How do I communicate with someone who can’t?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

Same in my spouse’s house whilst growing up. He told me they all ignored his father for many years in the house.
I was like WTF? Why?

There was no formal diagnosis and their mother never named what she suspected. My spouse said it was because the father never knew what was going on and couldn’t follow conversations.

It’s now crystal clear. And we have to be careful with the grandkids.

Wait what was wrong with him? And why can’t the grandkids be around him?

How do these men even get married? Are they extremely hot or something? I’m continually amazed that their wives stay. I know that in my mother’s case, she is incredibly beautiful to the point where people sort of miss how obviously nuts she is, and my father wasn’t so much better himself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

Same in my spouse’s house whilst growing up. He told me they all ignored his father for many years in the house.
I was like WTF? Why?

There was no formal diagnosis and their mother never named what she suspected. My spouse said it was because the father never knew what was going on and couldn’t follow conversations.

It’s now crystal clear. And we have to be careful with the grandkids.

Wait what was wrong with him? And why can’t the grandkids be around him?

How do these men even get married? Are they extremely hot or something? I’m continually amazed that their wives stay. I know that in my mother’s case, she is incredibly beautiful to the point where people sort of miss how obviously nuts she is, and my father wasn’t so much better himself.

DP here. MIL and FIL were very much alike - neither were particularly charming or outgoing - maybe in public, but absolutely not behind closed doors. DH and siblings feared their parents, because their parents were prone to snap. Some of the things out of MILs mouth were abhorrent - probably FIL, too. They get together because, to simply, "why not?"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

Same in my spouse’s house whilst growing up. He told me they all ignored his father for many years in the house.
I was like WTF? Why?

There was no formal diagnosis and their mother never named what she suspected. My spouse said it was because the father never knew what was going on and couldn’t follow conversations.

It’s now crystal clear. And we have to be careful with the grandkids.

Wait what was wrong with him? And why can’t the grandkids be around him?

How do these men even get married? Are they extremely hot or something? I’m continually amazed that their wives stay. I know that in my mother’s case, she is incredibly beautiful to the point where people sort of miss how obviously nuts she is, and my father wasn’t so much better himself.

DP here. MIL and FIL were very much alike - neither were particularly charming or outgoing - maybe in public, but absolutely not behind closed doors. DH and siblings feared their parents, because their parents were prone to snap. Some of the things out of MILs mouth were abhorrent - probably FIL, too. They get together because, to simply, "why not?"

To add, DH has reduced his snapping, only because I threatened to call police from his throwing stuff at the kids and me, and driving recklessly with them in the car. The tantrums were unbearable. DH still tries it, but I stick up for us - which you have no choice but to do, OP. The tantrums were how to be "heard" in his family of non-communicators.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And OP, if he loves you and is trying to work on things, take it as a blessing. There just aren't a lot of men out there than can do life's administration besides their own. They don't exist. And if they do, they are taken or they are helping everyone and don't have that much time for family.

This is so wrong. There are men out there who are completely competent and come to the table as equal partners. OP (and apparently you) just didn't select those men.

100% this.

Men absolutely can and do perform life admin, mental load, physical load, and are balanced partners. Many more than this person seems to think. Even those with ADHD, if they have had coaching and tools to manage it.

I feel very badly for women who think this is normal and okay to life with.

ASD is more challenging, and extremely rough on everyone if the partner on the spectrum masked until a big life changing event (such as having kids).

I think they have to tell themselves this, otherwise they're admitting to themselves that they've chosen poorly and their life is worse because of it. So they deny the existence of men who are full partners.

It's not that. It's that if you divorce your kids still have to live life with that person and you have to communicate from further away. Instead of pasta shells, it's much bigger issues.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

Same in my spouse’s house whilst growing up. He told me they all ignored his father for many years in the house.
I was like WTF? Why?

There was no formal diagnosis and their mother never named what she suspected. My spouse said it was because the father never knew what was going on and couldn’t follow conversations.

It’s now crystal clear. And we have to be careful with the grandkids.

Wait what was wrong with him? And why can’t the grandkids be around him?

How do these men even get married? Are they extremely hot or something? I’m continually amazed that their wives stay. I know that in my mother’s case, she is incredibly beautiful to the point where people sort of miss how obviously nuts she is, and my father wasn’t so much better himself.

Love bombing. They find people with a similar special interest. And yes they are good looking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And OP, if he loves you and is trying to work on things, take it as a blessing. There just aren't a lot of men out there than can do life's administration besides their own. They don't exist. And if they do, they are taken or they are helping everyone and don't have that much time for family.

This is so wrong. There are men out there who are completely competent and come to the table as equal partners. OP (and apparently you) just didn't select those men.

100% this.

Men absolutely can and do perform life admin, mental load, physical load, and are balanced partners. Many more than this person seems to think. Even those with ADHD, if they have had coaching and tools to manage it.

I feel very badly for women who think this is normal and okay to life with.

ASD is more challenging, and extremely rough on everyone if the partner on the spectrum masked until a big life changing event (such as having kids).

