S/O: Dud children

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My adult kids are doing great and they are the opposite of duds. But I have plenty of friends and family whose kids are duds but their parents aren’t. I’m not sure of the cause of the dud-ness, but I think being spoiled has something to do with it as all the families are UMC or UC.

The reason they are all UMC/UC is because you wouldn’t call someone from a lower class family a dud. Lack of ambition, poor career potential, low educational attainment, etc are the norm - those who achieve more stand out as exceptions. “Dud” is only possible when you start with elevated expectations and have somewhere to drop to. It’s a very classist phrase.

Amen.

[Anonymous]

Take responsibility.
It's not all nature.
You raised the Dud you are complaining about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:All of you calling your adult children "duds" need to look in the mirror.

No, I'm not being mean. No kid is a dud in a vacuum, people grow and learn by those around them. A kid who grew up in impoverished neighborhoods with a lot of drugs often will turn to crime and drugs as an adult not because they were "duds" but because that is what they say growing up and that is what they know. Same with a lazy, spoiled, upper middle class-born 25 year old, kids pick up their personality.

Well if you're a mom and you have sons with a dud DH, they're already seeing a terrible dynamic. The dud Dad does nothing and the mom is forced to do more and more and more and more. Instead of seeing the mom as a good role model and counterpoint to the dad, they identify with their father and imagine they'll be fine because some sucker will come along to take care of them and their kids, just like mom did. The mom really can't win. Choose wisely.

+100. So odd that it plays out this way, but it's true. Another oddity is that dud sons frequently resent the mother just like the husband does. They resent the woman who keeps them afloat. Such a strange world that we live in.

Her presence and productivity make them feel called out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm the "smug" poster.

We have four grown daughters and none is anywhere near to being a dud. They're all smart, kind, well educated, caring, loving, funny, self-supporting, treat their parents extremely well, and the three who are married have all chosen partners who are wonderful people. We are truly blessed.

You're the "I did everything right" poster? I'm happy for you either way, but not sure why you would feel the need to post on this thread. It's like posting how thing and fit you are on a thread about trying to lose weight and get in shape. Sort of a weird need....

Ummm, she does that too. No real job so lots of validation pursued here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t think it’s heredity. More than likely, when parents don’t agree on childrearing, kids take the easy way out.

See: Charlie Sheen’s daughter choosing to live with him and not her
Mom because he had no rules

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dud males should just become SAHDs. We need to let this happen. It’s not a bad thing. And we should use less derogatory language to describe them.
It’s just like dud females in our society’s past could hide out as SAHMs.
I’m NOT saying all SAHMs are duds. I’m saying that we all know at least one SAHM who is more of a dud than other moms who manage to be more productive in their roles.

??? SAHD is actually a hard job. Why would a dud be good at this?

I agree. It’s a hard job and also one where you need a lot of self confidence because unlike SAHMs, sahds do not have the same community of support

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Dud males should just become SAHDs. We need to let this happen. It’s not a bad thing. And we should use less derogatory language to describe them.
It’s just like dud females in our society’s past could hide out as SAHMs.
I’m NOT saying all SAHMs are duds. I’m saying that we all know at least one SAHM who is more of a dud than other moms who manage to be more productive in their roles.

Dud men will do none of the work of being a SAHD, either emotionally or physically. They would lounge around and play video games. SAHMs work really hard and 90% of men couldnt compare

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are two posts in the relationship forum re: dud husbands/wives, so I thought I'd start one here for dud children. Anyone willing to admit they have dud adult kids? I married a dud (divorced), and I feel like my kids are turning out to be dud'ish like him. It makes me so sad because I suspect that dud-like behavior is hereditary. For the record, three boys, 20, 22 and 26.

Isn't it too early to label a 20 year old as a dud?

Yes but not a 26 year old. The only dud kids i know are male. Two in their 50s still mooching off parents and two in their late 20s living at home with mediocre jobs.

It’s ok to have a “mediocre” job, someone has to do these jobs
It’s ok to live with parents as long as parents are ok with it
Doesn’t sound like duds to me

Weird. These are textbook definitions of duds. Dud is synonymous with failure to launch, and still living at home at 50 while parent mooching is failure to launch at its finest.

