Lochte Robbery Story: True or False

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What will it take for people to understand that when you go to a foreign country you are subject to their laws and penalties just as foreigners who come to the US are subject to our laws and penalties?

You can argue until the cows come home about shake downs and the minimal nature of the offenses but it is irrelevant. These guys and especially the douche bag Lochte violated the law there and that is the end of it.

The arrogance of Americans in thinking that they can get away with any kind of b-s in a foreign country is just amazing. In most countries, there is no right against self-incrimination, right to counsel, Miranda warnings, etc. If you don't like the way the legal system works abroad then stay in the US but it is ludicrous to go to a foreign country and expect that US standards of jurisprudence will be in effect.

If you go to countries like Malaysia or Indonesia and are found to have drugs, you face the death penalty. In fact, there are large posters at immigration and customs warning you that possession of drugs leaves you vulnerable to the death penalty. What is more, there are foreigners, including westerners, who have been executed in these countries for being in possession of drugs.

I personally am opposed to the death punishment - and not just for dealing in drugs - but that is neither here nor there. You cannot go to a foreign country and then expect they will not implement their laws.

Are you arguing that it is the law in Brazil that if you pee in an inappropriate place and remove a poster from a wall that you are required to pay a fine to the police on the spot? There is no arrest, no trial. The law is that you pay off the authorities right then and there? (And are then fined again later.)

That isn't what I understand to be the law, but since the media has gotten so much of this story wrong, I'm willing to be educated. Or are you just going off on a tangent?

I think PP is saying our rights as Americans - our right to due process, legal representation, etc. - disappear when we enter a foreign country, and we are just at their mercy. Are we supposed to apologize to everyone in that country too, for being Americans, or do we only have to do that if we get drunk and piss on a gas station wall?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If the only damage by the swimmers' "vandalism" was the poster, then the security guards' demand for money was pure extortion, a shakedown, as many knew the moment they heard about it. Whatever story Lochte told, overdramatizing the actual events, the swimmers were robbed at gunpoint and then charged with crimes by the Brazilian government.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/jimmy-feigen-last-of-four-lochte-robbery-swimmers-releases-statement-124037496.html

A "robbery-that-wasn’t-really-a-robbery-but-still-was-a-Brazilian-shakedown," followed by a further shakedown by officials when they forced Feigen to cough up a $10,800 "fine" for his passport so he could leave the country (that was the negotiated rate, down from $31k, then $47k). Lochte got out just in time, otherwise they'd be holding him hostage for cash too.

This part of the story has been largely ignored. They wanted him ( Feigen) to cough up more, but he got out in time. He was right to pay the first ridiculous fee and get that hell out.

Yes, there's no way to spin that to make Rio look in the right and to make Feigen look in the wrong. So the media hasn't really focused on it.

Imagnie if Lochte had stayed in Rio, how much they would have charged him for the privilege of leaving the country. 6 figures, 7 figures?

Totally agree. It's amazing to me how many people (in the media and otherwise) seem to be getting their jollies from publicly shaming and ridiculing this relatively harmless douchebag for committing minor offenses. It makes me wonder how many fully grown adults out there continue to nurture some sort of weird, longstanding resentment against the good looking jock at their high school.

This! Wow I think you really hit the nail on the head. Wonder if Matt Lauer got a lot of wedgies as a kid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What will it take for people to understand that when you go to a foreign country you are subject to their laws and penalties just as foreigners who come to the US are subject to our laws and penalties?

You can argue until the cows come home about shake downs and the minimal nature of the offenses but it is irrelevant. These guys and especially the douche bag Lochte violated the law there and that is the end of it.

The arrogance of Americans in thinking that they can get away with any kind of b-s in a foreign country is just amazing. In most countries, there is no right against self-incrimination, right to counsel, Miranda warnings, etc. If you don't like the way the legal system works abroad then stay in the US but it is ludicrous to go to a foreign country and expect that US standards of jurisprudence will be in effect.

