New TJ Lawsuit Filed 3/10/21 by Pacific Legal Foundation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people hating on a guy for saying he didn't think TJ was that important to spend Saturday mornings for years.

Because he said his kid would have been successful getting in if he did. It's insulting to think that kids that prep would not have gotten in otherwise.

I interpreted that to mean the prep school's cheating is not much of an issue, his kid would have gotten in with a legit prep school that didn't have tests beforehand.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people hating on a guy for saying he didn't think TJ was that important to spend Saturday mornings for years.

Because he said his kid would have been successful getting in if he did. It's insulting to think that kids that prep would not have gotten in otherwise.

But the PP didnt say that. PP said his/her kid *could have* gotten in if kid had spent Saturdays prepping. Not that your kid would NOT have gotten in if he/she had not prepped!
The point is—they didn’t start at the same baseline so don’t know!—and we never will. Is your kid academically gifted on his/her own? Maybe. Is PP’s kid? Maybe. But since PPs kid was up against a pool of kids who prepped every Saturday, and PP’s kid did not prep every Saturday, we’ll never know if a) your kid could have best out PP’s kid without Saturday prep OR b) your kid could have best out PPs kid if they BOTH had Saturday prep???

The point is, they weren’t judged from the same starting point.

You made decisions to position your kid to have the best possible advantage through prepping. And good for you. But do you see how PP might feel like that’s not really a measure of your child’s giftedness?

I mean ....my DD qualified to take Algebra in 7th grade without prep. He good friend took weekend classes for 4 months to prep for the IAAT. I told my DD we weren’t doing that. Because in my view, if you need to take a 6-month weekend class to prepare for the test that determines whether you are “ready” for algebra then you may as well just spend the next school year taking algebra bc what’s the difference??

Not all 6th grade AAP teachers are teaching pre-Algebra. I have seen AAP Math teachers who are barely able to teach their classes. Is it fair for some FCPS students to actually get the pre-algebra lessons while others do not? I see nothing wrong with families supplementing what lacks in the classroom. I have not sent my DS and DD to these test-prep places, but I can see how some parents see a need to supplement

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Curie obsessed poster - Please call the FBI to investigate Curie. Or even Washington Post.

OR.. get a life.

No one needs to investigate them. The damning information is already publicly available because they made it so.

Curie won't get punished for it, because they broke no laws.

Almost impossible to determine which kids furnished the questions from the secured exam for their question bank.

We (those who have sought to hold them accountable) got what we were after, which was for the exam to be eliminated so that families couldn't pay for privileged access to exam materials. The measures of Curie's effectiveness that they themselves published were a huge piece of evidence that the exam is a deeply flawed measure of student aptitude or achievement.

And now we want to ensure that it never happens again.

This is such a logic fail. It's like saying airplanes shouldn't be allowed in the air because there was a crash.

You have replaced a good system with some flaws with a far worse system that FCPS has even less chance of administering properly.

TJ is now just a demonstration project for a bunch of SJWs to take credit for placing more Black and Hispanic kids at the school.

I guess I'm a SJW because I'm happy to see FCPS finally realize that children from all across the socioeconomic spectrum can benefit from having access to a strong STEM curriculum. It's a public school and should benefit kids from all parts of Fairfax County. I didn't view a system that resulted in 30 percent of a class coming from one $4,000 prep school as a good system so there's also that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I guess I'm a SJW because I'm happy to see FCPS finally realize that children from all across the socioeconomic spectrum can benefit from having access to a strong STEM curriculum.

When did they realize this? They're not doing anything to make TJ more accessible to kids of lower incomes. The only thing the changes will do is ensure that the wealthier (largely white and Asian kids) at underrepresented schools will have an easier time getting accepted, and a lot of people (again, largely wealthier white and Asian families) will temporarily move right before 7th or 8th grade to benefit from the quota system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Curie obsessed poster - Please call the FBI to investigate Curie. Or even Washington Post.

OR.. get a life.

No one needs to investigate them. The damning information is already publicly available because they made it so.

Curie won't get punished for it, because they broke no laws.

Almost impossible to determine which kids furnished the questions from the secured exam for their question bank.

We (those who have sought to hold them accountable) got what we were after, which was for the exam to be eliminated so that families couldn't pay for privileged access to exam materials. The measures of Curie's effectiveness that they themselves published were a huge piece of evidence that the exam is a deeply flawed measure of student aptitude or achievement.

And now we want to ensure that it never happens again.

