How do I communicate with someone who can’t?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And OP, if he loves you and is trying to work on things, take it as a blessing. There just aren't a lot of men out there than can do life's administration besides their own. They don't exist. And if they do, they are taken or they are helping everyone and don't have that much time for family.

This is so wrong. There are men out there who are completely competent and come to the table as equal partners. OP (and apparently you) just didn't select those men.

100% this.

Men absolutely can and do perform life admin, mental load, physical load, and are balanced partners. Many more than this person seems to think. Even those with ADHD, if they have had coaching and tools to manage it.

I feel very badly for women who think this is normal and okay to life with.

ASD is more challenging, and extremely rough on everyone if the partner on the spectrum masked until a big life changing event (such as having kids).

I think they have to tell themselves this, otherwise they're admitting to themselves that they've chosen poorly and their life is worse because of it. So they deny the existence of men who are full partners.

It's not that. It's that if you divorce your kids still have to live life with that person and you have to communicate from further away. Instead of pasta shells, it's much bigger issues.

That doesn't explain why they insist that all men are just like this. They're just trying to make themselves feel better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I also got very social with my friends, work, kids stuff, my extended family. It saves your sanity.

And told people what I was going through in the household.

People get it.

+1

For the most part, this. Screen carefully.

[Anonymous]

OMG don't even get me started on the lack of common sense in that GD family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And OP, if he loves you and is trying to work on things, take it as a blessing. There just aren't a lot of men out there than can do life's administration besides their own. They don't exist. And if they do, they are taken or they are helping everyone and don't have that much time for family.

This is so wrong. There are men out there who are completely competent and come to the table as equal partners. OP (and apparently you) just didn't select those men.

100% this.

Men absolutely can and do perform life admin, mental load, physical load, and are balanced partners. Many more than this person seems to think. Even those with ADHD, if they have had coaching and tools to manage it.

I feel very badly for women who think this is normal and okay to life with.

ASD is more challenging, and extremely rough on everyone if the partner on the spectrum masked until a big life changing event (such as having kids).

I think they have to tell themselves this, otherwise they're admitting to themselves that they've chosen poorly and their life is worse because of it. So they deny the existence of men who are full partners.

It's not that. It's that if you divorce your kids still have to live life with that person and you have to communicate from further away. Instead of pasta shells, it's much bigger issues.

That doesn't explain why they insist that all men are just like this. They're just trying to make themselves feel better.

I think you are referring to my comment which didn't mean this but meant that a lot of men especially on apps aren't into home life. With young children, there aren't a plethera of other men for OP. OP's husband at least tries. Many other men especially on apps want nothing to do with the home and even if they don't have a disability will not pick up pasta. Or even marry. Sometimes because they are single and not interested in marrying and other times because they are cheating and already married. Or they are foreign and haven't been groomed to be happy doing "women's work". There are some but a large percentage of men on apps aren't marriage material either by choice or ability or culture.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH has what I perceive to be major communication deficits that he refuses to acknowledge. When I communicate things verbally, he often mishears or does not remember what I’ve said. So, after many years of struggles and problems, we agreed that important and non-important things must be communicated in writing. Tedious, but fine. In theory it should work better. But it doesn’t, and when something goes wrong because he’s ignored what I wrote or made up something entirely different and he is faced with the consequences, he deflects and throws blame at me, and gets so upset when caught in his mistakes that he’ll raise his voice and essentially tantrum while demanding that I “drop it.” Our neighbors live very close so this is effective…but also manipulative and doesn’t improve our communication.

Today he blew up for the dumbest thing ever. I texted a 3-item grocery list at his request, which included “pasta shells” for a pasta salad that I frequently make or have him help me make.

While I was driving and unable to see his text reply, he asked “penne? Rotini?”

I came home and both types of pasta were on the counter. No shells. I showed him the text and said “I asked you to get pasta shells. What happened?”

He said, “how was I supposed to know what kind of pasta you wanted?” And it blew up from there. Instead of owning the mistake, he blamed me for mentioning the mistake and said I was making him feel stupid and we couldn’t talk about it anymore because “you’re just trying to make me feel stupid.” I wasn’t, but I do think he felt stupid and I also don’t know how to manage being on the receiving end of his joint communication/ego problems.