If you go to countries like Malaysia or Indonesia and are found to have drugs, you face the death penalty. In fact, there are large posters at immigration and customs warning you that possession of drugs leaves you vulnerable to the death penalty. What is more, there are foreigners, including westerners, who have been executed in these countries for being in possession of drugs.

I personally am opposed to the death punishment - and not just for dealing in drugs - but that is neither here nor there. You cannot go to a foreign country and then expect they will not implement their laws.

Are you arguing that it is the law in Brazil that if you pee in an inappropriate place and remove a poster from a wall that you are required to pay a fine to the police on the spot? There is no arrest, no trial. The law is that you pay off the authorities right then and there? (And are then fined again later.)

That isn't what I understand to be the law, but since the media has gotten so much of this story wrong, I'm willing to be educated. Or are you just going off on a tangent?

I am not arguing as to what Brazilian law is because quite honestly I don't know the answer. But my point is that if any of the athletes who made that donation to charity - whether under duress or not - wanted to fight the demand, they had the right to do so. It would have meant that they would need to stay in the country and go through the legal process that is in effect in Brazil and take their chances. If they decided that was not worth the hassle or the risks involved, then it is not a shake down. It is a decision they make that the risk is not worth it.

I think they made the right decision to just pay up and leave Brazil rather than to take a chance.

Lochte was an imbecile for tearing down a poster and then getting into an argument with armed guards. He was very lucky not have been shot - something that could have happened quite easily. He was utterly stupid to then aggravate the situation further by lying about what happened. This idiot is a 32 year old guy - not a kid - and whether he was intoxicated or not, he cannot behave like a jackass when he visits another country. I blame him more than the others because he not only triggered the investigation by the authorities with his lies but put the others in jeopardy.

But above all, I say that when Americans travel abroad, it is incumbent on us to follow the laws and customs of the country we are visiting. If that is so objectionable then stay in the US. I have traveled extensively on business and for personal reasons and never have had any incident that was remotely threatening - sometimes traveling to countries that are not the safest. Just treat the people of other countries when one visits their country with respect and without any expectation that they need to accord any special favors because I am an American.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What will it take for people to understand that when you go to a foreign country you are subject to their laws and penalties just as foreigners who come to the US are subject to our laws and penalties?

You can argue until the cows come home about shake downs and the minimal nature of the offenses but it is irrelevant. These guys and especially the douche bag Lochte violated the law there and that is the end of it.

The arrogance of Americans in thinking that they can get away with any kind of b-s in a foreign country is just amazing. In most countries, there is no right against self-incrimination, right to counsel, Miranda warnings, etc. If you don't like the way the legal system works abroad then stay in the US but it is ludicrous to go to a foreign country and expect that US standards of jurisprudence will be in effect.

If you go to countries like Malaysia or Indonesia and are found to have drugs, you face the death penalty. In fact, there are large posters at immigration and customs warning you that possession of drugs leaves you vulnerable to the death penalty. What is more, there are foreigners, including westerners, who have been executed in these countries for being in possession of drugs.

I personally am opposed to the death punishment - and not just for dealing in drugs - but that is neither here nor there. You cannot go to a foreign country and then expect they will not implement their laws.

Are you arguing that it is the law in Brazil that if you pee in an inappropriate place and remove a poster from a wall that you are required to pay a fine to the police on the spot? There is no arrest, no trial. The law is that you pay off the authorities right then and there? (And are then fined again later.)

That isn't what I understand to be the law, but since the media has gotten so much of this story wrong, I'm willing to be educated. Or are you just going off on a tangent?

I am not arguing as to what Brazilian law is because quite honestly I don't know the answer. But my point is that if any of the athletes who made that donation to charity - whether under duress or not - wanted to fight the demand, they had the right to do so. It would have meant that they would need to stay in the country and go through the legal process that is in effect in Brazil and take their chances. If they decided that was not worth the hassle or the risks involved, then it is not a shake down. It is a decision they make that the risk is not worth it.

I think they made the right decision to just pay up and leave Brazil rather than to take a chance.