I think they have to tell themselves this, otherwise they're admitting to themselves that they've chosen poorly and their life is worse because of it. So they deny the existence of men who are full partners.

It's not that. It's that if you divorce your kids still have to live life with that person and you have to communicate from further away. Instead of pasta shells, it's much bigger issues.

DP here. Exactly. MUCH bigger issues - because it would be ALL about them (DH) and his "impressing" outsiders, while the kids suffer from his neglect (like his parents did to him).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

Same in my spouse’s house whilst growing up. He told me they all ignored his father for many years in the house.
I was like WTF? Why?

There was no formal diagnosis and their mother never named what she suspected. My spouse said it was because the father never knew what was going on and couldn’t follow conversations.

It’s now crystal clear. And we have to be careful with the grandkids.

Wait what was wrong with him? And why can’t the grandkids be around him?

How do these men even get married? Are they extremely hot or something? I’m continually amazed that their wives stay. I know that in my mother’s case, she is incredibly beautiful to the point where people sort of miss how obviously nuts she is, and my father wasn’t so much better himself.

Love bombing. They find people with a similar special interest. And yes they are good looking.

Not always this. I feel like you are regurgitating something you read?

[Anonymous]

OP, PP here - you have to put everything in writing. Which sounds exhausting, but literally the black and white thinking conveys to communication: "You need to stop this (behavior here) because (ramifications here)." Texts work, but use sparingly.

Speak his language - pick one that he understands: ie: it will cost him time, money, etc. Being succinct is key, because they do not have empathy or seem to have or value feelings, because their birth family did not.

This is a big step to being heard. HTH.

It is hard when you grow up in a nice, normal, outgoing, social, kind, warm, communicative family - and you get thrown into this awful, abusive situation that you never knew existed. REALLY hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, PP here - you have to put everything in writing. Which sounds exhausting, but literally the black and white thinking conveys to communication: "You need to stop this (behavior here) because (ramifications here)." Texts work, but use sparingly.

Speak his language - pick one that he understands: ie: it will cost him time, money, etc. Being succinct is key, because they do not have empathy or seem to have or value feelings, because their birth family did not.

This is a big step to being heard. HTH.

It is hard when you grow up in a nice, normal, outgoing, social, kind, warm, communicative family - and you get thrown into this awful, abusive situation that you never knew existed. REALLY hard.

You can put things in writing but a lot of people that have auditory issues also difficulty remembering details from writing. Use text sparingly. One idea at a time.

[Anonymous]

Amen to that.

[Anonymous]

Meant amen to it’s really hard to live with or around these types

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, PP here - you have to put everything in writing. Which sounds exhausting, but literally the black and white thinking conveys to communication: "You need to stop this (behavior here) because (ramifications here)." Texts work, but use sparingly.

Speak his language - pick one that he understands: ie: it will cost him time, money, etc. Being succinct is key, because they do not have empathy or seem to have or value feelings, because their birth family did not.

This is a big step to being heard. HTH.

It is hard when you grow up in a nice, normal, outgoing, social, kind, warm, communicative family - and you get thrown into this awful, abusive situation that you never knew existed. REALLY hard.

You can put things in writing but a lot of people that have auditory issues also difficulty remembering details from writing. Use text sparingly. One idea at a time.

PP here. Agree - thank you for adding that!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

Same in my spouse’s house whilst growing up. He told me they all ignored his father for many years in the house.
I was like WTF? Why?

There was no formal diagnosis and their mother never named what she suspected. My spouse said it was because the father never knew what was going on and couldn’t follow conversations.

It’s now crystal clear. And we have to be careful with the grandkids.

Wait what was wrong with him? And why can’t the grandkids be around him?

How do these men even get married? Are they extremely hot or something? I’m continually amazed that their wives stay. I know that in my mother’s case, she is incredibly beautiful to the point where people sort of miss how obviously nuts she is, and my father wasn’t so much better himself.

What was wrong?
He can’t make sense if the world and bad accidents happen.

Him with young kids?
Reparked his car and 2 yo followed him out to driveway and almost got ran over (unaware of surroundings or kids). Big heavy doors slamming on kids fingers (zero situational awareness again). Tells a 5 yo to put the raw steak on the hot grill (what a fun idea!). Hangs a 6yo up in a 10 wall at the park expecting her to do a full pull-up and slide down the slide. Instead she fell and broke her tib/fib (ugh, it was an accident! (Of piss poor judgment).

Him with older kids?
He can’t follow a conversation or do back and forth talking. He is however, kind and nods along. He talks to a 10 yo as if they are a 2yo.

How did this type get married?
I don’t know. He was a goofy, adventurous (re no common sense), Phd academic from another country (adventure). Esol blocked a lot of the underlying mental disorders.

She also seems on the spectrum - extreme introvert, no social life, rude off putting comments, puts down anything active people so.

Hard to tell if she was always like that or if 40+ years of living with an ASD husband did that to her.

[Anonymous]

A lot of men aren't into getting married. These men are because they want to be taken care of. But they don't advertise to women this way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of men aren't into getting married. These men are because they want to be taken care of. But they don't advertise to women this way.

x100000