No CogAT testing in FCPS AAP Screening this year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Curie school has five branches and offers NNAT and CogAT Prep that run $850-$950 dollars. They also run tutoring for K-6 Math and Science. They wouldn't run these classes if they were not profitable. And they are but one tutoring center. There is no way of knowing how many people are sending kids to these types of centers but there are more than enough options out there that make me think it is a decent percentage of the population. Grocery stores have NNAT and CogAT prep books for sale, I have seen them at multiple H Mart and Lotte locations.

So yes, there is a good amount of prepping. This is not exactly hidden.

It is theorized that it is one of the reasons that the test scores have become less important in the process.

Profitable does not equal effective

Effective enough that parents are willing to spend the money. If there were not enough kids being accepted into AAP or TJ, parents would stop using these centers.

No they wouldn't. You realize that research shows all that baby einstein crap and educational toys do nothing to improve the intelligence of toddlers and young children and yet parents spend tons of money on those toys too, right? Did you also realize that numerous research studies have been unable to show a positive effect of top quality preschools for more than a year or two after attendance (in other words, if your kid goes to a cadillac preschool, any minor positive effects have worn off by 1-2 years later)? I know this because I spent years doing marketing for an early childhood education company. So please don't confuse parents spending money on things with the idea that these things have a benefit. People are incredibly bad at discerning cause and effect and disentangling it from the passage of time, especially when there sample size consists of their one or two children in its entirety.

Parents applying to TJ or AAP likely don't care if the effect wears off- the kids needs to be short on test day- that's it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Curie school has five branches and offers NNAT and CogAT Prep that run $850-$950 dollars. They also run tutoring for K-6 Math and Science. They wouldn't run these classes if they were not profitable. And they are but one tutoring center. There is no way of knowing how many people are sending kids to these types of centers but there are more than enough options out there that make me think it is a decent percentage of the population. Grocery stores have NNAT and CogAT prep books for sale, I have seen them at multiple H Mart and Lotte locations.

So yes, there is a good amount of prepping. This is not exactly hidden.

It is theorized that it is one of the reasons that the test scores have become less important in the process.

Profitable does not equal effective

Effective enough that parents are willing to spend the money. If there were not enough kids being accepted into AAP or TJ, parents would stop using these centers.

No they wouldn't. You realize that research shows all that baby einstein crap and educational toys do nothing to improve the intelligence of toddlers and young children and yet parents spend tons of money on those toys too, right? Did you also realize that numerous research studies have been unable to show a positive effect of top quality preschools for more than a year or two after attendance (in other words, if your kid goes to a cadillac preschool, any minor positive effects have worn off by 1-2 years later)? I know this because I spent years doing marketing for an early childhood education company. So please don't confuse parents spending money on things with the idea that these things have a benefit. People are incredibly bad at discerning cause and effect and disentangling it from the passage of time, especially when there sample size consists of their one or two children in its entirety.

You then also realize those same studies show that any closure of “the gap” by Head Start/low income preschool programs is also lost by 2nd or 3rd grade. The biggest correlating factor with educational success is the highest degree obtained by the child’s mother. Turns out all the “equity” programs have a super high price tag and very little effect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who said poor kids can't take the CogAT? Isn't there a sliding fee or free option for Farms or low-income kids?

At George Mason I mean...

Yes!

Fee Reduction Policy for Individual Cognitive Assessments
It may be possible for your child to receive a fee reduction for an individual cognitive assessment (WISC-V, SB5, DAS-II, or KABC-II) if you meet the following criteria:
you are seeking admission to the Fairfax County Public School's Advanced Academic Program for your child, aged seven or above;
your family qualifies for the federal Free/Reduced Price Lunch program. Acceptable documentation is a copy of your eligibility letter from your child's local school.
A qualified child may receive one cognitive assessment, per year, at the reduced fee.

A lot of families do not have even “reduced fee” Cogat money. Dude, people lost their jobs in CoVID. Are you really this out of touch?

Not only that - what about the logistics of getting there? Parents with lower paying jobs may not have a car. May not have paid leave and cannot take off unpaid time. We passed a food donation line a few weeks ago that stretched a mile with people waiting in their cars. People are really hurting and probably dont have the time, ability or resources to focus on this while trying to survive.

This is easily solvable. FCPS could transport kids to school or GMU on test day if they wanted, just as they could choose to administer the test in school in a distanced manner. Just as the offered the SAT recently. Parents who could drive their kids probably would do so, further reducing the logistical hurdle.