I have NO idea how to go forward- I literally cannot communicate any more specifically and I also cannot take over grocery shopping, which is one of the last tasks I don’t already do due to blowups like this.

How can I communicate with someone like this? I’m lost and frustrated and feel stuck.

To preemptively answer your questions:
1) he is on ADHD medication
2) he was not like this before we married or had kids, but he did travel a lot for work and was free to focus on nothing else. He is very very successful at work but not so successful that we can hire someone to buy proverbial pasta shells for us.

There's verbal communication OP and then there's emotional IQ. Your DH is trying to make you happy. He's not getting things done correctly but he's trying. He feels shame when he can't do things right, that's why he explodes.

If you want to stay together then you're going to have to see the forest for the trees. Think of your end goal - a loving relationship. If things aren't critical (for example, which style of pasta to get which isn't life-or-death), let it go or do it yourself. For things that are important, create a system ahead of time, not when urgent, and get DH's input on how to work together. Appreciate DH when he gets things right, be over the top about it even if it's simple and easy for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: I showed him the text and said “I asked you to get pasta shells. What happened?”

This doesn’t sound like great communication on your part either. You sound like you are his mother and he is your child. Even if you’re not doing it on purpose, who does want to be spoken to as if they were stupid?

So what should I say? I’m not asking rhetorically. How do I respond to this stuff?

+1. You're not a great communicator either OP.

What you say is - thanks for getting some pasta honey. I really appreciate you taking the time to go to the store for me.

And next time, get it yourself or send a picture of exactly what brand pasta shells and what aisle to go to. You are the one who notices and cares about the shape of the pasta, not him.

[Anonymous]

I would not care about the pasta shape so much OP. Whatever pasta is fine. He got the pasta, and he seems obvious as to what is "shells" and what isn't.

Drop these small things and move on, and deal with bigger things.

[Anonymous]

I cannot comprehend why posters are defending the DH here. As a grown up, especially one who has chosen to marry and have children, it’s not okay to deflect and pass onto others. And certainly not okay to chronically lose your temper and cause fear in others.

[Anonymous]

It's just that the example given was small. The deflection is the problem, not the pasta. I think OP picked it because it was so small that it seemed incredible someone would defect this mistake, but this is her husband's default behavior so if he's going to be called on it, it needs to be about something big. That's what others are saying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH has what I perceive to be major communication deficits that he refuses to acknowledge. When I communicate things verbally, he often mishears or does not remember what I’ve said. So, after many years of struggles and problems, we agreed that important and non-important things must be communicated in writing. Tedious, but fine. In theory it should work better. But it doesn’t, and when something goes wrong because he’s ignored what I wrote or made up something entirely different and he is faced with the consequences, he deflects and throws blame at me, and gets so upset when caught in his mistakes that he’ll raise his voice and essentially tantrum while demanding that I “drop it.” Our neighbors live very close so this is effective…but also manipulative and doesn’t improve our communication.

Today he blew up for the dumbest thing ever. I texted a 3-item grocery list at his request, which included “pasta shells” for a pasta salad that I frequently make or have him help me make.

While I was driving and unable to see his text reply, he asked “penne? Rotini?”

I came home and both types of pasta were on the counter. No shells. I showed him the text and said “I asked you to get pasta shells. What happened?”

He said, “how was I supposed to know what kind of pasta you wanted?” And it blew up from there. Instead of owning the mistake, he blamed me for mentioning the mistake and said I was making him feel stupid and we couldn’t talk about it anymore because “you’re just trying to make me feel stupid.” I wasn’t, but I do think he felt stupid and I also don’t know how to manage being on the receiving end of his joint communication/ego problems.

I have NO idea how to go forward- I literally cannot communicate any more specifically and I also cannot take over grocery shopping, which is one of the last tasks I don’t already do due to blowups like this.

How can I communicate with someone like this? I’m lost and frustrated and feel stuck.

