him to consider himself Jewish as an adult.

Since you’re Jewish, isn’t your son automatically Jewish?

[Anonymous]

OP here, thanks to the PPs who provided helpful perspective.

We met with the rabbi. We are going to pare back what my son has to read (no haftarah!) and limit his practice to 20 min, 4 times a week (vs 30 min 6 times a week, which was the original expectation and was stressing him out). She will talk to him and make it very clear that she does not expect him to be believe in god or care if he believes in god and that it is not her job to make him believe in god. We will talk to him about how just as we can't guarantee that he will need algebra in his adult life but he has to learn it anyway, he needs to go through the Bar Mitzvah process because as his parents we think it makes sense for him to be well prepared to participate in a Jewish community when he is older if he wants to do so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom pressured me to get confirmed. I stood up at the church not believing any of it. While I wasn’t traumatized it was performative, which seemed odd to me. Wouldn’t the church want me to be faithful?

My sister got confirmed in church. I didn't believe any of it and didn't get confirmed. When we got married we had a civil ceremony.

Likewise, if a kid going through a bar mitzvah has to confirm their commitment to certain principles, if they agree to go through this against their beliefs, that seems to be a problem.

Except they don’t. There’s no affirmation. It’s like giving a speech in debate class. You do it but no one cares if you believe it or not. It’s the act that matters.

Then why bother if it doesn’t matter at all? Clearly it does to OP and the strongest argument I’ve heard so far is that “it keeps the chain going.” I do understand the benefits of religion but a 13 year old isn’t getting that right now and would rather hang out with his friends because he does have a community. Maybe as he grows up, he will value it more but it doesn’t sound like the right fit for now.

The effort and connection matter. The religious belief doesn’t. But I agree I wouldn’t force it. I would require attendance at Hebrew school through bnai mitvah age but not bnai mitzvah itself if the kid is strongly opposed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom pressured me to get confirmed. I stood up at the church not believing any of it. While I wasn’t traumatized it was performative, which seemed odd to me. Wouldn’t the church want me to be faithful?

My sister got confirmed in church. I didn't believe any of it and didn't get confirmed. When we got married we had a civil ceremony.

Likewise, if a kid going through a bar mitzvah has to confirm their commitment to certain principles, if they agree to go through this against their beliefs, that seems to be a problem.

Except they don’t. There’s no affirmation. It’s like giving a speech in debate class. You do it but no one cares if you believe it or not. It’s the act that matters.

Then why bother if it doesn’t matter at all? Clearly it does to OP and the strongest argument I’ve heard so far is that “it keeps the chain going.” I do understand the benefits of religion but a 13 year old isn’t getting that right now and would rather hang out with his friends because he does have a community. Maybe as he grows up, he will value it more but it doesn’t sound like the right fit for now.

The effort and connection matter. The religious belief doesn’t. But I agree I wouldn’t force it. I would require attendance at Hebrew school through bnai mitvah age but not bnai mitzvah itself if the kid is strongly opposed.

Perfect compromise

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We had an identical experience. I did not force my son to have one. As a kid I was forced to go through all the Catholic sacraments, because my Jewish mother and Catholic father decided without my input that I should be Catholic. I hated and resented having a religion I didn't choose forced on me - even moreso because at one point I had to do Confirmation, around bar mitzvah age, and everyone kept emphasizing how it marked my choice to be Catholic. Except I was forced and it didn't. It left me with a bad taste about forced religious rituals, so when my son didn't want a bar mitzvah I didn't force him.

I don't think forcing a kid to have one will make Jewish - it might even do the opposite. And you don't have to have one in order to be Jewish. So that's why I didn't force it.

That’s horrifying. Your poor maternal grandparents.

Love this megalomania, so typical. No care at all for the "poor" Catholic paternal grandparents.

Your AS AF respond is alas, also so typical. Gross.

What's AS about pointing out your ugly biases against the Catholic grandparents? You sound like the bigot yourself.

What's gross is shrieking "antisemite" every time somebody disagrees with you on an issue like which grandparents get to pass down their religion.

I swear there's a troll here pretending to be Jewish to make Jews look bad. They're also busy on the college forum crying antisemitism because Jewish representation in the ivies has declined from 30-40% of incoming classes in the 1970s to 16-20% today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My mom pressured me to get confirmed. I stood up at the church not believing any of it. While I wasn’t traumatized it was performative, which seemed odd to me. Wouldn’t the church want me to be faithful?

My sister got confirmed in church. I didn't believe any of it and didn't get confirmed. When we got married we had a civil ceremony.

Likewise, if a kid going through a bar mitzvah has to confirm their commitment to certain principles, if they agree to go through this against their beliefs, that seems to be a problem.

Except they don’t. There’s no affirmation. It’s like giving a speech in debate class. You do it but no one cares if you believe it or not. It’s the act that matters.

Then why bother if it doesn’t matter at all? Clearly it does to OP and the strongest argument I’ve heard so far is that “it keeps the chain going.” I do understand the benefits of religion but a 13 year old isn’t getting that right now and would rather hang out with his friends because he does have a community. Maybe as he grows up, he will value it more but it doesn’t sound like the right fit for now.

The effort and connection matter. The religious belief doesn’t. But I agree I wouldn’t force it. I would require attendance at Hebrew school through bnai mitvah age but not bnai mitzvah itself if the kid is strongly opposed.