I never said anything about mooching. Having a job, contributing to the household, helping parents while living with them - how is that bad?
Better than forgetting them at a nursing home for sure

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are two posts in the relationship forum re: dud husbands/wives, so I thought I'd start one here for dud children. Anyone willing to admit they have dud adult kids? I married a dud (divorced), and I feel like my kids are turning out to be dud'ish like him. It makes me so sad because I suspect that dud-like behavior is hereditary. For the record, three boys, 20, 22 and 26.

Isn't it too early to label a 20 year old as a dud?

Yes but not a 26 year old. The only dud kids i know are male. Two in their 50s still mooching off parents and two in their late 20s living at home with mediocre jobs.

It’s ok to have a “mediocre” job, someone has to do these jobs
It’s ok to live with parents as long as parents are ok with it
Doesn’t sound like duds to me

Weird. These are textbook definitions of duds. Dud is synonymous with failure to launch, and still living at home at 50 while parent mooching is failure to launch at its finest.

I never said anything about mooching. Having a job, contributing to the household, helping parents while living with them - how is that bad?
Better than forgetting them at a nursing home for sure

I don't recall any examples of people who are happily married with kids and gainfully employed whiling living with elderly parents being considered duds

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Dud males should just become SAHDs. We need to let this happen. It’s not a bad thing. And we should use less derogatory language to describe them.
It’s just like dud females in our society’s past could hide out as SAHMs.
I’m NOT saying all SAHMs are duds. I’m saying that we all know at least one SAHM who is more of a dud than other moms who manage to be more productive in their roles.

I know too many people with dud husbands who become SAHDs who continue to be duds, leaving the majority of the housekeeping to their working wives.

+1

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are two posts in the relationship forum re: dud husbands/wives, so I thought I'd start one here for dud children. Anyone willing to admit they have dud adult kids? I married a dud (divorced), and I feel like my kids are turning out to be dud'ish like him. It makes me so sad because I suspect that dud-like behavior is hereditary. For the record, three boys, 20, 22 and 26.

Not sure if this is a troll post...but if it isn't, OP-would you feel the same way about your kids if they were three girls? Also, they are still young and lots of young folks are not fully ripened yet. It seems early to decide they are 'duds'. I have 4 of my 6 kids in their 20's and there is a huge difference between 20 and 30.

Op here, and no this is not at all a troll post. And yes, if they were girls, dudness would likely be more pronounced since society is harder on women. I'm not being hard on my kids; I am calling a spade a spade. They are very similar to my ex as far as low ambition and pulling teeth to get small tasks completed.

I started the s/o thread to attack/identify the root of the problem: Dud adults/spouses were once somebody's dud children. The problem with assigning youth as an excuse is that the husbands and wives who are current duds were likely that way in their 20's too. I am certain their parents saw it and happily married the kids off to be someone else's problem. No way in hell dud-ways first emerge in a marriage. If you are married to a dud, you were dud-duped.

Off topic- but I see the sentiment of “parents happily marrying off” their problem child to “be someone else’s” problem on DCUM frequently. As though in the US we have arranged marriages! What do parents have to do with their kids’ spouses deciding to marry them?

My in-laws support my SIL (their daughter) and her DH. The DH is not ambitious, and the in-laws totally enable him not to work because they are wealthy, want their daughter who has never worked a day in her life (and was childless until 40) to live at the standard to which she's been accustomed, and just pay for everything. My SIL is a monster and her DH is a nice guy, who, factoring out the money part, does whatever she wants. It doesn't feel like a real marriage to me. They have separate bedrooms and seem to spend more time apart than together. I do wonder if my in-laws saw him as someone willing to take the trade of catering to her every whim and taking her abuse if they provided financially.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:One kid is a dud and the other is successful.

I see this pattern repeated with many of my friends around the same age as me (68) who also have the standard 2 kids.

I can accept that I helped create the dud, though. Kid #1 was so easy for us; she was a natural rule follower and very responsible and independent from a young age. She also excelled academically (was an early reader & writer). Also, she was such a good sleeper from shortly after birth.

We were very much the "I don't know what these other parents are complaining about, this parenting thing is cake!" until #2 came along.

The second one was a fighter from straight out of the womb and always restless. He seemed (and still to this day) to never need sleep. He never me a rule he didn't want to try to break. He's very independent as well but not responsible at all. So strong-willed, though. He's very smart but hated school. He only wanted to study and learn about subjects that interested him. If he liked the class and teacher, he was a rockstar. If he didn't, he was probably going to get a D or F. Punishment also didn't work because no matter what was taken away or restricted, he would say things like "that's fine, my imagination is all I need" and he meant it. He got in a fight at school and we took away his gaming system and other electronics, which back then meant CD player. No biggie for him. He'd take a fresh spiral notebook and write a short story or draw.