+1 theres no point to investigating them, the damage is done and one of their cash cows is gone and theyre partially to blame. alot of indian families will loose their best kept secret because of currie's actions.

I guess you don't know the definition of the word Secret.

Curie has been out there for anyone to attend, forever. I'm sure all the non-Indians did not want to go because there are "too many Indian kids" attending. Same reason why they would not have chosen to attend Sunshine Academy (predominantly Chinese kids).

Anyways, while your intentions may seen honorable, you have not proven anything in a court of law. If you were to make these allegations with your name attached to it, you would be slapped with a lawsuit so big, you won't know what hit you. I guess that's one of the reasons why are hiding behind the anonymity of these forums and keep bringing it up.

there's nothing about this that belongs in a court of law. and theyre not allegations - theyre facts provided by currie themselves. ppl like you are butthurt that those facts are being used against them in a public forum because you know that test prep is a dirty word now

what have they been 'accused' of?

Why don't you write an op-ed with your name on it accusing or insinuating them of doing something ILLEGAL. See how that turns out if they send their lawyers after you. I bet you are too chicken to do that! Anyone can be a keyboard warrior in an anonymous forum..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Curie obsessed poster - Please call the FBI to investigate Curie. Or even Washington Post.

OR.. get a life.

No one needs to investigate them. The damning information is already publicly available because they made it so.

Curie won't get punished for it, because they broke no laws.

Almost impossible to determine which kids furnished the questions from the secured exam for their question bank.

We (those who have sought to hold them accountable) got what we were after, which was for the exam to be eliminated so that families couldn't pay for privileged access to exam materials. The measures of Curie's effectiveness that they themselves published were a huge piece of evidence that the exam is a deeply flawed measure of student aptitude or achievement.

And now we want to ensure that it never happens again.

This is such a logic fail. It's like saying airplanes shouldn't be allowed in the air because there was a crash.

You have replaced a good system with some flaws with a far worse system that FCPS has even less chance of administering properly.

TJ is now just a demonstration project for a bunch of SJWs to take credit for placing more Black and Hispanic kids at the school.

I guess I'm a SJW because I'm happy to see FCPS finally realize that children from all across the socioeconomic spectrum can benefit from having access to a strong STEM curriculum. It's a public school and should benefit kids from all parts of Fairfax County. I didn't view a system that resulted in 30 percent of a class coming from one $4,000 prep school as a good system so there's also that.

Yes, you are. Now take some of that SJW indignation and complain about inequity in high school sports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/05/28/todays-anti-asian-racism-usually-disguises-itself-diversity/

So true.

On point. When you can't compete, you cry wolf and demonize the successful. Worked well in Russia, China and Nazi Germany.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people hating on a guy for saying he didn't think TJ was that important to spend Saturday mornings for years.

Because he said his kid would have been successful getting in if he did. It's insulting to think that kids that prep would not have gotten in otherwise.

If they would have gotten in otherwise, it’s a waste of resources.

It literally only makes sense to prep if you are trying to change your status from “not offered” to “offered”.

Let me know when you invent a time travel machine so we can avoid that "waste of resources". Imagine the amount of money parents would have saved on Lacrosse, Fencing, Ivy applications and college prep if only they knew the outcome!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people hating on a guy for saying he didn't think TJ was that important to spend Saturday mornings for years.

Because he said his kid would have been successful getting in if he did. It's insulting to think that kids that prep would not have gotten in otherwise.

If they would have gotten in otherwise, it’s a waste of resources.

It literally only makes sense to prep if you are trying to change your status from “not offered” to “offered”.

Bull crap. Sometimes you just want to prepare as best you can. Clearly, you are one of those bitter parents whose little Larlo didn't get in so you make excuses.

1) I have no kids

2) I clearly struck a nerve there

Prep does one of two things:

1) gets kids in who otherwise wouldn’t

2) is of no impact with respect to the admissions process

It’s literally no more complicated than that.

You have no kids?! WTF are you doing here? Are you the poster to whom TJ kids "flock to" and confide how bad it is? The Pied Piper?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people hating on a guy for saying he didn't think TJ was that important to spend Saturday mornings for years.

Because he said his kid would have been successful getting in if he did. It's insulting to think that kids that prep would not have gotten in otherwise.

