Anonymous wrote:Serious, and admittedly naive, question here. Is calling for a worldwide caliphate an extremist position?

The Islamic Khilafah was the crown of Islam for over a thousand years, Muslims were the most progressive society of their time when they were under just rulers and lived according to the tenets of Islam.Contrary to the common belief that Khalifat is an autocratic or authoritarian system of government with one man rule, it is very democratic in nature, especially when seen in context of Islam's emphasis on equality in all the walks of life. Islam puts no restriction upon what should be the form of government. So yes a lot of Muslims who are not extremists dream of a caliphate, but most ordinary Muslims don't give it too much thought on their day to day life.

Anonymous wrote:How do you know when god talk to you or are your emotion?
How do you know if god listened to you?
Why good things happen to bad people?

He always listens, whether you feel like He is or not. He is always there , after everybody leaves He remains. You might think good things are happening to bad people but something might appear good to you while it is bad and vice versa.

Anonymous wrote:Islam = culture, to a greater extent than other mainstream religions. Fundamentalist Christians, ultra-orthodox Jews, etc., also have much stronger cultural requirements, but they're not mainstream.

So saying that niqab is cultural rather than religious is inaccurate.

What?????

Anonymous wrote:

(besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

Pretty sure Muslima is not a woman. Either that, or it is multiple posters.

Why? Keep showing your misogynistic tendencies

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
How do you know these women were all "as Muslim as can be" as opposed to, say, atheist communists? Maybe they never wanted to cover, and they had a brief period under the Russian proxies when they didn't have to cover. The Taliban came in and the burkas returned for everybody, religious or not.

The Taliban have nothing to do with Islam.

If full covering was about Islam, women would have remained fully covered in Afganistan from the day the country went Muslim.

How do YOU know they were atheist communists?

How many Christian niqabis are there? Or Hindu? Some Christian women dress "more" modestly than others, some religious women wear headscarvew, etc. How many non-Muslim women wear a burka or niqab (besides Muslima's friend who ho likes the way they look)?

Oh boy- You know, the burqa and niqab are pre-Islamic right? Please tell me that you know that!

It is sometimes alleged that the face-veil was originally part of women's dress among certain classes in the Byzantine Empire and was adopted into Muslim culture during the Arab conquest of the Middle East. However, although Byzantine art before Islam commonly depicts women with veiled heads or covered hair, it does not depict women with veiled faces. In addition, the Greek geographer Strabo, writing in the first century AD, refers to some Persian women veiling their faces[not in citation given] and the early third-century Christian writer Tertullian clearly refers in his treatise The Veiling of Virgins to some pagan women of "Arabia" wearing a veil that covers not only their head but also the entire face. Clement of Alexandria commends the contemporary use of face coverings. There are also two Biblical references to the employment of covering face veils in Genesis 38.14 and Genesis 24.65, by Tamar and by Rebekah, Jacob and Abraham's daughters-in-law respectively. These primary sources show that some women in Egypt, Arabia, Canaan and Persia veiled their faces long before Islam. In the case of Tamar, the Biblical text,'When Judah saw her, he thought her to be an harlot; because she had covered her face' indicates customary, if not sacral, use of the face veil to accentuate rather than disguise her sexuality.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:So, after Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan, women were forced to dress a certain way but Islam is to blame? Good thought process, good throughout process!! People got it wrong for over 1000 years....

Could you explain a little more? This makes no sense, from any point of view. Sounds like you're trying to be sarcastic about Islam requiring women to veil for 1000 years in Afghanistan. But you can't mean that, can you?

The opposite. Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan when that picture posted by the PP was taken therefore you can not blame Islam for forcing women to veil as they would have been wearing their niqabs and hijabs from day 1. Same thing in Saudi Arabia where women before the 70s dressed differently.

Huh? I'm not the poster who put up that picture, but surely her point was the opposite. Whatever you think of the Shah (and like others here, I don't think much of him), one of his defining things was taking control away from the turbans so that women could dress as they wanted. Without a religious police to tell them to throw a chador over that miniskirt. Why do you think the mullahs hated the shah so much?

Oops, just looked at the picture. It's Afghanistan. Still, the same point applies: Afghanistan had a modernizing -- Russian-backed socialist! - government that religious folks hated. We even supported the religious folks against the Russians, and now we have the Taliban. You can't argue that Islam provided freedoms that were actually provided by the Russian proxies.

You still don't get it. These miniskirted women you see in the picture - they all Muslim as can be. Afghanistan has been Muslim for hundreds of years. That women were forced to cover their faces in the last several decades had nothing to do with Islam. Otherwise they would have had to cover for all these centuries.

+10000

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:So, after Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan, women were forced to dress a certain way but Islam is to blame? Good thought process, good throughout process!! People got it wrong for over 1000 years....

Could you explain a little more? This makes no sense, from any point of view. Sounds like you're trying to be sarcastic about Islam requiring women to veil for 1000 years in Afghanistan. But you can't mean that, can you?

The opposite. Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan when that picture posted by the PP was taken therefore you can not blame Islam for forcing women to veil as they would have been wearing their niqabs and hijabs from day 1. Same thing in Saudi Arabia where women before the 70s dressed differently.

Did you just get on the pill?