Once our oldest was out of the house and away at college, we gave up more on #2. We were just exhausted from the constant fight. Nothing with him was ever easy and he was always pushing buttons. If he didn't do his homework or failed a test, that was that. We didn't hound him over and over to do the work and make him show us. We just let him fail.

He didn't get into any colleges (no big shocker there) and decided to do NVCC. We agreed to pay only if he passed his courses and actually attended. He never did. He dropped out after one year and has mainly just been working service industry type jobs ever since. He's 33 and lives like he's still 19. No long-term girlfriend or wife but he does have one kid that he rarely sees (we see her pretty often), he lives with roommates from the restaurant where he works and they're all younger than him by at least 10 years. He parties all the time and I very much doubt he has any kind of savings at all.

This sounds like ADHD.

To this PP - IF you had to do it over again... would you have stood over him more closely and done everything possibly to get his grades up, support him in college, etc.? Do you have any regrets? My DH believes that some kids will be duds if left to their own devices, but if you intervene to the point necessary (which could be a lot) at some point, they'll realize it's better to be successful, and start to see the light... what do you think?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Out of all the people I know who are meh about their kids or regret having kids, all of them have boys. I think daughters are superior children.

You are a troll. But I'll bite.

Boys experience ADHD/anxiety/Learning disabilities/depression/etc at a much higher level than girls. Our education system is more geared towards typical girls---sitting at desks all day and having to focus for long periods which is incredibly hard for any kid with ADHD tendencies. My daughters could sit for hours and read books/color/focus at age 2, whereas I had to read to my son at age 2 while he ran around the playroom--he was listening but no way he was gonna sit still while I read to him for more than 2-3 mins, just was not going to happen, if he was awake he was going to be moving around constantly.

WRONG. ADHD has the same prevalence across sex. Check your bias.

Yes, but it often (not always but often) presents differently in girls. Although school can be tough for those with inattentive ADHD, it is torture for those who are hyperactive (like one of my sons, more common in boys).

Signed,
Mom to 3 ADHDers - 1 DS who is hyperactive, 1 DD who is inattentive, and 1 DS who is inattentive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the "smug" poster.

We have four grown daughters and none is anywhere near to being a dud. They're all smart, kind, well educated, caring, loving, funny, self-supporting, treat their parents extremely well, and the three who are married have all chosen partners who are wonderful people. We are truly blessed.

Cool. I'm really beautiful, have a great job with tons of vacation time, am thin and in great shape, am super rich, have a beautiful house, and have tons of amazing friends! Plus I do tons of volunteer work and get awards for my generosity all the time! Oh wait... am I off topic for this post?

[Anonymous]

My "dud" child works 10 times as hard as the average smart kid to achieve the same thing. He is twice exceptional, meaning he is gifted but also learning disordered, with a few medical diagnoses to round it all off. He has an IEP and 100% extra time. Extraordinarily slow processing speed. Various weird quirks. Lethal allergies.

He needs so much hand-holding in all matters of practical life.
Yet he has a high IQ and he's intellectually curious and decidedly academic. He knows exactly what he wants to do but has difficulty executing it.

It turns out my dud child, is not a dud. He is mentally resilient, and has learned to persist despite immense odds, starting from an accident at birth.

So he's a hero.

But people on this board will happily wave all kids with special needs into the "also-ran" category, and excoriate all families of youngsters with "invisible" special needs, because "we're coddling our kids", and we should "let them make their own mistakes", and because of us this "snowflake generation is completely incapacitated".

Once you shut out the noise of the ignorant masses, and focus on who your children really are, I don't think any of them will turn out to be duds. But you have to be observant, and compassionate, and never let them off the work ethic hook because of their needs. Know their potential, their strengths and weaknesses, and adjust expectations. Provide everything that they need to succeed. Teach them to advocate for themselves. Help them find what they're good at.

There are no duds in my family. Just variously functional people with labels like HFA or ADHD or anxiety. Some of those same people also have labels like MD and PhD, so we know that some labels are not incompatible with each other.

I think my point is: know yourself. Know your kids. Self-awareness is the greatest gift.