Lochte was an imbecile for tearing down a poster and then getting into an argument with armed guards. He was very lucky not have been shot - something that could have happened quite easily. He was utterly stupid to then aggravate the situation further by lying about what happened. This idiot is a 32 year old guy - not a kid - and whether he was intoxicated or not, he cannot behave like a jackass when he visits another country. I blame him more than the others because he not only triggered the investigation by the authorities with his lies but put the others in jeopardy.

But above all, I say that when Americans travel abroad, it is incumbent on us to follow the laws and customs of the country we are visiting. If that is so objectionable then stay in the US. I have traveled extensively on business and for personal reasons and never have had any incident that was remotely threatening - sometimes traveling to countries that are not the safest. Just treat the people of other countries when one visits their country with respect and without any expectation that they need to accord any special favors because I am an American.

What are you talking about? How is it "legal" to hold a vandal at gunpoint? Or for the government to let you "choose" between the legal system or paying a BRIBE and you can just go home?

Do you think Brazilian penal code states "the penalty for misdemeanor vandalism is immediate restitution or else getting shot, plus a $31,000 - no $47,000 - no wait, $11,000 fine"?

Idiot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What will it take for people to understand that when you go to a foreign country you are subject to their laws and penalties just as foreigners who come to the US are subject to our laws and penalties?

You can argue until the cows come home about shake downs and the minimal nature of the offenses but it is irrelevant. These guys and especially the douche bag Lochte violated the law there and that is the end of it.

The arrogance of Americans in thinking that they can get away with any kind of b-s in a foreign country is just amazing. In most countries, there is no right against self-incrimination, right to counsel, Miranda warnings, etc. If you don't like the way the legal system works abroad then stay in the US but it is ludicrous to go to a foreign country and expect that US standards of jurisprudence will be in effect.

If you go to countries like Malaysia or Indonesia and are found to have drugs, you face the death penalty. In fact, there are large posters at immigration and customs warning you that possession of drugs leaves you vulnerable to the death penalty. What is more, there are foreigners, including westerners, who have been executed in these countries for being in possession of drugs.

I personally am opposed to the death punishment - and not just for dealing in drugs - but that is neither here nor there. You cannot go to a foreign country and then expect they will not implement their laws.

Are you arguing that it is the law in Brazil that if you pee in an inappropriate place and remove a poster from a wall that you are required to pay a fine to the police on the spot? There is no arrest, no trial. The law is that you pay off the authorities right then and there? (And are then fined again later.)

That isn't what I understand to be the law, but since the media has gotten so much of this story wrong, I'm willing to be educated. Or are you just going off on a tangent?

I am not arguing as to what Brazilian law is because quite honestly I don't know the answer. But my point is that if any of the athletes who made that donation to charity - whether under duress or not - wanted to fight the demand, they had the right to do so. It would have meant that they would need to stay in the country and go through the legal process that is in effect in Brazil and take their chances. If they decided that was not worth the hassle or the risks involved, then it is not a shake down. It is a decision they make that the risk is not worth it.

I think they made the right decision to just pay up and leave Brazil rather than to take a chance.

Lochte was an imbecile for tearing down a poster and then getting into an argument with armed guards. He was very lucky not have been shot - something that could have happened quite easily. He was utterly stupid to then aggravate the situation further by lying about what happened. This idiot is a 32 year old guy - not a kid - and whether he was intoxicated or not, he cannot behave like a jackass when he visits another country. I blame him more than the others because he not only triggered the investigation by the authorities with his lies but put the others in jeopardy.

But above all, I say that when Americans travel abroad, it is incumbent on us to follow the laws and customs of the country we are visiting. If that is so objectionable then stay in the US. I have traveled extensively on business and for personal reasons and never have had any incident that was remotely threatening - sometimes traveling to countries that are not the safest. Just treat the people of other countries when one visits their country with respect and without any expectation that they need to accord any special favors because I am an American.