But the PP didnt say that. PP said his/her kid *could have* gotten in if kid had spent Saturdays prepping. Not that your kid would NOT have gotten in if he/she had not prepped!
The point is—they didn’t start at the same baseline so don’t know!—and we never will. Is your kid academically gifted on his/her own? Maybe. Is PP’s kid? Maybe. But since PPs kid was up against a pool of kids who prepped every Saturday, and PP’s kid did not prep every Saturday, we’ll never know if a) your kid could have best out PP’s kid without Saturday prep OR b) your kid could have best out PPs kid if they BOTH had Saturday prep???

The point is, they weren’t judged from the same starting point.

You made decisions to position your kid to have the best possible advantage through prepping. And good for you. But do you see how PP might feel like that’s not really a measure of your child’s giftedness?

I mean ....my DD qualified to take Algebra in 7th grade without prep. He good friend took weekend classes for 4 months to prep for the IAAT. I told my DD we weren’t doing that. Because in my view, if you need to take a 6-month weekend class to prepare for the test that determines whether you are “ready” for algebra then you may as well just spend the next school year taking algebra bc what’s the difference??

We could throw in that same logic for grades. And the variability in grades from one school to the next. He believes his kid would have gotten in if he prepped. That's arrogant and insulting. The vast majority of kids who prep do not make it because they aren't that gifted to start with and there is very little prep can do. To think that prep is the magic gateway in and the only reason Asian kids dominate the admissions at TJ and why his kid didn't make it is simply wrong.

[Anonymous]

28% of the class of 2024 came from the same prep company. Prep did work under the old system. It will be interesting to see how the kids actually do at TJ given that FCPS has the names of the kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:28% of the class of 2024 came from the same prep company. Prep did work under the old system. It will be interesting to see how the kids actually do at TJ given that FCPS has the names of the kids.

IMO, the prep school is a red herring. Kids who attend that prep school are a self selected group. It's like believing there is something unethical that top NBA draft picks come from a handful of schools. Well, yea, if you are a good player and want to be in the NBA, you attend one of those schools to get a better shot at being picked. And what do those teams have? Coaches! Oh my god, the horror that these kids are being coached! What has the wold come to?!?!?!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:28% of the class of 2024 came from the same prep company. Prep did work under the old system. It will be interesting to see how the kids actually do at TJ given that FCPS has the names of the kids.

This is confirmation bias. Those 28% May have gotten in on their own merits themselves without prep.
Many kids who go to prep don’t think it really helps. They are there also to learn and reinforce school. (Math, English)

Without controlling for the inputs, there is not certainty that prep helps.

When my kid took the SAT first time, got a 1560, just using Khan and a book bought from Amazon, and wanted to enroll in prep for a second attempt. The honest places just told us to keep our money - they would not be able to do much. These TJ places may not be like that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are people hating on a guy for saying he didn't think TJ was that important to spend Saturday mornings for years.

Because he said his kid would have been successful getting in if he did. It's insulting to think that kids that prep would not have gotten in otherwise.

If they would have gotten in otherwise, it’s a waste of resources.

It literally only makes sense to prep if you are trying to change your status from “not offered” to “offered”.

What? So you are saying that any kid that took a prep class would not have gotten in otherwise? PP is right, you are just bitter because your kid couldn't make the cut.

No. What I’m saying is that when you do the TJ prep thing, there are one of three possibilities:

1) you don’t get in (waste of time/resources)
2) you get in, but you would have anyway (waste of time/resources)
3) you get in when you wouldn’t have otherwise (likely not the best candidate)

This logic only applies to standardized tests because THEY HAVE NO OTHER APPLICATION IN THE REAL WORLD EXCEPT FOR GETTING INTO SCHOOLS.

It doesn’t apply to sports or music, because in those endeavors the preparation is actually applicable beyond the tryout process.

Really? I am not a fan at all of test prep culture. But what exactly do you think prep does? It teaches you material you need for the test plus ways of looking at problems that will help you on the test. Do you not see that as strengthening your knowledge of math or whatever? Do you really think kids who get an extra 4 hours of academic classes a week for 3 years (or however long) are getting absolutely nothing from them except a chance to go to TJ? Why is this my different from the kid playing travel soccer but who does not get a scholarship?

[Anonymous]

Curie got 50ish kids in for the class of 2022, 70ish kids for the class of 2023 and a whopping 133 kids in for the class of 2024. They published first and last names of the kids on their FB page.

The prep industry in NVa is a very competitive market. Curie has been around a long time. Jumping from 50 to 133 admissions in two years raises some eyebrows. Then add to that with multiple current TJ students stating in public forums (including the FB group TJ vents) that they had a copy of the test.

I personally am not against prep and giving your child the best possible shot. But the above severely undercuts the “merit” arguments.