I appreciate OP / PPs saying it's not going to happen, and I'm not arguing that's untrue. But the logistical barriers are very very easy to overcome. FCPS has the buses, it has the staff to proctor a half-day exam, and it has the empty space to spread kids out safely.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who said poor kids can't take the CogAT? Isn't there a sliding fee or free option for Farms or low-income kids?

At George Mason I mean...

Yes!

Fee Reduction Policy for Individual Cognitive Assessments
It may be possible for your child to receive a fee reduction for an individual cognitive assessment (WISC-V, SB5, DAS-II, or KABC-II) if you meet the following criteria:
you are seeking admission to the Fairfax County Public School's Advanced Academic Program for your child, aged seven or above;
your family qualifies for the federal Free/Reduced Price Lunch program. Acceptable documentation is a copy of your eligibility letter from your child's local school.
A qualified child may receive one cognitive assessment, per year, at the reduced fee.

A lot of families do not have even “reduced fee” Cogat money. Dude, people lost their jobs in CoVID. Are you really this out of touch?

Not only that - what about the logistics of getting there? Parents with lower paying jobs may not have a car. May not have paid leave and cannot take off unpaid time. We passed a food donation line a few weeks ago that stretched a mile with people waiting in their cars. People are really hurting and probably dont have the time, ability or resources to focus on this while trying to survive.

So how is that kid going to go to college? Even if they manage to secure a full scholarship, they still have to physically get there somehow. At some point, the parents have to figure it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It always amazes me how some parents think it is the end all be all. Having had one in AAP and one not, it really is not all that you would think it was cracked up to be. I think 5 th grade was the biggest difference(some more in depth projects). Everything else was not that different. Except for math. And then in MS(at least at Longfellow) Math is the only difference. My kids were on the same team and, except for math, had the exact same assignments and projects. for Language Arts, SS and science. A few papers were due a few days ahead in AAP but that was it. Maybe because all classes at that school are honors anyways….

It makes a huge difference for those of us in schools with high ESOL and FARMS populations where your example is not the case, but you would not understand that.

Oh no. Your kids will have to go to school with brown kids for one more year.

What’s your base school? Serious question.

Better question: why do you think you and your kids are better than the families at your base school to the extent you rely on AAP as an escape ?

This is a stupid question. You dont have to think your kid is better than someone to acknowledge that certain scenarios do slow the class down and negatively impacts the education your child is receiving. We dealt with this and it was not ideal. Nothing to do with the kids but no, I'm not sacrificing a better education for my kids so that someone's feelings arent hurt

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who said poor kids can't take the CogAT? Isn't there a sliding fee or free option for Farms or low-income kids?

At George Mason I mean...

Yes!

Fee Reduction Policy for Individual Cognitive Assessments
It may be possible for your child to receive a fee reduction for an individual cognitive assessment (WISC-V, SB5, DAS-II, or KABC-II) if you meet the following criteria:
you are seeking admission to the Fairfax County Public School's Advanced Academic Program for your child, aged seven or above;
your family qualifies for the federal Free/Reduced Price Lunch program. Acceptable documentation is a copy of your eligibility letter from your child's local school.
A qualified child may receive one cognitive assessment, per year, at the reduced fee.

A lot of families do not have even “reduced fee” Cogat money. Dude, people lost their jobs in CoVID. Are you really this out of touch?

Not only that - what about the logistics of getting there? Parents with lower paying jobs may not have a car. May not have paid leave and cannot take off unpaid time. We passed a food donation line a few weeks ago that stretched a mile with people waiting in their cars. People are really hurting and probably dont have the time, ability or resources to focus on this while trying to survive.

This is easily solvable. FCPS could transport kids to school or GMU on test day if they wanted, just as they could choose to administer the test in school in a distanced manner. Just as the offered the SAT recently. Parents who could drive their kids probably would do so, further reducing the logistical hurdle.

I appreciate OP / PPs saying it's not going to happen, and I'm not arguing that's untrue. But the logistical barriers are very very easy to overcome. FCPS has the buses, it has the staff to proctor a half-day exam, and it has the empty space to spread kids out safely.

