is nose-to-wall timeout too harsh?

[Anonymous]

YES. I’m a teacher and if a child reported this kind off a punishment to me, I would suspect that something was very wrong in your household. It would not rise to the level of COS reporting but my eyebrows would hurt from being raised and I would be watching out for emotional and physical abuse. I would also assume that both parents were over their heads with parenting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Op, does your daughter also go to time out for interacting with her brother during his time out?

she's 7, and we don't do timeout with her.

Why not?

she is a little too old I think. she doesn't really misbehave too much but usually a privilege is taken away if she does.

If time outs aren't working for the little one, try something different like losing privileges. Are you sure she's not provoking him?

We do take away privileges as well. No, she doesn't provoke him.

Something more is going on here. I would very much watch their interactions. If he's having that many concerns, get him evaluated. Some kids need more support than others. It sounds like you have labeled him the problem child and daughter is the golden child and nothing he does is right.

[Anonymous]

Gross.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:YES. I’m a teacher and if a child reported this kind off a punishment to me, I would suspect that something was very wrong in your household. It would not rise to the level of COS reporting but my eyebrows would hurt from being raised and I would be watching out for emotional and physical abuse. I would also assume that both parents were over their heads with parenting.

We don't do this kind of punishment and think it is ineffective... but really? On the whole spectrum of severity of punishments that parents across the country choose to use, this seems relatively mild to me. I would not bat an eye.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Depends on the child.

Nanny here. I've had a few hyperactive children who could focus on holding up and moving a penny on the wall for 5 minutes (and thought it was fun, and it helped them calm down) who couldn't sit still for 5 minutes. I've had a few children who needed to have unlimited time in their rooms to calm down... without active toys, but with books and stuffed animals. Then there are other children who do best with a 5 minute timeout on a step.

You sound like an abusive nanny. That is not ok at all.

what?? she actually sounds like a great nanny - she recognizes that different kids need different types of discipline.

[Anonymous]

FFS What is wrong with parents!!!

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:That sounds insane to me. I do timeouts, but they're in the kid's room and they can come out whenever they want as long as they are ready to be calm and kind. It's intended as an emotional reset, not some sort of ritualistic humiliation.

X100000000

all kids are different. my child with behavioral issues HATES to be alone - sending him to his room is impossible and the process of getting him there just makes the discipline process into a power struggle instead of a brief, swift consequence. and, in many cases, the kid actually needs a punishment instead of an "emotional reset." agree that the punishment should not be designed to be humiliating, but it has to be some kind of unpleasant to work. in general parents far over-estimate how unpleasant it needs to be. but OP's timeout facing the wall doesn't seem that off to me.

Kids don't need punishments. They really don't. You don't have to intentionally make life unpleasant just for the sake of making it more unpleasant in order to be a good parent. Your job as a parent isn't to coax a particular behavior out of a child, its to provide a good environment and lots of love so they can have a safe space to find their way in the world. This often means not letting them do something they would want to do, but that's just a natural consequence of life, not a punishment imposed by the parent.

I don't know how well I'm explaining this but lots of parenting books talk about discipline v. punishment.

YOUR kids don't. MY kid (and many) needs appropriate punishment to establish boundaries and learn appropriate behavior. But lol yeah, please tell all of us dealing with disruptive behavior that all we need is to "provide a good environment and lots of love." You think I don't love my kid? I love my kid enought that I got actual advice from an actually qualified child psychologist instead of reading "parenting books."

The child psychologist said that you need to punish your child? I am intrigued.

oh dear lord. pick up a book - you can start with Kazdin. punishments are not the main technique but are absolutely necessary in some cases.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:21:55 here. Punishment has it's place in parenting. I know the authors of the popular books don't think so, but a real life child psychologist disagrees.

Well real life pediatric associations disagree so I guess we are at an impasse.

real life pediatric associations are against time-outs and consequences? wow that will be surprising news to the highly credentialed child psychologists I’ve worked with.

[Anonymous]

I am from the former USSR and "stand in the corner" was a usual punishment. No "nose to the wall" but you had to just stand and stare at the corner. This was totally fine and one of my kids really benefits from an age-appropriate number of minutes in the corner. He has to count, so helps with some math skills too. Helps him calm down and reset himself. Another kid wants a hug and a chat. Whatever works.