Op here, my kid would go ahead and have the bar mitzvah if he had to do the work either way

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks to the PPs who provided helpful perspective.

We met with the rabbi. We are going to pare back what my son has to read (no haftarah!) and limit his practice to 20 min, 4 times a week (vs 30 min 6 times a week, which was the original expectation and was stressing him out). She will talk to him and make it very clear that she does not expect him to be believe in god or care if he believes in god and that it is not her job to make him believe in god. We will talk to him about how just as we can't guarantee that he will need algebra in his adult life but he has to learn it anyway, he needs to go through the Bar Mitzvah process because as his parents we think it makes sense for him to be well prepared to participate in a Jewish community when he is older if he wants to do so.

Let's see if he goes for it. I wouldn't. Algebra is different - it trains the mind and is required to do other forms of math (and to get into college) - which he presumably wants to do.

Maybe he'll like that the Rabbi isn't pushing God, but I wouldn't be swayed. I'd think the rabbi was hypocritical and would wonder if the whole synagogue was just a charade.

Please tell us your son's reaction. I hope for your sake that he goes for it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks to the PPs who provided helpful perspective.

We met with the rabbi. We are going to pare back what my son has to read (no haftarah!) and limit his practice to 20 min, 4 times a week (vs 30 min 6 times a week, which was the original expectation and was stressing him out). She will talk to him and make it very clear that she does not expect him to be believe in god or care if he believes in god and that it is not her job to make him believe in god. We will talk to him about how just as we can't guarantee that he will need algebra in his adult life but he has to learn it anyway, he needs to go through the Bar Mitzvah process because as his parents we think it makes sense for him to be well prepared to participate in a Jewish community when he is older if he wants to do so.

Let's see if he goes for it. I wouldn't. Algebra is different - it trains the mind and is required to do other forms of math (and to get into college) - which he presumably wants to do.

Maybe he'll like that the Rabbi isn't pushing God, but I wouldn't be swayed. I'd think the rabbi was hypocritical and would wonder if the whole synagogue was just a charade.

Please tell us your son's reaction. I hope for your sake that he goes for it.

I'm sure you're not telling your own kid to shirk the foreign language requirement for HS. I mean who cares right - you shouldn't have to do anything you don't want to do. F those colleges - you show them you don't ever need to learn anything new.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks to the PPs who provided helpful perspective.

We met with the rabbi. We are going to pare back what my son has to read (no haftarah!) and limit his practice to 20 min, 4 times a week (vs 30 min 6 times a week, which was the original expectation and was stressing him out). She will talk to him and make it very clear that she does not expect him to be believe in god or care if he believes in god and that it is not her job to make him believe in god. We will talk to him about how just as we can't guarantee that he will need algebra in his adult life but he has to learn it anyway, he needs to go through the Bar Mitzvah process because as his parents we think it makes sense for him to be well prepared to participate in a Jewish community when he is older if he wants to do so.

Let's see if he goes for it. I wouldn't. Algebra is different - it trains the mind and is required to do other forms of math (and to get into college) - which he presumably wants to do.

Maybe he'll like that the Rabbi isn't pushing God, but I wouldn't be swayed. I'd think the rabbi was hypocritical and would wonder if the whole synagogue was just a charade.

Please tell us your son's reaction. I hope for your sake that he goes for it.

Dp. I disagree about Algebra. Not everyone is capable but kids are failing basic math so that should come first.

[Anonymous]

Why would you think the rabbi was hypocritical? Judaism isn't really centered around needing to believe in God.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here, thanks to the PPs who provided helpful perspective.

We met with the rabbi. We are going to pare back what my son has to read (no haftarah!) and limit his practice to 20 min, 4 times a week (vs 30 min 6 times a week, which was the original expectation and was stressing him out). She will talk to him and make it very clear that she does not expect him to be believe in god or care if he believes in god and that it is not her job to make him believe in god. We will talk to him about how just as we can't guarantee that he will need algebra in his adult life but he has to learn it anyway, he needs to go through the Bar Mitzvah process because as his parents we think it makes sense for him to be well prepared to participate in a Jewish community when he is older if he wants to do so.

Sounds like a good plan. Good luck!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We had an identical experience. I did not force my son to have one. As a kid I was forced to go through all the Catholic sacraments, because my Jewish mother and Catholic father decided without my input that I should be Catholic. I hated and resented having a religion I didn't choose forced on me - even moreso because at one point I had to do Confirmation, around bar mitzvah age, and everyone kept emphasizing how it marked my choice to be Catholic. Except I was forced and it didn't. It left me with a bad taste about forced religious rituals, so when my son didn't want a bar mitzvah I didn't force him.

I don't think forcing a kid to have one will make Jewish - it might even do the opposite. And you don't have to have one in order to be Jewish. So that's why I didn't force it.

That’s horrifying. Your poor maternal grandparents.

Love this megalomania, so typical. No care at all for the "poor" Catholic paternal grandparents.

Your AS AF respond is alas, also so typical. Gross.

What's AS about pointing out your ugly biases against the Catholic grandparents? You sound like the bigot yourself.

What's gross is shrieking "antisemite" every time somebody disagrees with you on an issue like which grandparents get to pass down their religion.

You're a real peach, aren't you.

The answer, of course, is that clearly neither set of grandparents did their job. Presumably, OP would like to avoid a similar situation with her descendants.