To preemptively answer your questions:
1) he is on ADHD medication
2) he was not like this before we married or had kids, but he did travel a lot for work and was free to focus on nothing else. He is very very successful at work but not so successful that we can hire someone to buy proverbial pasta shells for us.

“I asked you go get pasta shells. What happened?” Says a lot about YOUR communication style. It’s accusatory and critical. And if you address him like this, it’s probably accumulated in him and he feels like nothing he does is ever good enough. It’s a common dynamic in a dysfunctional relationship where the woman sees herself as a task master and is a perfectionist. The blow ups indicate this accumulation.

Really? I think it's pretty calm. It invites the possibility for him to say "they were out of shells, so I made do" or any number of other reasonable explanations. But doesn't sound like OP's husband is a reasonable man.

This is one of these things where tone matters a lot. I am betting he felt attacked by the way she said it and it’s a familiar feeling.

[Anonymous]

And I’ll bet if she said Please and Thank you 50x a day nothing would get done nor done correctly either.

Then what? Never bring it up? Remind him and suffer from another verbal attack? Sent a short & simple text and get a lashing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DH has what I perceive to be major communication deficits that he refuses to acknowledge. When I communicate things verbally, he often mishears or does not remember what I’ve said. So, after many years of struggles and problems, we agreed that important and non-important things must be communicated in writing. Tedious, but fine. In theory it should work better. But it doesn’t, and when something goes wrong because he’s ignored what I wrote or made up something entirely different and he is faced with the consequences, he deflects and throws blame at me, and gets so upset when caught in his mistakes that he’ll raise his voice and essentially tantrum while demanding that I “drop it.” Our neighbors live very close so this is effective…but also manipulative and doesn’t improve our communication.

Today he blew up for the dumbest thing ever. I texted a 3-item grocery list at his request, which included “pasta shells” for a pasta salad that I frequently make or have him help me make.

While I was driving and unable to see his text reply, he asked “penne? Rotini?”

I came home and both types of pasta were on the counter. No shells. I showed him the text and said “I asked you to get pasta shells. What happened?”

He said, “how was I supposed to know what kind of pasta you wanted?” And it blew up from there. Instead of owning the mistake, he blamed me for mentioning the mistake and said I was making him feel stupid and we couldn’t talk about it anymore because “you’re just trying to make me feel stupid.” I wasn’t, but I do think he felt stupid and I also don’t know how to manage being on the receiving end of his joint communication/ego problems.

I have NO idea how to go forward- I literally cannot communicate any more specifically and I also cannot take over grocery shopping, which is one of the last tasks I don’t already do due to blowups like this.

How can I communicate with someone like this? I’m lost and frustrated and feel stuck.

To preemptively answer your questions:
1) he is on ADHD medication
2) he was not like this before we married or had kids, but he did travel a lot for work and was free to focus on nothing else. He is very very successful at work but not so successful that we can hire someone to buy proverbial pasta shells for us.

It is fking pasta op. Is that really a big deal. You eat and comes out as sh*t. All same thing. What a pain.

[Anonymous]

OP. You have to figure out a way to either accept or just manage the task yourself. Employees have to deal with this at work all the time too. See if you can have a loving partner before you really do have to do the grocery shopping yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DH has what I perceive to be major communication deficits that he refuses to acknowledge. When I communicate things verbally, he often mishears or does not remember what I’ve said. So, after many years of struggles and problems, we agreed that important and non-important things must be communicated in writing. Tedious, but fine. In theory it should work better. But it doesn’t, and when something goes wrong because he’s ignored what I wrote or made up something entirely different and he is faced with the consequences, he deflects and throws blame at me, and gets so upset when caught in his mistakes that he’ll raise his voice and essentially tantrum while demanding that I “drop it.” Our neighbors live very close so this is effective…but also manipulative and doesn’t improve our communication.

Today he blew up for the dumbest thing ever. I texted a 3-item grocery list at his request, which included “pasta shells” for a pasta salad that I frequently make or have him help me make.

While I was driving and unable to see his text reply, he asked “penne? Rotini?”

I came home and both types of pasta were on the counter. No shells. I showed him the text and said “I asked you to get pasta shells. What happened?”