So, after Islam was practiced for over 1000 years in Afghanistan, women were forced to dress a certain way but Islam is to blame? Good thought process, good throughout process!! People got it wrong for over 1000 years....

You do not have to respect/believe anything. You are a human being with free will to choose what you believe or not believe in. That is your Choice. That hadith has been in the Sahih book of Hadiths for centuries. Sahih meaning Authentic, so yeh for someone like me who is a Muslim, who believes in Islam and the message of the Prophet Muhammad (saw) it makes perfect sense, it doesn't have to make sense for you. That is the beauty of having 2 different brains in our heads, we can disagree and move on in our respective lives.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Just like you can't imagine that some choose to dress that way. Typical white girl arrogance - thinks she needs to save the brown natives and enlighten them.

Typical PP arrogance - twists my post that "some don't" into "you can't imagine that some do." Do you use logic much? Do understand how the word "some" was used in the post you responded to?

Also, you're an arrogant jerk because you have no clue what my skin color is.

Typical Muslima arrogance - writing that "the niqbis of the world" are all biting their nails. Every single one of them.

It's not my fault if you have comprehension issues...

Muslima, for your own good, you need to take a break from posting. Now. Once in a while you start acting like a petulant child. This is one of those moments, because you most certainly did imply that all the niqab-wearing women do it by choice. Take a deep breath, go do something else, and come back when you can conduct yourself like an adult.

Actually, I think you weird insistence that every niqabi woman should carry a notarized statement that she's wearing it on her own free will, and be ready to produce it for you at a moment's notice, is way more childish.

+1 We should also outlaw sexual intercourse. We have evidence that women are being raped daily, hourly by men in this country, being forced by men in this country to copulate, so from now on, for security reasons and for the wellbeing of all women in the world, we have to ban sexual intercourse. Every 107 seconds, a woman in America is being sexually assaulted. Given all these facts, we can only agree that those women who enjoy this act, are clearly brainwashed into thinking that it is good for them , we need to liberate them!

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Stop your lies, just because you are too narrow-minded to imagine that millions of women actually CHOOSE to wear a niqab doesn't mean the rest of the world uses your thought process. I have stated many times, that SOME women are forced to dress a certain way EVERYWHERE in the world be it a Niqab, a Hijab, a Miniskirt, or a Bikini. Get a grip and stop thinking the world revolves around what is normalized in your head.

You need to get a grip.

You write that the niqab-wearing women *choose* to dress that way (I bolded it for you). You didn't add any qualification that not *all* the "niqbis of the world" are biting their nails. Then you go beserk when somebody adds the qualification that you yourself neglected to add to your original post.

I have stated many times, numerous times, more than I can count that there are some women forced to dress the way they dress, be it a Niqab or a Hijab. My favorite anti-hijab/niqab and the argument that so called feminists wannabe fall back on is the argument of ‘whataboutery’. What about women who are forced to wear a niqab” You cry! If the feminist free woman like that PP argued, is that Muslim women who autonomously choose to veil only think they are doing so out of free will, and are in fact being brainwashed to do so, then the core principle of feminism to elevate women’s control of their own destiny is immediately violated. And worse, it underscores the argument that feminism is a western imperialist project: that only western culture can supposedly liberate women, and that all other ideas are brainwashing. Perhaps the most insulting subtext of all is that Muslim women are infants, to be patronised into the 'right' choices. If Muslim women are brainwashed into veiling, then the miniskirt generation is equally brainwashed into believing that showing skin and baring breasts is liberation.

Finally,stop fighting over what I wear, ridiculing and laughing at the choice of women who are not like you. That says more about you than them. Start addressing who I am. I am neither burqa nor bikini. I am woman.

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Just like you can't imagine that some choose to dress that way. Typical white girl arrogance - thinks she needs to save the brown natives and enlighten them.

Typical PP arrogance - twists my post that "some don't" into "you can't imagine that some do." Do you use logic much? Do understand how the word "some" was used in the post you responded to?

Also, you're an arrogant jerk because you have no clue what my skin color is.

Typical Muslima arrogance - writing that "the niqbis of the world" are all biting their nails. Every single one of them.

It's not my fault if you have comprehension issues...

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Muslima wrote:I am sure the niqbis of the world are biting their nails over your opinion on how they choose to dress....

Again that word "choose," because you can't imagine that some wearers don't have a choice. Actually, the ones who are forced to wear it probably appreciate that somebody, although not you, is concerned on their behalf.

Stop your lies, just because you are too narrow-minded to imagine that millions of women actually CHOOSE to wear a niqab doesn't mean the rest of the world uses your thought process. I have stated many times, that SOME women are forced to dress a certain way EVERYWHERE in the world be it a Niqab, a Hijab, a Miniskirt, or a Bikini. Get a grip and stop thinking the world revolves around what is normalized in your head.

I am interested in knowing where, in this world, women are FORCED to wear a miniskirt or a bikini?????

They're not.

In fact, I wore shorter skirts (not minis) through my early 30s- pre-kids. I CHOSE to wear them and then I CHOSE to stop wearing them.

Muslima - What's your comeback for this?

Keep telling that to yourself

The internet is free, use it, if you're bored, go and explore or watch a movie ! FYI what i cited was not from the Qu'ran