Agree! These tests are provided free of charge and they have weekend and evening appointments. Sorry, I just don’t buy that it isn’t doable with a little effort.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

Yikes! 7:50 for elem sounds god awful!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Curie school has five branches and offers NNAT and CogAT Prep that run $850-$950 dollars. They also run tutoring for K-6 Math and Science. They wouldn't run these classes if they were not profitable. And they are but one tutoring center. There is no way of knowing how many people are sending kids to these types of centers but there are more than enough options out there that make me think it is a decent percentage of the population. Grocery stores have NNAT and CogAT prep books for sale, I have seen them at multiple H Mart and Lotte locations.

So yes, there is a good amount of prepping. This is not exactly hidden.

It is theorized that it is one of the reasons that the test scores have become less important in the process.

Profitable does not equal effective

Effective enough that parents are willing to spend the money. If there were not enough kids being accepted into AAP or TJ, parents would stop using these centers.

No they wouldn't. You realize that research shows all that baby einstein crap and educational toys do nothing to improve the intelligence of toddlers and young children and yet parents spend tons of money on those toys too, right? Did you also realize that numerous research studies have been unable to show a positive effect of top quality preschools for more than a year or two after attendance (in other words, if your kid goes to a cadillac preschool, any minor positive effects have worn off by 1-2 years later)? I know this because I spent years doing marketing for an early childhood education company. So please don't confuse parents spending money on things with the idea that these things have a benefit. People are incredibly bad at discerning cause and effect and disentangling it from the passage of time, especially when there sample size consists of their one or two children in its entirety.

You then also realize those same studies show that any closure of “the gap” by Head Start/low income preschool programs is also lost by 2nd or 3rd grade. The biggest correlating factor with educational success is the highest degree obtained by the child’s mother. Turns out all the “equity” programs have a super high price tag and very little effect.

Uh, yeah, I do realize that. Did something about my previous post make you think that I didn't?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

Ah, 7:50am for 6-7 years for one elementary kid, longer if you have multiple kids- that sounds absolutely miserable! All my kids sleep until 8am:

Yikes! 7:50 for elem sounds god awful!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

Yikes! 7:50 for elem sounds god awful!

Schools are close here. We wake up at 7 and drop them off about 7:40. It’s not a big deal at all. I get nice early bedtimes which are heavenly and my kids are well rested. As are the older kids who get to sleep in. It’s really a win-win and most Loudoun parents I talk to really like it. Obviously you can stay where you are!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

Yikes! 7:50 for elem sounds god awful!

Schools are close here. We wake up at 7 and drop them off about 7:40. It’s not a big deal at all. I get nice early bedtimes which are heavenly and my kids are well rested. As are the older kids who get to sleep in. It’s really a win-win and most Loudoun parents I talk to really like it. Obviously you can stay where you are!

My kids sleep at least until 8 am. It would be very hard for mine to get up that early and sustain a long day, and then have homework and activities on top of it all. And then to have to worry about getting to bed early to wake up early the next am.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

Yikes! 7:50 for elem sounds god awful!

Schools are close here. We wake up at 7 and drop them off about 7:40. It’s not a big deal at all. I get nice early bedtimes which are heavenly and my kids are well rested. As are the older kids who get to sleep in. It’s really a win-win and most Loudoun parents I talk to really like it. Obviously you can stay where you are!

My kids sleep at least until 8 am. It would be very hard for mine to get up that early and sustain a long day, and then have homework and activities on top of it all. And then to have to worry about getting to bed early to wake up early the next am.

So don’t move here? I don’t care. But good luck come middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of this nonsense is why we chose to move to Loudoun. The gifted program is a minor after thought and not a separate curriculum. They also admit way fewer kids (with even higher scores) but all students remain in class together.

I’m starting to understand. The commute would be murder but I could own a horse farm out there for what I pay to live in FCPS. Now that I telework full-time it’s incredibly appealing.

PP here. I live 10 minutes north of Reston Town Center. The downtown commute is brutal, but places like Tyson’s, Reston, Chantilly and Herndon are fine.

NP but we're planning on moving here after my older child finishes 2nd grade (this year) mainly because we think AAP is horseshit.

PP here. My neighbor is an AART in FCPS and she deliberately chose LCPS for her kids because of the AAP craziness. I think you will be happy with your decision. We also have the best start times. 7:50 ES/8:30 MS/9:15 HS.

Yikes! 7:50 for elem sounds god awful!

It sounds awesome, as my kids wake up at 6 every day. Don't kids wake up later as they go from preschool to upper elementaryto middleschool? Plus it's very compatible with a dual income family's work schedule. If I drop off my ES kid at 9:20am, I don't get to work until 10:15. So I pay for SACC before care (pre covid). So do many other parents who use the SACC before care.