He said, “how was I supposed to know what kind of pasta you wanted?” And it blew up from there. Instead of owning the mistake, he blamed me for mentioning the mistake and said I was making him feel stupid and we couldn’t talk about it anymore because “you’re just trying to make me feel stupid.” I wasn’t, but I do think he felt stupid and I also don’t know how to manage being on the receiving end of his joint communication/ego problems.

I have NO idea how to go forward- I literally cannot communicate any more specifically and I also cannot take over grocery shopping, which is one of the last tasks I don’t already do due to blowups like this.

How can I communicate with someone like this? I’m lost and frustrated and feel stuck.

To preemptively answer your questions:
1) he is on ADHD medication
2) he was not like this before we married or had kids, but he did travel a lot for work and was free to focus on nothing else. He is very very successful at work but not so successful that we can hire someone to buy proverbial pasta shells for us.

“I asked you go get pasta shells. What happened?” Says a lot about YOUR communication style. It’s accusatory and critical. And if you address him like this, it’s probably accumulated in him and he feels like nothing he does is ever good enough. It’s a common dynamic in a dysfunctional relationship where the woman sees herself as a task master and is a perfectionist. The blow ups indicate this accumulation.

Really? I think it's pretty calm. It invites the possibility for him to say "they were out of shells, so I made do" or any number of other reasonable explanations. But doesn't sound like OP's husband is a reasonable man.

This is one of these things where tone matters a lot. I am betting he felt attacked by the way she said it and it’s a familiar feeling.

He has developed ODD- Oppositional Defiant Disorder, likely as a child, as a handy way to escape accountability. Now every comment, suggestion, question is wrongfully interpreted as an attack. He basically doesn’t want anyone to speak to him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do some research on Chris Watts and autism and you can see how when they first started dating he had autistic tendencies and she taught him how to work with people better but then that led to him resenting her. There is a video of him giving speeches in a class which makes this obvious. Their life ended up with him realizing he couldn’t keep up with all the family pressure, finding a mistress and killing his wife and kids. The wife was also narcissistic, high energy, thought nothing of giving him small criticisms like pasta shells and taking on high risk with money and more kids causing more stress for him and didn’t realize that he wasn’t on board with decisions or could handle these stressors. His family had lots of loopholes because that’s how they deal with stress. His dad is an addict and also autistic. They can’t cope with the world well unless everyone is positive and forgiving with one another all day long. Life is transactional and it’s just expected that multiple errors will occur all day so that the transactions can continue without raising anxiety. Reducing anxiety is the whole purpose of life. Try just making light of things and overlooking the mistakes and see if things get better emotionally. They won’t learn to fix mistakes because they can’t but you can get along better together and find other things to appreciate about each other. People like this can be very loyal but can’t remember back to yesterday and what you did for them and calculate effort with feeling. They just remember how you make them feel.

This is all true.

But to tell a NT wife and kids to go live like a simple hermit to accommodate a dysfunctional and unhealthy father is healthy for any of them.

He likely grew up in a household that stayed home, only did simple things - no holidays, vacations, sports, and never socialized or spoke much.

That is their normal.

He hit a wall with wife and kids and now all are suffering. He should exit stage left and just swing by for dinner once a week when he has the energy.

I’m the OP and you are correct that my DH’s family mostly stayed home, barely celebrated holidays, and did minimal social/extracurricular stuff. And they are quite quiet at meals. I didn’t know any of this until I got to know them over the years.

But how did YOU know this?! I’m baffled and intrigued.

My mother is mentally ill (not adhd or hfa) and our household growing up was much the same way to accommodate her. Nothing mattered as much as placating her and keeping her calm. Everything else is secondary or doesn’t matter at all.

+1 although my mom is more just toxic and hyper critical. I’ll take my likely HFA spouse any day.

Just a crazy thought, but not everyone has to be super social and have huge holiday parties. There is more than one way to live.

Like so many of these threads, it’s a few posters who are angry about their marriages playing armchair psychologist and lamenting the fact that their life isn’t as pretty as some others on instagram.