[Anonymous]

I did it a couple of times for a major infraction. But I felt it was too shaming and stopped. Can breed resentment and hatred. Not something you want to do.

[Anonymous]

OP your goal is to have him learn how to self-regulate correct? Because you wont be able to make him stand in a corner with his nose against the wall forever and it certainly isnt a long-term strategy for him. I mean, when he gets mad at 8 years old in the middle of art class, work or at his girlfriend do you want him saying excuse me I need a minute and then go find a corner to put his nose in? NO you dont. You want him to remove himself from the situation and/or be able to be downgrade/shift his emotional state.

Boys are a bit harder because they are actually physiologically more response to high emotions meaning their bodies response is at a higher level (i.e. blood pressure, heart rate, some neurotransmitters, etc).

Id really suggest conscious discipline as a resource on IG. https://www.instagram.com/p/CJRfkHkl79Y/

Your expectation is developmentally inappropriate. Please watch the link video specifically for your kids but the entire account is really helpful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Depends on the child.

Nanny here. I've had a few hyperactive children who could focus on holding up and moving a penny on the wall for 5 minutes (and thought it was fun, and it helped them calm down) who couldn't sit still for 5 minutes. I've had a few children who needed to have unlimited time in their rooms to calm down... without active toys, but with books and stuffed animals. Then there are other children who do best with a 5 minute timeout on a step.

Interesting.

[Anonymous]

We used time outs (nose to the wall) before the kids were old enough to be embarrassed or old enough to go to their room by themselves. Usually only if we were too busy for active redirection but needed to stop the behavior. I don't think it harmed anyone. Certainly not abusive, but also not particularly effective for a 5 yo.

"Stop jumping off the couch please."
"No more jumping off the couch. Why don't you go do X?"
"If you jump off the couch again you will go to time out to calm down."
[2 min in time out to calm down]
"OK, remember we don't jump on furniture. Let's go do XX now." (Redirection)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We used time outs (nose to the wall) before the kids were old enough to be embarrassed or old enough to go to their room by themselves. Usually only if we were too busy for active redirection but needed to stop the behavior. I don't think it harmed anyone. Certainly not abusive, but also not particularly effective for a 5 yo.

"Stop jumping off the couch please."
"No more jumping off the couch. Why don't you go do X?"
"If you jump off the couch again you will go to time out to calm down."
[2 min in time out to calm down]
"OK, remember we don't jump on furniture. Let's go do XX now." (Redirection)

It's child dependent, but I think a 2 year old is "old enough" to go to their room by themselves, at least for a short period and assuming the room is properly set up (kids shouldn't have things in their room that they need supervision with anyway).

And kids are "old enough" to be embarrassed as early as 2.5 (again, child dependent). I think any child capable of making a parent angry enough to try and punish with "nose to wall" is capable of feeling embarrassment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP your goal is to have him learn how to self-regulate correct? Because you wont be able to make him stand in a corner with his nose against the wall forever and it certainly isnt a long-term strategy for him. I mean, when he gets mad at 8 years old in the middle of art class, work or at his girlfriend do you want him saying excuse me I need a minute and then go find a corner to put his nose in? NO you dont. You want him to remove himself from the situation and/or be able to be downgrade/shift his emotional state.

Boys are a bit harder because they are actually physiologically more response to high emotions meaning their bodies response is at a higher level (i.e. blood pressure, heart rate, some neurotransmitters, etc).

Id really suggest conscious discipline as a resource on IG. https://www.instagram.com/p/CJRfkHkl79Y/

Your expectation is developmentally inappropriate. Please watch the link video specifically for your kids but the entire account is really helpful.

lol things like “conscious discipline” do NOT work unless the kid is naturally compliant. If they are naturally compliant, anything will work. Whenever I read those stupid parenting books and blogs, the description of the kids’ behavior is so incredibly mild that I laugh. Get back to me when your kid is repeatedly hitting you and other kids. you can’t emote your way out of that. you have to set firm boundaries, and past the toddler stage, you do that with a combination of positive and negative reinforcement.