I guess you don't travel to Rio. There were so many stories of Olympians being robbed, and an unfortunately sizeable though smaller number of Olympians arrested, detained, and/or robbed by the government.

[Anonymous]

I'm not loving everyone calling Lotche a douchebag. He is a decorated Olympian who was in the wrong place at the wrong time Peeing outdoors is beyond common in Brazil. He is a victim of a shakedown followed by a media hate storm. It's a Bit scary honestly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
What are you talking about? How is it "legal" to hold a vandal at gunpoint? Or for the government to let you "choose" between the legal system or paying a BRIBE and you can just go home?

Do you think Brazilian penal code states "the penalty for misdemeanor vandalism is immediate restitution or else getting shot, plus a $31,000 - no $47,000 - no wait, $11,000 fine"?

Idiot.

Clearly someone with the IQ of Lochte based on the logic displayed.

Actually, saying this makes it unfair to Lochte because even he is not this much of a dim-wit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm not loving everyone calling Lotche a douchebag. He is a decorated Olympian who was in the wrong place at the wrong time Peeing outdoors is beyond common in Brazil. He is a victim of a shakedown followed by a media hate storm. It's a Bit scary honestly.

The issue was not peeing outdoors. He lied about being held up with a gun held to his head and admitted that he lied - sorry, he said that he over exaggerated.

I hope he is banned from competitive swimming. He is a douche bag and a fucking disgrace.

[Anonymous]

Maybe Lochte should hook up with Hope Solo .............

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm not loving everyone calling Lotche a douchebag. He is a decorated Olympian who was in the wrong place at the wrong time Peeing outdoors is beyond common in Brazil. He is a victim of a shakedown followed by a media hate storm. It's a Bit scary honestly.

The issue was not peeing outdoors. He lied about being held up with a gun held to his head and admitted that he lied - sorry, he said that he over exaggerated.

I hope he is banned from competitive swimming. He is a douche bag and a fucking disgrace.

Dp- I'm sorry that you are so unseccessful that you have to spew so much hatred toward a decorated Olympian. He was held at gun point. To is head or not is so very irrelevant.

[Anonymous]

A white athlete being given lip by "foreigners". How else should the white guy react?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A white athlete being given lip by "foreigners". How else should the white guy react?

As a foreigner, let me educate you a bit. From our perspective, "white privilege" doesn't exist. Instead, what's pretty obvious is "American arrogance," regardless of skin color.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

What are you talking about? How is it "legal" to hold a vandal at gunpoint? Or for the government to let you "choose" between the legal system or paying a BRIBE and you can just go home?

Do you think Brazilian penal code states "the penalty for misdemeanor vandalism is immediate restitution or else getting shot, plus a $31,000 - no $47,000 - no wait, $11,000 fine"?

Idiot.

Erm--it is legal and customary in Brazil. Perhaps this was not covered in "Judge Judy's Defendant Preparation Manual".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What are you talking about? How is it "legal" to hold a vandal at gunpoint? Or for the government to let you "choose" between the legal system or paying a BRIBE and you can just go home?

Do you think Brazilian penal code states "the penalty for misdemeanor vandalism is immediate restitution or else getting shot, plus a $31,000 - no $47,000 - no wait, $11,000 fine"?

Idiot.

Erm--it is legal and customary in Brazil. Perhaps this was not covered in "Judge Judy's Defendant Preparation Manual".

Awesome!

The arrogance of some people commenting on the legal system in Brazil is only exceeded by their stunning ignorance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

What are you talking about? How is it "legal" to hold a vandal at gunpoint? Or for the government to let you "choose" between the legal system or paying a BRIBE and you can just go home?

Do you think Brazilian penal code states "the penalty for misdemeanor vandalism is immediate restitution or else getting shot, plus a $31,000 - no $47,000 - no wait, $11,000 fine"?

Idiot.

Erm--it is legal and customary in Brazil. Perhaps this was not covered in "Judge Judy's Defendant Preparation Manual".

That's the thing with this. People are trying to apply American law in another country. Visit another country, deal with their laws.